Remaining Roster Battles

[Punching Bag]

15 hours ago, NewEra said:

He got cut.  He’s toast

 

15 hours ago, nosejob said:

Doesn't mean they won't put him on the P.S

 

Teams sometimes cut players early they want to put on PS.

They have seen enough, are good enough to develop but not worth protecting.

[ticketssince61]

16 hours ago, MasterStrategist said:

I like it and great analysis!

 

1. I think Crowder and Hodgins will make it

2. Jones for ST/gunner...he's just that good at that role

3. Last spot to me is a bit different, I think we keep 6 LBs (Spector for now, will be interesting when Smith suspsension ends) and opt for Lewis over Blackshear.  

 

Unless Blackshear is in the plans for a returner role, I think they try to stash him on the P/S.  I already think Dorsey will have his work cut out for him involving the top 3 RBs, and Lewis adds more value as a possible gunner and backup corner (especially with a bit of uncertainty with Tre's exact return, as of now).

 

 Agree - easier to stash a RB on PS than a DB

[RedDog3940]

If the Bills' front office likes Blackshear enough, they might try to trade Moss for some improved depth at OL or for future draft choice.  I like Moss, but I don't think he will get much playing time behind Singletary and Cook.

[Matt_In_NH]

2 hours ago, Robert Paulson said:

 

just looked it up: $3.5MM against the cap one way or another- he's staying and he is stealing

 

Actually there is conflicting info on overthecap vs spotrac for post june 1st cut.  According to OTC, they save 2.2M vs the cap if he does not make the team.   If that is true, then the second TE job is up for grabs.

[GunnerBill]

16 hours ago, khlax3 said:

I have seen mentioned in numerous thread the different position battles however I don’t know the remaining battles are position specific. 
 

As far as the specialist go I think those 3 are set. Arazia will be the punter. The only thing he had to prove to win the job was that he could hold and he has done that.

 

On defense I think there are only 2 open spots.

 

1 spot on the dline. The top 8 are set (miller, groot, Epenesa, basham, Oliver, phillips, jones, settle). That leaves 1 spot as I believe they will keep 9 total. There are 4 contenders for this spot. Lawson, Love, Bryant, Ankou.

 

The other spot I think is between a 7th corner and 6th linebacker and it comes down to Spector or Lewis (this could change after game 6 when smith comes of suspension) 

 

on offense I think the qb position is set and oline is set keeping 9 (Dawkins, saffold, Morse, bates, brown, quessenberry, Doyle, ford,

mancz)

 

The top 4 running backs are set with singletary, moss, Gilliam, and cook.

 

The top 4 wr are also set with diggs, Davis, McKenzie, shakir

 

The top 2 tight ends are Knox and Howard.

 

Rather than looking at the last 4 spots available by position I think it makes sense to look at it from ST value along with positional need. 2 of those 4 spots will have to be WR with the remaining 2 spots could be at wr if they keep 7, a 3rd tight end (we have Gilliam so it’s not a given we have to have 3) and I could see up to 6 running backs for ST value. Here are the guys competing for those last spot:

 

Twain jones

blackshear

Sweeney

morris

austin

hodgins

crowder 

kumerow

 

Based on the camp reports and preseason I am keeping jones, blackshear, hodgins and crowder. This gives the best mix of offensive talent and special teams ability. I think you can stash Morris and Sweeney on PS and go into games with 2 true TE and Gilliam
 

 

I think you are pretty much correct.... my only quibbles would be I'm not sure OJ Howard is a total lock. I think the Bills want him to be, and the contract would suggest it but boy, oh boy, he does not look impressive at all. I don't like it but I don't think it is beyond the realm of possibility that Sweeney retains that 2nd spot and Howard is cut. Remember the whole Jacob Hollister thing? We all presumed he was nailed on as the 2nd guy and he got cut.

