Mini-Camp: A James Cook Barometer

[EasternOHBillsFan]

10 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

You're flat out drinking Haterade if you think Ty Johnson is "our best all around back". That's like saying Cam Lewis is our best all around DB bc you can put him all over the field.

 

James Cook is Josh's best Offensive Playmaker period. Ty Johnson is a 2.5m a year RB. A good blocker with some Receiving skills - but not NEARLY the weapon that Cook is.

 

If Cook was the best by far then he would get a vast majority of the touches and the contract he desires. You are making this personal when it is just business... why pay a guy who is in a rotation that much a season when you have two fully capable RBs on the roster? 

Edited Wednesday at 01:55 PM by EasternOHBillsFan

[BillsShredder83]

20 hours ago, eee1776 said:

How about someone being honorable enough to play out the contract he signed.

I don't blame him at all. RBs have like a 5 year shelf life... and 1st rders get 5 year rookie deals (i know cook was 2nd). Nflpa will have to renegotiate the RB rookie contracts to ever get this fixed.

 

Cook is worth a raise, and someone will give it to him, just not us and shouldn't be.

 

Our OL parts the damn red sea. Im ready to see Ray Davis take the crown here. Dude finished the season with nearly as many yards and more receiving TDs than Cook, with probably 25% of the snaps. He can pass block. Running the ball won't be a problem, and Davis will do more in the pass game.

 

Why in tf would we pay Cook? Absolutely insane. No hyperbole trade him at the top of his value. Laugh all you want but Ray is a better fit for our run game too IMO. Ready to get roasted 🤷

[BillsShredder83]

17 hours ago, The Wiz said:

The difference is that when Beane says "I don't want my 60m dollar QB just handing off to a 20m dollar RB" he's got a good point.  Unlike Joe Schoen talking about Daniel Jones.

 

I don't think Cook is going to get the same level of production.  Probably 10-11 TDs is my guess.  I think the problem that Cook doesn't realize is that just like with Barkley, he's running behind one of the better O-lines in the league.  The second he gets his 20m and goes to a team like the Pats/Colts, his production is likely going to fall off a cliff.

Bingo. He is not a back that can run behind a weak line. 0 power. Hes only dangerous staying clean in the backfield and through the hole into the secondary... eating once in the secondary is a real skill set, just not one we have the luxury of paying for. 

 

Give that $$ to a WR or somewhere else next year. I'll die on that hill

[GunnerBill]

7 minutes ago, BillsShredder83 said:

 

 

Why in tf would we pay Cook? Absolutely insane. No hyperbole trade him at the top of his value. Laugh all you want but Ray is a better fit for our run game too IMO. Ready to get roasted 🤷

 

No he isn't. Not even close. 

2 minutes ago, BillsShredder83 said:

Bingo. He is not a back that can run behind a weak line. 0 power. Hes only dangerous staying clean in the backfield and through the hole into the secondary... eating once in the secondary is a real skill set, just not one we have the luxury of paying for. 

 

Give that $$ to a WR or somewhere else next year. I'll die on that hill

 

He has elite vision. He sees gaps that other backs, including Davis, miss. 

[Dafan]

34 minutes ago, BillsShredder83 said:

"I don't blame him at all. RBs have like a 5 year shelf life... and 1st rders get 5 year rookie deals (i know cook was 2nd). Nflpa will have to renegotiate the RB rookie contracts to ever get this fixed."

 

This is one statement that people take out of context way too much.  Decent RBs play for a lot longer.  A lot of RBs come into the league and only last a couple years....not because if injuries, but because of quality.  

 

[longtimebillsfan]

12 hours ago, Ya Digg? said:

He’s been a team player for 3 years! This is a negotiating tactic and as a running back he gets one shot at this. You’re making it sound like he’s the first guy to ever do this. 
 

