So we're firing McD, right?

[DrDawkinstein]

5 minutes ago, RkFast said:

 

I understand. I agree Im not sure if there is a plug and play guy out there. And thats my overall point. A LOT of the chatter thats been out there is that there is. New HC and done deal, they win it all. I dont see that, especially in this sport. Thats MUCH more of a baseball or basketball type of thing. In football, which is a much more complex sport to coach and manage a team, you need to build the whole PROGRAM. And that takes a lot of time. 

 

 

Agreed in general. But there is a pretty well known stat that no Head Coach has won their first Super Bowl outside of the first 5 years with his team. So there is a bit to that "new HC, win it all". Far more so than "7th year Head Coach finally gets his act together".

[phypon]

With having to have so much roster turn over this offseason due to contracts, age, and cap, now is the perfect time to bring in a new regime and let them build the way they want to.  In my opinion, it would be the softest reset that you could possibly ask for.  Do it Pegs!!

[wppete]

Was hoping to wake up to news McDermott was let go. This team needs a change. A drastic change. 

[D. L. Hot-Flamethrower]

32 minutes ago, What a Tuel said:

 

Talk about dumb stuff? 

 

27-24 - Josh Allen and offense 4 plays 7 yards (fake punt)

27-24 - Defense causes fumble - touchback 

27-24 - Josh Allen and offense 3 plays -2 yards

27-24 - Defense forces Chiefs punt

27-24 - Josh Allen and offense drive down the field and come away with zero points

27-24 - Defense allows first down to end the game

 

But sure. The defense lost us the game.

 

So many opportunities for Josh to put this one away. He fell short. He will get back up and we will be in the thick of it next year.

Tuel rhymes with f_ _ l. I'm not going to bother arguing with someone who takes such a narrow view. Have a nice life.

[NoHuddleKelly12]

Tell me the obvious coaching blunder that led directly to this loss? If Stef, Trent, the entire D-Line and/or Bass do their job, you're not posting this poll, period. I thought the gameplan was as sound as it could be given the walking wounded on our D. This is the one year we have to give McD a pass--unless he was going to be able to suit up himself for the D, he did what he could, imho. We do need to desperately address WR in the offseason fwiw.  

Edited January 22 by NoHuddleKelly12

[BillsFanSD]

The result of this one particular game was due to injuries on the defense.  I don't fault McDermott for it.

 

I do fault McDermott for losing a bunch of gimmies earlier in the season.  They ended up not mattering, but each of those losses was unacceptable and there were several of them, along with some close calls (Giants, Patriots).  I don't think McD can get us over the hump, and I'm ready for somebody new.  Obviously that isn't going to happen -- just stating where I am as a fan.

[TheFunPolice]

The idea that there is a "story" out there, after the Tyler Dunne piece, that is still untold but would somehow be worse is intriguing and also infuriating. 

 

ESPECIALLY if Pegula knows about it. It's enough already. How many more years of Allen's career are we going to waste?

 

OR maybe it's another "he said, she said" thing that the team could explain away. 

[HappyDays]

5 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

Kelce and outside zone to get the linebackers (including Mr Miami retirement home) running laterally.

 

This only worked because McDermott chose to start Klein. Like I said before the game it should have been Dodson and Williams. When Williams was on the field we made a couple stops. We needed someone that could run laterally. Huge error by McDermott. I know you aren't going to agree with that but surely you can see that Klein was picked on all night.

[oldmanfan]

It is reasonable for Terry to ask McD what his plans are to get the team over the hump.  

Just now, HappyDays said:

 

This only worked because McDermott chose to start Klein. Like I said before the game it should have been Dodson and Williams. When Williams was on the field we made a couple stops. We needed someone that could run laterally. Huge error by McDermott. I know you aren't going to agree with that but surely you can see that Klein was picked on all night.

Mahomes would make a rookie look silly too.