 

I also don't think 9 DL is a total lock, though I agree that it is very likely given their history. But if Shaq doesn't seal that job they might feel comfortable that at least two of Love, Bryant and Ankou could be snuck through to the PS and then activated on gamedays if required? Maybe they even feel Shaq might make it to the PS? So I extend your defense question to Cam Lewis vs Spector vs 9th DL (2 out of 3 make it). I think this decision comes down to who is easier to sneak through to PS and while they have managed that with Cam Lewis the last two years, I fear he might get picked up off waivers now mainly because he can play inside / outside and last year he played 35% of the Bills special teams snaps. I could imagine a bottom feeder team looking at that versatility and saying "worth the risk."

 

As for the "final 4" as you have termed it.... I think Jones is pretty close to being locked in and then it comes down again to who you feel good about sneaking onto the PS - I think you feel good about Blackshear and Morris getting there so they miss the 53. Then Austin is out unless he wins the returner job (anyone know why he didn't play on Saturday? Is he injured?) so it comes down to the three receivers and Sweeney and one of them misses out. TBH if I was picking it'd be Sweeney, I just think he is a marginal NFL talent and we lack depth at outside receiver so I'd be willing to roll the dice on Hodgins. 

 

 

[Robert Paulson]

2 hours ago, SCBills said:

He’s at a premium position.  If you draft a guy and can stash him until time runs out, you do so.  
 

Look at Hodgins .. in the program for 2 years and is now pushing for a roster spot with one more cheap year on his deal after this year.  

 

We need as many dirt cheap contract contributors as possible with Josh Allen graduating from his rookie contract moving forward.  

Yea, but they have to show something.  This kid has shown nothing except being the next irrational hope.  What has he shown after 3 years except dropping the ball and being hurt. Hodgkins has had great camps at least. 

 

We latch onto guys with no promise because we want/hope to be right about them. 

 

 You should buy his jersey.  Does he have a consistent number?

[HiMark]

3 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

Every year after one preseason game, this board falls in love with a player.

Blackshear had a nice game like many before him.

 

I don’t see a spot for him.  Singletary, Moss and Cook I believe will be our 3 RB’s.  Taiwan will be our 4th reserve RB and main special teams ace.

 

We won’t keep 5 RB’s.

Gilliam will be our 5th rb, as well as our 3rd TE.  open question who will be our 2nd TE.  Blackshear will make it to PS, count on it.

[Robert Paulson]

1 hour ago, Matt_In_NH said:

 

Actually there is conflicting info on overthecap vs spotrac for post june 1st cut.  According to OTC, they save 2.2M vs the cap if he does not make the team.   If that is true, then the second TE job is up for grabs.

If true, that is great news

[HiMark]

Roster ?'s

QB: Barkley now in play vs Keenam

Taiwan is in. We are going to kick-off a LOT.  Duke looks like the last cut, but they are giving him every chance to make it. 5rb

Knox and ? TE stops at 2, with Gilliam in pocket as 3rd

9OL, starts + Mancz, Quessenberry, Doyle and Ford--haters be damned!

I say we keep 7.  Hard No to Austin.  Crowder survives on merit, with Shakir, Hodgins and Kumerow.  Love me some I Hod, but don't expect any ST value, he looked baaaad in kick cover.

9 dl. Of course we keep Shaq. No 5th DT standout

6 LB's, Dodson and Spector rounding out.  I say Spector is active; super ST value.  Dodson in danger when Smith gets back

6 cb, and looks like Tre will be ready, so Elam, Dane, Taron, Siran and Benford.  Sorry Cam, very tough cut.

S? nothing to see here

Araiza

 

 

 

 

[Buffalo716]

10 minutes ago, HiMark said:

Roster ?'s

QB: Barkley now in play vs Keenam

Taiwan is in. We are going to kick-off a LOT.  Duke looks like the last cut, but they are giving him every chance to make it. 5rb

Knox and ? TE stops at 2, with Gilliam in pocket as 3rd

9OL, starts + Mancz, Quessenberry, Doyle and Ford--haters be damned!

I say we keep 7.  Hard No to Austin.  Crowder survives on merit, with Shakir, Hodgins and Kumerow.  Love me some I Hod, but don't expect any ST value, he looked baaaad in kick cover.

