Trump and Russia

[Kemp]

Again: Without saying anything about Biden, is there any possible way for you to listen to Trump's reply and claim he's of sound mind?

 

Chef Jim blew his chance.

[Tiberius]

Wow, Trump is just a real POS 

 

 

[SoCal Deek]

2 minutes ago, Kemp said:

Again: Without saying anything about Biden, is there any possible way for you to listen to Trump's reply and claim he's of sound mind?.

The same is generally said about EVERY SINGLE POST you offer on here…so there’s that! 

[Doc]

3 hours ago, BillsFanNC said:

Tried to get dirt on Hunter Biden?

 

 

It's friggin out there in plain sight, well when it's not being censored that is.

 

 

 

It's funny how an actual admission of extortion (above) is nothing, but a call in which Trump never said anything about withholding aid to Ukraine unless/until the extortion above was investigated is impeachable.

Edited March 11, 2022 by Doc

[Chef Jim]

2 hours ago, Kemp said:

If you watched that interview and that's sincerely your take on it, I feel sorry for you about your lack of intellect. I'm hoping, for your sake, that you're lying.
 

 

To be honest I didn't listen to the whole interview.  I never listened to him speak when he was POTUS why would I now.  

 

Did you listen to it all?  

[Westside]

3 hours ago, Kemp said:

So an analysis of the Ukraine situation pertains to windmills? How so.

I had a feeling no one would be able to stay on topic, so thanks for that, at least.

 

Another one who couldn't answer. Can't say I blame you. There's no explanation or defense available as an answer. So, ramble on.

 

So, we can agree that Trump's mind isn't functionally correctly and that he should never be President, again, right?

If that's your stance, I'm happy to talk about Biden with you.

Stop being a partisan hack. Put the country first. Are you able to do that?

[Jackalope89]

3 hours ago, Westside said:

Stop being a partisan hack. Put the country first. Are you able to do that?

I'm sorry, but, how is supporting a guy that would rather brag about cozying up with the likes of Kim Jung Un, insult our allies, and slander people like a Judge for his ethnicity rather than speak a single word against Putin, "going against the US"?

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

21 hours ago, Kemp said:

Without saying anything about Biden, is there any possible way for you to listen to Trump's reply and claim he's of sound mind?

Admit it. If Biden or (Pick your Dem) spoke those words in response to that question, you'd be saying they should be in a mental institution.

Bet you can't answer my question. You can only ignore or wander off topic, much like your cult leader.

 

Without mentioning Biden:

 

I listened to the reply.  If a politician rambling, ignoring the question to address a topic they are interested in discussing, or giving answers that reveal nothing is new to you, you haven’t been paying attention.  Trump has done that many, many times since announcing his candidacy, and truth be told, long before that.  
 

This clip indicates nothing about whether or not he’s sound of mind.  Zero. Zilch.  Nothing.   It is, however, perfectly understandable that his political opponents would point to it as evidence he was losing it, or had already lost it.  
 

Question answered. 
 

With respect to your second “Don’t mention Biden but if Biden spoke those words”:

 

Biden of 2022 is not Biden of Obama/Biden and certainly not the Joe Biden who ran the Senate for decades (when, ironically toxic white male towel snapping was the order of the day).  In and of themselves, the rambling, plagiarism, racially charged comments, inappropriate touching, etc did not have anyone remarking that he was not of “sound mind”.  The argument was that he was an affable dimwit who was popular because had the best interest of the white, union, working class constituents in mind when developing his political platform.  
 

If Biden made said comment in 2008, it would be seized upon by his adversaries as evidence that the affable dimwit was just Joe being Joe.  In 2022, it would rightly be submitted as evidence that he can’t go 30 seconds without drifting off.    That’s not D v R, that’s the reality of Joe Biden today.
 

Finally, an analogy.  At some point when Obama was campaigning, he remarked about visiting all “52 states”.   There was no cry for cognitive testing, no rush to judgement on his mental state, no wondering aloud as to how a guy could get through Harvard thinking the country added East Dakota and South Virginia to the state registry somewhere along the line.   
 

Today, both Biden and Trump are hammered as old and senile by the opposition if they make a similar remark.  I assume we can agree on this, yes?  

 

 

 

 

 

[Chef Jim]

12 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

 

Without mentioning Biden:

 

I listened to the reply.  If a politician rambling, ignoring the question to address a topic they are interested in discussing, or giving answers that reveal nothing is new to you, you haven’t been paying attention.  Trump has done that many, many times since announcing his candidacy, and truth be told, long before that.  
 