[D. L. Hot-Flamethrower]

18 minutes ago, LarryMadman said:

No he didn't the QB played out of his mind and wouldnt let the team lose.

 

McDummie cant coach out of his mind as he is incapable of that.

People forget why we were even in the game.

[TheFunPolice]

1 minute ago, HappyDays said:

 

This only worked because McDermott chose to start Klein. Like I said before the game it should have been Dodson and Williams. When Williams was on the field we made a couple stops. We needed someone that could run laterally. Huge error by McDermott. I know you aren't going to agree with that but surely you can see that Klein was picked on all night.

 

and Shakir is really only playing due to Gabe's injuries. And look: guy making plays all over the field. 

 

It's a pattern with McDermott. He wants the experienced vets over all else. I get it to a point, but we need athletes on the field. IMO Elam did fine when he played but he never gets to play. 

[Billever76]

8 hours ago, longtimebillsfan said:

By your standards, every coach that did not advance their team to the conference championship should be fired.

 

This loss sucks.  I am as sick of losing to that punk Mahomes in the playoffs just like all of the Bills Mafia.  I just believe that McDermott is one of the best head coaches in our team's history.

 

It is absurd to call for the head coach to be fired after every loss.

 

What makes you think we will find a better coach if we do replace McDermott?

 

McDermott has us in the playoffs consistently.  The Bills are in the national spotlight.  And they are considered one of the top teams in the NFL each year.

 

You ignore all the successes McDermott has had with his time in Buffalo.

 

The Bills are not firing McDermott after this season.  With all the defensive injuries he has had to deal with, and beating several playoff teams during their 6 game winning streak.   This may be his best coaching season.

 

Also, name me a team that consistently beats the Chiefs in the playoffs?  There isn't one.  So why hold McDermott to an unrealistic standard?

 

Please accept that McDermott is not going anywhere.  He is not the problem.  

 

 

It's josh allen who has us on the cusp despite having a mid coach

[uticaclub]

4 minutes ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said:

Tell me the obvious coaching blunder that led directly to this loss? If Stef, Trent and/or Bass do their job, you're not posting this poll, period. I thought the gameplan was as sound as it could be given the walking wounded on our D. This is the one year we have to give McD a pass--unless he was going to be able to suit up himself for the D, he did what he could, imho. We do need to desperately address WR in the offseason fwiw.  

Didnt we give him a pass last year because of Hamlin? Its always something until its nothing

[HappyDays]

4 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

Mahomes would make a rookie look silly too.

 

But he didn't. Williams had two great plays. He stayed laterally with Mahomes to force him out of bounds at the LOS on the Chiefs last drive. That sideline to sideline speed made a difference there. He also had made a great play in coverage that the officials incorrectly called DPI on.

 

Maybe over the course of the game he would have been picked on too. But it's a huge playoff game against our nemesis. And McDermott, as usual, chose the safe comfortable option instead of shooting for the stars. Still waiting for that growth mindset to affect the guy preaching it.

 

Edited January 22 by HappyDays

[Billever76]

9 hours ago, Avisan said:

The Cover 2 shell came back into vogue because the current top QBs won't punish you for it.  The methodical ball control offense WORKS.  It wrecks the Cover 2 shell.  Slowly, but surely.  It worked all game.  We screwed ourselves on the final drive by gunning for the endzone instead.  If we had kept with that offense, we likely win the game.  Putting up 31 on that Chiefs D would have been an amazing feat, and that ball control offense would have done it.  We watched the Patriots pull it off year after year in that exact fashion, much to our despair.

Might as well trade allen if that's the box our coaches put him in...go get tua and run the two step drop and out offense 

[D. L. Hot-Flamethrower]

4 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

This only worked because McDermott chose to start Klein. Like I said before the game it should have been Dodson and Williams. When Williams was on the field we made a couple stops. We needed someone that could run laterally. Huge error by McDermott. I know you aren't going to agree with that but surely you can see that Klein was picked on all night.