9 dl. Of course we keep Shaq. No 5th DT standout

6 LB's, Dodson and Spector rounding out.  I say Spector is active; super ST value.  Dodson in danger when Smith gets back

6 cb, and looks like Tre will be ready, so Elam, Dane, Taron, Siran and Benford.  Sorry Cam, very tough cut.

S? nothing to see here

Araiza

 

 

 

 

One good game by Barkley versus backups, I don’t think I’ll make it a serious quarterback competition versus Keenum

 

I mean close to a decade of NFL stats show Keenum is vastly superior… Has taken a team to the playoffs as a starter and has much TD INT ratio in a lot more time played 

[RyanC883]

18 hours ago, 17islongenough said:

Are we sure the QB1 spot is settled? Barkley had over 200 yards yesterday in a half and Allen had 0.  

 

QB2 may not be.  

10 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

One good game by Barkley versus backups, I don’t think I’ll make it a serious quarterback competition versus Keenum

 

I mean close to a decade of NFL stats show Keenum is vastly superior… Has taken a team to the playoffs as a starter and has much TD INT ratio in a lot more time played 

 

this is true.  But camp reports seem iffy.  Glad we have some more preseason games to figure it out. 

[hemma]

10 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

One good game by Barkley versus backups, I don’t think I’ll make it a serious quarterback competition versus Keenum

 

I mean close to a decade of NFL stats show Keenum is vastly superior… Has taken a team to the playoffs as a starter and has much TD INT ratio in a lot more time played 

Yeah, I think Keenum is going to kick his own ass pretty hard this week..  

I expect much better on his next go.

[Scott7975]

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I think you are pretty much correct.... my only quibbles would be I'm not sure OJ Howard is a total lock. I think the Bills want him to be, and the contract would suggest it but boy, oh boy, he does not look impressive at all. I don't like it but I don't think it is beyond the realm of possibility that Sweeney retains that 2nd spot and Howard is cut. Remember the whole Jacob Hollister thing? We all presumed he was nailed on as the 2nd guy and he got cut.

 

I also don't think 9 DL is a total lock, though I agree that it is very likely given their history. But if Shaq doesn't seal that job they might feel comfortable that at least two of Love, Bryant and Ankou could be snuck through to the PS and then activated on gamedays if required? Maybe they even feel Shaq might make it to the PS? So I extend your defense question to Cam Lewis vs Spector vs 9th DL (2 out of 3 make it). I think this decision comes down to who is easier to sneak through to PS and while they have managed that with Cam Lewis the last two years, I fear he might get picked up off waivers now mainly because he can play inside / outside and last year he played 35% of the Bills special teams snaps. I could imagine a bottom feeder team looking at that versatility and saying "worth the risk."

 

As for the "final 4" as you have termed it.... I think Jones is pretty close to being locked in and then it comes down again to who you feel good about sneaking onto the PS - I think you feel good about Blackshear and Morris getting there so they miss the 53. Then Austin is out unless he wins the returner job (anyone know why he didn't play on Saturday? Is he injured?) so it comes down to the three receivers and Sweeney and one of them misses out. TBH if I was picking it'd be Sweeney, I just think he is a marginal NFL talent and we lack depth at outside receiver so I'd be willing to roll the dice on Hodgins. 

 

 

 

I could see Belichick trying to pick up another RB.  Might not be so easy to sneak Blackshear on if he continues to show well.

[ColoradoBills]

3 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

Every year after one preseason game, this board falls in love with a player.

Blackshear had a nice game like many before him.

 

I don’t see a spot for him.  Singletary, Moss and Cook I believe will be our 3 RB’s.  Taiwan will be our 4th reserve RB and main special teams ace.

 

We won’t keep 5 RB’s.

 

So true.  I will say that Blackshear had a great junior year at VT.  Over 1,000 yards rushing and receiving.

He seems a much better player than the William's and Wade's of recent years.

I hope he develops on the PS this year and can be a RB3 or better next year after Devin leaves.

