Tyrod QBR

[BuffaloHokie13]

I think yesterday's game hurt my argument. TT for sure outplayed Siemian.

So you expect a guy who thinks the QB is not good enough to post prolifically about how good the QB is after a good game?

 

Are you kidding?

 

Like I said, pick a lane. If I thought Mills sucked for years, and he had a good game, you would complain I'm not bitching enough or praising him enough?

 

Strange things outta this group here.

Different offenses for both this year, but TT outplayed Siemian last year too, outside of YPG

[Kirby Jackson]

he had good QBR 3's then very bad then very good.

 

CONSISTENCY is what we need.

He actually was above average QBR in week 2.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

He actually was above average QBR in week 2.

You can polish a 3 point turd all you want ..... It's still a turd.

 

4 for 13 on 3rd down is not above average.

Edited September 25, 2017 by ShadyBillsFan

[metzelaars_lives]

Tyron's QBR was NOT 125. His passer rating was 125. The QBR scale only goes to 100.

[BringBackOrton]

Different offenses for both this year, but TT outplayed Siemian last year too, outside of YPG

You could make that argument, yeah.

[Kirby Jackson]

You can polish a 3 point turd all you want ..... It's still a turd.

You said he had a below average QBR. He didn't. Whether you agree or not it isn't debatable. I don't think that he played well either (although he made the plays to win). I think that it was like 55.2 last week. 50 is average in QBR. His rating (which is different) is 9th right now. No one is calling him Aaron Rodgers but those clamouring for Peterman or saying that he's a backup is laughable at this point. It's not even worth dignifying. It's like when people hung on to EJ being a better option despite the fact that it was wrong. Sometimes we just need to admit we were wrong and move on. I had to do that with Chris Hogan. We all have those moments.

[JohnC]

You said he had a below average QBR. He didn't. Whether you agree or not it isn't debatable. I don't think that he played well either (although he made the plays to win). I think that it was like 55.2 last week. 50 is average in QBR. His rating (which is different) is 9th right now. No one is calling him Aaron Rodgers but those clamouring for Peterman or saying that he's a backup is laughable at this point. It's not even worth dignifying. It's like when people hung on to EJ being a better option despite the fact that it was wrong. Sometimes we just need to admit we were wrong and move on. I had to do that with Chris Hogan. We all have those moments.

Weren't you a D'Rick devotee? No one is immune from making bad judgments on players. I was a Rob Johnson fan to the ignominious conclusion. I also thought Trent Edwards and Losman were going to be franchise qbs.

 

I don't want to belabor the Taylor issue because without him this team would be sunk. However, the qualitative difference when watching a qb who can run the full span of passing plays is starkly evident compared to when he plays. I was watching part of the Skins/Raiders games and Cousins was completing the full menu of passing plays. (I consider Cousins a good, not elite qb.) Until that caliber of qb is attained this will be a meandering franchise.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

You said he had a below average QBR. He didn't. Whether you agree or not it isn't debatable. I don't think that he played well either (although he made the plays to win). I think that it was like 55.2 last week. 50 is average in QBR. His rating (which is different) is 9th right now.

 

No one is calling him Aaron Rodgers but those clamouring for Peterman or saying that he's a backup is laughable at this point. It's not even worth dignifying. It's like when people hung on to EJ being a better option despite the fact that it was wrong. Sometimes we just need to admit we were wrong and move on. I had to do that with Chris Hogan. We all have those moments.

It is my opinion that while Great Stats look good, they may not reflect the outcome of a game.

 

If he had a 153.645 Rating and a 100 QBR and still only managed 3 points... I'd still call it a bad game.

 

RE Peterman.

Those wanting NP because TT plain sucks types need to be ignored.

 

Is the intent to stay with the run first O and keep losing every other game? - Put in TT and his .500 - .600 skilset.

Is the intent to balance the run and pass keep losing every other game? - Put in Peterman to discover the unknown.

