Jump to content

H.R. 1 And The Fight For Voting Rights -- We The People!


Recommended Posts

Quote

 

Repairing the United States’ elections system has now become an existential challenge for Democrats. The Republican Party is increasingly devoted to choking off ballot access for those who don’t support them: As the Brennan Center for Justice notes, red-state legislatures are passing vote suppression measures dressed up as “ballot security” rules at a clip that has outpaced the same time period in 2020. Yes, some states are passing measures to increase access to the ballot, but measures that would make it harder to register, vote early, vote by mail, or produce voter ID are now being pressed in “the most significant wave of such restrictions since the Jim Crow era,” as Michael Waldman of the Brennan Center told ABC news.

For example, Georgia House Bill 531, which passed in the Georgia General Assembly last week, would add a voter ID requirement for absentee ballots, limit the number and locations of early voting drop-off boxes, and reduce early voting days during the weekends prior to an election—including allowing just one Sunday to vote early. Georgia allowed no-excuse absentee voting without an ID and widespread in-person early voting even before COVID-19. These reforms were not responses to the pandemic, nor were they intended to be temporary. They are only being rolled back now because a Democrat won the state, and Republicans realize they need to change the rules to prevent it from happening again. The Georgia bill also provides that individuals can be charged with a misdemeanor if they hand out food or drinks to voters standing in line on election days, even as it ensures that more voters will be forced to wait in longer lines to cast a ballot. Immiserating nonwhite voters, who are disproportionately forced to wait for hours in Georgia, is very much the game plan. As the lawyer for Arizona’s Republican Party conceded last week in oral arguments at the biggest voting rights challenge at the Supreme Court this term, the party is interested in limiting access to the ballot in swing states because otherwise, the GOP is at “a competitive disadvantage relative to Democrats.”

 

 

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2021/03/hr1-republicans-voting-rights-fight.html

 

Democrats are trying to increase democracy--Republicans will tell you we don't even have a democracy, we are a republic, which I guess means that Jim Crow like laws are fine with them. 

  • Haha (+1) 1
  • Awesome! (+1) 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Every citizen has the right to vote guaranteed in the Constitution.  Every citizen - regardless of economic status or race or whatever.  So to me we should first make sure that the individual voting is a citizen; I personally have no problem with some form of required ID so long as it is structured such that access to such an ID is equally available to all.  Second, instead of restricting options for voting we should provide more options to help ensure that the franchise is utilized by the entire populous.  These options would have to make sure of the identification of the voter, and models for mail in ballots such as in Colorado should be studied and potentially implemented nationwide as they seem to work quite well.  Third, we should eliminate artificial restrictions on voting.  The most disgusting and egregious thing I have seen in a long time is this proposal in Georgia that would make it a misdemeanor to offer a bottle of water to a thirsty voter in line to execute their Constitutional rights.  If this thing actually passes I plan to fill my car with cases of water and drive down there.  People should be encouraged to vote, not discouraged or restricted.  

 

Now, is it also true that the voters in this country are way too apathetic.  To celebrate the last election where around 50% of eligible voters actually voted as some sort of success is to me sad; we should aspire to 100%.  And voters should also be good citizens and actually study the issues and make informed decisions rather than just pull a lever or check off a box.  Which leads me to my last point, one that is admittedly idealistic, but I don't see making sure our democracy functions as idealistic.  We need to get back to a system where a political party wins by formulating policies that appeal to the most voters.  Not by restricting the ability to vote of those you believe will vote for the opposition.  

  • Like (+1) 8
Link to comment
Share on other sites

28 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

Every citizen has the right to vote guaranteed in the Constitution.  Every citizen - regardless of economic status or race or whatever.  So to me we should first make sure that the individual voting is a citizen; I personally have no problem with some form of required ID so long as it is structured such that access to such an ID is equally available to all.  Second, instead of restricting options for voting we should provide more options to help ensure that the franchise is utilized by the entire populous.  These options would have to make sure of the identification of the voter, and models for mail in ballots such as in Colorado should be studied and potentially implemented nationwide as they seem to work quite well.  Third, we should eliminate artificial restrictions on voting.  The most disgusting and egregious thing I have seen in a long time is this proposal in Georgia that would make it a misdemeanor to offer a bottle of water to a thirsty voter in line to execute their Constitutional rights.  If this thing actually passes I plan to fill my car with cases of water and drive down there.  People should be encouraged to vote, not discouraged or restricted.  

