ESPN the Mag: LeSean McCoy Interview

[QCity]

He comes across like a jilted ex-girlfriend that keeps saying she doesn't care about you anymore, yet follows you out wherever you go.

 

Shady, just shut up already.

[NoSaint]

 

I dont think the point McCoy is trying to make is as simple as "black or white", or can be determined by how many black players and white players Chip has signed/cut.

 

It's that Chip is willing to tolerate push back from white players, but immediately ships out any black players that dont immediately kowtow to his ways. He only wants subservient black players, not uppity blacks.

 

Just my take, trying to make sense of his comments.

i took that as what he was getting at too.

[dave mcbride]

But what you are talking about is not what McCoy was talking about. You can't field a team with white running backs and WR and CB. McCoy was talking about players with big personalities who speak their mind.

The problem with what he's saying is that by all appearances he's conflating that type of player with an authentic notion of blackness. I'm not saying that McCoy is saying something as dumb as, say, Torii Hunter ( http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/03/10/torii-hunter-black-dominican-players-are-imposters/), but the signaling about authenticity is there. It's mythological bs.

i took that as what he was getting at too.

McCoy presents no evidence that white players acted in the same way as the (perceived) outspoken black players. His argument is purely anecdotal and free of any attempt at a systematic analysis.

[Kelly the Dog]

Black stars added: DeMarcus Murray, Darren Sproles. Hoped-for-star who didn't pan out the way they hoped: Malcolm Jenkins.

Murray is not at all the kind of big name, outspoken star player that Jackson and McCoy are. Sproles is not a star in any way or outspoken. He may have said it wrong and it sounds bad in quotes, but I think it's pretty clear to anyone who looks at what he really said what he really means.

 

Personally, I don't believe Kelly is a racist but he is a pompous dick who doesn't like anyone to be bigger than he is. That type of person affects black people differently than it affects white people. Not always of course, but quite often and always has.

[NoSaint]

McCoy presents no evidence that white players acted in the same way as the (perceived) outspoken black players. His argument is purely anecdotal and free of any attempt at a systematic analysis.

 

i didnt say it was an awesome argument, or anything remotely similar. just agreed that he was likely getting at top tier talent more than bodies to fill the roster. ie counting bodies in and out, or looking at late round picks probably didnt address what he was trying to say. thats not to say i agree with him.

[ndirish1978]

Thanks for the heads up at the end. I don't usually hold grudges, and I'm a pretty reasonable guy, but I really can't stand Rodak.

 

+1, I didn't click because of the disclaimer. The kid's not even a competent interviewer/writer

 

 

Thank you for saving me the click!

 

Exactly.

[NoSaint]

Murray is not at all the kind of big name, outspoken star player that Jackson and McCoy are. Sproles is not a star in any way or outspoken. He may have said it wrong and it sounds bad in quotes, but I think it's pretty clear to anyone who looks at what he really said what he really means.

 

Personally, I don't believe Kelly is a racist but he is a pompous dick who doesn't like anyone to be bigger than he is. That type of person affects black people differently than it affects white people. Not always of course, but quite often and always has.

 

ill say thats probably pretty close to how i read the comments, and my own reaction.

[YoloinOhio]

It's pretty much common sense that he is referring to a certain type of black player. He said it in his last interview "chip doesnt like stars"; today he said "young" black players. He didn't expand or wasnt asked to expand. He is referring to flashy guys who enjoy the limelight and the superstar aspect of what they do; they generally do not like to be treated like college kids. It doesn't mean chip is wrong, it means it was a bad fit between the two style.

Edited May 6, 2015 by YoloinOhio

[dave mcbride]

Murray is not at all the kind of big name, outspoken star player that Jackson and McCoy are. Sproles is not a star in any way or outspoken. He may have said it wrong and it sounds bad in quotes, but I think it's pretty clear to anyone who looks at what he really said what he really means.

 

Personally, I don't believe Kelly is a racist but he is a pompous dick who doesn't like anyone to be bigger than he is. That type of person affects black people differently than it affects white people. Not always of course, but quite often and always has.

