1st half play calling

[Steptide]

This bothered me more than anything today. The bills looked rusty today, but the play calling had me scratching my head. 

 

I thought without a doubt today, the bills would come out firing with Miami's secondary being injured and just not that good. There was way more running and qb runs. I don't for the life of me understand what they were trying to do. It definitely got better in the 2nd half, but why wait until the 3rd quarter? 

[Gray Beard]

The short yardage slant or square pass play in the middle of the field is the favorite play in the NFL these days.  It can be a wideout or a tight end. Fitz was killing the Bills with those.  Brady and Welker/Edelman have won super bowls with that as their favorite play. Why don’t the Bills run that type of play very often?

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

I don’t know. The knuckleheads in the Gameday threads were complaining about the play calling. But the Bills were moving the ball. Just stalled out in the red zone today and had to settle for FGs.
 

I feel like it was more some execution issues than play calling. 

[D. L. Hot-Flamethrower]

The dropped pass by Knox was a big play early on. I think we score a TD soon after that catch. There were some execution issues no doubt, and that was one. I'm not sure his game plan was great, but they didn't help him out either. Penalties too.

Edited October 20, 2019 by D. L. Hot-Flamethrower

[PlayoffsPlease]

7 minutes ago, JR in Pittsburgh said:

I don’t know. The knuckleheads in the Gameday threads were complaining about the play calling. But the Bills were moving the ball. Just stalled out in the red zone today and had to settle for FGs.
 

I feel like it was more some execution issues than play calling. 

Review the play calls on the third down plays that stalled the drives.  Once you understand how bad those calls were, you will understand the OP's point. 

[fansince88]

10 minutes ago, D. L. Hot-Flamethrower said:

The dropped pass by Know was a big play early on. I think we score a TD soon after that catch. There were some execution issues no doubt, and that was one. I'm not sure his game plan was great, but they didn't help him out either. Penalties too.

I don't know Know.

[WideNine]

2 minutes ago, Gray Beard said:

The short yardage slant or square pass play in the middle of the field is the favorite play in the NFL these days.  It can be a wideout or a tight end. Fitz was killing the Bills with those.  Brady and Welker/Edelman have won super bowls with that as their favorite play. Why don’t the Bills run that type of play very often?

 

They did finally run that come-back route with Brown - speed to drive off the defender and get him to turn then come back. Josh with that ability to get the ball there in a hurry. 

 

It worked. Those deep outs will too.

 

I honestly think that the conservative underneath play calling is a very deliberate thing by Daboll to force Allen to read defenses and develop his anticipation and touch. Allen is making progress, still needs to throw more away, and had a unnecessary laser he threw at Beasley with a flick of his wrist, but a work in progress. The good news is when they take the shackles off later in games when they need a spark or have fallen behind Allen seems to play his best.

 

We can also see that touch developing on that great pass to Duke, and that touch pass to Beasley, and that perfect pass to Knox that he dropped. It is getting there folks, but developing players seems to be a thing of the past. Some of us older folks remember a different league where there was no free agency and teams could stash players for years as they developed. It is truly a thing of the past, but in the case of Allen being patient may well be worth it.

 

I think it will come together with patience. We basically drafted a high school QB with some incredible raw skills, that is about where I felt his game was at in regards to situational awareness, reading defenses, and throwing guys open. Allen was not that guy groomed since grade school to play QB at a college or pro level. He has off-the-chart physical talent, but he has been drinking from the fire hose trying to marry that talent up with being capable of playing the game at a pro level.  

 

I will take the progress I see as moving in the right direction.

 

 

[Boatdrinks]

20 minutes ago, Steptide said:

This bothered me more than anything today. The bills looked rusty today, but the play calling had me scratching my head. 

 

I thought without a doubt today, the bills would come out firing with Miami's secondary being injured and just not that good. There was way more running and qb runs. I don't for the life of me understand what they were trying to do. It definitely got better in the 2nd half, but why wait until the 3rd quarter? 

Interesting...I wanted to see more running. The Bills obviously have issues with that “ NE” style blitzing where guys are standing around the line. The OL tends to hold and Allen almost never beats the blitz. While the secondary was beat up, I wanted to see a pounding running game with play action off that. I generally don’t like criticizing playcalling because it’s usually execution that’s to blame. I do recall an incompletion on deep throw on a 3rd and five that was a head scratcher . 

