What does this even mean (created the most YPA rushing)

[Hapless Bills Fan]

 

 

OK Fantasy and Stats Gurus and such.

 

What does this even mean?

 

I understand YPA.  I understand yards from scrimmage.  This?

[Ethan in Cleveland]

I think it means the Bills O-line does not run block well

[Royale with Cheese]

I'm guessing there wasn't a hole and had to create his own YPA.  

[H2o]

 

Edited July 19, 2021 by H2o

[Royale with Cheese]

Just now, Ethan in Portland said:

I think it means the Bills O-line does not run block well

 

If that's the case, neither does the Browns, Titans, Vikings and Ravens.

[DJB]

@Hapless Bills Fan

 

Michelle is a huge Moss fan and so was I on twitter with regards to Moss. 

 

Essentially it represents the oline in that the Bills oline was pretty bad at creating yards. 

 

 

Here is a thread I did back in November which looked at all the rookies and how their advanced numbers looked at that time  

 

 

 

For those that don't want to read the entire thread here is the Moss stuff;

 

 

 

 

Edited July 19, 2021 by DJB

[Hapless Bills Fan]

10 minutes ago, DJB said:

Michelle is a huge Moss fan and so was I on twitter with regards to Moss. 

 

Essentially it represents the oline in that the Bills oline was pretty bad at creating yards. 

 

 

Here is a thread I did back in November which looked at all the rookies and how their advanced numbers looked at that time  

 

 

 

For those that don't want to read the entire thread here is the Moss stuff;

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks for sharing that.  Any insight into how "created yards per attempt" is defined and how it is assessed?

 

10 minutes ago, DJB said:

@Hapless Bills Fan

 

Michelle is a huge Moss fan and so was I on twitter with regards to Moss.

 

 

[DJB]

@Hapless Bills Fan

 

https://fantasydata.com/draft-advanced-metrics-rb-yards-created

 

This should explain it better than I can. 

 

"measures all yards above and beyond what was blocked. Yards created are generated by the running back after the first evaded tackle. The number of fantasy points scored by RBs is highly dependent on the quality of play of the offensive line. Did the RB gain rushing yards before contact because of the OL? Did the RB have to create yards for himself? These are two questions that Yards Created can help answer. A back's vision, agility, play speed, play strength, and toughness will determine their effectiveness at creating yards."

 

Essentially just another advanced metric when looking at and evaluating RB's. Fun tools. 

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

My 'superior' skills attempting to comprehend the 'YPA' concept:

 

Edited July 19, 2021 by Ridgewaycynic2013

[First Round Bust]

sorry guys  I was told that there would be no math...

[Sherlock Holmes]

44 minutes ago, H2o said:

 

For your health!

[Thurman#1]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

 

OK Fantasy and Stats Gurus and such.

 

What does this even mean?

 

I understand YPA.  I understand yards from scrimmage.  This?

 

 

Seems to be from here.

 

https://www.fantasypros.com/2020/01/best-and-worst-rbs-at-creating-yards-in-2019-fantasy-football/

 

Only took a quick look, but it's still pretty opaque.

 

 

 

 

"Below you’ll find which stats I found particularly relevant to evaluating a player’s yards created profile. More factors can certainly be used, but they are what I felt was most important along with links on where to find them:

 

Adjusted Line Yards

Second Level Yards

8+ Defenders in the Box

Yards After Contact Per Carry (YCO)

Yards Before Contact adjusted for Team Offensive Line Blocking (Adj. YBC)

Yards After Catch Per Reception (YAC)

Total Touches – smaller sample sizes are less reliable

Yards Per Carry (YPC)

 

"Now that we have all of this information, it’s time to blend it together. Each category gets weighted against the league average. Each variable is dependent on others, such as how yards before contact depends directly on blocking and how many defenders are in the box. 

We can then calculate what each player was expected to gain versus what they actually gained. This difference you see in the chart is what I am labeling as my “yards created above or below expected per attempt.” In the following chart, each running back with over 80 carries on the year is listed along with how well they performed in 2019:"

 

"RB Yards Created Above/Below Expected Per Attempt, Adjusted for Offensive Line, Stacked Box%, Yards Before/After Contact, YAC and Avg YPA"

Edited July 19, 2021 by Thurman#1

[Hapless Bills Fan]

36 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

Seems to be from here.