IMO We need week to week to week to week consistency in the passing game at the QB position. I've yet to see it.

[BillsFan2313]

But TJ Yates is winning playoff games.

 

True. It can be done, but I am not too confident it will. I hope I am wrong, as usual.

[Kirby Jackson]

Weren't you a D'Rick devotee? No one is immune from making bad judgments on players. I was a Rob Johnson fan to the ignominious conclusion. I also thought Trent Edwards and Losman were going to be franchise qbs.

 

I don't want to belabor the Taylor issue because without him this team would be sunk. However, the qualitative difference when watching a qb who can run the full span of passing plays is starkly evident compared to when he plays. I was watching part of the Skins/Raiders games and Cousins was completing the full menu of passing plays. (I consider Cousins a good, not elite qb.) Until that caliber of qb is attained this will be a meandering franchise.

I was ALL ABOUT Da'Rick. I always fall on the side of talent. That's why I'm frustrated watching Tolbert get double digit touches. We have some talent in the secondary though!!

 

At the same time he has better weapons. I know that I keep driving it home but it's hard to make a lot of plays when you have, inarguably, a bottom 3 receiving group. I do love that they have gotten Shady involved in the passing game. They need the ball in his hands. I'd really like to see them call up those PS guys. I didn't think I'd say it but Kaelin Clay may need to play some. At least he's an athlete. That was a LOADED box yesterday and no one could get separation.

 

True. It can be done, but I am not too confident it will. I hope I am wrong, as usual.

I am not sure that they will win playoff games but Tyrod is a middle of the road starter. He's an average QB. There have been some BAD QBs to win playoff games. Osweiler won one last year.

[bobobonators]

Weren't you a D'Rick devotee? No one is immune from making bad judgments on players. I was a Rob Johnson fan to the ignominious conclusion. I also thought Trent Edwards and Losman were going to be franchise qbs.

 

I don't want to belabor the Taylor issue because without him this team would be sunk. However, the qualitative difference when watching a qb who can run the full span of passing plays is starkly evident compared to when he plays. I was watching part of the Skins/Raiders games and Cousins was completing the full menu of passing plays. (I consider Cousins a good, not elite qb.) Until that caliber of qb is attained this will be a meandering franchise.

 

Cherry-picking is a problem. How did Carr look last night in contrast? A Broncos fans could've watched the Bills/Dolphins game last year where the Bills set a franchise record for offense in a game, and said, damn, I want that QB on our team.

 

I know plenty of Skins fans that don't want Cousins as their QB, and say he's not worth the money that he's going to want.

 

What I'm trying to say is that we can cherry pick a game any week of the NFL and say, damn look at that performance; I want that QB. But we don't come back on here when said QB falls flat on their face the following week (i.e., Siemian last week vs. Siemian this week).

[dave mcbride]

 

Cherry-picking is a problem. How did Carr look last night in contrast? A Broncos fans could've watched the Bills/Dolphins game last year where the Bills set a franchise record for offense in a game, and said, damn, I want that QB on our team.

 

I know plenty of Skins fans that don't want Cousins as their QB, and say he's not worth the money that he's going to want.

 

What I'm trying to say is that we can cherry pick a game any week of the NFL and say, damn look at that performance; I want that QB. But we don't come back on here when said QB falls flat on their face the following week (i.e., Siemian last week vs. Siemian this week).

Hence my focus above on the fact that Taylor has now started two full seasons worth of games (32) now. He has a 94.2 rating and the offense has performed well overall (with the expected ups and downs). I think we have enough evidence now to declare him "pretty good" - a bit above average relative to other qbs, but certainly not great. I will add that his good qualities don't get emphasized enough - remarkable toughness, extremely even-keeled and no- BS demeanor, and a remarkable propensity to not turn the ball over (I'm including the fact that he's only lost a couple of fumbles in his time in Buffalo, which is pretty remarkable).