[WideNine]

1 minute ago, Boatdrinks said:

Interesting...I wanted to see more running. The Bills obviously have issues with that “ NE” style blitzing where guys are standing around the line. The OL tends to hold and Allen almost never beats the blitz. While the secondary was beat up, I wanted to see a pounding running game with play action off that. I generally don’t like criticizing playcalling because it’s usually execution that’s to blame. I do recall an incompletion on deep throw on a 3rd and five that was a head scratcher . 

 

I keep wondering how many times we will give up the corner blitz, on Dawkins side. Seems like every game.

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

12 minutes ago, PlayoffsPlease said:

Review the play calls on the third down plays that stalled the drives.  Once you understand how bad those calls were, you will understand the OP's point. 

All three of those were 3rd and longs (3rd and 10, 11, and 7). You can’t quibble over play calls on 3rd and longs. And on one of them, Josh missed a wide open John brown. I would still argue it was more a matter of execution, less play calling. 

[Da webster guy]

11 minutes ago, D. L. Hot-Flamethrower said:

The dropped pass by Knox was a big play early on. I think we score a TD soon after that catch. There were some execution issues no doubt, and that was one. I'm not sure his game plan was great, but they didn't help him out either. Penalties too.

Knox dropped a lot of balls in camp, preseason and has a handful already this year.  He's made some awesome grabs and missed some simple catches at critical times.

 

   Concerning.

[Gray Beard]

4 minutes ago, WideNine said:

 

They did finally run that come-back route with Brown - speed to drive off the defender and get him to turn then come back. Josh with that ability to get the ball there in a hurry. 

 

It worked. Those deep outs will too.

 

I honestly think that the conservative underneath play calling is a very deliberate thing by Daboll to force Allen to read defenses and develop his anticipation and touch. Allen is making progress, still needs to throw more away, and had a unnecessary laser he threw at Beasley with a flick of his wrist, but a work in progress. The good news is when they take the shackles off later in games when they need a spark or have fallen behind Allen seems to play his best.

 

We can also see that touch developing on that great pass to Duke, and that touch pass to Beasley, and that perfect pass to Knox that he dropped. It is getting there folks, but developing players seems to be a thing of the past. Some of us older folks remember a different league where there was no free agency and teams could stash players for years as they developed. It is truly a thing of the past, but in the case of Allen being patient may well be worth it.

 

I think it will come together with patience. We basically drafted a high school QB with some incredible raw skills, that is about where I felt his game was at in regards to situational awareness, reading defenses, and throwing guys open. Allen was not that guy groomed since grade school to play QB at a college or pro level. He has off-the-chart physical talent, but he has been drinking from the fire hose trying to marry that talent up with being capable of playing the game at a pro level.  

 

I will take the progress I see as moving in the right direction.

 

 

Speaking of touch, there was a pass late in the game that he lobbed over a defender to McKenzie and it was accurate, soft, and easily caught.  I didn’t think he was capable of a nice throw like that.  

[WideNine]

3 minutes ago, Gray Beard said:

Speaking of touch, there was a pass late in the game that he lobbed over a defender to McKenzie and it was accurate, soft, and easily caught.  I didn’t think he was capable of a nice throw like that.  

 

I don't think he was capable of those passes last year - that is how raw I thought he was at the position.

 

Gonna take some time and some set backs, but the investment may well be worth it if Allen can bring his game in line with his physical talents.

 

 

 

[GunnerBill]

It was not the playcalling. It was the Quarterbacking. The only call I really did not like was that 3rd and 1 that they got a flag on that backed them up. 

 

Once Allen got into his rhythm suddenly the play calling looked good? Nah. The offense ultimately depends on your players executing. And the Quarterback did not execute well enough in the first half. 

 

He was a completely different player 2nd half. 

[WideNine]

1 minute ago, GunnerBill said:

It was not the playcalling. It was the Quarterbacking. The only call I really did not like was that 3rd and 1 that they got a flag on that backed them up. 

 

Once Allen got into his rhythm suddenly the play calling looked good? Nah. The offense ultimately depends on your players executing. And the Quarterback did not execute well enough in the first half. 

 

He was a completely different player 2nd half. 

 

Agree with some of this Gunner, but didn't Allen drive them down field and then throw a perfect pass to Knox for the go ahead TD that was dropped?

