GG Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 If Rogers is cutting their payment by more than one-half, there;s no financial gain to offset losing home field advntage. Brandon however is locked in to this fiasco plus he would have to sell another 73k of ticket inventory insuring 4 tv blackouts next year. Rogers is playing hardball with him and everything will be done to their terms including no preseason games in Toronto. The TV blackouts don't hurt the Bills as much as they hurt the local TV stations. Ralph Wilson gets his share of NFL revenue (which is predominantly is from the TV contracts), come rain or shine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Rogers is playing hardball with him and everything will be done to their terms including no preseason games in Toronto. Selling them pre-season scrimmages was like selling a snow ball to a polar bear. Nice job, but might be more difficult the second time around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 At the end of season meeting with RW, who else will push for any change and encourage RW to do so? Rumor had it back in 2008 that Brandon pushed to have DJ fired. Brandon knows better than anyone that selling 45k+ season tickets with Nix, Gailey, and perhaps Fitz, is all but impossible. I've been hard on Brandon because he's something of a sycophant, but he's not the problem at OBD. He may, in fact, be part of the solution. The BinT series is not his fault, he just happened to find a billionaire, Rogers, and his stooge, Lind, to overpay for the product. I suspect Brandon will push RW to have Nix retired, Gailey, fired, and Whaley to assume the GM role. Who else depends more on the personnel people more for their own success? It's Brandon. Maybe the 1st time ever I've completely agreed with you. It's a festivus miracle. And as one of the most optimistic Bills fan still around, I will have a tough time buying any tickets if no major changes aren't made. With the schedule and all the expectations, this may have been the most disappointing Bills season in the last 13 years. It's been like a giant kick to the balls. Selling them pre-season scrimmages was like selling a snow ball to a polar bear. Nice job, but might be more difficult the second time around. Where in the world would a polar bear get money in the first place? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CodeMonkey Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Where in the world would a polar bear get money in the first place? Polar bears are cheap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRH Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 My high school classmate married him. Many of the folks who are closer to her than I am regard him as a complete d-bag. But that's second-hand information. I can only evaluate what he's done for this franchise. There are two ways to market a team. One is to do what Brandon has done. The other is to win. I guess the best you can say for him is that he's made winning irrelevant to whether the team stays here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Where in the world would a polar bear get money in the first place? Maybe he tweaked someone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillnutinHouston Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 So I guess that it has not been overly publicizied, but the new toronto series will call for 2 games, YES 2 games played in Rogers center each year, and that's somehow GOOD for Buffalo? How can Bills fans actually be so blind? Link, or stop the tantrum please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete This Account Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 How does Branden get away with his lies. Heres' from the Toronro Star: The announced attendance last Sunday, when the Seattle Seahawks pasted the ever-lousy Bills, was 40,770. A man who knows suggested “way under” 40,000 tickets were sold and tales of day-game giveaways are common Brandens not only a liar but an idiot. Get rid of him. JW from what i've been told, the attendance figure from the game against the Seahawks was the closest accurate figure they're released in regards to tickets sold since the series debuted five years ago. ... also, the game is controlled by Rogers, not the Bills, so it is on them to provide attendance figures. i'm not entirely sure why you pin this on Russ. jw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 from what i've been told, the attendance figure from the game against the Seahawks was the closest accurate figure they're released in regards to tickets sold since the series debuted five years ago. ... also, the game is controlled by Rogers, not the Bills, so it is on them to provide attendance figures. i'm not entirely sure why you pin this on Russ. jw John. Never argue with us fans. We know everything. Just ask us! Haha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atlbillsfan1975 Posted December 25, 2012 Share Posted December 25, 2012 Russ is what he is, a MARKETING GUY. The mistake was when Ralph Wilson had him as head of football operations a few years back with no GM in place. Russ is not a personel guy. He is very good at finding ways to promote the team and try to build the brand of Buffalo Bills Football. He is not the problem really. If anything he is being asked by Mr Wilson to go above and beyond his area of expertise. That is not Russ' fault. Mr Wilson needs to bring in a competent football person to run the football side of things. this person would work in conjunction with Russ on moves and things the team was making. Thus giving Russ a product to sell. Just my take on it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwight in philly Posted December 25, 2012 Share Posted December 25, 2012 from what i've been told, the attendance figure from the game against the Seahawks was the closest accurate figure they're released in regards to tickets sold since the series debuted five years ago. ... also, the game is controlled by Rogers, not the Bills, so it is on them to provide attendance figures. i'm not entirely sure why you pin this on Russ. jw +i think people are frustrated with the toronto money grab and brandon is the face of it, rightly or wrongly, hence it is on him.. who else could we blame? littman , ralph, overdorf somehow are invisible.