 

Now, is it also true that the voters in this country are way too apathetic.  To celebrate the last election where around 50% of eligible voters actually voted as some sort of success is to me sad; we should aspire to 100%.  And voters should also be good citizens and actually study the issues and make informed decisions rather than just pull a lever or check off a box.  Which leads me to my last point, one that is admittedly idealistic, but I don't see making sure our democracy functions as idealistic.  We need to get back to a system where a political party wins by formulating policies that appeal to the most voters.  Not by restricting the ability to vote of those you believe will vote for the opposition.  

Great post.
 

The intent of that Georgia law I assume is because some groups will go to a homeless shelter or nursing home and offer free lunches for people who will come to the polls and vote for them.
 

Republicans are targeting the ‘line warming’ behavior because they are too dumb to figure out how to do the same. 

Edited by Over 29 years of fanhood
Link to comment
Share on other sites

22 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

Every citizen has the right to vote guaranteed in the Constitution.  Every citizen - regardless of economic status or race or whatever.  So to me we should first make sure that the individual voting is a citizen; I personally have no problem with some form of required ID so long as it is structured such that access to such an ID is equally available to all.  Second, instead of restricting options for voting we should provide more options to help ensure that the franchise is utilized by the entire populous.  These options would have to make sure of the identification of the voter, and models for mail in ballots such as in Colorado should be studied and potentially implemented nationwide as they seem to work quite well.  Third, we should eliminate artificial restrictions on voting.  The most disgusting and egregious thing I have seen in a long time is this proposal in Georgia that would make it a misdemeanor to offer a bottle of water to a thirsty voter in line to execute their Constitutional rights.  If this thing actually passes I plan to fill my car with cases of water and drive down there.  People should be encouraged to vote, not discouraged or restricted.  

 

Now, is it also true that the voters in this country are way too apathetic.  To celebrate the last election where around 50% of eligible voters actually voted as some sort of success is to me sad; we should aspire to 100%.  And voters should also be good citizens and actually study the issues and make informed decisions rather than just pull a lever or check off a box.  Which leads me to my last point, one that is admittedly idealistic, but I don't see making sure our democracy functions as idealistic.  We need to get back to a system where a political party wins by formulating policies that appeal to the most voters.  Not by restricting the ability to vote of those you believe will vote for the opposition.  

Disagree in principle.  The desire to see 100% participation is admirable, but the reality is that if people choose not to vote, they should be allowed to abstain in peace without guilting them into doing so.  
 

In fact, people that do not have a grasp of the issues should be encouraged to stay at home.  
 

I agree on voter identification, our elections should be treated like they matter.  We need to verify and restore trust in the system to the extent possible.  
 

I also think it’s long past time when we should be able to verify our vote was properly taped individually.  
 

Voter education...I agree with you on that.  As long as it’s kept out of the schools, I would concur.  Probably too late for that. 

  • Thank you (+1) 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

You would think that if they can break down what a persons DNA is that they could come up with a way for all Citizens of the US to vote with the proper ID one wouldn't think it would be that hard .

 

If they need to have the super groups that put up all these multiple millions of dollars for each candidate put some of the cash aside to send people from a election committee interns and such to peoples houses to collect votes from those that can't get out .

 

I know i had 4 calls this last election to ask my mother which has been dead for 7 yrs to please vote and it just so happened that it was someone from the democratic party for which i cursed their asses out & would have done the same if it were a republican that's just BS if they can't find out if someone has passed or not !! 

  • Like (+1) 1
  • Thank you (+1) 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, T master said:

You would think that if they can break down what a persons DNA is that they could come up with a way for all Citizens of the US to vote with the proper ID one wouldn't think it would be that hard .

