A Few Thoughts About The Game, in no particular order.....

[truth on hold]

He was watching Watkins have a career day, also blocking as McCoy/Williams run for over 200 yards and 3 TD's. Not everyone can get the ball often.

He looked bad in the game against jags too.

[DC Greg]

At half time I was saying we overpaid #55. I'm not saying that anymore.

 

Don't worry, you're in with the majority of Bills fans. On his next personal foul, the masses will calling for him to be cut or benched once again. Then he'll sack Fitz with one hand, take the ball from him, run it back for a touchdown, and set us up for a win.

 

A bunch of fans will be mad that they were wrong, and they'll brood until there's another penalty so they can call for his head.

[truth on hold]

You wouldnt be beating the clay drum because of the avatar would you? Lol. Jk but seriously. The passing game gave me much to be concerned about. The last 2 weeks Clay ATE!!! Woods ate. The ball was evenly distributed. Im not sure how i feel about the whole Clay 2 receptions for like 11 yards and McCoy Williams (im sorry, but i dont remember which it was) for 1 reception and Watkins with the rest. That doesnt seem like the recipe for a 5 star meal. I thought we had the birth of a dominant TE. Guess not.

And against jets we're really going to need him. Revis will contain Watkins, and cromartrie will do same with woods

[All I Need is Hope]

Same problems, week after week. Undisciplined / uninspired defense. Same pattern, year after year. A "good" win against a marginal team.

 

What's different this year, it seems, is that significantly more of the fan base isn't getting sucked back in after a win like this.

 

The posts this year reflect a huge amount of skepticism and cynicism, and I expect them to get smoked on national tv on Thursday.

 

They're on their glide path to between 7-9 and 9-7, with non play-offs.

[Big C]

And against jets we're really going to need him. Revis will contain Watkins, and cromartrie will do same with woods

 

Cromartie is not having a good season.

[JohninMinn.]

Question: what was wrong with Dareus today?

Same as always. He got paid.

[ganesh]

And both those teams gave up about 30 points and we gave up 17. We did not play well on defense at all and yet we gave up 17 points.

That is possibly due to the Dolphins being stupid.

[ctk232]

Now that the Bills FO can see what a really good OG in Richie Incognito can do for a team you think they will change their minds about drafting an offensive linemen with a first round pick? Man, i hope the Bills find a way to resign him.

Amen, just about to add this. Honestly, if he keeps this up, he's our #1 FA priority. His ability to pass block, downhill run block, and pull to open an edge is ridiculous. Couldn't hurt to draft someone for depth along the line, but certainly frees up the 1st round for another WR, LB, or even pass rusher (not starting this convo too soon, but nice that it's one less position of worry if we were to re-sign him). Bring him back for sure.

[Kelly the Dog]

That is possibly due to the Dolphins being stupid.

Name them. The fourth and goal was definitely the right call and the Bills made the play. They had a terrific game plan and executed it very well. They moved the ball all game.

[12Kachy]

I agree with yall. The Defense still looks flat. Brown is playing pretty bad. He missed a couple of tackles and his instincts seem off this year. The DL is still not providing the pressure they did last year. Hughes is starting to come around but they need M. Williams to play better. He just seems flat. Maybe he thinks the Bills will cut him next year and wants to take it easy this year.

[BADOLBILZ]

1) Very, very impressed by Karlos Williams today. He bounced off of the line a couple of times and just wouldn't quit. I'm not the biggest fan of Whaley but keeping Karlos over Fred while sad, was clearly the right move.

 

2) Speaking of moves, did any of you catch the one by Watkins approx. 2 minutes into the 4th quarter? The play went for for 15 yards and Grimes was absolutely helpless.

 

3) The penalties are still quite disturbing. There were no less than 13 today. One would think that when you are penalized 13 times you would lose. But 260 yards or so on the ground still wins games for an NFL team, or so it looks.

 

4) Bradham and Brown had decent numbers today, but I didn't think either of them played well. Too many missed tackles.

 

5) Standing on a tower,

World at my command.

You just keep a turning while I'm,

playing in the band.

 

If a man among you,

Got no sin upon his hand.

Let him cast a stone at me for,

playing in the band.

 

Playing,

Playing in the band.

Daybreak,

Daybreak on the land.