Edited September 25, 2017 by dave mcbride

[Scott7975]

 

It is my opinion that while Great Stats look good, they may not reflect the outcome of a game.

 

If he had a 153.645 Rating and a 100 QBR and still only managed 3 points... I'd still call it a bad game.

 

RE Peterman.

Those wanting NP because TT plain sucks types need to be ignored.

 

Is the intent to stay with the run first O and keep losing every other game? - Put in TT and his .500 - .600 skilset.

Is the intent to balance the run and pass keep losing every other game? - Put in Peterman to discover the unknown.

IMO We need week to week to week to week consistency in the passing game at the QB position. I've yet to see it.

 

Its hard to get consistency in the passing game if the OC doesn't let a QB pass the football. For instance Taylor threw 25 passes in the Carolina game. Half of those came on the last two drives of the game.

 

Even in the Denver game early on they were not letting TT throw and get in a rhythm. It wasn't until they started letting him throw that we actually started moving the ball. We went up 1 score and Dennison climbed back into his run run pass punt shell.

[HappyDays]

IMO We need week to week to week to week consistency in the passing game at the QB position. I've yet to see it.

The only QB that has seen week to week consistency so far this season is Matt Ryan. Brady is also pretty close although that first game for him was not up to par. Your standards are unrealistic. Good football teams can win even when their QBs aren't playing out of their minds. The fact we have a QB that can even sometimes carry the offense is amazing, and not easy to replicate. His lows are not EJ Manuel lows where he gifts the other team free TDs.

[26CornerBlitz]

The only QB that has seen week to week consistency so far this season is Matt Ryan. Brady is also pretty close although that first game for him was not up to par. Your standards are unrealistic. Good football teams can win even when their QBs aren't playing out of their minds. The fact we have a QB that can even sometimes carry the offense is amazing, and not easy to replicate. His lows are not EJ Manuel lows where he gifts the other team free TDs.

 

The same Matt Ryan who threw three interceptions yesterday against DET?

That includes one pick six.

[BADOLBILZ]

You said he had a below average QBR. He didn't. Whether you agree or not it isn't debatable. I don't think that he played well either (although he made the plays to win). I think that it was like 55.2 last week. 50 is average in QBR. His rating (which is different) is 9th right now. No one is calling him Aaron Rodgers but those clamouring for Peterman or saying that he's a backup is laughable at this point. It's not even worth dignifying. It's like when people hung on to EJ being a better option despite the fact that it was wrong. Sometimes we just need to admit we were wrong and move on. I had to do that with Chris Hogan. We all have those moments.

 

Far sightedness.

 

Tom Brady and Aaron Rodgers are clearly better.............then there are a handful who are better passers and therefore they are usually more effective............then there is a group that are better passers but are usually less effective because they can't extend plays, don't facilitate an improved running game and turn the ball over etc..........which is why Tyrod is easily a top 10 producer at QB.

 

But his haters can only see two guys way up at the top of the list and don't really follow enough of the rest of them to keep it in perspective.

[Antonio]

Yep. The throw rolling to the left to OLeary was tremendous (as was the catch). The run for 14 yards and first down when he was all but sacked pretty much no one makes. The TD to Clay running and stopping and seeing the play materialize not a lot of guys make either. He has a lot of faults but he makes plays few make and he doesn't get credit for them.

 

Exactly!

 

Thats why I like TT, he is not a future HOFer or an Elite Franchise QB, but we can win with him and a good D.

 

And with that kind of contract you can have better players at diferent positions.

 

DOn´t get me wrong, I would reather have a Manning, Brees, Rodgers, etc... but I´m fine rolling with TT until we get our future Elite QB.

[Yoho]

 

It is my opinion that while Great Stats look good, they may not reflect the outcome of a game.

 

If he had a 153.645 Rating and a 100 QBR and still only managed 3 points... I'd still call it a bad game.

 

RE Peterman.

Those wanting NP because TT plain sucks types need to be ignored.

