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Happy trails to Todd Haley, officially out in Pittsburgh

YoloinOhio

By YoloinOhio
in The Stadium Wall Archives

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OldTimeAFLGuy Hall of Famer

OldTimeAFLGuy

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8 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

https://t.co/VFjUpOsuHw?amp=1

 

 

.....a REAL (COUGH) shocker...........as caustic and as combative as they come........

1 minute ago, YoloinOhio said:

Ben hates him. Looks like they are going to promote the QB coach. Their defense was worse than the offense though. 

...think Munchak knew which is why he turned 2nd Zona interview.......

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JohnBonhamRocks Veteran

JohnBonhamRocks

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5 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

Ben hates him. Looks like they are going to promote the QB coach. Their defense was worse than the offense though. 

 

3 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

...think Munchak knew which is why he turned 2nd Zona interview.......

 

My thought was that Munchak (the OL coach) turned down the 2nd Cardinals HC interview because he thought he might become the Steelers OC. 

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Hapless Bills Fan Hall of Famer

Hapless Bills Fan

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14 minutes ago, billsfan11 said:

I would have loved him in Buffalo. Little too late for that though 

 

No.  No, you would not have loved him in Buffalo. 

 

He's the coaching equivalent of roquefort cheese.  At first, it can impart to a dish a unique flavor like no other and you savor the results.  But then you realize that it only works with specific combinations of ingredients.  It can be arrogantly overpowering despite how good it seems to its fans.  And gradually, if you don't contain it successfully, it imparts its flavor to every cheese in the drawer and develops an ammonia-like stench until you're forced to clean out the lot, scrub out the drawer, and start over.

 

Ask the Chiefs.  For that matter, did you catch in that WGR interview about Daboll in KC, the part about the mess Haley left behind him?

Edited by Hapless Bills Fan
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prissythecat Veteran

prissythecat

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2 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

No.  No, you would not have loved him in Buffalo. 

 

He's the coaching equivalent of roquefort cheese.  At first, it can impart to a dish a unique flavor like no other and you savor the results.  But then you realize that it only works with specific combinations of ingredients.  It can be arrogantly overpowering despite how good it seems to its fans.  And gradually, if you don't contain it successfully, it imparts its flavor to every cheese in the drawer and develops an ammonia-like stench until you're forced to clean out the lot, scrub out the drawer, and start over.

 

Lol. sounds like you have lots of experience with cheese.

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SlimShady'sSpaceForce Hall of Famer

SlimShady'sSpaceForce

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in a related topic 

 

Munchak turns down second Cardinals interview

 

It's unclear why Munchak declined the opportunity, but it's possible he sees himself as a candidate for the Steelers' offensive coordinator job now that Todd Haley will not return in the role next season

Edited by ShadyBillsFan
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corta765 Veteran

corta765

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Smart move that dude has done less with more then most OC's. Wayy too arrogant of a play caller who thinks the talent he has could supersede scheme and design. If you had a mind the caliber of McVay at OC in PIT they would be hosting NE right now.

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dpberr Veteran

dpberr

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From his time in Arizona and Pittsburgh, you certainly get the impression he's an unlikable individual.  

 

I think that runs its course eventually.  Getting into bar fights or "altercations" as a grown adult doesn't help your cause either.  

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gobillsinytown RFA

gobillsinytown

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27 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

Ben hates him. Looks like they are going to promote the QB coach. Their defense was worse than the offense though. 

 

It also doesn't help that they lost the centerpiece of their defense in Shazier to a horrible injury.  These are tough guys, but seeing that kind of 

injury had to shake them up for a while.  

 

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BillsFan4 All Pro

BillsFan4

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19 minutes ago, ShadyBillsFan said:

in a related topic 

 

Munchak turns down second Cardinals interview

 

It's unclear why Munchak declined the opportunity, but it's possible he sees himself as a candidate for the Steelers' offensive coordinator job now that Todd Haley will not return in the role next season

 

I'll be curious to see if anything comes out about this down the line.

 

I find it interesting that someone would (potentially) turn down a shot at being a head coach for a shot at being an OC. 