Um, Murray led the league in rushing for the most popular team in the country. And I hope you're not conflating "outspoken" with some misguided notion of racial authenticity, which I would bet is the logic underlying McCoy's quote.

[scribo]

The various talking heads on ESPN really aren't attacking Shady on this. They are saying even this perception is harmful for Chip Kelly.

 

They are taking some subtle swings at Rodak, wondering out loud why the story doesn't contain follow-up questions and answers. Either Rodak wasn't wise enough to pursue this more or he chose not to include whatever additional answers he did get. Either way, very bad on Rodak.

[Kelly the Dog]

Um, Murray led the league in rushing for the most popular team in the country. And I hope you're not conflating "outspoken" with some misguided notion of racial authenticity, which I would bet is the logic underlying McCoy's quote.

I'm not talking in any way about how good Murray is. He's not uppity. He's not outspoken, doesn't grab headlines. Until last year you hardly heard of him even though he was very good.

 

And I don't in ANY way think that authenticity is underlying in McCoy's quote. I think that's pretty offensive to say actually, and you're one of the ten people in my top five posters of all time here.

 

McCoy is talking more about bigness than blackness. And then because in his mind Kelly doesn't like bigness, it becomes (wrongly) a blackness issue to McCoy and Jackson and Steven A Smith (who often wrongly makes it racial) and others.

[ToGoGo]

Black stars added: DeMarcus Murray, Darren Sproles. Hoped-for-star who didn't pan out the way they hoped: Malcolm Jenkins.

 

Yolo put it best. He doesn't like black stars with "swag". I don't know how else to say it without being non-PC.

Um, Murray led the league in rushing for the most popular team in the country. And I hope you're not conflating "outspoken" with some misguided notion of racial authenticity, which I would bet is the logic underlying McCoy's quote.

 

You're still not getting the point.

 

 

The various talking heads on ESPN really aren't attacking Shady on this. They are saying even this perception is harmful for Chip Kelly.

 

I think because the "Chip Kelly is crazy" narrative is getting more clicks right now.

Edited May 6, 2015 by musichunch

[YoloinOhio]

 

Yolo put it best. He doesn't like black stars with "swag". I don't know how else to say it without being non-PC.

 

 

You're still not getting the point.

 

 

 

I think because the "Chip Kelly is crazy" narrative is getting more clicks right now.

see I think that is the problem in people not understanding - it is hard to explain it without being stereotypical of certain groups of black people. Even shady said something like "I can't explain it.." Because it's awkward to do so. On one hand you have TO and on the other you have Larry Fitzgerald, basically. Both the same race. Edited May 6, 2015 by YoloinOhio

[dave mcbride]

I'm not talking in any way about how good Murray is. He's not uppity. He's not outspoken, doesn't grab headlines. Until last year you hardly heard of him even though he was very good.

 

And I don't in ANY way think that authenticity is underlying in McCoy's quote. I think that's pretty offensive to say actually, and you're one of the ten people in my top five posters of all time here.

 

McCoy is talking more about bigness than blackness. And then because in his mind Kelly doesn't like bigness, it becomes (wrongly) a blackness issue to McCoy and Jackson and Steven A Smith (who often wrongly makes it racial) and others.

You're welcome to believe what you want to believe. What he said is factually wrong about black players in Philly in total (and Oregon, for that matter), and it does lead one to wonder what he might mean when he picks out two people who he implies have similar personalities and uses the term "black" to identify them - all the while ignoring the larger picture, which completely cuts against his argument. (And, btw, Jeremy Maclin, who put up identical numbers in 2015 to Jackson's 2014 numbers, was resigned by the Eagles prior to the 2014 season. He wasn't resigned this past season because of money reasons, not because the Eagles didn't want him. He got a huge contract from a team in his home state.)

 

If you don't think this is an occasional issue that crops up across the league, just think about the Percy Harvin/Russell Wilson situation and your own favorite, Ronnie Harmon. I'm not saying that McCoy has gone down this road (he appears to be a well liked player), but one has to wonder given the obvious evidence that stands against his claim. And maybe, just maybe, Kelly thinks that Alonso is a player with a better future than McCoy and a much more manageable contract? Philly's defense was terrible, after all. Couldn't McCoy just say that, yeah, he got traded for another really good player who is more of a need than him?