 

Is the intent to stay with the run first O and keep losing every other game? - Put in TT and his .500 - .600 skilset.

Is the intent to balance the run and pass keep losing every other game? - Put in Peterman to discover the unknown.

IMO We need week to week to week to week consistency in the passing game at the QB position. I've yet to see it.

 

Do you mean the week to week consistency shown by Derek Carr or Ben Rothliesberger? Even Brady is only 2 for 3 this year.

[Utah John]

Taylor has played well all year. Even in the Carolina game when our O line couldn't handle the D, he did as well as possible in the second half, with just a little too much on the last pass to Jones. If Jones makes that catch the Bills are 3-0.

 

It could be he's in a scheme that works for him, finally. No QB thrives in the wrong scheme.

 

Yesterday he was really good. His decision making is much better than previously. He's throwing over the middle of the field, and he's throwing receivers open.

 

He missed one pass yesterday, to a wide open Jones, when running to his left. That makes it a tougher throw but no excuses, that was a terrible pass. But other than that he played really well, when the running game was shut down and he had to rely on receivers with no speed.

[Augie]

And you're wrong, the scheme heavily favors Taylor, the more he throws the more he will give chances to the opposing team, he is a good running QB, in most instances if you ask him to win a game with his arm, he will lose ( see the Carolina game), there is only 1 QB that I know, maybe there were more ? Feel free to let me know but Rich Gannon is the only QB I can recall who went from a journeyman/ average QB and turned into a franchise QB pretty much out of nowhere, I'm not sure what happened to him or what clicked but it's very rare. Gannon will never be a HOF QB imo but for a few years in a row he was putting up monster numbers for back then. Maybe Taylor can have the same sort of resurgence but the odds are he's just an average QB.

Blah, blah, blah....which makes him an NFL QB. Which is what I said. Not elite, but middle of the pack...or "average". Trying to make him a pocket passer does not work in his favor. They have gradually begun to use him more wisely by moving the pocket and taking advantage of his mobility.

[mannc]

 

Far sightedness.

 

Tom Brady and Aaron Rodgers are clearly better.............then there are a handful who are better passers and therefore they are usually more effective............then there is a group that are better passers but are usually less effective because they can't extend plays, don't facilitate an improved running game and turn the ball over etc..........which is why Tyrod is easily a top 10 producer at QB.

 

But his haters can only see two guys way up at the top of the list and don't really follow enough of the rest of them to keep it in perspective.

I hate to ruin the fun for all the folks who have written off this season and are just looking forward to the draft, but there is a good possibility that the Bills will bring back Tyrod in 2018 and will NOT give away multiple picks to move up for a QB in the 2018 draft. That doesn't mean they won't (or shouldn't) draft a QB this year, but if Tyrod continues to play well, I don't think management will consider QB to be the primary need in this draft.

[Kirby Jackson]

Saw this in the Barnwell thread but since the Broncos pass defense became so dominant in 2015 only 1 passer had a QB rating in triple digits, Drew Brees at 111.6. Yesterday Tyrod was at 126.

[billykaykay]

He played better than he has and did what they asked of him. Let's not get too crazy though. He only had 200 yards passing. Brady had half that on the final drive of the game alone. We will see next week that we still need a QB to keep up with teams that have one

Did anyone notice how many QB's threw for 300 plus yards & lost? And, how many threw for under 300 & won.

Taylor has played well all year. Even in the Carolina game when our O line couldn't handle the D, he did as well as possible in the second half, with just a little too much on the last pass to Jones. If Jones makes that catch the Bills are 3-0.

 

It could be he's in a scheme that works for him, finally. No QB thrives in the wrong scheme.

 

Yesterday he was really good. His decision making is much better than previously. He's throwing over the middle of the field, and he's throwing receivers open.

 

He missed one pass yesterday, to a wide open Jones, when running to his left. That makes it a tougher throw but no excuses, that was a terrible pass. But other than that he played really well, when the running game was shut down and he had to rely on receivers with no speed.

