Sherfield and Harty

[iccrewman112]

10 hours ago, Your Brown Eye said:

I had pretty elevated hopes for Sherfield, thought he could be a jack of trades in the pass and run game

Is it on Beane for bad acquisitions or on Dorsey for not utilizing the players properly?

[Chaos]

Harty is small and has average speed and average moves. Beane blundered on this one, not the coaches.  Sherfield could never be as good as Gabe Davis, in anyone wildest dreams.  That pretty much sums up why Sherfield has no impact. He is the definition of a JAG reciever.  Every team has at least two guys like these.  

[NoSaint]

7 minutes ago, iccrewman112 said:

Is it on Beane for bad acquisitions or on Dorsey for not utilizing the players properly?

Don’t forget fans needing to manage expectations? I think a little of all 3 issues depending on the player. 

 

honestly, I framed sherfield as a backup guy that we needed. Not producing a ton unless diggs or Davis missed time. I think that’s held true.
 

I thought harty would take over the whole mckenzie/Hines package. I’m now realizing that package may not have existed with Dorsey. That’s a real disappointment. I think he’d be great going horizontally, on crossers or end arounds… or out of the backfield on wheel routes. Get him against a linebacker and let him run away. 

[ganesh]

10 hours ago, Dubie54 said:

I really thought these two guys would help strengthen our receiving corps talent, based on what they had done recently in NO and MIA. They both played meaningful roles in those offenses and served as as strong contributors.

 

Harty had his breakout year in 2021 (he was hurt last year and saw limited action in 4 games), and no doubt we signed him based on his solid production in 2021. Besides being a solid return guy, in 2021 his receiving stats were:

                            36 rec        570 yds        YPC -  15.8         longest - 72 yds

 

 

 

I know there are those who will say why do you want to throw more to these guys when you have Diggs/Davis/Kincaid. Well Miami last year, found a way to use Sherfield even though Hill had 119 rec. and Waddle had 75 rec., and Sherfield was gaining 14 YPC. Harty played on a team in 2021 that had a very mediocre receiving corps (no Michael Thomas that year) so he was asked to play a larger. What really stands out to me is the YPC under the current Bills offense. That may be based on the fact that they have been targeted on check downs more this year than in years past, but I also think it's a clear reflection of the short pass Dorsey scheme. 

 

I think under a more dynamic offense, both of these guys could contribute more. Why sign guys like these if you don't plan to work them into the offense - just to use them as decoys?    

   

 

Completely agree.  We have paid a good amount of cash and our offense is not diverse enough to take advantage of their strength - speed.

[DuckyBoys]

i know Mcdermott wont do it but I'd give Shorter some reps when hes off IR  

[BananaB]

I’m glad I didn’t get fooled on this one.  Beane has whiffed on too many O players to buy into two guys with a combined 9 years experience and less than 150 catches between the two. To make it worse one of them is 5’6”. 

[Comebackkid]

1 hour ago, LABILLBACKER said:

We don't work any of these secondary wrs into the offense.  Hines, Harty & Sherfield have basically been invisible.  The money we spent on these 3 could've gone to an actual WR2.  Sorry Gabe.....

i dont know why they bother bringing in offense players most of the time.  its like they have tunnel vision when it comes to game planning.

[BarleyNY]

11 hours ago, Dubie54 said:

I really thought these two guys would help strengthen our receiving corps talent, based on what they had done recently in NO and MIA. They both played meaningful roles in those offenses and served as as strong contributors.

 

Harty had his breakout year in 2021 (he was hurt last year and saw limited action in 4 games), and no doubt we signed him based on his solid production in 2021. Besides being a solid return guy, in 2021 his receiving stats were:

                            36 rec        570 yds        YPC -  15.8         longest - 72 yds

 

The guy is quick and shifty and the Saints under Payton obviously found ways to utilize his speed and elusiveness. He was 2nd on the team in receiving yards.

 

Sherfield had his breakout year in 2022. Behind Hill and Waddle, he was 3rd on the team in receiving yards:

                           30 rec         417 yds         YPC - 13.9       longest - 75 yds

 

 

So far in 2023, here's they stand:

 

Harty:                13 rec       113 yds      YPC -  8.7     longest - 43 yds

Sherfield:           7  rec         53 yds      YPC - 7.6      longest -  9 yds

 

 

I know there are those who will say why do you want to throw more to these guys when you have Diggs/Davis/Kincaid. Well Miami last year, found a way to use Sherfield even though Hill had 119 rec. and Waddle had 75 rec., and Sherfield was gaining 14 YPC. Harty played on a team in 2021 that had a very mediocre receiving corps (no Michael Thomas that year) so he was asked to play a larger. What really stands out to me is the YPC under the current Bills offense. That may be based on the fact that they have been targeted on check downs more this year than in years past, but I also think it's a clear reflection of the short pass Dorsey scheme. 