 

6) Gilmore made a fine play on the last play of the first half when he defended the pass. Ryan was pumping his fist. It was good. Other than that I was less than impressed. He gave up too many passes and was penalized. He was also taken out of the play on a few runs. Shut-down? I don't think so. At least not today.

 

7) Good things happened when Rex let them blitz. Sorry folks, I just can't stand this sissy Jauron style defense.

 

8) Hey Miller, welcome to the NFL! The next DT he faces will look like Cinderella, no matter who it is. Suh is a freaking monster, and is clearly disturbed mentally.

 

9) Big Time kudos to Mr. Taylor. You know, he didn't need so much air under his deep passes to Sammy. The kid has a nice arm. And he ran just enough to take pressure away from his weapons.

 

10) Sammy too was fantastic today! I just love the way he gets open.

 

11) I laugh when they say our defense "bullies" other teams. We do not, at least not on defense. Our DL runs away from the LOS and the entire defense commits stupid penalties.

 

12) On the first drive, both Sammy and McCoy threw nice blocks.

 

13) Sorry people for being so critical of the defense after a win. They were causing me a great deal of nervous frustration. Rex needs to get his act straightened out imo.

 

14) Time now to beat the jets!!!

 

15) GO BILLS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

1) Gotta disagree on Fred......it wasn't a choice between he and Karlos....and with McCoy and Karlos neutralized by injuries they could have used him a lot more than Seattle has. Perhaps just as important, this team has lacked leaders/gamers like Freddie.

 

7) This defense is driving me crazy too. They just give away first downs like candy. Were very lucky that Miami botched that final drive of the first half or the game might have gone much differently.

 

I will add that Greg Roman deserves a lot of credit for a very strong offensive gameplan.

 

It's to be expected, given two weeks to prepare.......but props to him.

[DC Greg]

 

1) Gotta disagree on Fred......it wasn't a choice between he and Karlos....and with McCoy and Karlos neutralized by injuries they could have used him a lot more than Seattle has. Perhaps just as important, this team has lacked leaders/gamers like Freddie.

 

7) This defense is driving me crazy too. They just give away first downs like candy. Were very lucky that Miami botched that final drive of the first half or the game might have gone much differently.

 

I will add that Greg Roman deserves a lot of credit for a very strong offensive gameplan.

 

It's to be expected, given two weeks to prepare.......but props to him.

 

While I liked a lot about Roman's scheme today, the gimmicks are horrible. Every time he trys to get too cute with a flea flicker or something, it backfires. Just line up and play to your players' strengths. You've got enough playmakers to win without a chan gaileyesque offense.

[Agent 91]

Now that the Bills FO can see what a really good OG in Richie Incognito can do for a team you think they will change their minds about drafting an offensive linemen with a first round pick? Man, i hope the Bills find a way to resign him.

I dont think it will be too hard to do. 4-5 a few more seasons might do the trick? What do you think

[Agent 91]

Bradham and Brown are very poor LBs. Neither can tackle. Robey and Darby are the eilite of this defense.

In this defense... i have to agree. Bradham and brown for whatever reason turned out to be non existing. I was saying to my dad its funny how all the players who were dominant last year fell off a cliff this year. The d line, linebackers, aaron williams even looked different even injured, something just wasnt right

[BADOLBILZ]

 

While I liked a lot about Roman's scheme today, the gimmicks are horrible. Every time he trys to get too cute with a flea flicker or something, it backfires. Just line up and play to your players' strengths. You've got enough playmakers to win without a chan gaileyesque offense.

 

The flea flicker with only 1 receiver in the route was ill advised. Receiver ended up triple covered. Karlos might have gone yard if he just kept it.

[Agent 91]

But every game is different. Other times we came out throwing every play and went right down the field. This is really the first game we have had a healthy McCoy and Karlos. Next week against the Jets we may be throwing the ball all over the field. I think this offense has been very versatile when we have had Watkins and McCoy/Karlos at the same time. I don't think you can count the games that EJ played without Watkins and McCoy hurting and Karlos out. That is not the team we have or the offense we run. We can run and we can pass with our starters. I don't think the game plan was to rarely pass and play ground and pound. We just never had to pass much and when we did we burnt them deep a couple times.

