10-1: McDermott Monday Presser at 4 PM ET; Daboll and Frazier Follow at 4:30 - Check the OP for Presser Links

[That's No Moon]

1 hour ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

You can't give a man chicken feathers and then demand that he make good chicken salad. 

What if the man had turkey, decided he didn't want it because he didn't have a recipe for it, threw it away, then replaced it with spam? Can I criticize him for making a terrible meal then?

[26CornerBlitz]

 

it's hard to win games

  Hmmm? I've heard something similar from another coach before. 

[NewEraBills]

34 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

They either need new OLmen or a new OL coach.  Whatever Teflon Juan is telling them to do, seems only to result in massive confusion week after week.  Either these aren't the right guys for him (can't interpret their assignments IRT) or he's not the right coach for them.

 

Yes, there are times when they're getting beat, but there are more times when 4 guys are trying to block 2 defenders whilst 2 other defenders are licking their chops and heading unimpeded for the QB.

 

Given what I saw with what Juan did with Marshal Yanda, Kelechi Osemele and Micheal Orr by making them all look like the three stooges, I'm going to side with it's a bit of both.  I don't think Ducasse, Mills, Miller, Bodine are great and definitely far from it.  However, you don't have to have great at every spot on the line for it to be competent.  If we do league inventory, what we discover is that there are a lot of bad lines talent wise, but they don't look this confused every wee. I think it's a combination of Juan and the line.

Edited October 1, 2018 by NewEraBills

[John from Riverside]

1 minute ago, NewEraBills said:

 

Given what I saw with what Juan did with Marshal Yanda, Kelechi Osemele and Micheal Orr by making them all look like the three stooges, I'm going to side with it's a bit of both.  I don't think Ducasse, Mills, Miller, Bodine are great and definitely far from it.  However, you don't have to have great at every spot on the line for it to be competent.  If we do league inventory, what we discover is that there are a lot of bad lines talent wise, but they don't look this confused every wee. I think it's a combination of Juan and the line.

If they wanted to shake things up and send a message....firing Juan would be perfect for that.....

 

 

[26CornerBlitz]

36 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

They either need new OLmen or a new OL coach.  Whatever Teflon Juan is telling them to do, seems only to result in massive confusion week after week.  Either these aren't the right guys for him (can't interpret their assignments IRT) or he's not the right coach for them.

 

Yes, there are times when they're getting beat, but there are more times when 4 guys are trying to block 2 defenders whilst 2 other defenders are licking their chops and heading unimpeded for the QB.

 

Teflon Juan! 

[John from Riverside]

1 hour ago, ScottLaw said:

Yea so I don't understand what he expects? 

 

And a lot of those personnel moves and reasons the offense sucks rooster are on him and Beane so he should look in the mirror.

You really think this team is in its final construct to contend for a championship?   Some of these guys are absolute placeholders until next year and its 90 million dollars of cap space

 

And their drafts have not been that bad

[ColoradoBills]

10 minutes ago, NewEraBills said:

 

Given what I saw with what Juan did with Marshal Yanda, Kelechi Osemele and Micheal Orr by making them all look like the three stooges, I'm going to side with it's a bit of both.  I don't think Ducasse, Mills, Miller, Bodine are great and definitely far from it.  However, you don't have to have great at every spot on the line for it to be competent.  If we do league inventory, what we discover is that there are a lot of bad lines talent wise, but they don't look this confused every wee. I think it's a combination of Juan and the line.

 

I also find it interesting that Daboll called a game plan yesterday "forcing" the OL to perform.

We all seen how that worked.

 

As for the rushing game side of things.  I took out Josh Allen's rushes from the team stats.

Remainder of Bills rushing is 71 rushes for 237 yards which is a 3.3 yards per rush ( Allen's average was 4.3).

That puts the Bills next to last with the likes of the Bucs rushing game.

[GrizzReaper]

What I'm seeing is a HC try his damndest not to throw his o line under the bus... They are bad. Point blank period. So it's kind of comical to listen to him try to answer these questions in a way where he's trying spread the blame around a bit. I mean yeah I'm sure Allen being a rookie has something to do with the sacks and hitsbhes taken so far... but we can't keep trying to dance around the fact that this line is playing very poorly and inconsistent... Or maybe they're consistently bad idk. 