We went way to long with AJ chasing Kelce before we made any adjustment. Even given the injuries, McD said the D, starting with him, didn't do enough. He's correct of course.

[LarryMadman]

1 hour ago, TheFunPolice said:

 

Well, IF the report of a mystery team being interested in Belichick but not having an opening is true maybe Pegula would do that.

 

To be clear, I would rather have Harbaugh but we're stuck right now. With Allen McDermott will always win enough games that "you can't fire the coach!" 

Hmmmm........bring in Belichick as HC for a couple years and Vrabel as DC and he takes over as HC when Belichick steps down.......leave Brady and let him install is own offense...........i'm on board 1000000% with this plan.

[NoHuddleKelly12]

Just now, uticaclub said:

Didnt we give him a pass last year because of Hamlin? Its always something until its nothing

I think we all can agree we've been served up the scalps (Frazier/Dorsey) for last year's failings and this year's iffy start--now if McD can't do it with the guys that are supposed to be out there, I would agree he's at the end of the line. But I just can't throw it all at his feet given the reality of what was on the field--or did we really expect Klein to find the fountain of youth 2 weeks into a comeback gig, or Williams to suddenly be a cagey vet to go along with his speed? We only have to look at how our D was doing before Milano got hurt, to see what could've been. 

[Joe Ferguson]

And why would you kick to tie it with 1:40 left? Mahomes only needed 13 ***** seconds to take the lead back. I rather have Allen to win or lose the game than Tyler Arse who has been incosistent. Again, sign of a feeble and moronic coaching by  McWimpy

Edited January 22 by Joe Ferguson

[HappyDays]

4 minutes ago, D. L. Hot-Flamethrower said:

We went way to long with AJ chasing Kelce before we made any adjustment. Even given the injuries, McD said the D, starting with him, didn't do enough. He's correct of course.

 

I just don't understand why we waited. It was obvious before the game. Put your two best athletes Dodson and Williams on the field or else Mahomes is going to play around with Klein all game. Put Siran Neal on Kelce like we have done successfully in the past. When we did these things late in the game we found success. But what exactly was the defensive gameplan at the start? And why does this same crap keep happening year after year in the playoffs?

 

Edited January 22 by HappyDays

[DrDawkinstein]

1 hour ago, TheFunPolice said:

 

With Allen McDermott will always win enough games that "you can't fire the coach!" 

 

This.

 

Allen is keeping us in Head Coach Purgatory.

[pocoboy]

I highly doubt they fire McDermott.

 

But Terry Pegula should look into his crystal ball and see where things are headed in the next two years. If you had any misgivings on McDermott's decisionmaking in the crucial moments, now would be the time to start building to the next run. You cannot let McDermott usurp even one more season of draft picks for his vanishing DL.

 

So that's what a smart man would do, go get your offensive-minded HC, let him draft replacements for Davis & Dawkins, clean up this salary cap a bit for 2024, probably still squeak into the playoffs with your generational talent at QB, and be ready to get back into elite talk for 2025 and beyond.

[GunnerBill]

10 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

This only worked because McDermott chose to start Klein. Like I said before the game it should have been Dodson and Williams. When Williams was on the field we made a couple stops. We needed someone that could run laterally. Huge error by McDermott. I know you aren't going to agree with that but surely you can see that Klein was picked on all night.

 

I saw Williams line up in the wrong place again too. He can run and hit but he has no idea where he should be or what he should be doing. 

 

I actually think @boyst is on to something with the use of Siran Neal earlier point. They only brought Siran in on some plays in the 4th Quarter. Leslie used him successfully against KC previously and I think that is an adjustment that they could have gone to sooner. That is the only thing I have read so far in terms of a "what could they have done differently on defence?" that I think there is merit in. They could have gone to that sooner. I am not persuaded that Williams was the answer. He solves one problem and gives you another. 