 

If they need to have the super groups that put up all these multiple millions of dollars for each candidate put some of the cash aside to send people from a election committee interns and such to peoples houses to collect votes from those that can't get out .

 

I know i had 4 calls this last election to ask my mother which has been dead for 7 yrs to please vote and it just so happened that it was someone from the democratic party for which i cursed their asses out & would have done the same if it were a republican that's just BS if they can't find out if someone has passed or not !! 

Well you know, she probably voted anyway.

  • Like (+1) 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, Big Blitz said:

All part of the Covid Coup/Insurrection led by the CCP and their lib enablers

 

 

 

 

 


You do know HR1 for these voting protections is a bill that has been through the House since the Republicans lost the house in 2018? All prior to COVID right? Or was that not on your right wing talking points list?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, Big Blitz said:

All part of the Covid Coup/Insurrection led by the CCP and their lib enablers

 

 

 

 

 

I don't agree with letting felons vote.  But instead of carping about the CCP and the other drivel you usually come out with, tell me this:  why in a country where citizens are guaranteed the right to vote should we be making that constitutional right harder to do?  Should we not make it easier to vote.  Why is is OK to pass laws that restrict someone's Constitutional right?  Folks like you yell your head off when someone on the left suggests restricting your Second amendment right, but it's OK by you to tell people trying to vote that they can't have a bottle of water given to them while standing in line? It's OK to make registration harder rather than easier?  Why don't we get back to the actual purpose of elections, for the candidates and the parties they represent win votes by the power of their argument and the logic of their positions on issues?

 

 

  • Like (+1) 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

It’s unfortunate people won’t just come out and admit what this is really about.

 

there are 59 million Americans on welfare, many more on other programs like subsidized housing, food stamps, etc. To be on welfare, you are probably not the most motivated person in the world to do things, like registering, getting id’s, making it to a poll on a certain day, etc. Mail in ballots are a god send to easily harvesting the low effort voters, even more so than free lunches for votes and bussing to polls. 
 

Democrats need them to win as it’s a significant portion of their base and republicans want to have some friction in their way to reduce turn out of that group because they are not the party of social welfare, and overwhelmingly lose there.
 

All the rest of this is a smoke and mirror show. It’s not a debate about right and wrong, rights, fraud, etc, it’s about legislating a better chance for their respective parties to win future elections. 
 

So the real conversation is around how people feel about relaxing rules around voting to ensure the apathetic low effort voter votes are extracted. 
 

To put this in terms of a different right, I’ve thought about owning a gun, but have never spent the time or effort. If the republicans went door to door registering people for and handing them guns, a lot more people would have guns because it’s their right. And maybe require ID or proof of registration, would be considered to impede that right, so if they didn’t ask for that either, even more gun owners. I’m not sure that’s the correct thing to do. But inevitable an outcome. 
 

and I’m not sure which side is right. It’s complicated. I think the real problem is the welfare rolls are so high. But I don’t pretend to know how to solve that especially if it provides for a good enough lifestyle that there is no reason to get off of it. I was always led to believe handouts were designed for the week and taken advantage of by the lazy, sort of the same way capitalism works ok until it runs into greed. 

Edited by Over 29 years of fanhood
  • Awesome! (+1) 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

47 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

It’s unfortunate people won’t just come out and admit what this is really about.

 

there are 59 million Americans on welfare, many more on other programs like subsidized housing, food stamps, etc. To be on welfare, you are probably not the most motivated person in the world to do things, like registering, getting id’s, making it to a poll on a certain day, etc. Mail in ballots are a god send to easily harvesting the low effort voters, even more so than free lunches for votes and bussing to polls. 
 

Democrats need them to win as it’s a significant portion of their base and republicans want to have some friction in their way to reduce turn out of that group because they are not the party of social welfare, and overwhelmingly lose there.
 

All the rest of this is a smoke and mirror show. It’s not a debate about right and wrong, rights, fraud, etc, it’s about legislating a better chance for their respective parties to win future elections. 
 

So the real conversation is around how people feel about relaxing rules around voting to ensure the apathetic low effort voter votes are extracted. 
 