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homey D. Clown Posted January 29, 2013 Author Share Posted January 29, 2013 I will never give up the fight, so with the terrible news of the abomination toronto series, I implore all Bills fans to come to their senses, and petition the team to rid themselves of the idiotic man behind this steam-pile. You now know who is really pulling the strings, so lets get the guy who is COMPLETELY RESPONSIBLE for stealing away a home game every year from loyal Bills fans, and crippling the team and doom it to failure. This can't possibly be about the money, since Erie County loses out in a massive way, and the revenue lost from actual stateside ticket sales is not offset by this ridiculous series, so seriously ask yourself WHY then are they doing it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 there is no way Russ Brandon fires himself. Only hope is a new owner and a house cleaning, if and when that happens... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 (edited) I will never give up the fight, so with the terrible news of the abomination toronto series, I implore all Bills fans to come to their senses, and petition the team to rid themselves of the idiotic man behind this steam-pile. You now know who is really pulling the strings, so lets get the guy who is COMPLETELY RESPONSIBLE for stealing away a home game every year from loyal Bills fans, and crippling the team and doom it to failure. This can't possibly be about the money, since Erie County loses out in a massive way, and the revenue lost from actual stateside ticket sales is not offset by this ridiculous series, so seriously ask yourself WHY then are they doing it? If Bills fans sold out every game I might agree. But we don't. PTR Edited January 29, 2013 by PromoTheRobot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 If Bills fans sold out every game I might agree. But we don't. PTR Honestly, what Bills fans do is absolutely amazing considering how the team does. But for all the crying about Toronto, our tickets are freaking dirt cheap. They are like half of major markets. Pats fans love coming to games at the Ralph because it's like pocket change for them. If you can steal $75 million again from Toronto and also prove they aren't ready to have their own franchise, why the hell not? Buffalo = smallest NFL market in the NFL. Buffalo + Toronto=top 5 market and better for the Bills to stay long term. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 (edited) Buffalo + Toronto isnt happening. Do you guys read the press up there or speak to actual Canadians? they want nothing to do with the Bills unless it is their own team Unless they were already Bills fans, and they hate the series too and prefer games in WNY Edited January 29, 2013 by May Day 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Bills Fan Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 If we can use the money made from this towards signing free agents then I guess I am ok with it. Also, would having this series make it harder for the team to be moved? CBF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 Buffalo + Toronto isnt happening. Do you guys read the press up there or speak to actual Canadians? they want nothing to do with the Bills unless it is their own team There are a ton of people from Southern Ontario who comes to Bills games as fans. I think it is like 20% maybe. So you throw them a bone once a year. And honestly, if it did help get Mario, who cares that we couldn't see the Seahawks? For the record, most Canadians hate the Toronto game because tailgating there sucks. Not my favorite thing in the world, but who cares if they don't give up a division game? Just put the least attractive team on our schedule up there and steal their funny looking money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 you should be THANKING russ...... with Toronto the bills are the 4th largest NFL market...... without Toronto the bills will be the 2nd largest NFL market.......when they move to Los Angeles.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffBill Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 Not sure you can totally blame it on Brandon, sure Ralphy has a say in the money he pockets. If it were me, Brandon would have already been gone for keeping Buddy Nix around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brenty Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 First, I don't think a petition will ever get a guy fired. Also, when RW passes, and team is sold, I believe he will get fired then. Just wait a year or two. Not hoping RW dies, I never wish anyone dies, just looking at it at the big picture. He dies, team gets sold, new everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 Ralph just named him Team President. Who's going to fire him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snorom Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 (edited) LMAO