Unfortunately you have to count them. That was your pitfall with having 2 developmental qbs on the team. Tyrod is learning. EJ is learning. But its really hard to learn when you have so many missing parts. A healthy McCoy and Williams was the difference. I know many give Tyrod the credit. But this gsme was won on the ground... and in the trenches. Watkins was nice but McCoy and Williams were the unstoppable 2 man tandem i hope to get more than my share of for atleast the next 6 yrs

For as much as we complain about officiating when calls go against us I think it's only fair to point out that we got some big calls in our favor today.

 

1. Karlos Williams clearly fumbled the ball on his 2nd quarter TD run before the ball broke the plane. The endzone camera angle showed this. Should have been a touchback, Miami's ball.

 

2. Suh had Tyrod spun around just before the long TD pass to Sammy and it should have been registered as a sack. If it would have been called a sack as it should have been Miami would have declined the penalty, we would have punted, and that would have meant no TD pass to Sammy.

 

At the end of the day a win is a win and I'm glad we won. I still think we deserved the win especially after the many times we've been hosed by bad calls in the past. But I think it needs to be pointed out that we got some breaks today.

What about John Miller holding on to Suh for dear life on the Watkins TD. He was absolutely mugged

[Agent 91]

i called him out before the game for having more pi's than ints, today he had more penalties than passes defended. He just doesnt turn his head around. Darby is what we all wanted n gilmore. gilmore is overated. I hope we dont overpay him when we can sign 2-3 other guys with his money. Oh and mckelvin looked pretty darn good after not playing for a year!

The one big play and i thought people would want his head. I thought McKelvin was awesome all things considered

[Agent 91]

who? oh and did you notice how bad gilmore played?

Gilmore is decent. DEFINITELY not elite. And not Justin Rogers. I dont understand what everyone sees in him. 4 years in. Had 6 ints his first 3 yrs. I am not really sure how many this year. But i do know that as far as i am cocerned. Darby is about to be a shut down corner in this league. I was afraid that he would learn from Gilmore. And that would just expound upon his "bad habits" in college. Ut so far so good. He has played every teams number 1 receivers very well. He akes the college to pro transition seemlessly. I hope i didnt just jinx him.

[aristocrat]

I'm worried about the jets def line against our o line after seeing our o line get beat up on pass plays

[Agent 91]

 

Don't worry, you're in with the majority of Bills fans. On his next personal foul, the masses will calling for him to be cut or benched once again. Then he'll sack Fitz with one hand, take the ball from him, run it back for a touchdown, and set us up for a win.

 

A bunch of fans will be mad that they were wrong, and they'll brood until there's another penalty so they can call for his head.

Ah the Manziel special? Is that the number 8 or 9 on the menu

And against jets we're really going to need him. Revis will contain Watkins, and cromartrie will do same with woods

Gonna need Hogan and Gragg too. Its not going to be anywhere as easy. Grimes is... or was an excellent ball player. But he is not Revis. And cromartie is just so long out there.

Same as always. He got paid.

Meeting him and talking to him i have to question his heart.

[2020 Our Year For Sure]

Gilmore is a good corner, y'all is crazy. He played well today. One penalty and a few short completions, not exactly a disaster...also had a few breakups. Yes Darby is better, so what? Darby is really freakin good. We have good corners.

 

John Miller was killing people in the run game! Struggled in pass pro, had a couple penalties I believe but he had a tough assignment. I like this kid. In general some real well-blocked run plays today, and McCoy was just fantastic! Gotta give Greg Roman a lot of credit this week.

[GunnerBill]

Gilmore is a good corner, y'all is crazy. He played well today. One penalty and a few short completions, not exactly a disaster...also had a few breakups. Yes Darby is better, so what? Darby is really freakin good. We have good corners.

 

John Miller was killing people in the run game! Struggled in pass pro, had a couple penalties I believe but he had a tough assignment. I like this kid. In general some real well-blocked run plays today, and McCoy was just fantastic! Gotta give Greg Roman a lot of credit this week.

It was Miller's best game in my estimation. Yes he got beat by Suh a couple of times in pass protection but his angles in run blocking were excellent. It was a good day fom the line.

[stony]

Gilmore is a good corner, y'all is crazy. He played well today. One penalty and a few short completions, not exactly a disaster...also had a few breakups. Yes Darby is better, so what? Darby is really freakin good. We have good corners.