 

So if we do like McDermott says and start in the trenches and winning the line of scrimmage then who does that fall on the o line players and Juan Castillo. So if the coach believes his players are talented enough to at least be a serviceable offensive line then I think obviously the problem can be traced back to the coach. So fire the guy and get someone else... Either find a couple decent lineman in some dumpster out there if he believes it's the lack of player talent OR fire the fricken line coach and get a guy that can get these players to play up to the talent level he believes they possess....

 

We can't run the ball and the QB is under constant pressure. Something needs to be done sooner than later about the line. Keep messing around trotting either the same players or the line coach out there for the rest of this season and eventually that shiny new QB the GM worked so hard to acquire is going to get broken. You're also wasting the talent of 2 very good RBs in what may be their twilight years of football. Wasting what they could provide behind bad lineman or a bad line coach. Can this be traced to Castillo? This incompetent play is either his failure as a coach or these guys are really just bad players who don't belong as starters on an NFL roster. Personally I think it's more about the way they are being coached...

[Mark Vader]

29 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

 

  Hmmm? I've heard something similar from another coach before. 

Yeah, but there is more substance to it here.

[26CornerBlitz]

 

Edited October 1, 2018 by 26CornerBlitz

[CEN-CAL17]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

? Daboll talked about 6:30 minutes.  Link in OP.  Frazier followed him.

Didn't say much beyond "they did a good job" and "we have to do better", but he talked.

I saw it. Just wasn’t posted. Or I missed it.

 

I was hoping for someone to ask, “on 3rd & 4 What was the reason for all the WRs running 15 yard routes?”

 

I mean, do they understand how bad the calls can look at times to the average fan? I mean talk about hurting ourselves! Coach inflicted, I know he took some blame, but sometimes it’s just embarrassing. Ask the tough questions.

[26CornerBlitz]

 

[vincec]

McDermott sounded pissed. Good.

[26CornerBlitz]

1 hour ago, vincec said:

McDermott sounded pissed. Good.

 

He should be pissed at himself and his GM for the dreck personnel he's given his OC and QB to work with. 

Edited October 2, 2018 by 26CornerBlitz

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, 1ZAYDAY1 said:

I saw it. Just wasn’t posted. Or I missed it.

 

I was hoping for someone to ask, “on 3rd & 4 What was the reason for all the WRs running 15 yard routes?”

 

I mean, do they understand how bad the calls can look at times to the average fan? I mean talk about hurting ourselves! Coach inflicted, I know he took some blame, but sometimes it’s just embarrassing. Ask the tough questions.

 

I think that’s what McDermott was alluding to when he said “We didn't get the job done yesterday, particularly on offense, and we have to go and come up with a better plan than we did yesterday to put the players in a position to be successful”

 

I believe “Putting the players in a position to be successful” is coach-speak for drawing up a successful game plan to exploit the opponent, and calling appropriate plays for down and distance.

[26CornerBlitz]

Would love to hear the converations between the HC and OC regarding this.

 

[CEN-CAL17]

50 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I think that’s what McDermott was alluding to when he said “We didn't get the job done yesterday, particularly on offense, and we have to go and come up with a better plan than we did yesterday to put the players in a position to be successful”

 

I believe “Putting the players in a position to be successful” is coach-speak for drawing up a successful game plan to exploit the opponent, and calling appropriate plays for down and distance.

You’re probably right...

 

but they should know we see it too. It’s not really even game planning. It’s called reaching into your play book for that 3rd and short play. You should have 6 or 7 pass plays alone. It being a concept style offense each design should be capable from like 5 different sets. So ultimately like 20 different options. But you call a 3rd and 10-15 yard play. 

 

Get better Daboll.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

He should be pissed at himself and his GM for the dreck presonnel he's given his OC and QB to work with. 

 

Well, he should.  But other coaches *cough* Gailey *cough*  *cough* Marrone *cough* have had dreck, and managed to look more respectable with it.

 

Even in that memorable 2010 Week 2 loss to Green Bay where Green Bay played "psycho" and turned Trent Edwards into a toon-eyed paralyzed statue, we still managed to 1) hang onto the ball on offense almost half the time 2) achieve 14 first downs 3) convert 1/3 of our 3rd downs 4) score a touch

 

And in 2013, with that no chance he could ever be a franchise QB bust EJ Manuel under center and TJ Graham, Marquise Goodwin, and Stevie Johnson at WR, Marrone had the Bills losing games 21-23 or 20-27.