[HiMark]

21 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

One good game by Barkley versus backups, I don’t think I’ll make it a serious quarterback competition versus Keenum

 

I mean close to a decade of NFL stats show Keenum is vastly superior… Has taken a team to the playoffs as a starter and has much TD INT ratio in a lot more time played 

All true about Keenum, but a guy can get old.  We may have to look waiver wire for #2, but Barkley has at least earned PS consideration, and is forcing the question with Keenum. 

[nosejob]

4 hours ago, Paul Costa said:

I think they will bring in Steven Carlson former Browns TE to replace him. Jamestown NY native. Great ST player, excellent blocker, solid pass catcher. 

I'll have to look him up.

 

[msw2112]

I saw the game and agree that Keenum looked bad and Blackshear looked good.  Barkley also looked good.  That said, it's one preseason game and isn't enough of a sample size to make final roster judgments.  Keenum played with the backup OL (and even third-team guys like Tenuta starting at tackle) against the Colts' first team defense - and the Colts have a decent defense.  Blackshear and Barkley played against the third string Colts defense.  Blackshear is a young guy who may have some upside and I'm all in if he continues to play well.  With Barkley, we know what his ceiling is.  I suspect that Blackshear will be on the PS and Barkley will be the 3rd QB, inactive on game days.  Keenum is no world beater, but I think that he can be servicable with the first team OL and skill guys.  Barkely may also be PS, depending on the numbers and if they want that roster spot for a different position.

Edited August 15, 2022 by msw2112

[GunnerBill]

10 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

 

I could see Belichick trying to pick up another RB.  Might not be so easy to sneak Blackshear on if he continues to show well.

 

He rushed 6 times for 11 yards against 3rd stringers. I wouldn't be scouting property in Boston yet if I were him. He showed some juice which was nice but so did half a dozen other late round or undrafted backs around the league last weekend. 

[Scott7975]

Just now, GunnerBill said:

 

He rushed 6 times for 11 yards against 3rd stringers. I wouldn't be scouting property in Boston yet if I were him. He showed some juice which was nice but so did half a dozen other late round or undrafted backs around the league last weekend. 

 

Im not saying we should keep him on the roster.  I honestly didnt get to see him play because my meds knocked me out by the second half.  Im just saying that I think BB is going to be looking for some young RBs and probably some receivers around the league. Not just BB either.  It might not be so easy for a team to stash these type of players this year.

[Scott7975]

Lol so you dont think any teams might looks to snag a RB or WR off another teams practice squad at all?  Lol ok bro.

Edited August 15, 2022 by Scott7975

[Airseven]

Remaining roster battles:

DE Lawson v Love

DT Phillips v Bryant

LB Matakevich v Spector

QB Keenum v Barkley

RB Duke v Jones

WR Kumerow v Hodgins

TE Sweeney v trade

OL Ford v Tenuta

[HardyBoy]

26 minutes ago, HiMark said:

All true about Keenum, but a guy can get old.  We may have to look waiver wire for #2, but Barkley has at least earned PS consideration, and is forcing the question with Keenum. 

 

We have literally no clue how he is being graded. He's throwing timing routes to spots on the field. They had backup receivers against the colts starting dbs.

 

Really good chance the bills receivers couldn't get off press and hit their spots in time and Keenum was making anticipation throws to the right spot, at the right time based on his reads. Or he was forced to hold it longer because guys were not hitting their markers and the pocket would collapse or the window would be gone.

 

He is not Josh Allen who can excel in that situation playing outside of the system, but does not mean he cannot be highly effective within the system. Basing his value with a third string OL and basically a ST only receiver playing in the #2 spot. He looked pretty good throwing to Shakir, who I would think was the only starting WR getting consistent separation early in the game and hitting his routes, though will wait for people to analyze the all-22.

 

Really want to see what Hodgins looks like against #1 cbs...his release off the line on that deep catch was twitchy as heck!