 

John Miller was killing people in the run game! Struggled in pass pro, had a couple penalties I believe but he had a tough assignment. I like this kid. In general some real well-blocked run plays today, and McCoy was just fantastic! Gotta give Greg Roman a lot of credit this week.

 

There was a play in the game that summarizes the reactions on the board between the Gilmore bashers and Darby lovers. It was a 3 & 4 conversion when Landry converted with a tough catch in pretty tight coverage (IMO, great throw and catch. Good coverage, too. These two are not mutually exclusive). My point is, if it was Gilmore, we'd hear a lot of "he needs to finish plays" or whatever. With Darby, i haven't even seen anyone bring it up. The double standard with the two is amazing.

[PO16FFS]

 

There was a play in the game that summarizes the reactions on the board between the Gilmore bashers and Darby lovers. It was a 3 & 4 conversion when Landry converted with a tough catch in pretty tight coverage (IMO, great throw and catch. Good coverage, too. These two are not mutually exclusive). My point is, if it was Gilmore, we'd hear a lot of "he needs to finish plays" or whatever. With Darby, i haven't even seen anyone bring it up. The double standard with the two is amazing.

Could it be because one player is a first round pick, in year 4, and always gives up a big play or has a penalty every game while the other is a rookie drafted in the 2nd round?

 

Could it be because Darby is being thrown at more than Gilmore and his impact has been bigger?

[stony]

Could it be because one player is a first round pick, in year 4, and always gives up a big play or has a penalty every game while the other is a rookie drafted in the 2nd round?

 

Could it be because Darby is being thrown at more than Gilmore and his impact has been bigger?

 

I could give two craps where they were drafted.

 

Gilmore's PI penalty was a damn heady play, imo.

[BillsFan-4-Ever]

this team, the one we've been seeing week in and week out... i am so done with this team right now. they're wins are uninspiring and they really have no heart. it's great that guys like watkins and mccoy had great games - they're supposed to - because they're supposed to be all pro. The only two highlights of todays game I took away are John Miller is someone to appreciate and Karlos Williams makes me happy with his style of play.

 

The LB's, the DL, the S's are playing piss poor football. The CB's are up and down and it's disappointing. The OL is trying and working hard ... some times. The QB/Taylor is full of charisma and I appreciate it. The skill players on offense, well, I don't know why we can't get the ball to our playmakers. I don't know why Miami couldn't shut down Watkins. I don't know why we have Clay and Woods right now and wish they could get the ball.

I'll give you a +1 on what I too see as "uninspiring" and that Sammy, McCoy and the Legend of Karlos.

 

Did any of the trick plays even work on the offense in + yards?

 

Happy for the win, but to was hard to see the game in full control on both sides.

Also IMO some of the people here trashing Gilmore way to much.

[Maury Ballstein]

And against jets we're really going to need him. Revis will contain Watkins, and cromartrie will do same with woods

Keep bending over to the jets, they are trash. Watkins will toast revis's old ass.

[PO16FFS]

 

I could give two craps where they were drafted.

 

Gilmore's PI penalty was a damn heady play, imo.

Where they were drafted means absolutely nothing. However, he was a first round pick. #10 I believe. And this changes peoples expectations.

[JohnC]

The two players who made an impression on me in this game who don't fall in the category of play makers were Incognito and McKelvin. If anyone wants to make a clinic tape for guards he should be the model player. Not only is he our best offensive lineman by far he is also one of the best guards in the league. Miller got abused in pass protection but he and Incognito are both excellent pulling guards.

 

I have to give McKelvin a lot of credit for playing so effectively after being out for so long. Even on the plays when he was covering a receiver who caught a pass he was usually in good position. He got right back into the action without exhibiting any rust. That was quite impressive.

[DC Greg]

It was Miller's best game in my estimation. Yes he got beat by Suh a couple of times in pass protection but his angles in run blocking were excellent. It was a good day fom the line.

 

I didn't pay close enough attention to him specifically. Happy to hear that he played well against the run. It seemed like there were BIG holes all day long for Shady and especially Karlos to run through. If you give Karlos Williams a hole to get a few steps downfield through, I feel sorry for your linebackers and secondary. That dude just trucks people.