 

 

 

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BillsFan130 All Pro

BillsFan130

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26 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

No.  No, you would not have loved him in Buffalo. 

 

He's the coaching equivalent of roquefort cheese.  At first, it can impart to a dish a unique flavor like no other and you savor the results.  But then you realize that it only works with specific combinations of ingredients.  It can be arrogantly overpowering despite how good it seems to its fans.  And gradually, if you don't contain it successfully, it imparts its flavor to every cheese in the drawer and develops an ammonia-like stench until you're forced to clean out the lot, scrub out the drawer, and start over.

 

Ask the Chiefs.  For that matter, did you catch in that WGR interview about Daboll in KC, the part about the mess Haley left behind him?

Haha nice post.

 

And no I can’t say I did.

 

Was Just judging based on my own observations with Pittsburgh.

 

I really liked some of the concepts he used with them. Their run game, mis directions, using Bell as a receiver, screens.

 

I know he had tons of talent on that offence, but hard to argue with the results.

 

I mean, they just scored 42 points and almost 600 yards of offence against one of the best defences in the league.

 

What more do they want from their offence? Lol

 

I believe not bringing him back had little to do with results, and more to do with Bens relationship with him. According to reports anyways 

Edited by billsfan11
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Hapless Bills Fan Hall of Famer

Hapless Bills Fan

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11 minutes ago, dpberr said:

From his time in Arizona and Pittsburgh, you certainly get the impression he's an unlikable individual.  

 

I think that runs its course eventually.  Getting into bar fights or "altercations" as a grown adult doesn't help your cause either.  

 

Don't forget his HC stint in KC.

 

I think he did well in AZ because Whisenhunt had both the knowledge and the personality to be a check-and-balance on Haley, and he had Kurt Warner.

In KC, he failed to get the best out of Matt Cassel while serving as his own OC.  To his credit, he brought in Charlie Weis who took them to the playoffs, but it's not been clear to me why Charlie left the following year.

 

The bar fight was a ridiculous distraction, especially if the cause is as Shady Bills Fan specified.  Control your damn libido and keep it out of the public eye.

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corta765 Veteran

corta765

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18 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

Ben hates him. Looks like they are going to promote the QB coach. Their defense was worse than the offense though. 

 

Their defense lost its leader in Shazier which matters and while 31pts still isn't a pretty number, JAX defense contributed directly to 14pts between the fumble rec for TD and the INT on the PIT 20. That put their defense in a big hole quick. That said it doesn't excuse the deep passes they allowed late.

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Buffalo Barbarian Hall of Famer

Buffalo Barbarian

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58 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

https://t.co/VFjUpOsuHw?amp=1

 

Yeah because it was his fault they only scored 41 points

 

 

50 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

Ben hates him. Looks like they are going to promote the QB coach. Their defense was worse than the offense though. 

 

I thought they got over that a few years ago?

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cba fan Veteran

cba fan

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1 minute ago, Happy Gilmore said:

Wonder how much pressure Big Ben put on the Steeler's brass...it's either me or Haley.  If you choose to keep Haley, I'll retire.

Kind of strange that a guy who had all kinds of legal trouble in back rooms and hallways in bars like Ben had, before he found God/married/started family, could not counsel Haley and get him on the straight and narrow.

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cba fan Veteran

cba fan

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3 minutes ago, Happy Gilmore said:

Wonder how much pressure Big Ben put on the Steeler's brass...it's either me or Haley.  If you choose to keep Haley, I'll retire.

I thought it was a given Ben retires this year.

 

He himself said he was hairbreadth away from retiring last year and this was confirmed by his teammates and friends. Surely after one more year of NFL pounding and his skills eroding that hairbreadth gap would have closed.

 

 

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Happy Veteran

Happy

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1 minute ago, cba fan said:

Kind of strange that a guy who had all kinds of legal trouble in back rooms and hallways in bars like Ben had, before he found God/married/started family, could not counsel Haley and get him on the straight and narrow.

 

How many instances do you know of where a player councils a coach and "takes them under his wing?"  Normally it is the other way around.  I applaud Ben for turning his life around; like you indicated, Ben was a punk.