This clip indicates nothing about whether or not he’s sound of mind.  Zero. Zilch.  Nothing.   It is, however, perfectly understandable that his political opponents would point to it as evidence he was losing it, or had already lost it.  
 

Question answered. 
 

With respect to your second “Don’t mention Biden but if Biden spoke those words”:

 

Biden of 2022 is not Biden of Obama/Biden and certainly not the Joe Biden who ran the Senate for decades (when, ironically toxic white male towel snapping was the order of the day).  In and of themselves, the rambling, plagiarism, racially charged comments, inappropriate touching, etc did not have anyone remarking that he was not of “sound mind”.  The argument was that he was an affable dimwit who was popular because had the best interest of the white, union, working class constituents in mind when developing his political platform.  
 

If Biden made said comment in 2008, it would be seized upon by his adversaries as evidence that the affable dimwit was just Joe being Joe.  In 2022, it would rightly be submitted as evidence that he can’t go 30 seconds without drifting off.    That’s not D v R, that’s the reality of Joe Biden today.
 

Finally, an analogy.  At some point when Obama was campaigning, he remarked about visiting all “52 states”.   There was no cry for cognitive testing, no rush to judgement on his mental state, no wondering aloud as to how a guy could get through Harvard thinking the country added East Dakota and South Virginia to the state registry somewhere along the line.   
 

Today, both Biden and Trump are hammered as old and senile by the opposition if they make a similar remark.  I assume we can agree on this, yes?  

 

 

 

 

 

I’ll just put this here.   How often were people screaming 25th Amendment during Trump’s Presidency?  There were an awful lot of armchair psychologists back then that have become very silent today. 

[Bob in Mich]

1 hour ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

 

 

Today, both Biden and Trump are hammered as old and senile by the opposition if they make a similar remark.  I assume we can agree on this, yes?  

 

 

Good post, Lance.  I hope all is well with you and yours

 

Certainly neither of them is as sharp as they were as young men.  The verbal stumbles and the gait changes are apparent in both.

 

I think too that Trump has had greater verbal skills over Joe, likely at any age.  Verbal skill is an element of intelligence but it surely should not be the sole decider of intellect, right?  Do you recall those essay questions we always had in school?  Those were to determine what you knew but also if you could organize and convey the proper answer, obviously in written form. In my opinion, most Presidential decisions are more like essay questions and less like flash card contests.

 

Of course I don’t agree with Joe on some issues.  I better trust Joe to give an issue thought though, to hire sane advisors, to more consistently consult with those sane advisors, to more often make decisions without having to pet his ego, to have better historical knowledge on global issues, and to put the needs of the people and the country over his own and those of his cronies.  I don’t trust Trump to do any of those things when making decisions. 

Edited March 12, 2022 by Bob in Mich

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

1 hour ago, Bob in Mich said:

Good post, Lance.  I hope all is well with you and yours

 

Certainly neither of them is as sharp as they were as young men.  The verbal stumbles and the gait changes are apparent in both.

 

I think too that Trump has had greater verbal skills over Joe, likely at any age.  Verbal skill is an element of intelligence but it surely should not be the sole decider of intellect, right?  Do you recall those essay questions we always had in school?  Those were to determine what you knew but also if you could organize and convey the proper answer, obviously in written form. In my opinion, most Presidential decisions are more like essay questions and less like flash card contests.

 

Of course I don’t agree with Joe on some issues.  I better trust Joe to give an issue thought though, to hire sane advisors, to more consistently consult with those sane advisors, to more often make decisions without having to pet his ego, to have better historical knowledge on global issues, and to put the needs of the people and the country over his own and those of his cronies.  I don’t trust Trump to do any of those things when making decisions. 

We're all good here, Bob, thank you. Hope the same applies to you and that you're feeling well these days.

 

I agree with your thoughts on verbal skill v intellect, and recall the essay question days quite well.  I preferred that format over the multiple choice standard, and I think you are on point with essay v flash cards.  The challenge is that most of that which passes for political analysis is based on the flash card methodology, and folks extrapolate from there.   The "52 states" comment is a prime example---reasonable people recognize that people can get turned around a bit especially in stressful and exhausting situations.  Reasonable people also recognize that certain people exhibit certain behavioral characteristics that have nothing to do with intellect.  The only question is whether or not the political analysts choose to make it the/a topic du jour.  