 

Miller got abused by Suh on a few pass rushes. But, it's Suh, so it happens.

[Kelly the Dog]

The two players who made an impression on me in this game who don't fall in the category of play makers were Incognito and McKelvin. If anyone wants to make a clinic tape for guards he should be the model player. Not only is he our best offensive lineman by far he is also one of the best guards in the league. Miller got abused in pass protection but he and Incognito are both excellent pulling guards.

 

I have to give McKelvin a lot of credit for playing so effectively after being out for so long. Even on the plays when he was covering a receiver who caught a pass he was usually in good position. He got right back into the action without exhibiting any rust. That was quite impressive.

 

The only long pass completion of the game he got roasted on right off the line and hustled back to make the tackle on a pass that was under thrown. He was beat bad. Other than that he had a pretty good game.

 

On another note, the Bills defensive coaches have been coaching these guys to grab and be very physical at the line and you may be surprised at all the times it works. They are willing to give up a few five yard defensive holding penalties a game in order to play like that the whole game. As fans we go crazy when we see it called and a lot of times it looks like Gilmore or Darby were just being stupid but it's part of the strategy. I wish they would do it a little less too, as far as the holding and PI calls, but if they did you would see a lot less passes defensed and deflected.

 

No one has also made mention of the fabulous play Gilmore made when he intentionally tried to tap the ball to I think Preston Brown to intercept but it fell to the ground. That was an awesome play.

[GunnerBill]

On another note, the Bills defensive coaches have been coaching these guys to grab and be very physical at the line and you may be surprised at all the times it works. They are willing to give up a few five yard defensive holding penalties a game in order to play like that the whole game. As fans we go crazy when we see it called and a lot of times it looks like Gilmore or Darby were just being stupid but it's part of the strategy.

 

I hadn't really considered this but you might be right. It is certainly the way Seattle play. They grab every play on the basis that "they can't flag us every time" and it works. They are the most penalised team the past couple of years - but they tend to be 5 yard holding calls, and they tend to avoid the big PI penalties.

[JohnC]

The only long pass completion of the game he got roasted on right off the line and hustled back to make the tackle on a pass that was under thrown. He was beat bad. Other than that he had a pretty good game.

 

On another note, the Bills defensive coaches have been coaching these guys to grab and be very physical at the line and you may be surprised at all the times it works. They are willing to give up a few five yard defensive holding penalties a game in order to play like that the whole game. As fans we go crazy when we see it called and a lot of times it looks like Gilmore or Darby were just being stupid but it's part of the strategy. I wish they would do it a little less too, as far as the holding and PI calls, but if they did you would see a lot less passes defensed and deflected.

 

No one has also made mention of the fabulous play Gilmore made when he intentionally tried to tap the ball to I think Preston Brown to intercept but it fell to the ground. That was an awesome play.

I don't understand some of the negative views on Gilmore. I consider him not only our best CB but I rank him very high at his position league wide. The no touch rules applied to the defensive backfield make it (next to qb) the most challenging position to play. A major difference in this game that contributed to the win is how our CBs (including McKelvin) played compared to Miami's CBs.

 

The way the league strictly enforces the holding and PI rules make the games very difficult to watch. It kills the flow and continuity of the game. The accumulation of penalties is becoming an irritating problem. When you get a reputation for clutching and grabbing you are not going to get the benefit of the doubt.

[GunnerBill]

I don't understand some of the negative views on Gilmore. I consider him not only our best CB but I rank him very high at his position league wide. The no touch rules applied to the defensive backfield make it (next to qb) the most challenging position to play. A major difference in this game that contributed to the win is how our CBs (including McKelvin) played compared to Miami's CBs.

 

The way the league strictly enforces the holding and PI rules make the games very difficult to watch. It kills the flow and continuity of the game. The accumulation of penalties is becoming an irritating problem. When you get a reputation for clutching and grabbing you are not going to get the benefit of the doubt.

 

I totally agree on Gilmore and one of my colleagues who is a fellow NFL fan (Browns sadly for him) thinks Gilmore is a top 5 corner and is still fuming that the Browns didn't pick him #3 overall in 2012. That is a tad higher than I have him but I think he is better than the TBD consensus.