 

So you know, I kind of find it hard to put it all on the dreck personnel.  Not absolving them - just saying.

 

[26CornerBlitz]

2 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Well, he should.  But other coaches *cough* Gailey *cough*  *cough* Marrone *cough* have had dreck, and managed to look more respectable with it.

 

Even in that memorable 2010 Week 2 loss to Green Bay where Green Bay played "psycho" and turned Trent Edwards into a toon-eyed paralyzed statue, we still managed to 1) hang onto the ball on offense almost half the time 2) achieve 14 first downs 3) convert 1/3 of our 3rd downs 4) score a touch

 

And in 2013, with that no chance he could ever be a franchise QB bust EJ Manuel under center and TJ Graham, Marquise Goodwin, and Stevie Johnson at WR, Marrone had the Bills losing games 21-23 or 20-27.

 

So you know, I kind of find it hard to put it all on the dreck personnel.  Not absolving them - just saying.

 

 

Not this level of barrel scraping dreck at OL/WR in combination with a very raw rookie QB.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Just now, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Not this level of barrel scraping dreck at OL/WR in combination with a very raw rookie QB.

 

What would you call EJM the first 5 games of 2013? 

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

What would you call EJM the first 5 games of 2013? 

 

Player for player, I don't think it was this bad.  They had a decent corps of receivers with Stevie, Woods, and Chandler with Freddie and CJ at RB. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

14 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Player for player, I don't think it was this bad.  They had a decent corps of receivers with Stevie, Woods, and Chandler with Freddie and CJ at RB. 

 

I kinda think you might be mis-remembering.  Chandler was competent, I grant you.

#1 Stevie Johnson was struggling without Fitz.  Caught less than 50% of his targets and his yardage went down by 50%.  He went to San Francisco and became a #3 WR.

Woods was a raw rookie and struggling to gain separation and haul balls in that year.  Caught less than 50% of his targets.  I think you're remembering a later version of Woods.

 

FredEx was Truth.  Spiller was OK that year.  Given a line and the play calling I like McCoy/Ivory/Murphy >> FredEx at 32/Spiller.

 

OL - The tackles were probably better - Glenn was shaping well his 2nd year and Pears was probably better than Mills.

But Doug Legursky/Wood/Urbik?  I'm not sure I'd try to argue for Legursky/Urbik over Ducasse/Miller, mmm, no.  And Wood was struggling between them.

 

 

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I kinda think you might be mis-remembering.  Chandler was competent, I grant you.

#1 Stevie Johnson was struggling without Fitz.  Caught less than 50% of his targets and his yardage went down by 50%.  He went to San Francisco and became a #3 WR.

Woods was a raw rookie and struggling to gain separation and haul balls in that year.  Caught less than 50% of his targets.  I think you're remembering a later version of Woods.

 

FredEx was Truth.  Spiller was OK that year.  Given a line and the play calling I like McCoy/Ivory/Murphy >> FredEx at 32/Spiller.

 

OL - The tackles were probably better - Glenn was shaping well his 2nd year and Pears was probably better than Mills.

But Doug Legursky/Wood/Urbik?  I'm not sure I'd try to argue for Legursky/Urbik over Ducasse/Miller, mmm, no.  And Wood was struggling between them.

 

Would still take that group over what we have right now. 

[transient]

14 hours ago, mattynh said:

 

What else can he say?   We suck balls cause we have little talent and are building for years down the road?

 

I want him to answer every question by just rephrasing the question like Andy during the speed dating scene in The 40 Year Old Virgin (Do you want me to be f%#*+£g r%#€#%#d?). It will be like watching a Doug Whaley press conference, only intentional. 

[Buffalo Barbarian]

12 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

 

Sorry coach, not with these players ( I know you said the players are "good enough" but you and we know better )

 

 

[billsredneck1]

11 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

They either need new OLmen or a new OL coach.  Whatever Teflon Juan is telling them to do, seems only to result in massive confusion week after week.  Either these aren't the right guys for him (can't interpret their assignments IRT) or he's not the right coach for them.