To put this in terms of a different right, I’ve thought about owning a gun, but have never spent the time or effort. If the republicans went door to door registering people for and handing them guns, a lot more people would have guns because it’s their right. And maybe require ID or proof of registration, would be considered to impede that right, so if they didn’t ask for that either, even more gun owners. I’m not sure that’s the correct thing to do. But inevitable an outcome. 
 

and I’m not sure which side is right. It’s complicated. I think the real problem is the welfare rolls are so high. But I don’t pretend to know how to solve that especially if it provides for a good enough lifestyle that there is no reason to get off of it. I was always led to believe handouts were designed for the week and taken advantage of by the lazy, sort of the same way capitalism works ok until it runs into greed. 

I can only speak for myself, but I believe voting is a right protected under the Constitution and I feel we should do everything we can to ensure people can exercise that right, not do whatever we can to deny them that right.

  • Like (+1) 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

41 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

I can only speak for myself, but I believe voting is a right protected under the Constitution and I feel we should do everything we can to ensure people can exercise that right, not do whatever we can to deny them that right.


That’s probably a good philosophy as any wrt the constitution. I do worry about the entitled and welfare group having the loudest voice at the table which is what Ds want and Rs don’t. But not because I care about either agenda. I just don’t want a bunch of deadbeats determining my future. 
 

there is always the option to move to a different country, and there are a lot of better ones to pick from, especially looking forward, where their politicians aren’t trying to incite a civil war. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Backintheday544 said:


You do know HR1 for these voting protections is a bill that has been through the House since the Republicans lost the house in 2018? All prior to COVID right? Or was that not on your right wing talking points list?

 

 

All part of the plan yes.  You think they dreamt up "we can get these idiots to shelter in place for 18 to 24 months" overnight?  This was 2 plus years in the making.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We just had an election where almost half of the country thinks it was rigged. If you want to legitimatize the results and shut the conspiracy people up then you shouldn't have any problem with a common sense law that says you have to show ID before voting. Technology is also available for biometric, iris, facial recognition. ID would be the least invasive. You can't go to a Bills game without them scanning your ticket. It's common sense. If you want to have another election where half of the country is rioting then don't change anything.

  • Like (+1) 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, KDIGGZ said:

We just had an election where almost half of the country thinks it was rigged. If you want to legitimatize the results and shut the conspiracy people up then you shouldn't have any problem with a common sense law that says you have to show ID before voting. Technology is also available for biometric, iris, facial recognition. ID would be the least invasive. You can't go to a Bills game without them scanning your ticket. It's common sense. If you want to have another election where half of the country is rioting then don't change anything.


really good point. Even if it’s a hard fact there was no fraud, there is obviously enough uncertainty in the process that a lot of people questioned it. The unifying approach would be to have an independent commission on that and obtain recommendations on improving the process that led to the crazy’s at the capital.

 

and let’s not pretend this was the first time election results were challenged. Pelosi called 2016 hijacked and Hilary just last year reiterated the election was stolen from her. There was the hanging Chad bit and so on. 

Edited by Over 29 years of fanhood
  • Like (+1) 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, KDIGGZ said:

We just had an election where almost half of the country thinks it was rigged. If you want to legitimatize the results and shut the conspiracy people up then you shouldn't have any problem with a common sense law that says you have to show ID before voting. Technology is also available for biometric, iris, facial recognition. ID would be the least invasive. You can't go to a Bills game without them scanning your ticket. It's common sense. If you want to have another election where half of the country is rioting then don't change anything.

I have no problem with showing ID so long as every citizen can access how to get one and so long as no one tries to keep people from obtaining it.  And if you think that will end the nonsense of people claiming fraud you’re naive.

46 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:


really good point. Even if it’s a hard fact there was no fraud, there is obviously enough uncertainty in the process that a lot of people questioned it. The unifying approach would be to have an independent commission on that and obtain recommendations on improving the process that led to the crazy’s at the capital.

 

and let’s not pretend this was the first time election results were challenged. Pelosi called 2016 hijacked and Hilary just last year reiterated the election was stolen from her. There was the hanging Chad bit and so on. 