 

I think under a more dynamic offense, both of these guys could contribute more. Why sign guys like these if you don't plan to work them into the offense - just to use them as decoys?    

   

 

 

The contracts that the Bills have signed players to rarely surprise me. Harty’s sure did. While 2/$9.5M (plus escalators) is not that big of a deal by today’s standards it was a lot more than I thought he was worth. I agree that the Bills were banking on him breaking out though I’m not sure what they saw to make them believe that. 

[NoSaint]

12 minutes ago, BarleyNY said:

 

The contracts that the Bills have signed players to rarely surprise me. Harty’s sure did. While 2/$9.5M (plus escalators) is not that big of a deal by today’s standards it was a lot more than I thought he was worth. I agree that the Bills were banking on him breaking out though I’m not sure what they saw to make them believe that. 

to be fair, they given you no opportunity to see what he could do 

[Since1981]

10 hours ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

You have a rocket armed QB that you drafted chained to a bunch underneath guys,

YES YES YES

rocket arm dude and you run two tight end sets all and have no John Brown to take advantage of said arm!!!???

[Dr.Sack]

Get Kincaid deeper 

[BarleyNY]

55 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

to be fair, they given you no opportunity to see what he could do 

 

I do not get why the Bills keep using resources to bring players here and then not even try to utilize them. It happened with Hines. That was a very odd situation. 

[John from Riverside]

16 hours ago, Bangarang said:

Harty played 3 snaps on offense on Sunday. Beane deserves criticism for that contract. 

You factor in the amount he’s being paid absolutely

[Eastport bills]

Harty is not a vertical threat anymore and that’s what he was brought in for. He’s not a return man and that’s what they’re asking him to do. We don’t have a Hines type replacement in house. Sherfield is a good slot receiver but in Dorsey’s offense, he’s invisible. This team is spinning their wheels but with Josh, they always have a puncher’s chance. 

[LabattBlue]

11 hours ago, DuckyBoys said:

i know Mcdermott wont do it but I'd give Shorter some reps when hes off IR  

Why?

[kkim0904]

Shakir should get deep routes and sherfield for quick slant opposite side of Kincaid.

Edited November 8, 2023 by kkim0904

[C.Biscuit97]

Like McKenzie, why do people think these bargain basement/ never produced at a high level receivers are going to magically turn into players you can count on? 
 

Unless you are trading draft picks or drafting guys, you are going to keep replacing a scrub with another scrub because they aren’t good enough. KC has the same problem but they are at least trying with the draft (Rice) or draft picks (Toney). 
 

with the money Allen makes, the days of 100+ threads for Hopkins are over. They just need to hit on some draft picks. Davis, as frustrating as he is, is a huge win in the 4th. Now do it with higher round picks.

[Xerx]

I think it's a safe bet when looking at other teams "breakout" players little limited historical data to support this at any level is to remember our own guys like this.

 

Just always remember Robert Foster

 

All teams have these guys in flashes 

[DuckyBoys]

2 hours ago, LabattBlue said:

Why?

Why not ?  Harty and Sherfield have produced virtually nothing unless you are stoked about 7 yds per catch Shorter is  a big target with upside who never reached potential in college  Talent is there  Don't think we need more undersized guys without any special attributes and Sherfield is the definition of a camp body  Nice story but yet to see one special play from him in the regular season  They whiffed on Harty period

[Gisele]

Our offensive mind doesn't know how to use anyone. If Allen wasn't the QB, he (Dorsey) would have already been locked out of the building.  We went from the team that had 11 different receivers getting catches in a game to an offense that can't even scheme to get their number 2 a single catch.  

[FilthyBeast]

I honesty don't know why these guys are even on the roster if we aren't going to use them.

 

I was high on Sherfield but looks like he might have been the biproduct of a loaded offense and genius coach in Miami. But Harty especially is yet another big swing and miss considering his contract and that he was a day one FA target.

 

 

[LabattBlue]

41 minutes ago, DuckyBoys said:

Why not ?  Harty and Sherfield have produced virtually nothing unless you are stoked about 7 yds per catch Shorter is  a big target with upside who never reached potential in college  Talent is there  Don't think we need more undersized guys without any special attributes and Sherfield is the definition of a camp body  Nice story but yet to see one special play from him in the regular season  They whiffed on Harty period

You are comparing two guys who while not being starters in the NFL, have experience, compared with Shorter who is a day 3 rookie who has done….nothing. 

[Shemp]

The Bills neuter new vet pickups.