Your reaction is valid as a fan, but it’s why you’re a fan and not an executive or agent. He’s not being pouty or a child, it’s actually a calculated strategy. If he gets hurt, it diminishes his value, so he is minimizing risk. I’m sure the team would like to see him there, but they aren’t taking it personally-it’s business

 

I highly doubt he will be there next week, and don’t be surprised if he misses a couple of days of training camp. That being said, he will end up in training camp, some very misguided fans will boo him, he will be there opening day and he will play hard for a contract if he doesn’t get one during training camp. He knows sitting out games isn’t going to get him paid big money

I have been around long enough to see this tactic play out many times.  It seldom generates the desired long term results. 

 

Every player is risking injury every time they step on the field.  It's part of the game.  That is part of the reason why the average NFL career is about 5 years or so.

 

In my opinion, Cook is over valuing his worth and is hurting his reputation by his actions.

 

In most cases, giving a rb a second huge contract is a mistake.  I know, you can argue that it worked out for the Eagles and the Ravens, but their success was not mostly driven by their rbs.  Those teams are loaded.

Edited yesterday at 12:07 AM by longtimebillsfan

[Rocky Landing]

5 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I don't know what he is drinking but it has sent him loopy if he thinks anyone other than James Cook is the Bills best back. 

 

 

That may well be true, but Ty Johnson is the better receiver.

[Paup 1995MVP]

21 hours ago, transient said:

I don't necessarily think it changes Cook's asking price. In addition to being a reflection of his talent, Henry's contract is also a reflection of the fact that he's a RB over 30 with a lot of wear. It's the highest contract in league history for a RB over 30.

Henry is a unicorn.  He is still top 3 in the NFL even at age 30.  He is getting what he deserves. 
 

James Cook is a nice RB.  But he isn’t changing the landscape of the NFL.  I think the Bills may offer $35 mill for 3 years tops.  And that’s a very fair contract for him.  If he won’t take that, he may not play for the Bills again.  
 

And we won’t miss him.  Because there are a lot of guys who would run very well behind our O line.  And if we have to become a more passing centric team w/o Cook we will be that.  

[RiotAct]

12 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

You're flat out drinking Haterade if you think Ty Johnson is "our best all around back". That's like saying Cam Lewis is our best all around DB bc you can put him all over the field.

 

James Cook is Josh's best Offensive Playmaker period. Ty Johnson is a 2.5m a year RB. A good blocker with some Receiving skills - but not NEARLY the weapon that Cook is.

the fact that you got 4 “disagree” reactions to this post is a little concerning, and makes me wonder how much those people really watched the games last season.

 

(unless you want to make the syncophantic argument that Josh Allen is actually Josh Allen’s best playmaker…  )

[HamptonBillsfan]

22 hours ago, dcinmuncie said:

if king Henry is worth 15 million, james is not. that contract really hurt his value, IMO

Are you forgetting Cook is only 25 and he outplayed Henry in the divisional head to head in the biggest game of his career.Give Cook more touches  and you’ll see more production in yardage and TDs. Beane is mishandling this negotiation. He could have had him for $42 for 3 years with $35 guaranteed. How many mediocre backs have we had since Thurman. Even Lynch, who was good, was crazy when he was here and had to go. Sign Cook before he has another great year and he becomes even more expensive.

[Captain Hindsight]

17 hours ago, PrimeTime101 said:

To the bolded. Preparation is key.. saying the FO people don't give a damn is the furthest from the truth... 

 

JS.. 

Nobody cares about an elite player like Cook missing a practice in June. I'll be concerned in late August. Until then, this is just how the NFL is sometimes 

[The Firebaugh Kid]

They'll get a deal done before camp. Just a hunch. 

[ShakAttack]

23 hours ago, dcinmuncie said:

if king Henry is worth 15 million, james is not. that contract really hurt his value, IMO

 

Hodor...... Henry is worth 15 million, yes......at age 31.  

 

Cook is 25 and prime age for a RB.  