Absolutely not.  No.  The only reason - the only reason - we had this nonsense was because Trump started telling his believers he could only lose by fraud weeks before the election.  Every single review of results of reviews into fraud including the one after the 2016 election that Trump’s review team looked at found no evidence of systemic fraud.  No state found it after the 2020 election, the DOJ didn’t.  No one.

 

The answer is to stand up to this nonsense and tell the truth:  the election was not fraudulent.  Period.

  • Like (+1) 1
  • Agree 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

24 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

 the election was not fraudulent.  Period.

To me, this is the best reason I could think of to do the independent commission.

 

you can yell the truth at someone who has been conned all day long, but exposing the liar is the best way to un-sow the seeds of descent. 
 

I’m sort of agnostic on the topic because the two parties we have to choose from are a lot bigger problem in this process than any election malfeasance. I just don’t see what there is to lose.
 

bonus is, all the tens of thousands of man hours investigators spent the last 4 years trying to overturn that election are freed up now And with one party across the board, it’s not like R’s they can try the same with Biden. They are beyond impotent, weak and may be the minority party for a long time. 

Edited by Over 29 years of fanhood
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

To me, this is the best reason I could think of to do the independent commission.

 

you can yell the truth at someone who has been conned all day long, but exposing the liar is the best way to un-sow the seeds of descent. 

"If you’re looking for a way to convince people there was no fraud, having a commission chosen by Nancy Pelosi, Mitch McConnell, and John Roberts is not going to get you to where you want to go. It ain’t going to work."  Lindsey Graham Floor Speech 1/6/2021.

 

Seriously, there is a huge problem in this country with people looking for news that what they want to hear or validates what they want to believe.  Just look at how Fox News rating dropped and OAN and Newsmax ratings spiked after the election.  And Fox News was hardly objective.  They just weren't as bat ***** crazy.  The only thing that would make a difference would be if Trump acknowledged the truth and if Republicans would stop abetting or supporting his lies.

 

The only thing a commission would do is validate Trumps lies at some level.   People will think there must be some truth, otherwise why would there be a commission?  It would also buy some time so people forget about the lie.

1 hour ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

bonus is, all the tens of thousands of man hours investigators spent the last 4 years trying to overturn that election are freed up now 

What does this mean?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

To me, this is the best reason I could think of to do the independent commission.

 

you can yell the truth at someone who has been conned all day long, but exposing the liar is the best way to un-sow the seeds of descent. 
 

I’m sort of agnostic on the topic because the two parties we have to choose from are a lot bigger problem in this process than any election malfeasance. I just don’t see what there is to lose.
 

bonus is, all the tens of thousands of man hours investigators spent the last 4 years trying to overturn that election are freed up now And with one party across the board, it’s not like R’s they can try the same with Biden. They are beyond impotent, weak and may be the minority party for a long time. 

One more commission won’t change a thing.  You think those who refuse to believe there was no fraud will change their minds?  This is beyond ridiculous.

  • Like (+1) 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, oldmanfan said:

One more commission won’t change a thing.  You think those who refuse to believe there was no fraud will change their minds?  This is beyond ridiculous.

Fair enough... why attempt to extend an olive branch? Just keep shouting at them that they are idiots. I’m sure that will convince them.
 

That’s the issue with bipartisan party line sheep. Trying to have a conversation and understand and address differences just boils down to shouting at each other “are not, are too.”

 

At least appreciate the irony that all these politicians on one hand are either asserting there was fruad or wasn’t fraud and at the same time both parties are racing to push conflicting new state level and federal level election laws respectively. 😂 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

Fair enough... why attempt to extend an olive branch? Just keep shouting at them that they are idiots. I’m sure that will convince them.
 

That’s the issue with bipartisan party line sheep. Trying to have a conversation and understand and address differences just boils down to shouting at each other “are not, are too.”