[BuffaloWings]

Good point... Where was Dareus? Was he on the field? Seriously.

 

Regarding point 9... I like Taylor. He did plenty good and he needs to be our starter. I'm not questioning that... But. But, he really needs to look downfield more. Too much of the offense is played within 10yds of the line. It seems he's either throwing short or long bombs, with very little in between. I'd like to see more mid range passes in that 20 yd type range. I think that would loosen the defenses up even more.

 

Our Defense still needs work. Plain and simple. They looked confused on most every snap. I don't know what they're doing, but they definitely need more time to figure it all out.

 

With those 2 caveats, this was a pretty darn good, complete win. We needed it and we got it! We're still in the hunt... Now lets take down the Jets!

 

Not sure if this was discussed already, but that's a tell-tale sign of players trying to be forced into a scheme instead of a scheme developed around your players' strengths.

 

I hated how they'd have 7 guys on the line of scrimmage, then drop 3 or even 4 of them into coverage. Tannehill had all day to throw yesterday and it clearly bugged the H out of me.

[truth on hold]

The two players who made an impression on me in this game who don't fall in the category of play makers were Incognito and McKelvin. If anyone wants to make a clinic tape for guards he should be the model player. Not only is he our best offensive lineman by far he is also one of the best guards in the league. Miller got abused in pass protection but he and Incognito are both excellent pulling guards.

 

I have to give McKelvin a lot of credit for playing so effectively after being out for so long. Even on the plays when he was covering a receiver who caught a pass he was usually in good position. He got right back into the action without exhibiting any rust. That was quite impressive.

+1 on McKelvin. And we really needed him back there. With Williams out, it was too easy to pick on graham and Rambo

[dave mcbride]

I don't understand some of the negative views on Gilmore. I consider him not only our best CB but I rank him very high at his position league wide. The no touch rules applied to the defensive backfield make it (next to qb) the most challenging position to play. A major difference in this game that contributed to the win is how our CBs (including McKelvin) played compared to Miami's CBs.

 

The way the league strictly enforces the holding and PI rules make the games very difficult to watch. It kills the flow and continuity of the game. The accumulation of penalties is becoming an irritating problem. When you get a reputation for clutching and grabbing you are not going to get the benefit of the doubt.

It's more than that - the call is so arbitrary. Gilmore impedes and holds a Jags receiver and Graham gets a pick 6. No call. Then Robey gets called for ridiculous PI. Then the guy for Philly (Byron Maxwell) gets called twice late last night on the ticky-tackiest penalties. And in the meantime, there's still minor holding on most every play. From a DB's perspective, who knows whether you'll get called for it. I mean, at the end of the first half Gilmore could have been called for PI on his final pass breakup and it would have been justifiable by the letter of the law. It would have been a terrible call, of course, but I see it called all of the time.

Edited November 9, 2015 by dave mcbride

[GunnerBill]

I mean, at the end of the first half Gilmore could have been called for PI on his final pass breakup and it would have been justifiable by the letter of the law. It would have been a terrible call, of course, but I see it called all of the time.

 

Agree. Equally some refs don't call the one on the previous play as the ball was basically uncatchable. Honestly the inconsistency is baffling.

[mead107]

Thanks Bill

[JohnC]

It's more than that - the call is so arbitrary. Gilmore impedes and holds a Jags receiver and Graham gets a pick 6. No call. Then Robey gets called for ridiculous PI. Then the guy for Philly (Byron Maxwell) gets called twice late last night on the ticky-tackiest penalties. And in the meantime, there's still minor holding on most every play. From a DB's perspective, who knows whether you'll get called for it. I mean, at the end of the first half Gilmore could have been called for PI on his final pass breakup and it would have been justifiable by the letter of the law. It would have been a terrible call, of course, but I see it called all of the time.

The referees have an impossible job. They are instructed by the league office to emphasize certain infractions. What frustrates me to no end is the arbitrariness of many of the calls (as you noted). If a minor infraction has no bearing on a play or is not near where the play goes to it shouldn't be called. The referees have lost a sense of perspective and situational awareness. Is there a kickoff and punt return play where the call for blocking in the back isn't called? Because of the increasing amount of penalty calls it is less enjoyable to watch a game. The refereeing in general has become a pet peeve of mine. I'm tired of it!