[pennstate10]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I think you are pretty much correct.... my only quibbles would be I'm not sure OJ Howard is a total lock. I think the Bills want him to be, and the contract would suggest it but boy, oh boy, he does not look impressive at all. I don't like it but I don't think it is beyond the realm of possibility that Sweeney retains that 2nd spot and Howard is cut. Remember the whole Jacob Hollister thing? We all presumed he was nailed on as the 2nd guy and he got cut.

 

I also don't think 9 DL is a total lock, though I agree that it is very likely given their history. But if Shaq doesn't seal that job they might feel comfortable that at least two of Love, Bryant and Ankou could be snuck through to the PS and then activated on gamedays if required? Maybe they even feel Shaq might make it to the PS? So I extend your defense question to Cam Lewis vs Spector vs 9th DL (2 out of 3 make it). I think this decision comes down to who is easier to sneak through to PS and while they have managed that with Cam Lewis the last two years, I fear he might get picked up off waivers now mainly because he can play inside / outside and last year he played 35% of the Bills special teams snaps. I could imagine a bottom feeder team looking at that versatility and saying "worth the risk."

 

As for the "final 4" as you have termed it.... I think Jones is pretty close to being locked in and then it comes down again to who you feel good about sneaking onto the PS - I think you feel good about Blackshear and Morris getting there so they miss the 53. Then Austin is out unless he wins the returner job (anyone know why he didn't play on Saturday? Is he injured?) so it comes down to the three receivers and Sweeney and one of them misses out. TBH if I was picking it'd be Sweeney, I just think he is a marginal NFL talent and we lack depth at outside receiver so I'd be willing to roll the dice on Hodgins. 

 

 

I don’t know. 
Everyone is saying that Jones is a lock. 
and I realize that McD said he was an elite gunner. 
Was. 
 

Guy is 34 years old and has averaged 5 tackles per year the past 4 seasons with the Bills. 
 

And yes, I realize that you can’t assess his real worth just by tackles on ST. But I watched all22 of his games last year and wasn’t impressed. And he took a really dumb penalty in an important game last year
  

It wouldn’t surprise me if he gets cut in favor of younger blood. 

[GunnerBill]

2 hours ago, pennstate10 said:

I don’t know. 
Everyone is saying that Jones is a lock. 
and I realize that McD said he was an elite gunner. 
Was. 
 

Guy is 34 years old and has averaged 5 tackles per year the past 4 seasons with the Bills. 
 

And yes, I realize that you can’t assess his real worth just by tackles on ST. But I watched all22 of his games last year and wasn’t impressed. And he took a really dumb penalty in an important game last year
  

It wouldn’t surprise me if he gets cut in favor of younger blood. 

 

So I do think he took a slight step back last year, and age catches up to us all in the end but before last year he was absolutely elite. He was still very good last year.

 

The fact he was a protected player on Saturday makes me think the Bills have already decided he is here. He didn't play a single snap in pre-season last year and was on the roster. Feels like the same approach. 

[pennstate10]

36 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

So I do think he took a slight step back last year, and age catches up to us all in the end but before last year he was absolutely elite. He was still very good last year.

 

The fact he was a protected player on Saturday makes me think the Bills have already decided he is here. He didn't play a single snap in pre-season last year and was on the roster. Feels like the same approach. 

I understand your point but I think the coaching staff wanted to look at other gunners. They already have an idea what Jones can do. 
 

it’s a cruel world. But how many 34 yo gunners - or other speed positions- like CB- are in the league?

[GunnerBill]

32 minutes ago, pennstate10 said:

I understand your point but I think the coaching staff wanted to look at other gunners. They already have an idea what Jones can do. 
 

it’s a cruel world. But how many 34 yo gunners - or other speed positions- like CB- are in the league?

 

People said the same "trying out other guys" thing last year. You know how many of the pre-season hold outs they cut last year? Zero. When this regime sits a guy in the pre-season it is generally because that guy is locked in. Before Saturday I thought Jones was 60/40 to make the roster. I am at 95/5 now.