I think everyone has forgotten that he threw a TD pass to Tolbert which he dropped.

[26CornerBlitz]

@buffalobills

T2. #GoBills

 

https://twitter.com/i/videos/tweet/912350835312603136

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

Do you mean the week to week consistency shown by Derek Carr or Ben Rothliesberger? Even Brady is only 2 for 3 this year.

in bold would be great.

 

Taylor has show us for 31 or 32 games what he is. - A running QB and not a passing QB. 2 or 3 superb games a season doesn't cut it.

we need 10 excellent outings a season not 2 or 3 excellent outings.

[Kirby Jackson]

in bold would be great.

 

Taylor has show us for 31 or 32 games what he is. - A running QB and not a passing QB. 2 or 3 superb games a season doesn't cut it.

 

we need 10 excellent outings a season not 2 or 3 excellent outings.

He's the 9th rated passer in the league currently. That doesn't factor in running. Please elaborate on your point....

[BuffaloHokie13]

in bold would be great.

 

Taylor has show us for 31 or 32 games what he is. - A running QB and not a passing QB. 2 or 3 superb games a season doesn't cut it.

we need 10 excellent outings a season not 2 or 3 excellent outings.

You do know that Carr is coming off a game where he went 19/31 for 118 Yards (3.81 YPA), 1 TD and 2 INTs, right? He's had a stinker in 1/3 games as well and it was worse than Tyrod's...

[mannc]

He's the 9th rated passer in the league currently. That doesn't factor in running. Please elaborate on your point....

Total passing yards!

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

He's the 9th rated passer in the league currently. That doesn't factor in running. Please elaborate on your point....

QB Rating and QBR STATS are not the end all.

 

His passing "stats" look good. But you and I both know that he's NOT a passing QB.

 

When TT plays and Wins 4 or 5 games with 35 to 40 passing plays and still protects the ball then we can discuss this further.

 

Alex Smith's QB Rating rated higher than Tom Brady after 3 weeks. These stats say what? Brady is getting old or Smith is the better QB?

 

Jared Goff is 3rd , Case Keenum 6th. Elite Superstars?

 

Aaron Rodgers is 13, Russel Wilson 15, and Dak Prescott 25th.

 

Is TT really better than Rodgers, Wilson?

 

Yards per game ranking

29th Tyrod Taylor

Edited September 25, 2017 by ShadyBillsFan

[26CornerBlitz]

@ChrisTrapasso

Tyrod Taylor's QB Rating while using playaction: 144.1 (best in NFL) ...without playaction: 84.7 (20th)

[mannc]

@ChrisTrapasso

 

Tyrod Taylor's QB Rating while using playaction: 144.1 (best in NFL) ...without playaction: 84.7 (20th)

Which is exactly why a lot of us want to see more first down passing plays.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

You do know that Carr is coming off a game where he went 19/31 for 118 Yards (3.81 YPA), 1 TD and 2 INTs, right? He's had a stinker in 1/3 games as well and it was worse than Tyrod's...

I've said this hundreds of times. Not every QB is at the top of his game 16 of 16.

 

My point is that 2 great games of 16 games is not what we need. We need a QB that is great in games at least 10 of 16.

 

IMO, over the last 3 seasons Carr has developed far more that TT has sitting on a bench for 4 or 5 years.

[Kelly the Dog]

@ChrisTrapasso

 

Tyrod Taylor's QB Rating while using playaction: 144.1 (best in NFL) ...without playaction: 84.7 (20th)

 

The funny thing is we couldn't run for schit so the playaction shouldn't have been so effective.

[Bills757]

I hate to ruin the fun for all the folks who have written off this season and are just looking forward to the draft, but there is a good possibility that the Bills will bring back Tyrod in 2018 and will NOT give away multiple picks to move up for a QB in the 2018 draft. That doesn't mean they won't (or shouldn't) draft a QB this year, but if Tyrod continues to play well, I don't think management will consider QB to be the primary need in this draft.