 

https://www.fantasypros.com/2020/01/best-and-worst-rbs-at-creating-yards-in-2019-fantasy-football/

 

Only took a quick look, but it still pretty opaque.

 

 

 

 

"Below you’ll find which stats I found particularly relevant to evaluating a player’s yards created profile. More factors can certainly be used, but they are what I felt was most important along with links on where to find them:

 

Adjusted Line Yards

Second Level Yards

8+ Defenders in the Box

Yards After Contact Per Carry (YCO)

Yards Before Contact adjusted for Team Offensive Line Blocking (Adj. YBC)

Yards After Catch Per Reception (YAC)

Total Touches – smaller sample sizes are less reliable

Yards Per Carry (YPC)

 

"Now that we have all of this information, it’s time to blend it together. Each category gets weighted against the league average. Each variable is dependent on others, such as how yards before contact depends directly on blocking and how many defenders are in the box. 

We can then calculate what each player was expected to gain versus what they actually gained. This difference you see in the chart is what I am labeling as my “yards created above or below expected per attempt.” In the following chart, each running back with over 80 carries on the year is listed along with how well they performed in 2019:"

 

"RB Yards Created Above/Below Expected Per Attempt, Adjusted for Offensive Line, Stacked Box%, Yards Before/After Contact, YAC and Avg YPA"

 

Yikes.  Well That's Real Clear Now (not)

[Mr. WEO]

lol..."juke rate'

 

Talk about searching for a silver lining..

 

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

2 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

If that's the case, neither does the Browns, Titans, Vikings and Ravens.

 

Well all of  those players had YPA's of like 5, vs. moss's 4.3.

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

Do 'north-south' yards factor into the equation?  🤔

[Motorin']

2 hours ago, DJB said:

@Hapless Bills Fan

 

https://fantasydata.com/draft-advanced-metrics-rb-yards-created

 

This should explain it better than I can. 

 

"measures all yards above and beyond what was blocked. Yards created are generated by the running back after the first evaded tackle. The number of fantasy points scored by RBs is highly dependent on the quality of play of the offensive line. Did the RB gain rushing yards before contact because of the OL? Did the RB have to create yards for himself? These are two questions that Yards Created can help answer. A back's vision, agility, play speed, play strength, and toughness will determine their effectiveness at creating yards."

 

Essentially just another advanced metric when looking at and evaluating RB's. Fun tools. 

 

It seems like there are two main factors that could effect "yards above and beyond what was blocked." The line's ability to hold their block, and the running backs ability to get through the hole quickly while the block is held. 

 

A fast rb that gains 7 yards on a run where he was able to get through the line and encounter a tackler at the 5 yard mark seems to have gained 2 yards above expected. 

 

For the exact same play, with the exact same blocking, a slow back that can't get through the hole quick enough and encounters a tackler that shed the block at the line of scrimmage but gains 3 yards on the play would have gained 3 yards above expected.

 

Not sure if I'm getting it right, but seems like the expected yards per block is highly variable based on the rb's capabilities.

 

Edited July 19, 2021 by Motorin'

[Buffalo716]

4 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Thanks for sharing that.  Any insight into how "created yards per attempt" is defined and how it is assessed?

 

 

 

It's basically yards accumulated after the first missed tackle attempt

[TroutDog]

4 hours ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said:

My 'superior' skills attempting to comprehend the 'YPA' concept:

 

Good Lord that was funny! 😃 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

6 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

It's basically yards accumulated after the first missed tackle attempt

 

Is that different than YAC?

[machine gun kelly]

4 hours ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said:

My 'superior' skills attempting to comprehend the 'YPA' concept:

 

Missed it by that much!

 

 

[ticketssince61]

What these stats don't measure is what the running back SHOULD have done.

 

For example, there could be a gaping hole that would lead to a 20 yard run, but the RB did not see it, got hit at the line of scrimmage, broke a tackle, and gained 5 yards.

 

With these stats, that would look like a great run, but it was really a terrible play.

 

 

[Buffalo716]

2 hours ago, Motorin' said:

 

It seems like there are two main factors that could effect "yards above and beyond what was blocked." The line's ability to hold their block, and the running backs ability to get through the hole quickly while the block is held. 

 

A fast rb that gains 7 yards on a run where he was able to get through the line and encounter a tackler at the 5 yard mark seems to have gained 2 yards above expected. 