[Kirby Jackson]

7 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

But he didn't. Williams had two great plays. He stayed laterally with Mahomes to force him out of bounds at the LOS on the Chiefs last drive. That sideline to sideline speed made a difference there. He also had made a great play in coverage that the officials incorrectly called DPI on.

 

Maybe over the course of the game he would have been picked on too. But it's a huge playoff game against our nemesis. And McDermott, as usual, chose the safe comfortable option instead of shooting for the stars. Still waiting for that growth mindset to affect the guy preaching it.

 

Great post!!

 

I’ve been interacting with a lot of fish fans on Twitter lately (mostly talking 🗑️). That fan base is very much divided when it comes to Tua. It dawned on me today that our situation is almost the EXACT same but with our HC. While it’s true Tua is their best QB since Marino and McDermott is better than Jauron, are they good enough to win a title in this AFC? Each presents you with a relatively high floor but neither has approached the ceiling. I’m on team “move on from McDermott” because the clock struck midnight for my patience. He’s proven that he can consistently get to the divisional round. I’m sure, LOTS of people could do that with Josh Allen in his prime. Time to move on from Doug Collins and find our Phil Jackson.

[RousseauRage]

50 minutes ago, What a Tuel said:

 

Talk about dumb stuff? 

 

27-24 - Josh Allen and offense 4 plays 7 yards (fake punt)

27-24 - Defense causes fumble - touchback 

27-24 - Josh Allen and offense 3 plays -2 yards

27-24 - Defense forces Chiefs punt

27-24 - Josh Allen and offense drive down the field and come away with zero points

27-24 - Defense allows first down to end the game

 

But sure. The defense lost us the game.

 

So many opportunities for Josh to put this one away. He fell short. He will get back up and we will be in the thick of it next year.

You're not allowed to make sense in here!

[Billever76]

1 minute ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Great post!!

 

I’ve been interacting with a lot of fish fans on Twitter lately (mostly talking 🗑️). That fan base is very much divided when it comes to Tua. It dawned on me today that our situation is almost the EXACT same but with our HC. While it’s true Tua is their best QB since Marino and McDermott is better than Jauron, are they good enough to win a title in this AFC? Each presents you with a relatively high floor but neither has approached the ceiling. I’m on team “move on from McDermott” because the clock struck midnight for my patience. He’s proven that he can consistently get to the divisional round. I’m sure, LOTS of people could do that with Josh Allen in his prime. Time to move on from Doug Collins and find our Phil Jackson.

Meanwhile bill belichick is out there for the taking....Bill would win multiple superbowls with Josh allen

[Kirby Jackson]

1 minute ago, Billever76 said:

Meanwhile bill belichick is out there for the taking....Bill would win multiple superbowls with Josh allen

I think you’re right. Honestly, the Bills would be prepared every week. See if you could get him to hang around for 4-5 seasons. I’d love Vrabel as well. I just hate that these opportunities continue to slip by. 

[HappyDays]

3 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

I saw Williams line up in the wrong place again too. He can run and hit but he has no idea where he should be or what he should be doing. 

 

I would still take that over Klein moving through quicksand all night. You have to admit Klein was by far our weakest point of defense... Maybe Williams misses some reads in the game but at least he can move side to side. Klein can hit his spot 100% of the time and it won't matter as Kelce easily runs right by him.

 

And yes I mentioned Siran Neal covering Kelce before the game too. This is what troubles me - I am just an amateur fan and I knew what our game plan should have been. McDermott didn't figure it out until the 4th quarter when it was too late. We have seen this before. McDermott loses his nerve in the playoffs and goes soft with his defensive game plan, and it costs us. Fans have tried to blame Leslie Frazier. It was McDermott all along. He isn't learning.

[BernieBill]

22 minutes ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said:

Tell me the obvious coaching blunder that led directly to this loss? If Stef, Trent and/or Bass do their job, you're not posting this poll, period. I thought the gameplan was as sound as it could be given the walking wounded on our D. This is the one year we have to give McD a pass--unless he was going to be able to suit up himself for the D, he did what he could, imho. We do need to desperately address WR in the offseason fwiw.  

