T&C Posted June 26, 2021 Share Posted June 26, 2021 1 hour ago, Heitz said: Engineer Warned of ‘Major Structural Damage’ at Florida Condo Complex A consultant in 2018 urged the managers to repair cracked columns and crumbling concrete. The work was finally about to get underway when the building collapsed. nytimes.com/2021/06/26/us/miami-building-collapse-investigation.html Yikes. Both the management board and original designer / engineer are in some real trouble here... Yep... they failed a lot of people alright. This article details a bit more than what I've heard so far. https://www.baynews9.com/fl/tampa/us-world-news/2021/06/26/condo-search-grows-dire-with-159-still-unaccounted-for-1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted June 26, 2021 Share Posted June 26, 2021 3 hours ago, Beerball said: Are you forgetting you don't believe in climate change? Since you argue against everything I can see how you'd lose track. Question everything. That is all. If you read carefully, I was faulting CC... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted June 26, 2021 Share Posted June 26, 2021 1 hour ago, ExiledInIllinois said: Question everything. That is all. If you read carefully, I was faulting CC... I realize what you were faulting. A couple weeks ago you argued against climate change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted June 26, 2021 Share Posted June 26, 2021 5 minutes ago, Beerball said: I realize what you were faulting. A couple weeks ago you argued against climate change. I do from time to time. No big deal. "Do I contradict myself? Very well then I contradict myself, (I am large, I contain multitudes.)" ~Song of Myself, Walt Whitman. YOU should try it sometime. CliffNotes explanation: "When Whitman writes, "Do I contradict myself? / Very well then I contradict myself, / (I am large, I contain multitudes)," he is embracing something that is typically thought of as a shortcoming or something that makes a person appear to be unreliable. He makes the act of contradicting oneself something positive: a person who contradicts himself, in Whitman's view, is a person who has more to discover about himself, more to contribute to the world from himself. More often, we are told that we must adhere to our principles all the time, but we rarely discuss the fact that those principles can change. We are told that we must be consistent or risk appearing weak and unreliable: Whitman clearly doesn't care a pittance for such appearances. It is as though, for him, the person who never contradicts himself hasn't considered life deeply enough or leads a too-simple interior life." 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wacka Posted June 26, 2021 Share Posted June 26, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, ExiledInIllinois said: Question everything. That is all. If you read carefully, I was faulting CC... Is that Chinese Carp? Edited June 26, 2021 by Wacka 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALF Posted June 26, 2021 Share Posted June 26, 2021 Is deregulation good ? Lack of safety inspections and enforcement . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaoulDuke79 Posted June 26, 2021 Share Posted June 26, 2021 6 minutes ago, ALF said: Is deregulation good ? Lack of safety inspections and enforcement . As with most things, finding the appropriate balance is key. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T&C Posted June 28, 2021 Share Posted June 28, 2021 Had no idea that condo owners could be on the hook for this much money. https://www.baynews9.com/fl/tampa/ap-top-news/2021/06/27/before-building-collapse-9-million-in-repairs-needed "Owners of units in a Florida oceanfront condo building that collapsed with deadly consequences were just days away from a deadline to start making steep payments toward more than $9 million in major repairs that had been recommended nearly three years earlier. That cost estimate, from the Morabito Consultants engineering firm in 2018, meant owners at Champlain Towers South were facing payments of anywhere from $80,000 for a one-bedroom unit to $330,000 or so for a penthouse, to be paid all at once or in installments. Their first deadline was July 1. One resident whose apartment was spared, Adalberto Aguero, had just taken out a loan to cover his $80,000 bill. “I figured I would pay it off after they fixed the building. I didn’t want to pay it off before because you never know,” said Aguero, adding that he pulled paperwork to make the installment payments a day after Thursday’s collapse. “I said cancel everything.” More in the article but, wow that is a lot of dough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Jack Posted June 28, 2021 Share Posted June 28, 2021 (edited) Quote On Thursday morning at around 1.30am, Cassie was standing on the balcony of her apartment on the fourth floor of Champlain Towers South overlooking the Atlantic Ocean. She was speaking on the phone with her husband Michael Stratton. "Suddenly she says, 'honey the pool is caving in, the pool is sinking to the ground'," Ashley recounts. "He said 'what are you talking about?' And she says, 'the ground is shaking, everything's shaking' and then she screamed a blood curdling scream and the line went dead." 'Honey, the pool is caving in': Woman says sister was on phone to husband as she stood on collapsed Miami building balcony See what experts say is the probable sequence of collapse at the Florida condo tower Edited June 28, 2021 by Just Jack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
