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YoloinOhio

Report: Bills working on extension for Jordan Phillips

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4 hours ago, BuffAlone said:

He outplayed Harry the Horrible. Probably at a price comparable to a 3rd rd pick. Therefore, excellent opportunity to lock him up for a few years

 Would be a solid, judicial signing👍

Jordan has been in the league for 4 years, Harry is just a rookie.

 

I would hope that he would outplay him.

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Now go steal Drake from the Carp.

 

😀

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2 hours ago, Protocal69 said:

I am never fine with a player costing us a game or 2 especially if he is not winning me at least 4 by himself

Jerry Hughes cost us a couple games.  I’m ok with him.  Apparently you aren’t 

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3 hours ago, DJB said:

Good . Just like i said they should.  Once he signs no chance we go DT in round 1.  

 

Phillips,  Star, Harry with Lawson occasionally on passing downs makes DT not a draft target in round 1 

I don’t believe a rotational lineman keeps OBD from drafting a potential starting  defensive lineman in round 1.

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6 hours ago, WideNine said:

 

I am a bit concerned with Harry, but think he is the type of player who will keep working to get better. I like the kid, and have my fingers crossed that he takes a step forward next year having a season under his belt.

FWIW his stats are almost as good as KW's rookie season and better than JP's rookie season.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/W/WillKy20.htm

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/P/PhilJo01.htm

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/P/PhilHa00.htm

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7 minutes ago, Nervous Guy said:

 

Word. Great post TEEB!

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I can see why they are doing this. I am not a big Jordan Phillips fan (he misses far too many routine plays for me) but with Kyle gone he is the only penetrating defensive tackle on the roster. Harrison Phillips and Star Lotulelei are run stuffers with basically no pass rush (and for all those knocking Harrison as "not having done much" this year..... he has been our most consistent interior run defender). So you kind of have to try and keep Jordan Phillips and then improve there somehow in the draft. But just be aware every time you trot Jordan Phillips out there is as much chance he majorly whiffs as there is he makes a play. He is a boom or bust defensive lineman.

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, jwhit34 said:

Not true - go to Spotrac and check out how teams allocate $ to DL. Invariably, the top 4 get almost all the money, and player #4 is around $2-3 million. All the rest, the rotational players, are almost always under $1 million, a few in the $1-2 million range. There are a few exceptions but if you click on the teams spending $25-32 million on DL you will find this distribution to be the norm. 

 

The Bills best 4 players on DL returning in '19 are Hughes, Murphy, Lawson and Star L. The two Phillips are next and will be in the $1-2 million slots. Jordan Phillips is not worth $3-4 million and they will not spend that much, nor will they have to on a guy who was waived this year. 

 

Start spending that kind of cash on backups and the Bills will end up back in cap jail in 3 years. The Bills can take a firm stance on this guy he is not getting a sniff in first free agency wave he is the prototypical 2nd or 3rd wave that has to settle for modest money. 

Unless Shaq is starting at DT, your analysis is flawed here. "Top 4 guys" =/= starting 4 guys. One member of the Phillips and Phillips Law Firm is going to have to be the starter next to Star. One of Murphy and Lawson will be the rotational sub at DE. You should not expect to pay a starting DT $2 mil or less.

 

Some of your other points are valid, such as him being a second or third wave guy, etc. But it's just a typical Bills fan attitude otherwise. As a group, it seems we see a "big number" and the reaction of many us to say "whoa, he's good but not X dollars good," and this happens more often than not.

Edited by JM57

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8 hours ago, jwhit34 said:

Not true - go to Spotrac and check out how teams allocate $ to DL. Invariably, the top 4 get almost all the money, and player #4 is around $2-3 million. All the rest, the rotational players, are almost always under $1 million, a few in the $1-2 million range. There are a few exceptions but if you click on the teams spending $25-32 million on DL you will find this distribution to be the norm. 

 

The Bills best 4 players on DL returning in '19 are Hughes, Murphy, Lawson and Star L. The two Phillips are next and will be in the $1-2 million slots. Jordan Phillips is not worth $3-4 million and they will not spend that much, nor will they have to on a guy who was waived this year. 

 

Start spending that kind of cash on backups and the Bills will end up back in cap jail in 3 years. The Bills can take a firm stance on this guy he is not getting a sniff in first free agency wave he is the prototypical 2nd or 3rd wave that has to settle for modest money. 

 

According to Spotrac, the DTs making $3-$4M AAV that aren't on rookie contracts are:

Akeem Spence

Haloti Ngata

Steve McClendon

Domata Peko

lawrence Guy

Abry Jones

Corey Peters

Bennie Logan

Earl Mitchell 

 

Rotational guys. All of them. 

 

Now, if you don't think Phillips is worth as much as those guys, that's fine, but that's what a rotational DT that plays 30+ snaps per game costs.

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7 hours ago, DJB said:

 

So a rookie with almost no reps didn't do much this year. Colour me as suprised .  If we sign Phillips  no chance we go DT in rouND 1. 

 

So according to pro football reference, Harrison played 38% of the defensive snaps. That is not almost no reps dude. Star, a starter and big FA acquisition played just 47% of the snaps. Defensive lineman here are rotational players. Harrison had ample opportunity and did nothing. Pencilling him in as some kind of impact player is a massive mistake. Signing a depth player like Jordan Phillips is not the answer. If DT is BPA, it will 100% be the pick. 3 tech is a huge need on this team. 