 

Henry at 25 would be more than 15 mil in today's (new) RB market.

 

I'm not so sure that this contract hurt James value as much as some may believe.

 

 

[transient]

57 minutes ago, Paup 1995MVP said:

Henry is a unicorn.  He is still top 3 in the NFL even at age 30.  He is getting what he deserves. 
 

James Cook is a nice RB.  But he isn’t changing the landscape of the NFL.  I think the Bills may offer $35 mill for 3 years tops.  And that’s a very fair contract for him.  If he won’t take that, he may not play for the Bills again.  
 

And we won’t miss him.  Because there are a lot of guys who would run very well behind our O line.  And if we have to become a more passing centric team w/o Cook we will be that.  

Not disagreeing on him getting his due, moreso that I think if he was still in his 20s he'd be getting closer to Saquon money. IMO, Henry's current contract is discounted for age.

[PrimeTime101]

55 minutes ago, Captain Hindsight said:

Nobody cares about an elite player like Cook missing a practice in June. I'll be concerned in late August. Until then, this is just how the NFL is sometimes 

agree 100% on this entire statement

 

August is when he needs to show up... and not just show up at game 1.. thats silly talk..

[Einstein's Dog]

7 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I don't know what he is drinking but it has sent him loopy if he thinks anyone other than James Cook is the Bills best back. 

 

There were definitely rumours that the Bills allowed his agent to explore trade options in the spring pre-draft. If there was a deal that made sense for us, another team and Cook it would have happened in that window. It didn't, and I don't think as such there is a trade that makes sense at this point. So he will play. 

What about an in-season trade?  I would like to get back to where the Bills pay the WR1 and not the RB1. 

 

Trade J Cook for a good WR.  Trying to think of possibilities, maybe J Cook for C Olave (Olave shows he's back from injury and after Kamara gets injured) or Cook for G Pickens.  Or J Cook for DJ Moore if/when Chicago fails to meet the new lofty expectations.  Something like that.

[NoSaint]

4 hours ago, FireChans said:

He did.

 

James Cook should do what's best for James Cook. If that means holding out to the last possible second to secure financial salvation for at least 2 generations of his family, so be it and good for him. 

the contract allows for skipping camp/mandatory activities, just with penalties.

 

Honor is as honor does.

oh I wont vilify him for it. I just also wont go all the way to the wall either. 
 

he signed a deal with rewards and consequences. If he’s ok taking the consequences, so be it. As a fan in this window, I’d be bummed if we get less than the best though

[GunnerBill]

14 minutes ago, Einstein's Dog said:

What about an in-season trade?  I would like to get back to where the Bills pay the WR1 and not the RB1. 

 

Trade J Cook for a good WR.  Trying to think of possibilities, maybe J Cook for C Olave (Olave shows he's back from injury and after Kamara gets injured) or Cook for G Pickens.  Or J Cook for DJ Moore if/when Chicago fails to meet the new lofty expectations.  Something like that.

 

Currently the Bills aren't paying either. They are paying the offensive line. 

 

Is an in season trade possible? Maybe. I just don't see a world where the Bills are in sell mode. If they want to add a receiver they will trade picks like last year IMO.

[Einstein's Dog]

3 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Currently the Bills aren't paying either. They are paying the offensive line. 

 

Is an in season trade possible? Maybe. I just don't see a world where the Bills are in sell mode. If they want to add a receiver they will trade picks like last year IMO.

Where I think it is mostly likely to come into play is if J Cook is on an undefined (possibly 11 week) "hold-in" and misses games.   And if, during the initial weeks of the "hold-in" R Davis and T Johnson perform admirably, Cooks days could be numbered. 

 

I could see this type of "hold-in"  being interpreted as a nuclear, Diggs dimensional diss to our FO and team, where they will not have him suit up as a Bill ever again. 

[appoo]

He's not gonna be here until the week before the season kicks off. 

 

It's the nature of the business.