 

I like McCoy, and I'm glad he's on the team. He's really good. But he probably shouldn't keep saying the same thing when it is patently false. It raises questions about his judgment and--from that--the basis of his views.

 

Having said all of this, I don't think it's a big deal.

 

Yolo put it best. He doesn't like black stars with "swag". I don't know how else to say it without being non-PC.

 

You're still not getting the point.

 

I absolutely get the point. I just don't agree with the fundamental premise.

Edited May 6, 2015 by dave mcbride

[Kelly the Dog]

You're welcome to believe what you want to believe. What he said is factually wrong about black players in Philly in total (and Oregon, for that matter), and it does lead one to wonder what he might mean when he picks out two people who he implies have similar personalities and uses the term "black" to identify them - all the while ignoring the larger picture, which completely cuts against his argument. (And, btw, Jeremy Maclin, who put up identical numbers in 2015 to Jackson's 2014 numbers, was resigned by the Eagles prior to the 2014 season. He wasn't resigned this past season because of money reasons, not because the Eagles didn't want him. He got a huge contract from a team in his home state.)

 

If you don't think this is an occasional issue that crops up across the league, just think about the Percy Harvin/Russell Wilson situation and your own favorite, Ronnie Harmon. I'm not saying that McCoy has gone down this road (he appears to be a well liked player), but one has to wonder given the obvious evidence that stands against his claim. And maybe, just maybe, Kelly thinks that Alonso is a player with a better future than McCoy and a much more manageable contract? Philly's defense was terrible, after all. Couldn't McCoy just say that, yeah, he got traded for another really good player who is more of a need than him?

 

I like McCoy, and I'm glad he's on the team. He's really good. But he probably shouldn't keep saying the same thing when it is patently false. It raises questions about his judgment and--from that--the basis of his views.

 

Having said all of this, I don't think it's a big deal.

 

 

I absolutely get the point. I just don't agree with the fundamental premise.

Dave, maybe you didn't read the article. The question he answered was about stars. Specifically, "You told The Philadelphia Inquirer in April that Chip doesn't "like or respect stars." What was the problem with you and Chip, and how did that relationship end?" He was not at all talking about black players he was talking star black players.

[Dante]

I hate being forced into cheering for a person I don't like. I guess I won't be drafting him in my leagues.

[BuffOrange]

I hope he does well on the field, but this guy really is an idiot.

 

It's shaping up to be that sort of team. The anti-2011 easy to root for group. Hopefully the record is flipped too.

 

Good point by jw, I was thinking the same thing. Wonder what was left out...

 

John Wawrow ‏@john_wawrow 3m3 minutes ago

It's a half-quote full of intimation from McCoy, but no actual accusation. A follow up is required as in: "What exactly do you mean?"

 

Is that supposed to be when he snaps and just says the three magic words which he's not at all subtly already saying anyway?

 

On another note it's hilarious that he mentioned Stephen A., effectively using himself as a source.

"Yo SAS - I think this guy hates brothers. Don't put my name on it, but if you want to mention in it publically just in general...."

SAS - "People are talking....I'm not saying...I'm just saying."

3 months later...

"Like SAS said...."

Lol ok Shady.

Edited May 6, 2015 by BuffOrange

[Kelly the Dog]

 

It's shaping up to be that sort of team. The anti-2011 easy to root for group. Hopefully the record is flipped too.

 

 

Is that supposed to be when he snaps and just says the three magic words which he's not at all subtly already saying anyway?

 

On another note it's hilarious that he mentioned Stephen A., effectively using himself as a source.

"Yo SAS - I think this guy hates brothers. Don't put my name on it, but if you want to mention in it publically just in general...."

SAS - "People are talking....I'm not saying...I'm just saying."

3 months later...

"Like SAS said...."

Lol ok Shady.

They don't call him "Shady" for nuttin.'

[C.Biscuit97]

Black stars added: DeMarcus Murray, Darren Sproles. Hoped-for-star who didn't pan out the way they hoped: Malcolm Jenkins.