at this thread I hate the Toronto series too, but it produces huge money that no NFL owner would pass up for any reason. Fact is the Toronto series ads huge revenue to Bills, and Russ would never be fired for increasing profit margins. The Bottom line is all that matters in any business, and profits are up. and Nix should not be fired regardless of what the knee jerks around Bills town think. Edited January 29, 2013 by Snorom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 I thought Ralph's monetary influence was gone, and winning was the only thing that mattered in the "Brandon era" (which really started the day Donahoe was sent packing). all smoke and mirrors Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snorom Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 I thought Ralph's monetary influence was gone, and winning was the only thing that mattered in the "Brandon era" (which really started the day Donahoe was sent packing). all smoke and mirrors seriously.. When in a capitalistic society has money/profits ever been 2nd to anything Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
offsides#76FredSmerlas Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 (edited) You can't blame the people of Toronto for hating the Bills. I mean we give them a terrible product and they are not Buffalonians. I sometimes can't stand the fact that I was born in Buffalo because now I am a Bills fan for life and except for a brief time in the late 80's, early 90's we have sucked. Buffalo is 1-4 during the regular season in Toronto and last season we got smoked by Seattle. We give the people of Toronto no reason to like us. If we went up there and built a winning tradition or played competetive football we might have won some people over but that has not happened and playing on this neutral field doesn't help our team when there is no crowd behind them. It's obvious the Bills organization is more worried about the buck than the win because we take away home field advantage by going to Toronto. I also believe it has a negative affect on the players because they know they are not welcomed and they feel they like they shouldn't be there, ask Woods! Edited January 29, 2013 by offsides#76FredSmerlas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mousetrap08 Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 This miserable toronto series is BY FAR the worst thing to happen to the Bills in their entire sports history, it is an embarrassment to the team, the city of Buffalo, and has become a national punch line. After listening to Russ Brandon on the radio, it is VERY clear he is clueless to what this team needs to be successful, and does not care what fans, player, or anyone with common sense in the media have said. he continues to claim the game is a success, but even Canadian callers admit that they left the game this past Sunday NOT because the Bills were losing, but the experience was a complete bust. I would like to publicly petition his removal, and get someone who knows that a team that plays less home games than the rest of the league will never be successful. The formula is simple, win games and the stadium will sell out in Buffalo, THE END. If the team plays better, the atmosphere will never favor the Bills at rogers center, so what is the point? the answer is painfully obvious, it is simply a cash grab with no regard to the team's loyal fanbase. There are simply so many other ways to bring fans and corporate support to the team from Toronto, like possibly SELL naming rights to a toronto based business? SELL luxury suites and packages to toronto based businesses? SELL advertising to toronto based businesses? SELL tickets and travel packages to toronto residents? GOOD LORD that can't possibly help the team!! NO, Instead, give away a HOME game where they Bills are at a DISADVANTAGE!!! Think the team's long term survival in Buffalo is the reason for this abomination? Then why is the City's name not present in the promotional material? "Bills in toronto series" is everywhere, but nowhere is it called the Buffalo Bills in toronto. Ignore the facts if you want, but I simply don't know how anyone can fool themselves into thinking this is good for the city of Buffalo or the Bills anymore, I thought we were all smarter than that. After hearing Russ on the radio this morning, I am convinced he is on a mission, and completely ignoring the obvious. FIRE RUSS BRANDON NOW!!! NOTE - I.M. me your name and I will add it to the list, also if you'd like to add some brief comments, I will create a spot for your voice to be heard. ALSO - SIGN THIS PETITION IN THE LINK PROVIDED BELOW: https://www.change.o...-toronto-series Lets stand up and stop this embarrassment and get our team back before it's too late!!!! Oh gee another poster who thinks he knows it all.Go get a job in the NFL so you have some sort of creditably if any team hires YOU! for your so called expertise then I will sign anything you want. Like the "Coach" Chuck Dickerson use to say " I think you picked your nose and scratched your brain." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hondo in seattle Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 Buffalo is, as I recall, the 3rd smallest market in the NFL. Green Bay is smaller, but Green Bay represent the whole state of Wisconsin and is owned by their fans. The Packers aren't moving. I think Jacksonville is also smaller and Jax fans also worry about losing their team. There are bigger cities out there, LA prominently among them, that don't have NFL franchises. Worse, the Buffalo market is stagnant while other cities enjoys healthy growth and prosperity. 