 

Yes, there are times when they're getting beat, but there are more times when 4 guys are trying to block 2 defenders whilst 2 other defenders are licking their chops and heading unimpeded for the QB.

i think problem no. 1 is teflon juan.  doesn't the oc usually have control over line coaches?  is juan a mcd crony? are dabol and juan buttin heads? are they 2 separate entities?

[Ol Dirty B]

13 hours ago, TheBeane said:

 

I find it pretty hard to base "not very good" when you're dealing with the lack of talent on the field each week.

 

And who is at fault for that? 

7 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

What would you call EJM the first 5 games of 2013? 

 

I haven't looked at the stats but in my opinion, I was more excited about EJ than Allen.

 

He had the Pats game, Carolina game, and even the browns game before he got hurt he looked alright. We have Minnesota with Allen, which was nice, but outside of the east throw to Croom and the two runs... I really don't see much beyond a great athlete.

[billsredneck1]

8 hours ago, 1ZAYDAY1 said:

You’re probably right...

 

but they should know we see it too. It’s not really even game planning. It’s called reaching into your play book for that 3rd and short play. You should have 6 or 7 pass plays alone. It being a concept style offense each design should be capable from like 5 different sets. So ultimately like 20 different options. But you call a 3rd and 10-15 yard play. 

 

Get better Daboll.

3rd and short when a running play can either get you the first or make the fg a little shorter. it was maddening for sure.....

 

even down 16-0, (with plenty of time) why not put up a couple of fgs?

[Big Turk]

McDermott kinda blasted the offense and seemingly Daboll and with good reason. 3 of the 4 games they have done too little or nothing when ot mattered. Basically comes right out amd says we need to put players in better position to succeed and to come up with a better gameplan than what we had.  Could Daboll get canned before the bye if this continues??

 

"We’ve got to go and come up with a better plan than what we had yesterday, putting the players in a position to be successful," said McDermott. "That’s where it starts, goes right down through fundamentals and techniques, winning one-on-one’s, guys doing their job, establishing a line of scrimmage." 

[Roundybout]

Not a good look for McD if he goes through his second coordinator in 4 games.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

3 minutes ago, matter2003 said:

McDermott kinda blasted the offense and seemingly Daboll and with good reason. 3 of the 4 games they have done too little or nothing when ot mattered. Basically comes right out amd says we need to put players in better position to succeed and to come up with a better gameplan than what we had.  Could Daboll get canned before the bye if this continues??

 

"We’ve got to go and come up with a better plan than what we had yesterday, putting the players in a position to be successful," said McDermott. "That’s where it starts, goes right down through fundamentals and techniques, winning one-on-one’s, guys doing their job, establishing a line of scrimmage." 

 

...doubt very much he gets fired.....didn't McDermott send a message about his displeasure with defense by allegedly taking play calling from Frazier?......

[teef]

if mcdermott was smart, he'd come on here and start a thread about how daboll should be fired.  that's how things get done around here.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

9 minutes ago, teef said:

if mcdermott was smart, he'd come on here and start a thread about how daboll should be fired.  that's how things get done around here.

 

...bet he's already here.....take your pick of screen names that fit the bill....................fire EVERYBODY.............

Edited October 2, 2018 by OldTimeAFLGuy

[Soda Popinski]

we've gone from playoff caliber to high draft pick caliber lol.    suddenly 7-9 is a respectable record with this team 

[Jerome007]

17 hours ago, 1ZAYDAY1 said:

Not happy with the offense, say team needs to put these guys in a better position to succeed. 

 

Didnt seem happy with the the play calling!!!

 

Good!!!! I hope someone asks Daboll the tough questions!

Good!

It was sooooo evident. IDK why either. Of course you don't repeat exactly what you did in game 3 in game 4, but it's like none of the game plan after the first few drives was tailored to what could work for the Bills O. Sure the first few drives didn't pan out but stick to the plan a little longer! By changing so drastically, the Offense cannot have an "identity". IDK about Ivory as a receiver, but we know McCoy is pretty good and I'd venture to say the TE are better than the WR group. A purely "vertical" route tree doesn't work as the main one for these players! Help Allen a bit!

[stevewin]

42 minutes ago, teef said:

if mcdermott was smart, he'd come on here and start a thread about how daboll should be fired.  that's how things get done around here.

Or put up a billboard