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12 hours ago, NewEra said:

I’m all for it.  Especially with the loss of Kyle, we still need one more guy to go with Star and the 2 Phillips kids.  I can see him costing us a game or two with his over excitement penalties but that’s fine with me.  I like the guy a lot

Uh, no..... It's not fine. Ask the Steelers or Vikings if they could have a game or two back. I don't expect his over exuberance to be an issue. It was over Miami's use of him and he'll be somewhere now that will use him often and where fans appreciate his efforts. 

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35 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

 

So according to pro football reference, Harrison played 38% of the defensive snaps. That is not almost no reps dude. Star, a starter and big FA acquisition played just 47% of the snaps. Defensive lineman here are rotational players. Harrison had ample opportunity and did nothing. Pencilling him in as some kind of impact player is a massive mistake. Signing a depth player like Jordan Phillips is not the answer. If DT is BPA, it will 100% be the pick. 3 tech is a huge need on this team. 

Been saying the exact same thing. Would love Oliver or even Dexter Lawrence if we go DT.

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2 hours ago, MrEpsYtown said:

 

So according to pro football reference, Harrison played 38% of the defensive snaps. That is not almost no reps dude. Star, a starter and big FA acquisition played just 47% of the snaps. Defensive lineman here are rotational players. Harrison had ample opportunity and did nothing. Pencilling him in as some kind of impact player is a massive mistake. Signing a depth player like Jordan Phillips is not the answer. If DT is BPA, it will 100% be the pick. 3 tech is a huge need on this team. 

 

I just think we have far larger needs in round 1 than DT.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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I put him at 3 years $18M, which is certainly above market. We have the cash and I built in an out after year 1 if he doesn't perform up to the contract.

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I'd be shocked if we don't go Defense at Pick 9.   If I had to guess, we go multiple OL in FA and a #2 WR and/or TE. 

 

BPA at 9 will almost surely be a DT/LB/DB so I'd have no issue with an Ed Oliver, Dexter Lawrence, Greedy Williams or Josh Allen.

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3 hours ago, billsbackto81 said:

Uh, no..... It's not fine. Ask the Steelers or Vikings if they could have a game or two back. I don't expect his over exuberance to be an issue. It was over Miami's use of him and he'll be somewhere now that will use him often and where fans appreciate his efforts. 

If the Steelers or Vikings season ended because of a personal foul they’re better off with the better draft pick.  They aren’t that goodz

 

I get why it’s not ok to lose a game because of one player making a stupid mistake..... I just think he can help us win more than 1 game.  His excitement is infectious and players feed of off that.  He’s a really talented player that is still very young.  He wasn’t an UDFA, he was a second rd pick.  

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4 years 28M with 16 guaranteed 7M AVV is perfect. 

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1 hour ago, MAJBobby said:

4 years 28M with 16 guaranteed 7M AVV is perfect. 

 

I might go 4 for 25, keeping the guarantee the same

 

That solidifies the DT spot for the immediate future... They could still draft another for the rotation

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High energy 6’6” 340 lb player. I’m interested haha. I think fits perfectly here. He’s great for a rotation. Gets proper rest during the game so he can stay effective and bring that high energy on more plays. Other guys feed off of guys who bring that little bit of extra to the game. 

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In Buffalo, Phillips clogged rushing lanes and stepped into passing lanes to knock down the ball. He had just one sack in 2018, and that was in the first part of the season while he was with the Dolphins. He averages around 20 tackles a year.

Phillips played 26% of Buffalo’s defensive snaps in 2018, a number that jumps above one-third if you only include games he was on the roster. It was 38% for Miami in 2017, 54% in 2016, and 37% in his rookie year.

So is he a starter or a rotational piece? Does his motivation concern you moving forward or are you ready to commit to him? What’s his role on the team?
 

Sure, he fires up the crowd, but Buffalo already has a highly-paid space eater in Star Lotulelei and a young up-and-comer in Harrison Phillips that can do that, too. What they need is a penetrating defensive tackle to take the place of Kyle Williamsand complement Lotulelei and Phillips. I don’t know if Phillips does that enough for me to commit big money.

If you look at all the free agent defensive tackle contracts signed in 2018, the majority were for a single year. Only Lotulelei, Dontari Poe, and Xavier Williams signed multi-year deals a year ago.

Factor in a strong class of potential free agents and a strong class of players available in the 2019 NFL Draft, and the Bills are in a strong negotiating position. All of that is to say, I’m offering him a one-year deal to see what he can do in training camp knowing I can get another that can do that cheaply. That’s not a deal Phillips is going to sign before he hits the open market.

 

Last year, Johnathan Hankins had to wait until after Week 1 to sign his $2.1 million deal. He made his way into the starting line up and is a big free agent prospect in 2019 after playing well in Oakland. Phillips will need to follow a similar path and wait it out to sign a bigger deal.

My offer:

One year, $1.8 million
$350,000 signing bonus
$350,000 guaranteed

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On 1/3/2019 at 1:07 PM, MAJBobby said:

4 years 28M with 16 guaranteed 7M AVV is perfect. 

 

That deal would make me vomit. 

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I don't mind having Phillips, but anything more than rotational money is a waste.

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Well let’s hope he still holds a grudge against Gase. More motivation to beat another division rival 

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On 1/3/2019 at 10:54 AM, BuffaloHokie13 said:

I put him at 3 years $18M, which is certainly above market. We have the cash and I built in an out after year 1 if he doesn't perform up to the contract.

 

On 1/3/2019 at 1:07 PM, MAJBobby said:

4 years 28M with 16 guaranteed 7M AVV is perfect. 

 

This is ridiculous money for this guy. Anything more than 3M a year is a waste.

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