 

As it relates to Biden v Trump, I trust Biden less on just about every issue other than the often chaotic nature of the Trump presidency.  Trump is, and was, a force of nature and most certainly directed by emotion and gut instinct.  His rise to the Presidency is among the truly remarkable stories in American history whether one likes or despises him.  Biden is a force of establishment politics, a guy good and compliant enough to be in club as a member, doing dirty work and heavy lifting, and until the twilight of his 7th decade not remotely electable as The big guy.  

 

As I said in another thread, the world knew who he was when he was elected.  He was the guy that would go on to botch the draw-down in Afghanistan, and read "My Dead Son, Chapter 17" to grieving parents, spouses and children.  He was the guy who would speak of Killing COVID©️, only to reveal, again, an innate ability to lead quite badly.  He was the guy on who's watch the  incineration of a family of 10 in a drone strike would take place.  He was the guy to push an aggressive climate agenda along to the detriment of most working Americans, and to create and perpetuate an increasingly hostile environment against any and all people and companies that work in/around the fossil fuel business.  He was the guy who would speak bravely about metaphorically Killing Putin©️ , only to find out that Putin recognized him for what he is--an old and increasingly feeble politician who's best days weren't all the great but they certainly were better than they are today. 

 

What was also completely predictable was the treatment he would receive from some of the largest media establishments (and the entrenched political class) in the country.  

 

The old expression "If you always do what you always did, you'll always get what you've always got" describes Biden Inc to a T. 

 

 

 

 

[Bob in Mich]

44 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

We're all good here, Bob, thank you. Hope the same applies to you and that you're feeling well these days.

 

I agree with your thoughts on verbal skill v intellect, and recall the essay question days quite well.  I preferred that format over the multiple choice standard, and I think you are on point with essay v flash cards.  The challenge is that most of that which passes for political analysis is based on the flash card methodology, and folks extrapolate from there.   The "52 states" comment is a prime example---reasonable people recognize that people can get turned around a bit especially in stressful and exhausting situations.  Reasonable people also recognize that certain people exhibit certain behavioral characteristics that have nothing to do with intellect.  The only question is whether or not the political analysts choose to make it the/a topic du jour.  

 

As it relates to Biden v Trump, I trust Biden less on just about every issue other than the often chaotic nature of the Trump presidency.  Trump is, and was, a force of nature and most certainly directed by emotion and gut instinct.  His rise to the Presidency is among the truly remarkable stories in American history whether one likes or despises him.  Biden is a force of establishment politics, a guy good and compliant enough to be in club as a member, doing dirty work and heavy lifting, and until the twilight of his 7th decade not remotely electable as The big guy.  

 

As I said in another thread, the world knew who he was when he was elected.  He was the guy that would go on to botch the draw-down in Afghanistan, and read "My Dead Son, Chapter 17" to grieving parents, spouses and children.  He was the guy who would speak of Killing COVID©️, only to reveal, again, an innate ability to lead quite badly.  He was the guy on who's watch the  incineration of a family of 10 in a drone strike would take place.  He was the guy to push an aggressive climate agenda along to the detriment of most working Americans, and to create and perpetuate an increasingly hostile environment against any and all people and companies that work in/around the fossil fuel business.  He was the guy who would speak bravely about metaphorically Killing Putin©️ , only to find out that Putin recognized him for what he is--an old and increasingly feeble politician who's best days weren't all the great but they certainly were better than they are today. 

 

What was also completely predictable was the treatment he would receive from some of the largest media establishments (and the entrenched political class) in the country.  

 

The old expression "If you always do what you always did, you'll always get what you've always got" describes Biden Inc to a T. 

 

 

 

 

Ah, Lars, there you go with the gish gallop again. I gotta credit you for teaching me that tactic.  So many points with which I disagree and way too many to counter without spending the afternoon.

 

Your take on both Trump and Biden seeming unelectable until they were, is spot on.  I recall hearing the following when Hillary lost to Trump and I think it applies to Biden’s win as well.

 

The President has many faults but how bad was your candidate to have lost to this current president?  Why Republicans think Dems love Biden, I have no idea.  The guy has a number of shortcomings and Dems are well aware of most all of them.  Point is he was a compromise candidate put up to defeat Trump.  The guy isn’t the Dem ideal but he is not the other candidate, as in Trumps win over Hillary

 

Btw, I see too that you want to criticize the administration for issues I think you are smart enough to know are not under presidential control.  How would you have prevented Putin from his current military adventure?  I know as a political animal you are going to criticize the current admin regardless of course.  So, I gather you favor direct war with Russia over a non-NATO country?  While I am asking, what solution you got to gas prices?  Thanks in advance

Edited March 12, 2022 by Bob in Mich

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

8 minutes ago, Bob in Mich said:

Ah, Lars, there you go with the gish gallop again. I gotta credit you for teaching me that tactic.  So many points with which I disagree and way too many to counter without spending the afternoon.