 

Just picking a QB can be tricky as we've seen in so many cases in the recent past. For every Derek Carr (who looked pretty pedestrian without great pass pro last night), there's a Vince Young and an RG3. Having said that, if there's a QB in the upcoming draft that strikes Beane and McD as possibly being THE guy, you do what you feel you need to do to get him. Of course, building a solid Oline is important and developing the current skill guys as well. There are so many parts to the equation but the Bills are in great position to make deals if they feel their franchise QB is in the '18 draft.

 

I'm a big TT fan but things can change in an instant. You have to be planning for the future and for unforeseen circumstances constantly. Even if TT leads the Bills to the playoffs and maybe wins a game there, if deals can be done in next year's draft that make sense to get a guy like Darnold or Rudolph, you make those deals (not a big fan of Rosen personally).

[Kirby Jackson]

 

QB Rating and QBR STATS are not the end all.

 

His passing "stats" look good. But you and I both know that he's NOT a passing QB.

 

When TT plays and Wins 4 or 5 games with 35 to 40 passing plays and still protects the ball then we can discuss this further.

 

Alex Smith's QB Rating rated higher than Tom Brady after 3 weeks. These tats say what? Brady is getting old?

Jared Goff is 3rd , Case Keenum 6th.

 

Aaron Rodgers is 13, Russel Wilson 15, and Dak Prescott 25th.

 

Is TT really better than Rodgers, Wilson?

 

Yards per game 29 Tyrod Taylor

So we agree that's he's passing well, I assume we agree that his weapons suck but we are supposed to agree that he's a bad passer? Honestly, how does that even make sense to you? Here are his passer ratings in his last 6 starts: 100.1, 105.2, 118.4, 92.0, 79.6, 126. That averages to 103.6. That would have had him 5th last year (and again that doesn't account for rushing).

[26CornerBlitz]

The funny thing is we couldn't run for schit so the playaction shouldn't have been so effective.

 

Still have to respect it with McCoy in the backfield.

[Kelly the Dog]

Still have to respect it with McCoy in the backfield.

True. I have been yelling for it all year. And still, the most effective playaction has been historically following a few successful runs.

[26CornerBlitz]

@YardsPerPass

These are the 3 deep balls that TT threw. On all of them there is depth from his OL, getting convinced that this is necessary for him

 

 

 

[QCity]

So we agree that's he's passing well, I assume we agree that his weapons suck but we are supposed to agree that he's a bad passer? Honestly, how does that even make sense to you? Here are his passer ratings in his last 6 starts: 100.1, 105.2, 118.4, 92.0, 79.6, 126. That averages to 103.6. That would have had him 5th last year (and again that doesn't account for rushing).

 

Well I'm sold. He's clearly a better passer than Dan Marino.

[JohnC]

 

Cherry-picking is a problem. How did Carr look last night in contrast? A Broncos fans could've watched the Bills/Dolphins game last year where the Bills set a franchise record for offense in a game, and said, damn, I want that QB on our team.

 

I know plenty of Skins fans that don't want Cousins as their QB, and say he's not worth the money that he's going to want.

 

What I'm trying to say is that we can cherry pick a game any week of the NFL and say, damn look at that performance; I want that QB. But we don't come back on here when said QB falls flat on their face the following week (i.e., Siemian last week vs. Siemian this week).

I have no clue what you are getting at. I and anyone else who is normal would take Carr or Cousins over our qb. My assessment has nothing to do with any particular game. That would be an insane way to judge a qb. It's about general competency.

 

There are people, as you mentioned, who say Cousins isn't worth the money he is asking for. What I can tell you is that he is a legitimate franchise qb (not elite) and is going to get top shelf money. If you are going to overpay for a qb it is better to overpay for a franchise qb then pay less than market value for a qb who isn't a franchise qb.