It's more of a general "by hook or by crook, the McDermott Bills find ways to lose winnable playoff games."  The "obvious coaching blunder" is the result, losing, at home, again.

[beer can shower]

So,  who is left in the playoffs.

KC Chiefs
San Fran 49ers
Baltimore Ravens
Detroit Lions
      All on Bills schedule for next year.

 

Wake up Pegula, McDermott and Bean had much more leeway than other regimes would have gotten and they just can't do it.

 

[DrDawkinstein]

2 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

I would still take that over Klein moving through quicksand all night. You have to admit Klein was by far our weakest point of defense... Maybe Williams misses some reads in the game but at least he can move side to side. Klein can hit his spot 100% of the time and it won't matter as Kelce easily runs right by him.

 

And yes I mentioned Siran Neal covering Kelce before the game too. This is what troubles me - I am just an amateur fan and I knew what our game plan should have been. McDermott didn't figure it out until the 4th quarter when it was too late. We have seen this before. McDermott loses his nerve in the playoffs and goes soft with his defensive game plan, and it costs us. Fans have tried to blame Leslie Frazier. It was McDermott all along. He isn't learning.

 

The bolded is the most troubling for all of us.

 

This isnt even hindsight. So many of us saw it coming. Surely, the Bills would see it too, and have some sort of scheme up their sleeve to change something up. But no.

 

And at this point, the Chiefs are pretty much a divisional game with familiarity. None of this should surprise our team. Yet we are left looking clueless each time.

[Billever76]

1 hour ago, TheFunPolice said:

 

Well, IF the report of a mystery team being interested in Belichick but not having an opening is true maybe Pegula would do that.

 

To be clear, I would rather have Harbaugh but we're stuck right now. With Allen McDermott will always win enough games that "you can't fire the coach!" 

You hit the nail on the head!..we have a qb that is every bit as good as brady,mahomes,montana,elway,manning yet he isn't put into those conversations bc we have the wrong coaches to get him there!..but his elite abilities will overcome allot of the coaching downfalls and make it appear we are on the cusp of greatness and the coaches just need 1 more player...1 more year...no injuries etc etc....by the time you realize the horrible mistake we have made allen is past his prime and his superbowl chances go up in smoke how marinos did smh

[boyst]

9 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I saw Williams line up in the wrong place again too. He can run and hit but he has no idea where he should be or what he should be doing. 

 

I actually think @boyst is on to something with the use of Siran Neal earlier point. They only brought Siran in on some plays in the 4th Quarter. Leslie used him successfully against KC previously and I think that is an adjustment that they could have gone to sooner. That is the only thing I have read so far in terms of a "what could they have done differently on defence?" that I think there is merit in. They could have gone to that sooner. I am not persuaded that Williams was the answer. He solves one problem and gives you another. 

Siran Neal as 2nd nickel man coverage on Kelce was doable. We went man coverage for this game. A bit surprising but I won't get into too much of that.

 

With 3 DL rotation we can put Klein in the middle to come down hill on anyone, Dobson at WLB and his speed can assist to make up for the weak side while Neal follows Kelce as SLB. The chiefs could move coverage with Kelce to the other side which would be interesting but if Poyer comes up to the box as the Jack basically making us a 3-4 defense we would be fine. Poyer spent a lot of time up at the line.

 

The 3-2-6 lineup:

3 DL

Klein & Dobson

Jackson - Neal - Johnson - Poyer - Hyde - Douglas

 

Let them run but shut down the pass. If they're in the RedZone buckle down and play with an extra DL vs Dobson

[SoonerBillsFan]

18 minutes ago, LarryMadman said:

Hmmmm........bring in Belichick as HC for a couple years and Vrabel as DC and he takes over as HC when Belichick steps down.......leave Brady and let him install is own offense...........i'm on board 1000000% with this plan.