 

Your take on both Trump and Biden seeming unelectable until they were, is spot on.  I recall hearing the following when Hillary lost to Trump and I think it applies to Biden’s win as well.

 

The President has many faults but how bad was your candidate to have lost to this current president?  Why Republicans think Dems love Biden, I have no idea.  The guy has a number of shortcomings and Dems are well aware of most all of them.  Point is he was a compromise candidate put up to defeat Trump.  The guy isn’t the Dem ideal but he is not the other candidate, as in Trumps win over Hillary

You're misremembering recent history, Bob.  I was responding to the Kempster, you jumped in and shared why you supported Biden.  I simply replied to your post.  As for loving the guy, I'm not sure why it matters?

 

8 minutes ago, Bob in Mich said:

 

Btw, I see too that you want to criticize the administration for issues I think you are smart enough to know are not under presidential control.  How would you have prevented Putin from his current military adventure?  I know as a political animal you are going to criticize the current admin regardless of course.  So, I gather you favor direct war with Russia over a non-NATO country?  While I am asking, what solution you got to gas prices?  Thanks in advance

Interesting.  I've been seeing this sentiment offered of late...that the challenges we face as a country have nothing to do with the occupant of the White House.  It's interesting because during the prior administration, it seemed just about every challenge--real, imagined or fabricated--was tied directly back to the occupant in the White House.   Of course, that was my part of my point in my last post, but maybe I just wasn't clear. 

 

I recognize that the current price of gas is directly related to demand for the product.  Biden's short term options are limited in that respect.  He could support and lobby for a suspension of the federal gas tax, he could lean on the states to do the same to help working folks.  He could ratchet up pressure on foreign nations to increase production, and squeeze domestic producers to lower prices.   He could appeal directly to the American people to stay at home, drive less, consume less and make sure their tires were properly inflated.  The reality is, Bob, that all he's going to do is push his green agenda, and continue to demonize industry leaders with rhetoric about "insane profits" and "greedy conglomerates" because that's what he's done for his entire career.  In fairness to him, it's worked.  

 

What I would like to see him do is...nothing.   Decades of hostility toward those in the petroleum industry cannot be undone in a few short months, and I'd just as soon he not try and put lipstick on this particular pig.  

 

As for Putin and his 2022 invasion, well, that just is what it is.  I'm not privy to the intelligence gathered, the recommendations of those crackerjack advisers you speak of, and the choices at his disposal.  I have no diplomatic or military experience.  I am not so arrogant as to believe the invasion could not have happened on Trump's watch, nor so naive as to think it was going to happen regardless of who carried the White House in the last election.   Speculation beyond that seems silly, doesn't it? 

 

What I do know is that I voted for the candidate who spoke about keeping Americans out of harms way in foreign lands, of the international community stepping up to relieve the inordinate burden on the shoulders of the American taxpayer, and on whose watch Putin did not invade Ukraine.  Then again, it's like you said earlier--for those of you that chose Biden, he wasn't the other guy at all, I wonder though if the citizens of the Ukraine wish he was? 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Bob in Mich]

1 hour ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

You're misremembering recent history, Bob.  I was responding to the Kempster, you jumped in and shared why you supported Biden.  I simply replied to your post.  As for loving the guy, I'm not sure why it matters?

 

Interesting.  I've been seeing this sentiment offered of late...that the challenges we face as a country have nothing to do with the occupant of the White House.  It's interesting because during the prior administration, it seemed just about every challenge--real, imagined or fabricated--was tied directly back to the occupant in the White House.   Of course, that was my part of my point in my last post, but maybe I just wasn't clear. 

 

I recognize that the current price of gas is directly related to demand for the product.  Biden's short term options are limited in that respect.  He could support and lobby for a suspension of the federal gas tax, he could lean on the states to do the same to help working folks.  He could ratchet up pressure on foreign nations to increase production, and squeeze domestic producers to lower prices.   He could appeal directly to the American people to stay at home, drive less, consume less and make sure their tires were properly inflated.  The reality is, Bob, that all he's going to do is push his green agenda, and continue to demonize industry leaders with rhetoric about "insane profits" and "greedy conglomerates" because that's what he's done for his entire career.  In fairness to him, it's worked.  