White guys who screamed the n word repeatedly kept: 1

 

Kelly wants to win. But keeping Cooper isn't a great look.

[BillsFanForever19]

I think Shady's right. But it's not about race. It's about Chip not wanting to deal with Superstars he himself didn't mold. He wants to create and take credit for his own stars.

[dave mcbride]

Dave, maybe you didn't read the article. The question he answered was about stars. Specifically, "You told The Philadelphia Inquirer in April that Chip doesn't "like or respect stars." What was the problem with you and Chip, and how did that relationship end?" He was not at all talking about black players he was talking star black players.

Dog -- I sure did read it:

 

"You see how fast he got rid of all the good players. Especially all the good black players. He got rid of them the fastest. That's the truth. There's a reason. ... It's hard to explain with him. But there's a reason he got rid of all the black players -- the good ones -- like that."

 

The best player on the Eagles remains black, and he was the best player on the team when McCoy and Jackson were both there: Jason Peters.

[Rob's House]

 

I mean, who is it embarrassing for? Bills fans? That's pretty selfish.

 

The guy has earned the right to speak his mind by being a star player. Agree or not, but that's how it goes. When a nobody talks, people say "who the heck is this guy, shut up and earn it on the field". Well this guy has earned it. We knew what we were getting when we brought him on board, the team is desperate to make him comfortable here, and he knows we're not going to shut him up. Rex and Whaley know we're lucky we even have him so they're going to deal with it. If you think about it, he's the closest thing we have to a star QB.

 

As for the fans on this board squirming because they're terrified of negative attention, I just don't really care. The man is an established star and veteran in this league and he feels like he was traded for some very shady (pun not intended) reasons. He's not the first star player to be traded by Kelly and there are apparently whispers from others in the league that agree with McCoy, who is the only one with the balls to speak out. Do you trust the NFL to handle it internally after the Rice incident. If anything, the Rice incident proved that the only way the NFL will act is if there is threat of public embarrassment.

 

There may not be any proof, but I know from experience that you know when somebody doesn't like you. You would tell your friends and they would say "really? what did they do? what did they say?". And you'll say "nothing, but I can just TELL that they don't like me". Sometimes it's all in the vibe. McCoy has had a lot of time to digest it and months later he's still talking about it.

 

If Kelly is really getting rid of star black players because he fears they'll talk back to him and he'll lose the locker room, well then, that should be out there. In my opinion solving social injustices are worth far more than having some negative attention affect the team. For me to tell McCoy to shut up because I get annoyed when players talk and it might affect our W-L column seems very petty and selfish to me when put into perspective.

This is the dumbest thing I've read this week. And I read some of gatorman's posts this morning.

 

He's embarrassing himself because he's gone over this ground a few times before.

 

I think McCoy does have a point with regards to the three black stars jettisoned out and Cooper still there. Chip has a perception problem among black players on that team I would imagine. The reality is probably more along the lines that Chip doesn't like other people getting the attention and Riley Cooper would never overshadow him because he doesn't have that kind of talent. Just because someone insinuates racism doesn't mean that that's what it is. It might just mean that Chip wants to be the peacock and he's getting rid of all the other potential peacocks. He might be looking for a "no name" team where he gets all of the credit. I don't know for sure what the deal is, but that's what I imagine it is.

What does Riley Cooper still being there have to do with anything? Is he a loud guy who gives the coach a lot of push back?

[Luka]

Chip does not want big personalities in the locker room. He doesn't want prima donas, whiners, etc. It's his team, if you can't handle that then you get traded or released. He's getting his point across to the rest of that locker room. It's either his way or the highway.

 

For McCoy to infer that Chip "got rid of" him and Jackson because they're black is probably the dumbest thing I've heard in a long time, and if this is how the black community sees the world than no wonder they are rioting and looting. Chip Kelly's mind and personality in a black man's body still trades McCoy. He obviously has a toxic personality. Should be fun to watch, and great trade Whaley. Could've had Tevin Coleman who actually fits the power running game Roman wants to employ. But nah, let's trade for a guy who cries racism because a coach doesn't like his douchey personality.