\GoBillsInDallas/ Posted June 28, 2021 Author Share Posted June 28, 2021 https://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/community/miami-dade/miami-beach/article252394393.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpberr Posted June 28, 2021 Share Posted June 28, 2021 18 hours ago, T&C said: Had no idea that condo owners could be on the hook for this much money. https://www.baynews9.com/fl/tampa/ap-top-news/2021/06/27/before-building-collapse-9-million-in-repairs-needed "Owners of units in a Florida oceanfront condo building that collapsed with deadly consequences were just days away from a deadline to start making steep payments toward more than $9 million in major repairs that had been recommended nearly three years earlier. That cost estimate, from the Morabito Consultants engineering firm in 2018, meant owners at Champlain Towers South were facing payments of anywhere from $80,000 for a one-bedroom unit to $330,000 or so for a penthouse, to be paid all at once or in installments. Their first deadline was July 1. One resident whose apartment was spared, Adalberto Aguero, had just taken out a loan to cover his $80,000 bill. “I figured I would pay it off after they fixed the building. I didn’t want to pay it off before because you never know,” said Aguero, adding that he pulled paperwork to make the installment payments a day after Thursday’s collapse. “I said cancel everything.” More in the article but, wow that is a lot of dough. I suspect that decades of previous owners just kicked the maintenance can down the road. The first rule of being wealthy is never spend your own money. That condo association, past and present members, is going to be sued from here until eternity. Can't sue anyone else involved with the project as they are all dead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted June 28, 2021 Share Posted June 28, 2021 Rut-oh! I know it was mentioned early on... But has there been any uptick on any conspiracy theories: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/uss-gerald-ford-shock-trials-earthquake-florida/#app Weird coincidence! ?? Could it have jiggled (days earlier) an already weak structure? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punching Bag Posted June 29, 2021 Share Posted June 29, 2021 On 6/27/2021 at 8:44 PM, T&C said: "Owners of units in a Florida oceanfront condo building that collapsed with deadly consequences were just days away from a deadline to start making steep payments toward more than $9 million in major repairs that had been recommended nearly three years earlier. That cost estimate, from the Morabito Consultants engineering firm in 2018, meant owners at Champlain Towers South were facing payments of anywhere from $80,000 for a one-bedroom unit to $330,000 or so for a penthouse, to be paid all at once or in installments. Their first deadline was July 1. Could someone be so greedy and heartless to have HELPED building collapse and just take insurance money before they needed to pay? It happens with arsonists but would require more knowledge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Back2Buff Posted June 29, 2021 Share Posted June 29, 2021 17 hours ago, ExiledInIllinois said: Rut-oh! I know it was mentioned early on... But has there been any uptick on any conspiracy theories: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/uss-gerald-ford-shock-trials-earthquake-florida/#app Weird coincidence! ?? Could it have jiggled (days earlier) an already weak structure? The issue would be with the building. Nothing to do with the test. If your building can't sustain that, there are issues with your building. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hindsight Posted June 29, 2021 Share Posted June 29, 2021 On 6/24/2021 at 4:08 PM, The Avenger said: It's a terrible story and one that we don't see too often in this country, fortunately - I have seen stories about similar collapses in third world countries and the devastation is incredible. If there are inspections my guess is that that they wouldn't tell you much unless you could see things like cracks or concrete erosion. If floor joist connections were made improperly, insufficient rebar was used in concrete slabs, concrete was too porous to support designed load you probably wouldn't be able to detect such things, even if you did a pretty thorough structural inspection. Sadly, they only learn about these things after a tragedy. Its a matter of time until that happens here. Our infrastructure is incredibly outdated and the more regulations that are cast aside for the sake of profit, the more frequently this will happen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Hammersticks Posted June 29, 2021 Share Posted June 29, 2021 So I’m down here in Miami Beach on vacation this week. Our resort is just a shade over 4 miles north of the condo collapse. I have found it interesting that no one down here really talks about it, and there seems to be very little coverage of it on the local news. I was watching the local news yesterday morning expecting a big “story” with a lot of details. It was just a 5 second blurb about how the search for survivors was still going on. No other details at all. Very strange. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBBills Posted June 29, 2021 Share Posted June 29, 2021 3 hours ago, Johnny Hammersticks said: So I’m down here in Miami Beach on vacation this week. Our resort is just a shade over 4 miles north of the condo collapse. I have found it interesting that no one down here really talks about it, and there seems to be very little coverage of it on the local news. I was watching the local news yesterday morning expecting a big “story” with a lot of details. It was just a 5 second blurb about how the search for survivors was still going on. No other details at all. Very strange. What else are you supposed to say? 22 hours ago, ExiledInIllinois said: Rut-oh! I know it was mentioned early on... But has there been any uptick on any conspiracy theories: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/uss-gerald-ford-shock-trials-earthquake-florida/#app Weird coincidence! ?? Could it have jiggled (days earlier) an already weak structure? That happened over 100 miles off the coast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Hammersticks Posted June 29, 2021 Share Posted June 29, 2021 2 hours ago, TBBills said: What else are you supposed to say? Oh, I don’t know. It is a HUGE international news story. There’s probably going to be 160+ confirmed dead before it’s all said and done, sadly. Also some information about the 2018 reports related to the building being deemed in need of serious maintenance. The city building inspector announcing at some community meeting shortly thereafter that the building was “in good shape.” Ya know...stuff like that maybe? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBBills Posted June 29, 2021 Share Posted June 29, 2021 14 minutes ago, Johnny Hammersticks said: Oh, I don’t know. It is a HUGE international news story. There’s probably going to be 160+ confirmed dead before it’s all said and done, sadly. Also some information about the 2018 reports related to the building being deemed in need of serious maintenance. The city building inspector announcing at some community meeting shortly thereafter that the building was “in good shape.” Ya know...stuff like that maybe? I guess so but I think we know everything we can so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Jack Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 There are pictures from under the pool deck, just two days before the collapse, showing the damaged concrete.... Two days before condo collapse, a pool contractor photographed this damage in garage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T&C Posted July 3, 2021 Share Posted July 3, 2021 A condo building 5 miles away is being evacuated: https://www.baynews9.com/fl/tampa/ap-online/2021/07/02/city-orders-evacuation-of-condo-building-deemed-unsafe 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBBills Posted July 3, 2021 Share Posted July 3, 2021 (edited) People are posting pictures and videos of the places they live. Takes a tragedy to make change... And even then the change doesn't hold forever once complacency sets in again. Over 120+ dead, imagine getting a strong hurricane this year. Edited July 3, 2021 by TBBills Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaoulDuke79 Posted July 3, 2021 Share Posted July 3, 2021 What about the people who had to evacuate from the other side of the building? Do they ever have an opportunity to recover their belongings? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T&C Posted July 3, 2021 Share Posted July 3, 2021 12 hours ago, RaoulDuke79 said: What about the people who had to evacuate from the other side of the building? Do they ever have an opportunity to recover their belongings? I've wondered the same thing... to at least get important papers/documents/photos... stuff like that. I doubt anyone is worried about their couch or 60" tv. Looks like the rest of the collapsed building is coming down tomorrow: https://www.baynews9.com/fl/tampa/ap-top-news/2021/07/03/another-building-evacuated-search-goes-on-at-collapse-site Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QCity Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 21 hours ago, RaoulDuke79 said: What about the people who had to evacuate from the other side of the building? Do they ever have an opportunity to recover their belongings? Nope, and I doubt you'll hear any complaints from them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbillievable Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 14 hours ago, T&C said: I've wondered the same thing... to at least get important papers/documents/photos... stuff like that. I doubt anyone is worried about their couch or 60" tv. Looks like the rest of the collapsed building is coming down tomorrow: https://www.baynews9.com/fl/tampa/ap-top-news/2021/07/03/another-building-evacuated-search-goes-on-at-collapse-site I can't think of any belongings worth risking death for... even pictures. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 6 hours ago, QCity said: Nope, and I doubt you'll hear any complaints from them. Maybe, what about stranded pets? Looks like pets may be going down too. I read one had a dog in a cage on the 9th floor. That's gotta be tough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Brown Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 On 6/29/2021 at 9:17 AM, Captain Hindsight said: Its a matter of time until that happens here. Our infrastructure is incredibly outdated and the more regulations that are cast aside for the sake of profit, the more frequently this will happen Thanks Captain Hindsight 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T&C Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 Drilling nearly done to demolish rest of collapsed condo https://www.baynews9.com/fl/tampa/ap-top-news/2021/07/04/demolition-crews-move-in-at-condo-tower-amid-storm-fears Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 Pet owners trying to delay demolition: https://nypost.com/2021/07/04/pet-owners-seek-to-delay-demolition-of-florida-condo-tower/amp/ You'd think they could do an organized sweep? Or should they just bury the pets alive? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaoulDuke79 Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 Just now, ExiledInIllinois said: Pet owners trying to delay demolition: https://nypost.com/2021/07/04/pet-owners-seek-to-delay-demolition-of-florida-condo-tower/amp/ You'd think they could do an organized sweep? Or should they just bury the pets alive? Terrible situation all around. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 3 minutes ago, RaoulDuke79 said: Terrible situation all around. Yup.. So awful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warcodered Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 1 hour ago, ExiledInIllinois said: Pet owners trying to delay demolition: https://nypost.com/2021/07/04/pet-owners-seek-to-delay-demolition-of-florida-condo-tower/amp/ You'd think they could do an organized sweep? Or should they just bury the pets alive? “If there were people in there, they would have found a way,” Miro told the Herald of officials overseeing the rescue effort. “But they don’t think animals are as valuable.” I mean...yeah help the animals if you can but the priority has to be the people. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Warcodered said: “If there were people in there, they would have found a way,” Miro told the Herald of officials overseeing the rescue effort. “But they don’t think animals are as valuable.” I mean...yeah help the animals if you can but the priority has to be the people. Yeah.. If the building is teetering, that's bad. A zillion places for a scared animal to hide, especially if it got out of their area and damaged spaces. Finding a cat would be a nightmare. Ours gets lost in all the ***** we have in basement! /smdh... Edited July 4, 2021 by ExiledInIllinois Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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