[njbuff]

What are the chances Allen gets cut if Keenan plays well against the Broncos?🙃

[MWK]

4 hours ago, Airseven said:

Remaining roster battles:

DE Lawson v Love

DT Phillips v Bryant

LB Matakevich v Spector

QB Keenum v Barkley

RB Duke v Jones

WR Kumerow v Hodgins

TE Sweeney v trade

OL Ford v Tenuta

 

Almost none of those are actual battles. If you think they’re cutting Phillips for Brandin Bryant you’re nuts. Or Lawson for a 5 year practice squad player who has never gotten a sniff from anyone. Phillips didn’t even play in the first game, which is typically a sign that he’s getting kept. Maybe your last three could happen, but Keenum, Lawson, Phillips, Matakevich, and Jones will be on this team.

Edited August 15, 2022 by MWK

[Solomon Grundy]

Joe Schoen watching the Bills waiver wire

[nosejob]

22 hours ago, That's No Moon said:

They did this with someone else not that long ago. I can't remember who though. Cut them early, then signed them to PS later.

Maybe he was too far down the pecking order to get a lot of looks thru camp. I just don't see O.J. either staying healthy or making an impact, I hope I'm wrong. I also had hopes for Sweeney, I guess we'll see for sure this year which way his trajectory will go. I believe he will have a chance at some point. I hope he gets the bulk of TE duty during one of these pre season games.

[Scott7975]

53 minutes ago, njbuff said:

What are the chances Allen gets cut if Keenan plays well against the Broncos?🙃

 

Why cut him?  Beane got a pick for Tyrod Taylor.  Im sure he could get a couple 3rd rounders for Allen.  Daboll would probably trade him straight up for Saquan.

Edited August 16, 2022 by Scott7975

[Rochesterfan]

7 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I think you are pretty much correct.... my only quibbles would be I'm not sure OJ Howard is a total lock. I think the Bills want him to be, and the contract would suggest it but boy, oh boy, he does not look impressive at all. I don't like it but I don't think it is beyond the realm of possibility that Sweeney retains that 2nd spot and Howard is cut. Remember the whole Jacob Hollister thing? We all presumed he was nailed on as the 2nd guy and he got cut.

 

I also don't think 9 DL is a total lock, though I agree that it is very likely given their history. But if Shaq doesn't seal that job they might feel comfortable that at least two of Love, Bryant and Ankou could be snuck through to the PS and then activated on gamedays if required? Maybe they even feel Shaq might make it to the PS? So I extend your defense question to Cam Lewis vs Spector vs 9th DL (2 out of 3 make it). I think this decision comes down to who is easier to sneak through to PS and while they have managed that with Cam Lewis the last two years, I fear he might get picked up off waivers now mainly because he can play inside / outside and last year he played 35% of the Bills special teams snaps. I could imagine a bottom feeder team looking at that versatility and saying "worth the risk."

 

As for the "final 4" as you have termed it.... I think Jones is pretty close to being locked in and then it comes down again to who you feel good about sneaking onto the PS - I think you feel good about Blackshear and Morris getting there so they miss the 53. Then Austin is out unless he wins the returner job (anyone know why he didn't play on Saturday? Is he injured?) so it comes down to the three receivers and Sweeney and one of them misses out. TBH if I was picking it'd be Sweeney, I just think he is a marginal NFL talent and we lack depth at outside receiver so I'd be willing to roll the dice on Hodgins. 

 

 

I agree - I could see 8 DL - especially as I think Von wants more snaps.  I think that frees Boogie to play inside and out and essentially acts as either spot and I think there are 4 potential guys that can go to the PS - even if 1 gets picked up - you have options.

 

I think they go DB heavy and keep Lewis also and use Benford as a game day inactive when Tre is healthy (and Tre as an inactive if he is not ready).

 

I also think Spector makes it and then at game 6 they will have to decide on Smith - if everyone is healthy.  If someone is dinged up - you have options when he clears the suspension.

 

The offensive side is where it gets fun.  With Lewis playing gunner (and Neal) it gives a spot where maybe Kumerow can be let go and you keep Crowder and Hodgins as WRs.