 

At least appreciate the irony that all these politicians on one hand are either asserting there was fruad or wasn’t fraud and at the same time both parties are racing to push conflicting new state level and federal level election laws respectively. 😂 

I wish you were right and that people would listen to facts.  It is apparent they won’t.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, oldmanfan said:

I wish you were right and that people would listen to facts.  It is apparent they won’t.

Sure but it’s also a fact, that a very large group of people were fed a lie by individuals in very powerful positions, which to be honest is quite normal in my view. But it’s really damaging that they continue to believe it and a unifying agenda would seek to repair that misunderstanding and maybe even mea culpa their own rhetoric from elections past where they not nearly as vigorously spewed some of the same. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 3/10/2021 at 8:15 AM, oldmanfan said:

I can only speak for myself, but I believe voting is a right protected under the Constitution and I feel we should do everything we can to ensure people can exercise that right, not do whatever we can to deny them that right.

 

Every registered voter is assigned a polling place and absentee ballots have been used for decades for true absenteeism or disability. None of this or the act of identifying one's self prevents people from voting. 

  • Like (+1) 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, keepthefaith said:

 

Every registered voter is assigned a polling place and absentee ballots have been used for decades for true absenteeism or disability. None of this or the act of identifying one's self prevents people from voting. 

As I have said previously I am OK with a consistent form of voter ID as long as everyone has equal ability to obtain the ID.  I do not believe actively coming up with ways to limit voter’s ability to cast their votes is a good thing. Having more vs. less polling places is a good thing, not a bad thing.  Expanding weekend hours so those who cannot take time off on a Tuesday to vote is a good thing, not a bad thing.  And being able to give someone who has been standing in line to vote for hours a bottle of water is a good thing, and wanting to outlaw that is absurd.

 

Figuring out ways to disenfranchise certain voters because you are afraid they’ll vote against you is not just wrong, it is cowardly.  It is cowardly because you don’t have enough faith in your own ideas and principals to stand up for them and believe in your ability to persuade the majority of voters.

Edited by oldmanfan
Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

ROGER KIMBALL ON THE BIDEN/PELOSI/SCHUMER ERA: For US, Gradual Ruin Is About to Become Sudden.

 

There is the passage in the house of H.R. 1, the so-called “For the People” bill, which would effectively assure that were was never another fair election in this country.

 

It would do this by all-but-obliterating voter ID requirements—you need an ID to board a plane but not cast a vote—mandating same-day voter registration and at least two weeks of early voting, and by requiring states to provide unsupervised drop boxes to receive completed ballots.

 

In other words, H.R. 1 would centralize presidential elections, taking responsibility for oversight away from the states, where the Constitution placed it, and arrogating it to the clutches of the federal government and its sprawling bureaucracy.

 

If, as seems almost certain, H.R. 1 becomes the law of the land, it would be the final nail in the coffin of electoral integrity.

 

The widespread irregularities (that’s polysyllabic periphrasis for “fraud”) that attended the 2020 election would be codified into law assuring that, for as long as anyone could envision, 2016 would have to be counted as the last free, fair, and open presidential election.

 

It used to be that American was the land of the free and home of the brave. A robust culture of free speech was every American’s birthright.

We had free and fair elections, unlike the banana republics we were always called upon to bail out or police.

 

We also had borders, and even politicians eager to increase immigration understood the difference between entering the country legally and opening the floodgates to the hordes massing on our Southern border.

 

That’s all behind us now, or at least those traditions appear to be on life support—no, the patient was on life support, but someone came to euthanize him and pulled the plug.

 

The signs and portents are many and they are not encouraging.

 

Perhaps the most disturbing episode last week was Joe Biden’s alarming performance when he announced the elevation of two women to the status of combat generals.

 

Biden went on to underscore the “intensity of purpose” with which his administration would be pursuing “body armor that fits women properly, tailoring combat uniforms for women, creating maternity flight suits, updating their hairstyle requirements.”

 

This was not from a Saturday Night Live skit: it was the President of the United States live in front of the cameras.

 

First as farce, second as tragedy.

 

 

https://www.theepochtimes.com/for-us-gradual-ruin-is-about-to-become-sudden_3733858.html

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

×
×
  • Create New...