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Hapless Bills Fan Hall of Famer

Hapless Bills Fan

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19 minutes ago, billsfan11 said:

I really liked some of the concepts he used with them. Their run game, mis directions, using Bell as a receiver, screens.

I know he had tons of talent on that offence, but hard to argue with the results.

I mean, they just scored 42 points and almost 600 yards of offence against one of the best defences in the league.

 

This is the "flavor like no other" part of the Roquefort analogy.  It can be good stuff, make no mistake.

 

Quote

What more do they want from their offence? Lol

 

Success on 4th down, LOL.  Haley pushes a form of advanced analytics for game day decisions, including when to do onside kicks and when to go for it on 4th down

http://archive.advancedfootballanalytics.com/2010/10/todd-haley-advanced-nfl-stats-coach-of.html

has some stuff on this.  That was far from the first mystifying 4th down call from Haley in the playoffs, or with the Steelers:

https://twitter.com/WillBrinson/status/952619357535899649/video/1
As HC of the Chiefs, Haley loved unnecessary and unexpected onside kicks.  I think he may have sold that philosophy to Tomlin.

 

This is the "if you don't contain it successfully, it imparts its flavor to every cheese in the drawer" part of the analogy

 

Quote

I believe not bringing him back had little to do with results, and more to do with Bens relationship with him. According to reports anyways 

 

He did not get along with Big Ben and it wouldn't be a hard guess to think he was offensive to his assistants.  That is the "arrogantly overpowering" part of the analogy.

But it had to do with results.  Make no mistake, the Steelers convert on those 4th downs, succeed on that onside kick, and win the game, Haley stays and Big Ben and Haley get told to kiss and make up.  But they failed, and Tomlin wound up looking stupid on a national stage.  First rule of work: Don't embarrass your boss or make your boss look stupid in public.

 

So Tomlin threw Haley out and scrubbed the drawer. 

Edited by Hapless Bills Fan
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BillsFan130 All Pro

BillsFan130

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33 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

This is the "flavor like no other" part of the Roquefort analogy.  It can be good stuff, make no mistake.

 

 

Success on 4th down, LOL.  Haley pushes a form of advanced analytics for game day decisions, including when to do onside kicks and when to go for it on 4th down

http://archive.advancedfootballanalytics.com/2010/10/todd-haley-advanced-nfl-stats-coach-of.html

has some stuff on this.  That was far from the first mystifying 4th down call from Haley in the playoffs, or with the Steelers:

https://twitter.com/WillBrinson/status/952619357535899649/video/1
As HC of the Chiefs, Haley loved unnecessary and unexpected onside kicks.  I think he may have sold that philosophy to Tomlin.

 

This is the "if you don't contain it successfully, it imparts its flavor to every cheese in the drawer" part of the analogy

 

 

He did not get along with Big Ben and it wouldn't be a hard guess to think he was offensive to his assistants.  That is the "arrogantly overpowering" part of the analogy.

But it had to do with results.  Make no mistake, the Steelers convert on those 4th downs, succeed on that onside kick, and win the game, Haley stays and Big Ben and Haley get told to kiss and make up.  But they failed, and Tomlin wound up looking stupid on a national stage.  First rule of work: Don't embarrass your boss or make your boss look stupid in public.

 

So Tomlin threw Haley out and scrubbed the drawer. 

Once again, good post.

 

From what I have heard and read, Mike Tomlin was the one who didn’t want Big Ben sneaking on 4th downs anymores. Or at least it was an agreement between him and Haley.

 

So while those 4th down plays were questionable, a QB sneak was not an option for Haley to call for whatever reason.

 

And fair enough about having better success on 4th down. But that’s nitpickin to a certain degree.

 

At the end of the day they got 42 points and racked up huge yards against a great defence.

 

Their defence is by far the most important reason in which why they lost, not the offence.

 

If someone told you before the game Pitts was going to score 42 points, but gave up a fumble returned for a TD, Ben throwing a pick, and didn’t convert on a couple 4th downs, wouldn’t you still  guess they would beat the Jaguars by at least 14 points?

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