 

I have also said the TE position to me is where the RB picks will hinge.  If they go 2 TEs (my choice is Knox and Morris, but it could be Sweeney or Howard) - then Gilliam is more of a H-Back/TE and maybe opens up the spot for Blackshear.  Especially if you use Doyle as the blocking TE.  
 

I could see 2 QB, 2TE, 9OL, 6WR, 1FB/TE, and 5 RBs with both Cook and Blackshear splitting out to aid the WRs as needed.

 

Then the D-side going speed heavy 8 DL (Von included), 6 LBs, 7 CBs, and 4 Safeties.

 

You basically replace Kumerow with Lewis as ST gunner.

 

That leaves your 3 specialists and you are there.  
 

GameDay you can sit Benford (or White), Spector, Blackshear, Crowder/Hodgins, and Moss if everyone is healthy or if someone is hurting switch it up.

 

 

[Rochesterfan]

5 hours ago, HardyBoy said:

 

 

Really want to see what Hodgins looks like against #1 cbs...his release off the line on that deep catch was twitchy as heck!

 

I agree his release was sweet and he blew past the guy.  My issue with Hodgins is after blowing past the guy - he lacked the speed to put him away.  The CB caught up and made it a contested catch. 
 

The throw made it so Hodgins never had to slow down and he just could not outrun a 3rd/4th string DB.

 

I am hoping Hodgins makes the team and I want him to grow, but there are flaws that could keep him out.

 

The same goes to Blackshear - I want him to be on the roster, but he is at best a #5 RB on a low rising team - I can see a path, but I can also understand choosing someone else.

 

 

[HardyBoy]

6 minutes ago, Rochesterfan said:

 

I agree his release was sweet and he blew past the guy.  My issue with Hodgins is after blowing past the guy - he lacked the speed to put him away.  The CB caught up and made it a contested catch. 
 

The throw made it so Hodgins never had to slow down and he just could not outrun a 3rd/4th string DB.

 

I am hoping Hodgins makes the team and I want him to grow, but there are flaws that could keep him out.

 

The same goes to Blackshear - I want him to be on the roster, but he is at best a #5 RB on a low rising team - I can see a path, but I can also understand choosing someone else.

 

 

 

You might be right, but I disagree. I think he kept the db where he could continue to feel him with his off arm and maintain enough contact to prevent the db from getting a step inside and having a chance to make a play on the ball.

 

Kind of like a box out in basketball. Only chance the defender had to make a play on the ball would have been by going through Hodgins and committing PI.

 

Think of it this way, he ended up having to dive to make the catch, but he waited for the last second to get that separation. That was a lofted arcing pass, and even with slowing down he only had to dive a little bit. If he doesn't slow down to ultimately get the separation at the end, the db, and especially a starting db meets the ball at the high point and likely knocks it out of his hands. In my mind,  the only way he could have prevented that from happening was to slow down, and use his off hand to get a bit of separation and then dive. .

 

Allen throws him into the endzone on more of a line and allows him to run full speed away from the db.

[Pete]

29 minutes ago, Rochesterfan said:

 

I agree his release was sweet and he blew past the guy.  My issue with Hodgins is after blowing past the guy - he lacked the speed to put him away.  The CB caught up and made it a contested catch. 
 

The throw made it so Hodgins never had to slow down and he just could not outrun a 3rd/4th string DB.

 

I am hoping Hodgins makes the team and I want him to grow, but there are flaws that could keep him out.

 

The same goes to Blackshear - I want him to be on the roster, but he is at best a #5 RB on a low rising team - I can see a path, but I can also understand choosing someone else.

 

 

Blackshear could be our returner.  And he probably will be a beast at special teams.  Versatility is valued high, and it makes sense.  Versatilty frees up roster spots

[hemma]

2 minutes ago, Pete said:

Blackshear could be our returner.  And he probably will be a beast at special teams.  Versatility is valued high, and it makes sense.  Versatilty frees up roster spots

 

That’s what I saw too.  Cut and go, no dancing.