 

Gotta be balanced with these. Not sure it is all rhythm, but as a team they usually hit their stride in the 2nd halves of games.

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, WideNine said:

 

Agree with some of this Gunner, but didn't Allen drive them down field and then throw a perfect pass to Knox for the go ahead TD that was dropped?

 

Gotta be balanced with these. Not sure it is all rhythm, but as a team they usually hit their stride in the 2nd halves of games.

 

The Knox pass wasn't a touchdown pass. It was a first down though inside the 10 and should have been caught. 

 

I am being completely fair with Josh. He was brilliant 2nd half. He was not good first half and he was the biggest reason for the offenses struggling to finish. 

[Xwnyer]

34 minutes ago, PlayoffsPlease said:

Review the play calls on the third down plays that stalled the drives.  Once you understand how bad those calls were, you will understand the OP's point. 

 My thoughts exactly WTF ea h drive stuff is working get to near 20 and get away from it

[MtlBillsFan]

No question Brian Daboll was the weakest link in the first half.

[vorpma]

48 minutes ago, PlayoffsPlease said:

Review the play calls on the third down plays that stalled the drives.  Once you understand how bad those calls were, you will understand the OP's point. 

I did and sorry, not buying it!

4 minutes ago, MtlBillsFan said:

No question Brian Daboll was the weakest link in the first half.

Says the OTB NFL experts!

26 minutes ago, Gray Beard said:

Speaking of touch, there was a pass late in the game that he lobbed over a defender to McKenzie and it was accurate, soft, and easily caught.  I didn’t think he was capable of a nice throw like that.  

Come on, your suppose be critical!

Anybody else remember we are 5 - 1; seriously!

[brianthomas]

I think the playcalling has been pretty good by Daboll... Especially considering he's working with a raw talent in Allen & has 2 new WR's & 2, 3 new TE's.

The success of our offense hinges on Allen & his ability to execute & on everyone else to catch what he throws.

My only complaint was what someone earlier stated, that we didn't run the ball enough.

But as for the 1st half sluggishness, I'd put that more on Allen than on the playcalling. 2nd half he & the rest of the team got it done for sure though.

 

I would like them to work on the deep ball & correct whatever reasons we have for not being able to execute on those.

You have a QB with one of the top arms in the league & you can't execute any deep balls? Somethings wrong there & needs to be fixed imo.

[WideNine]

29 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

The Knox pass wasn't a touchdown pass. It was a first down though inside the 10 and should have been caught. 

 

I am being completely fair with Josh. He was brilliant 2nd half. He was not good first half and he was the biggest reason for the offenses struggling to finish. 

 

We can disagree on where Knox would have been tackled - I think he would have gotten in, but you could very well be right as there was a safety lurking. Either way, he catches the ball at the Miami 13 and I think we score more than a field goal and have a bit of a different narrative for the entire first half.

 

 

 

That first possession I thought he was inconsistent as he had some pressure and had two incomplete passes (I think one was tipped) and a throw away. Toss in a penalty that took away 10 yards and a scramble for zero gain and we settled for a field goal.

 

That second possession they did drive down the field again, but I did not like the screen play call to McKenzie on 3rd and 11 which went for 0 yards. That play was called after Allen completed a 9 yard pass on 2nd and 10 that was called back with a 10 yard penalty. To me, the screen was a play that had little chance of success with how the Phins defense was playing in the box and a play that said that the Bills coaches were more than happy to settle for a field goal which we did. I also have a hard time laying the fault for that drive faltering all on Allen.

 

That 3rd possession was the possession with the back to back drops by Knox where we settled for a field goal.

 

There was some inconsistency and I saw the passes that were off the mark, but I think things went better in the second half because the refs stopped calling as many penalties and the rest of the offense along with Allen started making the plays they should have been making earlier when they were settling for field goals.

 

Edit here - Also our defense started finally making stops after that long drive they gave up in the 3rd.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited October 20, 2019 by WideNine

[Formerly Allan in MD]

Not sure it was in the first half but for a change we witnessed a perfectly executed screen pass.  We need more of what works on offense.

[purple haze]

I would have liked to see more running of the rock early on, in particular.  Gore should have had more than 11 carries.

