machine gun kelly Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 So, I seriously doubt anything happens at all, but if you had to wonder about one position group, it’s TE. Now Spotrac has him valued at $12.7 mil. Probably past what we can do, but just looking at the roster. Murphy would be $8 mil., Barkley $1.8 mil., Taiwan Jones $900k, Lee Smith $1.7 mil., and so on. I know it’s probably foolish, but this is the one area We would immediately be better, and he is fantastic. Rip me up on this one, but was hoping we would have gone for this guy. They are $80 mil. over next year and negotiations have broken off. The guys I mentioned are not critical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1ManRaid Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 Guess we just shouldn't develop Knox into a stud then... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rc2catch Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 Ertz is a pipe dream. The season hasn’t even started why would philly give up possibly their best offensive player? Has to be more than just a cap casualty to ship him out now. If philly falls apart and is 2-5 or something maybe they try and unload contracts but right now there’s zero chance they’d trade him unless you’re giving a seriously blue chip rookie which we do not have. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DFT Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 It could absolutely happen. Goedert is waiting in the wings. I think what’s understated though is the Bills affinity for Knox. But it could happen, definitely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted September 7, 2020 Author Share Posted September 7, 2020 My point was simply they love Goedert, amd is much cheaper, and Ertz has more value this year vs. next. They are in cap he’ll coming up, and I love Knox, but look at the Ravens. They play 13 personnel all the tim, so three TE’s on the field. Wouldn’t it be nice to have Ertz and Knox in the same huddle together if we can swing it. That’s all. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
die hard bills fan Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 Kroft and draft pick for Ertz and his salary😉 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brennan Huff Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 I love Dawson Knox. Total man crush on him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted September 7, 2020 Author Share Posted September 7, 2020 1 2 minutes ago, Brennan Huff said: I love Dawson Knox. Total man crush on him Me too. It’s not an either or. It’s both. That’s the point. A 12 personnel with Ertz and Knox on the field with choose your RB, AMD Diggs and Brown is a crazy combination. Not a let’s avoid Beasley. It’s a let’s have options so we can do either. Having more than one stud TE is a huge plus. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bricks Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 Julie Ertz as a Bills fan is worth 14 mil/year. Gold medal family right there... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJB Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 Just draft Kyle Pitts TE in 2021. 5 years on a rookie contract. He's the next Darren Waller in terms of talent 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Otreply Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 1 hour ago, machine gun kelly said: So, I seriously doubt anything happens at all, but if you had to wonder about one position group, it’s TE. Now Spotrac has him valued at $12.7 mil. Probably past what we can do, but just looking at the roster. Murphy would be $8 mil., Barkley $1.8 mil., Taiwan Jones $900k, Lee Smith $1.7 mil., and so on. I know it’s probably foolish, but this is the one area We would immediately be better, and he is fantastic. Rip me up on this one, but was hoping we would have gone for this guy. They are $80 mil. over next year and negotiations have broken off. The guys I mentioned are not critical. I can understand your want to have him on the team, and ya, it is not a likelihood, but it’s cool to think of what could happen if everything went down just right. Go Bills!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, machine gun kelly said: So, I seriously doubt anything happens at all, but if you had to wonder about one position group, it’s TE. Now Spotrac has him valued at $12.7 mil. Probably past what we can do, but just looking at the roster. Murphy would be $8 mil., Barkley $1.8 mil., Taiwan Jones $900k, Lee Smith $1.7 mil., and so on. I know it’s probably foolish, but this is the one area We would immediately be better, and he is fantastic. Rip me up on this one, but was hoping we would have gone for this guy. They are $80 mil. over next year and negotiations have broken off. The guys I mentioned are not critical. I'm pretty sure Ertz will be on the trading block next year along with a number of other Philly players. They have played the "restructure" game for so long it's pretty much going to be a nightmare for them next spring. With the decreased cap the Bills are in a tight spot themselves next year (NO WHERE NEAR Philly) so I think it's a slim to none shot on him becoming a Bill. Edited September 7, 2020 by ColoradoBills 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted September 7, 2020 Author Share Posted September 7, 2020 I know CB, which is why I said doubt it. I know it won’t probably happen. I just thought worth a worthless conversation given we have to wait days before real games and can talk about something real. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 14 minutes ago, machine gun kelly said: I know CB, which is why I said doubt it. I know it won’t probably happen. I just thought worth a worthless conversation given we have to wait days before real games and can talk about something real. I hear you MGK. As I sit here waiting for snow to hit in a few hours (crazy) I've was just looking at next years cap numbers for the Bills and teams around the league. I looked closely at Philly and just had to laugh. Unfortunately the teams that could cash in on what I think could be a fire sale by a number of teams are in the AFC. IND, NE, NYJ and the also ran JAX are going to probably get some real deals. Bills are pretty much all in $ wise for next year. After what Beane said today concerning Milano and the other FAs it's going to be fun to see what happens. It's going to be another important draft for the "wizard"! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bills Fan of St Augustine Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 Stick with Knox, trust the process. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt_In_NH Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 2 hours ago, 1ManRaid said: Guess we just shouldn't develop Knox into a stud then... Yeah I mean all you have to do is say I will develop player x into a stud and it just happens. 2 hours ago, DFT said: It could absolutely happen. Goedert is waiting in the wings. I think what’s understated though is the Bills affinity for Knox. But it could happen, definitely. There is room for more than one. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Lightning Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 15 minutes ago, mattynh said: Yeah I mean all you have to do is say I will develop player x into a stud and it just happens. No, you have to have patience. Knox's rookie year is not far off of Ertz's. Errz developed, albeit in year two, but that's where Knox is heading. Great players grow so let's see what we have in Knox before dropping $80 mil on a near 30 year old. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freddie's Dead Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 1 hour ago, Bricks said: Julie Ertz as a Bills fan is worth 14 mil/year. Gold medal family right there... Sign her to punt. Gotta be better than Bodork. First husband and wife to play in the NFL. GOLD JERRY!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethan in Cleveland Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 Knox is best TE prospect in decades. There is plenty of skill position talent on this team. Like it or not this season is 90% on Allen and 10% on Daboll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djp14150 Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 You don’t trade capital for a player who turns 30 in the season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1ManRaid Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 1 hour ago, mattynh said: Yeah I mean all you have to do is say I will develop player x into a stud and it just happens. There is room for more than one. Ok, you're right he's a lost cause and we should blow the money we were saving to extend our stars on a guy few think we need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FeelingOnYouboty Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 We should probably be drafting Pat Freiermuth with our first rounder next year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 (edited) 11 hours ago, machine gun kelly said: So, I seriously doubt anything happens at all, but if you had to wonder about one position group, it’s TE. Now Spotrac has him valued at $12.7 mil. Probably past what we can do, but just looking at the roster. Murphy would be $8 mil., Barkley $1.8 mil., Taiwan Jones $900k, Lee Smith $1.7 mil., and so on. I know it’s probably foolish, but this is the one area We would immediately be better, and he is fantastic. Rip me up on this one, but was hoping we would have gone for this guy. They are $80 mil. over next year and negotiations have broken off. The guys I mentioned are not critical. They're critical. To different degrees, but they're all important. What if Allen is injured? Barkley's suddenly the most important guy on the team. More, you're oversimplifying the money. Cutting Barkley doesn't save $1.8 mill. His bonuses have already been paid. What would be saved is the $1.5 mill of his salary, but somebody else would have to replace him on the roster. Let's say it's someone being paid vet minimum, which is $610K. So you save about $890K by cutting Barkley, and that only if you replace him with somebody at vet minimum, which isn't probably all that likely. Cut Taiwan Jones and you only save his salary, which is $1.05 mill. Again, replace him with a vet min guy and you've saved $400K and downgraded us on STs. When we have a bit of cap money left over, get used to thinking, "Hmm, who can we re-sign this year or next with that money unspent right now." Edited September 8, 2020 by Thurman#1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt_In_NH Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 9 hours ago, 1ManRaid said: Ok, you're right he's a lost cause and we should blow the money we were saving to extend our stars on a guy few think we need. Did I say any of that? Nope Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt_In_NH Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 11 hours ago, 1ManRaid said: Ok, you're right he's a lost cause and we should blow the money we were saving to extend our stars on a guy few think we need. 12 hours ago, Green Lightning said: No, you have to have patience. Knox's rookie year is not far off of Ertz's. Errz developed, albeit in year two, but that's where Knox is heading. Great players grow so let's see what we have in Knox before dropping $80 mil on a near 30 year old. I am on board with Dawson Knox and "developing" him. However, it is also reasonable to add talent to the position. There is room for more than one TE. I am pretty sure Phily is "developing" a guy with Ertz on the team now. They may offload Ertz due to salary cap concerns which could benefit another team. I am not super passionate either way with the Ertz concept I am just saying there is room to have your cake and eat it too. There seems to be no issues with adding WR talent but why not TE? If Knox goes down, then what, its good to have a couple competent guys there and it does not mean you are giving up on a lost cause or that you don't have patience, it could mean that you are making your team better. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 17 hours ago, machine gun kelly said: So, I seriously doubt anything happens at all, but if you had to wonder about one position group, it’s TE. Now Spotrac has him valued at $12.7 mil. Probably past what we can do, but just looking at the roster. Murphy would be $8 mil., Barkley $1.8 mil., Taiwan Jones $900k, Lee Smith $1.7 mil., and so on. I know it’s probably foolish, but this is the one area We would immediately be better, and he is fantastic. Rip me up on this one, but was hoping we would have gone for this guy. They are $80 mil. over next year and negotiations have broken off. The guys I mentioned are not critical. Before you posted this, by any chance did you actually look at Zack Ertz rookie stats? They were slightly better than Knox's stats, 36 v 28 catches, 469 v 388 yards, 4 v 2 TD's, and basically the same size and weight. So how in your wisdom do you know that Knox won't be just as good. Knox had many drops, though am sure while some were his fault, likely with Allen's accuracy issues likely some weren't the easiest to catch either and that's pretty much his only fault. (and I'm not saying this as a knock on Allen either, accuracy has improved, but still not great) Exactly how many drops did Ertz have his rookie year BTW? Ertz 2nd season was up to 58 catches, not amazing by any stretch. Over the years he's certainly benefited from having a better cast around him too than Knox had last season This is exactly how teams get themselves into trouble with the cap by making dumb moves like this. You have to cut other players to pay for a guy like Ertz and you then give up on a 3rd round draft pick on top of it. Will Knox become a great TE, who knows, and no one else knows either, but he's also got too much potential talent not to be out there on a regular basis as a #1 TE to develop.. If he cuts the drops in half, that would be pretty good. He also may not get many more chances this year with having a better cast around him too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted September 8, 2020 Author Share Posted September 8, 2020 Ed, people are making the leap I posted as an indictment on Knox. That couldn’t be farther from the truth, and think he is the best TE draft pick since Metz. I mean that. What is dumbfounding to me is you have a team about to be $80 mil. over the cap next year. You look at our roster and what is the weakest position group after Knox, TE. That doesn’t mean Knox won’t clear up his drops this year. I’m betting he will. Now look at the Ravens. They play 13 personnel all the time, so not for you Ed as I know you are good in football talk, but it’s 1 RB, and a 3 TE set. I can see with this WR Corp us employing if we had a 2nd top TE (notice I said a 2nd), we have another dimension beyond what most likely will be mostly 11 personnel with Diggs, Brown, Beasley, Motor, and Knox. What if we had some sets with Diggs, Brown, Knox, Ertz, and Motor or Moss? We have an even more difficult offense for a team to defense. Stop with converting and I don’t mean necessarily you Ed, a comment about a quality TE potentially available, to Knox stinks or we should move on for a rookie. I’ll give you an example of being patient. Peyton Manning threw 28 picks his rookie year, so just because Knox dropped the ball, doesn’t mean he won’t grow. As far as the age of Ertz, he’s 29, not 30, and Travis Kelce just received an obscene amount of $ at 30. Ertz is ranked as the 3rd best TE in football after Kittle and Kelce. So considering the 3rd best TE in football (subjective evaluation by many but widely accepted) could be a Bill, and the persons I originally mentioned I have no problem about moving on from as do many of you. Listen, it was a suggestion, and just wanted to know what you guys thought. I did say as well, if you think we are so set at TE and the offense we couldn’t use another proven weapon, or we should wait for a TE in the draft as it’s supposed to be solid, ok. What I’m not crazy about is Kroft, and Smith, and Gilliam hard to tell if he is really a TR or FB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan89 Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 14 hours ago, djp14150 said: You don’t trade capital for a player who turns 30 in the season Ertz is one of the top TE's in the league and not too bad of an injury history. But I agree it is hard to justify significant draft capital and the extension he would want (which would be a 15ish million dollar deal.) Diggs was younger and already on a bigger deal (so the costs were more fixed.) I just don't see how with the Dawkins and Tre extensions adding Ertz a vet on a big contract would make sense. If the Bills want to add a TE I think a rental for cheaper player would make more sense. The TE out of Cleveland would be the type of player I would go after for a mid round pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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