[Rob's House]

White guys who screamed the n word repeatedly kept: 1

 

Kelly wants to win. But keeping Cooper isn't a great look.

Looks like musichunch didn't hold the crown for long.

[C.Biscuit97]

Looks like musichunch didn't hold the crown for long.

Haha. I'm sure you have your pulse on the mind of young black players.

 

But I'm sure they are dumb because they don't agree with you. If black guys say it, why can't white guys, right?

[Rob's House]

Haha. I'm sure you have your pulse on the mind of young black players.

 

But I'm sure they are dumb because they don't agree with you. If black guys say it, why can't white guys, right?

It has nothing to do with whether I agree; it has to do with lacking a logical connection between the premise and the conclusion.

 

If you can explain how Riley Cooper fits into any of this, I'm all ears.

[NoSaint]

It has nothing to do with whether I agree; it has to do with lacking a logical connection between the premise and the conclusion.

 

If you can explain how Riley Cooper fits into any of this, I'm all ears.

Simply in that young teammates may draw the connection, Right or wrong- so In a common push in a lot of threads this week, the optics are bad, regardless of validity? Edited May 7, 2015 by NoSaint

[26CornerBlitz]

@AdamBenigni

#Bills Rex Ryan reaction to McCoy comments @wgrz http://www.wgrz.com/story/sports/2015/05/06/ryan-wont-muzzle-bills-after-mccoy-questions-chip-kelly/70903526/

 

[Rob's House]

Simply in that young teammates may draw the connection, Right or wrong- so In a common push in a lot of threads this week, the optics are bad, regardless of validity?

I suppose that's possible insofar as young guys with below median IQs and preconceived notions of racism may latch onto it, but I don't think any reasonably rational and intelligent people would take much away from that.

[Dopey]

White guys who screamed the n word repeatedly kept: 1

 

Kelly wants to win. But keeping Cooper isn't a great look.

Black guys who scream the same word repeatedly kept: my guess more than 1

McCoy was talking about outspoken loud black stars and Kelly.Cooper isn't black or a star and doesn't argue with coach. Cooper has nothing to do with this.

Don't coaches come in and make a ton of changes to bring in their kind of players all the time? McCoy seems hurt by the trade still.

Edited May 7, 2015 by Dopey

[TheFunPolice]

Chip Kelly is a control freak and dictator who wants yes men. He even had his old boss sent packing so he could run the entire show.

 

With Chip it's his way or the highway, except he really means it when he says it.

 

I think it's that simple.

[Lurker]

Public Service Warning:

 

Sully has weighed in with his brilliance on Shady's comments. I inadvertantly clicked on the column on the Snooze site, not knowing the author.

 

As Rob Lowe says in the Direct TV ads, "Don't be like this guy...Don't click the 'McCoy Revelations Have No Merit' link....

[Storm Front]

If McCoy had been traded for a black player, would he still be so upset?

[Deranged Rhino]

This year is going to be so much fun.

[NobesBLO13]

McCoy was on a team where they traded him when there's a guy like Riley Cooper who dropped the n word and violent threats against any black person, and kept him. I'm not black or understand being a minority but how can you not feel like WTF, as a minority?

 

Where are The NFL 'no more' ads about racism after Riley Cooper's n word drop?

Edited May 7, 2015 by NobesBLO13

[Rob's House]

McCoy was on a team where they traded him when there's a guy like Riley Cooper who dropped the n word and violent threats against any black person, and kept him. I'm not black or understand being a minority but how can you not feel like WTF, as a minority?

 

Where are The NFL 'no more' ads about racism after Riley Cooper's n word drop?

Aaand we have a new leader.

[YoloinOhio]

Not saying I agree but Shady is not the first former Eagle to feel this way

 

http://www.thescore.com/nfl/news/718016

[plenzmd1]

Aaand we have a new leader.

In the "makes sense post" ..I agree that post makes a ton of sense.

[eball]

And in the "surprises no one" department, Jerry Sullivan is critical of McCoy in today's editorial. I didn't click on it or read it, but I'm using my infinite powers of foreseeability.

[Rob's House]

In the "makes sense post" ..I agree that post makes a ton of sense.

I'm not sure which post you're referring to.