100 years ago, Buffalo was perhaps the 10th biggest city in the US. Now the Buffalo metro area is about 40th, and it's only going to drop further down that list. Let's not forget that ticket prices in Buffalo are among the lowest in the league - if not the absolute lowest. While this is good for fans, it sucks for the Bills as a business. The smallish Buffalo economy just doesn't support a higher price point for tickets. Why would a billionaire owner want to keep a billion dollar franchise in a non-growth market when there are - financially speaking - much better options out there? Russ is doing everything he can to answer that question. If he succeeds in creating an active fan base in Toronto and Rochester, we may actually have some hope of keeping the Bills in Buffalo long term. If he fails, I seriously worry about the consequences. I'm not signing the petition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 it sounds like people are arguing for the team to move. While the Sabres try to sew good will with the fans and know how to strike the right notes. They sell millions of merchandise in days coming off the lockout, and also pretty much sell out the season. I also notice many new sponsors inside the arena. Thats what effort brings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xsoldier54 Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 You can't blame the people of Toronto for hating the Bills. I mean we give them a terrible product and they are not Buffalonians. I sometimes can't stand the fact that I was born in Buffalo because now I am a Bills fan for life and except for a brief time in the late 80's, early 90's we have sucked. Buffalo is 1-4 during the regular season in Toronto and last season we got smoked by Seattle. We give the people of Toronto no reason to like us. If we went up there and built a winning tradition or played competetive football we might have won some people over but that has not happened and playing on this neutral field doesn't help our team when there is no crowd behind them. It's obvious the Bills organization is more worried about the buck than the win because we take away home field advantage by going to Toronto. I also believe it has a negative affect on the players because they know they are not welcomed and they feel they like they shouldn't be there, ask Woods! I agree. Why would fans in Toronto rally around the Bills when it is not their team and the Bills have pretty much stunk up the Rogers Centre every time they have gone there to play? Maybe if they went up there and put on a good show, they might actually win some fans and support and the atmosphere would be different. This makes sense for the team from a financial standpoint and it is up to the team to go up there and perform and win over the fans. So far they have given them very little reason to come onboard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T master Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 Travis Tritt has a song titled "It's All About THe Money" & that is what this is about & it along with the regular season at the Ralph will be much better when the Bills start to win more. But the proof is in the pudding as they use to say ! This new venture is looking kind of suspect but i will be rooting for the boys in blue . I hope that Brandons first appointee is not what it seems to some of us fans, i wm taking the wait & see attitude in hopes that i am proved wrong !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPS Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 russ brandon is a big reason why the bills have a chance to stay here after ralph goes to the big fieldhouse in the sky show me a petition to give him a raise and ill sign that one ick. My question is: who would said petition be addressed to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clearwater cadet Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 Your looking at it the wrong ways, playing one game in toronto is not going to prevent the team from winning, and if it helps the expand the fan base, more power to it. You have to remember there are 31 other owner that want the bills to as profitable as possible, expand the game to canada, and don't want to share there revenue with under performing teams. These owners will have a say who the next owner of the team will be, regardless what happens on the field the Bills have to demonstrate that they looking to bring in other revenue sources to expand the fan base, and make the league more profitable as a whole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuTheFat Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 Per the news releases, the Bills make more than double their usual take for each game in Toronto. Think about it this way... if a potential new owner who sees this contract in place, what does this do to the odds he will move the Bills out of Buffalo? As much as you may hate the Toronto series, it may be one of the brightest spots keeping the team from moving out of town. Add in the new stadium lease and you begin to realize that a certain 94-yr old owner is actually doing a great deal to keep Buffalo from losing their team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88what Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 20 to 30 percent of bills fan come from Canada, could buffalo even survive without if you banned canadians from the Ralph. And didn't the last toronto series bring Mario Williams to toronto, maybe there looking to get another guy..... The op. Is a cry baby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McBeane Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 20 to 30 percent of bills fan come from Canada, could buffalo even survive without if you banned canadians from the Ralph. And didn't the last toronto series bring Mario Williams to toronto, maybe there looking to get another guy..... The op. Is a cry baby Whoa... who ever talked about banning Canadians from the Ralph??