 

For the exact same play, with the exact same blocking, a slow back that can't get through the hole quick enough and encounters a tackler that shed the block at the line of scrimmage but gains 3 yards on the play would have gained 3 yards above expected.

 

Not sure if I'm getting it right, but seems like the expected yards per block is highly variable based on the rb's capabilities.

 

Technically how it works

 

But every single running back has good burst in the NFL 

 

If we took the same exact play and it was blocked the same exact way.. and one NFL running back was able to bust out 5 yards without getting touched

 

Even a slower NFL back would get well past the line of scrimmage with that kind of blocking.. maybe not 5 yards but at least 2-3 on a well blocked play 

 

It's one thing if you're making a guy Miss behind the backfield and then taking it for seven yards... Or just hitting a hole clean for seven... 

 

If you're able to just hit a hole clean for 7 in the NFL.. even a slower back will take it three or four.. he's not getting stuffed behind the line with the same exact blocking

 

 

 

 

[Buffalo716]

8 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Is that different than YAC?

Yes because you don't need contact for a missed tackle attempt

 

Somebody like Derrick Henry or Zack Moss will have a pretty good yards after contact..  shady not so much 

 

Shady will probably have a high created yards per attempt.. since he made a lot of guys miss

[Hapless Bills Fan]

24 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Yes because you don't need contact for a missed tackle attempt

 

Somebody like Derrick Henry or Zack Moss will have a pretty good yards after contact..  shady not so much 

 

Shady will probably have a high created yards per attempt.. since he made a lot of guys miss

 

Oh, OK, that makes sense

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

5 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Yikes.  Well That's Real Clear Now (not)

I was (once again) wrong.  By the time this thread is over, it will be worse than the rules of fizzbin.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

43 minutes ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said:

I was (once again) wrong.  By the time this thread is over, it will be worse than the rules of fizzbin.

 

Actually, I thought @Buffalo716 explained it pretty clearly in about 3 sentences.

[HardyBoy]

How much variance is there in successful jukes/attempted jukes?

 

Gotta think that's a thing people look at.

 

How much does this stat matter year to year?

 

Moss is also a better zone runner, and inherent in zone runs are making a cut to avoid incoming contact, how is this accounted for in the metric (schemes may impact this)?

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Actually, I thought @Buffalo716 explained it pretty clearly in about 3 sentences.

Some of us perceive better than others. 😁

[JakeFrommStateFarm]

I'll take a stab at it.

 

Yards per attempt (YPA) is simply total yards divided by total attempts or carries.

 

Total Yards/total attempts

 

But there's more. Looking at stats posted earlier in the thread there is something interesting that stood out. 

 

Zack Moss

7 games. 59 att 224 yards 3.79 avg

YBC/Att- 1.7 yards 41st YAC/Att - 2.1 21st

Att/Br - 6.6 2nd 8+D% - 15.25 32nd

 

His Yards before contact is terrible, however we can blame the Bills poor run blocking oline for this.

 

His Yards after contact is bottom 3rd in the league (21st) which is pretty average.

 

What really stands out is he's 2nd in the NFL at breaking Tackles. He breaks alot of Tackles getting out in the open field driving his YPA up.

 

In fact he's behind "Only Nick Chubb, Derrick Henry, JK Dobbins, and Dalvin Cook"

 

So these stats mean he's a far better RB than what he gets credit for on this board.

Edited July 20, 2021 by JakeFrommStateFarm

[hondo in seattle]

On 7/19/2021 at 9:38 AM, DJB said:

@Hapless Bills Fan

 

https://fantasydata.com/draft-advanced-metrics-rb-yards-created

 

This should explain it better than I can. 

 

"measures all yards above and beyond what was blocked. Yards created are generated by the running back after the first evaded tackle. The number of fantasy points scored by RBs is highly dependent on the quality of play of the offensive line. Did the RB gain rushing yards before contact because of the OL? Did the RB have to create yards for himself? These are two questions that Yards Created can help answer. A back's vision, agility, play speed, play strength, and toughness will determine their effectiveness at creating yards."

 

Essentially just another advanced metric when looking at and evaluating RB's. Fun tools. 

 

 

It sounds like a great question to ask: How many yards did the back earn on their own?  

But the way it is measured seems very subjective:  "All yards... beyond what was blocked....  after the first evaded tackle."