[WideNine]

5 minutes ago, Formerly Allan in MD said:

Not sure it was in the first half but for a change we witnessed a perfectly executed screen pass.  We need more of what works on offense.

 

There was a bit of a screen pass to McKenzie late that worked. Will have to watch it again as I was not sure if it was a screen or a twist on a wheel route that usually goes to running backs. I think they got some blockers in front of him. Daboll likes to bring guys like McKenzie in motion for all those jet sweeps and such because defenses have to respect the motion and sets them up for counter plays.

 

There was nice touch on that pass and he took it in stride down to the one.

 

 

[DuckyBoys]

5 minutes ago, purple haze said:

I would have liked to see more running of the rock early on, in particular.  Gore should have had more than 11 carries.

Yeah Gore had 4 carries in the first half  Think Josh would be more effective with the defense thinking run vs sprinkling in the occasional run amongst the endless empty set passing plays  1st half flowed a lot like the Jets game minus the turnovers

[Florida Bills Fanatic]

I thought that they got away from the running game too much.  They had pretty good success with Gore off right tackle and then stopped going there.  Allen also had a couple of nice gains on the right side as well.  Miami brought a lot of blitzes up the middle which left the center of the field open.  You'd expect the slot receiver or a tight end to make the correct read and run the hot pattern in behind the blitzing linebacker.  I only saw that happen once during the game.  It also appeared that Allen had a lot of time on several plays and didn't have an open receiver.  Other than Brown, the receivers played poorly today.  As others have already pointed out, Daboll had a really bad first half.  It almost seemed that the Bills were expecting that Miami would just mail in the game.

 

With all of that said, it's still pretty cool to be 5 and 1.

[Helpmenow]

Daboll is too cute at times. 

[Happy]

4 minutes ago, Helpmenow said:

Daboll is too cute at times. 

 

This.  Daboll gets better in the second half where he calls plays that seem to be more manageable for Josh and end up being more successful.

[WideNine]

24 minutes ago, Florida Bills Fanatic said:

I thought that they got away from the running game too much.  They had pretty good success with Gore off right tackle and then stopped going there.  Allen also had a couple of nice gains on the right side as well.  Miami brought a lot of blitzes up the middle which left the center of the field open.  You'd expect the slot receiver or a tight end to make the correct read and run the hot pattern in behind the blitzing linebacker.  I only saw that happen once during the game.  It also appeared that Allen had a lot of time on several plays and didn't have an open receiver.  Other than Brown, the receivers played poorly today.  As others have already pointed out, Daboll had a really bad first half.  It almost seemed that the Bills were expecting that Miami would just mail in the game.

 

With all of that said, it's still pretty cool to be 5 and 1.

 

Saw Gore on another stretch play that went for maybe a yard - not going to say that will never work, but it is like hammering the square peg into a round hole all day. He is usually money off tackle - he may get stopped for a yard, but usually he plows ahead for a bit more and if a guy misses and he gets any steam he's gonna pick up your 1st. 

 

Gore has also caught a few lobs on the wheel that have really surprised me, his soft hands and his ability to usually make at least one guy miss.

 

I was pretty skeptical of the Gore signing - I was wrong and glad he is a Bill.

[Buffalo Junction]

31 minutes ago, Florida Bills Fanatic said:

I thought that they got away from the running game too much.  They had pretty good success with Gore off right tackle and then stopped going there.  Allen also had a couple of nice gains on the right side as well.  Miami brought a lot of blitzes up the middle which left the center of the field open.  You'd expect the slot receiver or a tight end to make the correct read and run the hot pattern in behind the blitzing linebacker.  I only saw that happen once during the game.  It also appeared that Allen had a lot of time on several plays and didn't have an open receiver.  Other than Brown, the receivers played poorly today.  As others have already pointed out, Daboll had a really bad first half.  It almost seemed that the Bills were expecting that Miami would just mail in the game.

 

With all of that said, it's still pretty cool to be 5 and 1.

I really thought they’d just hammer Miami with Gore after those first few runs. Dabs went away from it even though it was working... 

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

Did the Fins abandon the Blitz in the 2nd half???  

 

Josh was much better when not under constant blitzes 

 

[Gray Beard]

Early in the game there was a pass to DiMarco in the flats that resulted in a 27 yard gain.   I’ve always liked that play (Sam Gash).  I was really happy to see them use it successfully.