[GunnerBill]

5 hours ago, HardyBoy said:

 

You might be right, but I disagree. I think he kept the db where he could continue to feel him with his off arm and maintain enough contact to prevent the db from getting a step inside and having a chance to make a play on the ball.

 

Kind of like a box out in basketball. Only chance the defender had to make a play on the ball would have been by going through Hodgins and committing PI.

 

Think of it this way, he ended up having to dive to make the catch, but he waited for the last second to get that separation. That was a lofted arcing pass, and even with slowing down he only had to dive a little bit. If he doesn't slow down to ultimately get the separation at the end, the db, and especially a starting db meets the ball at the high point and likely knocks it out of his hands. In my mind,  the only way he could have prevented that from happening was to slow down, and use his off hand to get a bit of separation and then dive. .

 

Allen throws him into the endzone on more of a line and allows him to run full speed away from the db.

 

That WAS Hodgins at full speed. 

[Rochesterfan]

7 hours ago, HardyBoy said:

 

You might be right, but I disagree. I think he kept the db where he could continue to feel him with his off arm and maintain enough contact to prevent the db from getting a step inside and having a chance to make a play on the ball.

 

Kind of like a box out in basketball. Only chance the defender had to make a play on the ball would have been by going through Hodgins and committing PI.

 

Think of it this way, he ended up having to dive to make the catch, but he waited for the last second to get that separation. That was a lofted arcing pass, and even with slowing down he only had to dive a little bit. If he doesn't slow down to ultimately get the separation at the end, the db, and especially a starting db meets the ball at the high point and likely knocks it out of his hands. In my mind,  the only way he could have prevented that from happening was to slow down, and use his off hand to get a bit of separation and then dive. .

 

Allen throws him into the endzone on more of a line and allows him to run full speed away from the db.

I hear what you are saying, but I think that was Hodgins at full speed.  For example - if that had been Davis with that sweet move at the line and the separation he created - Barkley has to put the ball a couple of yards farther down field and that DB never gets close.

 

Hodgins just does not have the foot speed - he is slick off the line and runs great routes, but he does not increase separation in route and by the time the ball is there the DB will catch up.

 

It is not a bad thing for a #5 WR - it just is not ideal in a #1 or #2.  Most of his catches are going to end up box out, go up and get it and if he can do that great .  He was smooth and I think there is use for that, but as a team they need to know what they are getting.  

Edited August 16, 2022 by Rochesterfan

[GunnerBill]

5 minutes ago, Rochesterfan said:

I hear what you are saying, but I think that was Hodgins at full speed.  For example - if that had been Davis with that sweet move at the line and the separation he created - Barkley has to put the ball a couple of yards farther down field and that DB never gets close.

 

Hodgins just does not have the foot speed - he is slick off the line and runs great routes, but he does not increase separation in route and by the time the ball is there the DB will catch up.

 

It is not a bad thing for a #5 WR - it just is not ideal in a #1 or #2.  Most of his catches are going to end up box out, go up and get it and if he can do that great .  He was smooth and I think there is use for that, but as a team they need to know what they are getting.  

 

Yep. He wasn't a seperator in college. It just isn't who he is. There is no 5th or 6th gear. 

[HardyBoy]

3 hours ago, Rochesterfan said:

I hear what you are saying, but I think that was Hodgins at full speed.  For example - if that had been Davis with that sweet move at the line and the separation he created - Barkley has to put the ball a couple of yards farther down field and that DB never gets close.

 

Hodgins just does not have the foot speed - he is slick off the line and runs great routes, but he does not increase separation in route and by the time the ball is there the DB will catch up.

 

It is not a bad thing for a #5 WR - it just is not ideal in a #1 or #2.  Most of his catches are going to end up box out, go up and get it and if he can do that great .  He was smooth and I think there is use for that, but as a team they need to know what they are getting.  

 

 

3 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yep. He wasn't a seperator in college. It just isn't who he is. There is no 5th or 6th gear. 

 

yeah, I rewatched it, agree I don’t think he had time to do anything other than just run.