No Brady.  Bring in somone who csn run the WCO. The rest I can live with

[BillnutinHouston]

SHOULD they fire and WILL they fire are two very different things.

 

I think Pegula is busy with his wife's situation and isn't looking for new projects (HC hiring) to take on at this time. 

[phypon]

25 minutes ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said:

Tell me the obvious coaching blunder that led directly to this loss? If Stef, Trent, the entire D-Line and/or Bass do their job, you're not posting this poll, period. I thought the gameplan was as sound as it could be given the walking wounded on our D. This is the one year we have to give McD a pass--unless he was going to be able to suit up himself for the D, he did what he could, imho. We do need to desperately address WR in the offseason fwiw.  

WGR has made some really good points this AM.

 

- Fake punt - horrible

- Not trusting the younger/more athletic players

- Fluctuating mindset between playing for a win and then a tie

- Fielding Sam Martin

- Perhaps trusting Bass

- Having Allen throw 16 passes behind the line of scrimage

- Playing a gameplan that is afraid to score fast

- Playing a gameplan with no faith in the defense (and he's the DC)

 

I'm sure there is more, but that's a good start.  And that's just this game, let alone the season or years past...

[HappyDays]

1 minute ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

The bolded is the most troubling for all of us.

 

This isnt even hindsight. So many of us saw it coming. Surely, the Bills would see it too, and have some sort of scheme up their sleeve to change something up. But no.

 

And at this point, the Chiefs are pretty much a divisional game with familiarity. None of this should surprise our team. Yet we are left looking clueless each time.

 

Excluding kneeldowns we gave up 8.5 yards per play... 3 yards per play more than what the Chiefs offense averaged all season... That is quite possibly the worst playoff defensive performance of McDermott's career. It is getting worse, not better. The only reason the Chiefs didn't put up 40+ is that we controlled the ball and TOP on offense, and we got saved once by the dumbest rule in sports. And this is likely to be the weakest Chiefs offense we ever see in the Mahomes/Reid era. So what is the reason to be optimistic that McDermott will suddenly figure it out against this team when it counts?

[Heavy Kevi]

1 hour ago, T master said:

 

What about Bass missing the game tying FG, what about Diggs dropping the pass that probably would have been a TD, what about Cook dropping another pass that hit him in the hands as he was once again WIDE OPEN with no body around him ? 

 

Yah that F N McD is a POS HC & he probably coached those guys to miss all that stuff yep it's all about the coach & has absolutely NOTHING to do with the players !!! 

 

There's a hole lot more to this loss and this season than the HC to reinvent a team with as many all pro starters out for the season as they had and to put a defense on the field with tape & bubble gum to get to the second round of the play offs . 

 

Never mind its useless ...

 

Yeah it's more than just this game or this year.

 

If it was isolated we wouldn't be having this conversation.

[Avisan]

27 minutes ago, Billever76 said:

Might as well trade allen if that's the box our coaches put him in...go get tua and run the two step drop and out offense 

Honestly this is just idiocy

 

Dink and dunk against the Cover 2 shell is what sets up the big shots you want to see, and it worked all night

[DrDawkinstein]

4 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

Excluding kneeldowns we gave up 8.5 yards per play... 3 yards per play more than what the Chiefs offense averaged all season... That is quite possibly the worst playoff defensive performance of McDermott's career. It is getting worse, not better. The only reason the Chiefs didn't put up 40+ is that we controlled the ball and TOP on offense, and we got saved once by the dumbest rule in sports. And this is likely to be the weakest Chiefs offense we ever see in the Mahomes/Reid era. So what is the reason to be optimistic that McDermott will suddenly figure it out against this team when it counts?

 

And even if McD somehow figures it out, who will be listening to his stale-ass message in that locker room next year?

 

I look forward to Diggs' meltdown in OTAs when he figures out it's Groundhog's Day all over again. Heck, make Diggs HC at this point.