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyanC883 Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 you dont think they have attempted to SELL luxury boxes to toronto business? you dont think they try to SELL advertising to toronto businesses? lol.... maybe im in the minority, but im FINE with "giving" away a home game to Toronto every year if it keeps generating revenue to the Bills and allows them to stay in Buffalo (even though at this point id be glad if they move to LA/London) - its expanding the Bills market/reach - the same thing they are doing by holding training camps in Rochester, expanding the brand to try and generate as much revenue as possible so the Bills can remain viable in a small city market like Buffalo....its playing one game on a neutral playing field instead of a home game....whats the big deal if its whats keeping the Bills economically viable and in Buffalo full time? Personally I think Brandon is a master at marketing and making money for this team....thank god hes not running the football side of the operation anymore, but as far as the business side....hes solid in my opinion (the ownership needs to be decided, unfortuantely meaning Ralph has to die, before any real "change" happens at OBD) I agree with you. He continually sells out games for a team that has not been to the playoffs in 13 years. Taking our your frustration on someone who has nothing to do w/ the poor quality of play over the past 13 years while trying to increase the fanbase in a shrinking city that is on economical hard times is absurd. We need the Toronto money, and the move that Brandon has made to get more fans from Rochester and CNY (which is largely lost on the anti-Brandon crowd). We need to regionalism, that is the TRUTH. You may not like it, you may wish that the economy and population of Buffalo was not shrinking, but they are. Fact is, if it weren't for Brandon recognizing this, this team would have no hope for a future in Buffalo. Whoa... who ever talked about banning Canadians from the Ralph??? Without the efforts to reach out to the CA fan-base, the Canadians would not come to the Ralph. Buffalo is, as I recall, the 3rd smallest market in the NFL. Green Bay is smaller, but Green Bay represent the whole state of Wisconsin and is owned by their fans. The Packers aren't moving. I think Jacksonville is also smaller and Jax fans also worry about losing their team. There are bigger cities out there, LA prominently among them, that don't have NFL franchises. Worse, the Buffalo market is stagnant while other cities enjoys healthy growth and prosperity. 100 years ago, Buffalo was perhaps the 10th biggest city in the US. Now the Buffalo metro area is about 40th, and it's only going to drop further down that list. Let's not forget that ticket prices in Buffalo are among the lowest in the league - if not the absolute lowest. While this is good for fans, it sucks for the Bills as a business. The smallish Buffalo economy just doesn't support a higher price point for tickets. Why would a billionaire owner want to keep a billion dollar franchise in a non-growth market when there are - financially speaking - much better options out there? Russ is doing everything he can to answer that question. If he succeeds in creating an active fan base in Toronto and Rochester, we may actually have some hope of keeping the Bills in Buffalo long term. If he fails, I seriously worry about the consequences. I'm not signing the petition. A well-though out response! I'd rather send Brandon a thank you card for his efforts than sign this poorly though out petition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 So Brandon sells out the stadium on a constant basis, but Buffalo is too poor and insignificant to support anything nice. Dont tell that to the Sabres or their fans though because they are marketing the right way, by giving the fans pride in the team and themselves, not constantly driving home the image that that are inferior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malazan Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 it sounds like people are arguing for the team to move. While the Sabres try to sew good will with the fans and know how to strike the right notes. They sell millions of merchandise in days coming off the lockout, and also pretty much sell out the season. I also notice many new sponsors inside the arena. Thats what effort brings. Did they sell enough merchandise to pay the 7 million to Vanek? You don't know anything about the Sabres financials. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 (edited) Did they sell enough merchandise to pay the 7 million to Vanek? You don't know anything about the Sabres financials. the Sabres lose money. The owner doesnt care. He wants to win. As a result, they are able to raise prices and people are spending more. With a more favorable CBA, they might make money. The team markets better in print, on TV, and amongst the NHLPA. Then you have Russ Brandon who during his self promoting P.C. borrowed the same exact lines that Pegula used when he bought the team. It is all B.S. It is also nearly impossible to lose money in the NFL Edited January 29, 2013 by May Day 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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