 

What I would like to see him do is...nothing.   Decades of hostility toward those in the petroleum industry cannot be undone in a few short months, and I'd just as soon he not try and put lipstick on this particular pig.  

 

As for Putin and his 2022 invasion, well, that just is what it is.  I'm not privy to the intelligence gathered, the recommendations of those crackerjack advisers you speak of, and the choices at his disposal.  I have no diplomatic or military experience.  I am not so arrogant as to believe the invasion could not have happened on Trump's watch, nor so naive as to think it was going to happen regardless of who carried the White House in the last election.   Speculation beyond that seems silly, doesn't it? 

 

What I do know is that I voted for the candidate who spoke about keeping Americans out of harms way in foreign lands, of the international community stepping up to relieve the inordinate burden on the shoulders of the American taxpayer, and on whose watch Putin did not invade Ukraine.  Then again, it's like you said earlier--for those of you that chose Biden, he wasn't the other guy at all, I wonder though if the citizens of the Ukraine wish he was? 

 

 

Hey, Larry, thanks for the thoughts.  Have a good evening!

 

[BillStime]

Maria Bartiromo is a joke

 

 

[BillStime]

 

 

[Tiberius]

7 hours ago, BillStime said:

 

 

Hmmm...finally getting through to this f’n idiot that a genocidal war criminal is not a great friend? 

 

Trumps done 

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

4 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

Hmmm...finally getting through to this f’n idiot that a genocidal war criminal is not a great friend? 

 

Trumps done 

He’s not even close to being done, Tibs.
 

Let’s not rewrite history, either.  The intersection of “Putin is horrible!” and the modern American liberal can be traced back to the end of the Obama era when the heir apparent lost the election. 
 

Obviously, the actions of the Russians in Ukraine are brutal, horrible and are rightly condemned worldwide.  

 

[Doc]

37 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

Hmmm...finally getting through to this f’n idiot that a genocidal war criminal is not a great friend? 

 

Trumps done 

 

He said weeks ago that what is happening is an atrocity.  Dems just need to hear Repubs denounce something every second of the day, and they still don't believe it.

[SoCal Deek]

Still reminds me of the classic scene from My Cousin Vinny…something to the effect of: “Do you think the little deer is going to give a crap what color pants you’re wearing when his little deer brains are splattered all over the forest?”

[Tiberius]

38 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

He’s not even close to being done, Tibs.
 

Let’s not rewrite history, either.  The intersection of “Putin is horrible!” and the modern American liberal can be traced back to the end of the Obama era when the heir apparent lost the election. 
 

Obviously, the actions of the Russians in Ukraine are brutal, horrible and are rightly condemned worldwide.  

 

I just hope he still has enough left in the tank to win the GOP nomination 👍 

[All_Pro_Bills]

24 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

I just hope he still has enough left in the tank to win the GOP nomination 👍 

I'm expecting by 2024 what Trump does or says or doesn't do or say is going to be pretty far down on the list of things to worry about.   

[Doc]

25 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

I just hope he still has enough left in the tank to win the GOP nomination 👍 

 

We hope the same for Joey.  Or Kammy.

[Tiberius]

19 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

We hope the same for Joey.  Or Kammy.

Yup, Joe will smoke that traitor again! 

21 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

I'm expecting by 2024 what Trump does or says or doesn't do or say is going to be pretty far down on the list of things to worry about.   

🤣

[Doc]

40 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

Yup, Joe will smoke that traitor again! 

 

[Chef Jim]

58 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

I think somebody’s smokin’ something. 

[Tiberius]

Putin has changed? How do? The guy who mirrored half a million in Syria and created a massive refugee crisis there is now different? 
 

Trump is mentally diseased 

[BillsFanNC]

This guy is going to be stellar by 2024. Uh huh. Insane ramblings of a addled brain.

 

 

[BillStime]

[Tiberius]

President Trump may have been involved with a change to the Republican Party campaign platform last year that watered down support for U.S. assistance to Ukraine, according to new information from someone who was involved.

Diana Denman, a Republican delegate who supported arming U.S. allies in Ukraine, has told people that Trump aide J.D. Gordon said at the Republican Convention in 2016 that Trump directed him to support weakening that position in the official platform.

POLITICS 

Week Ahead: Trump Aims To Dismiss Russia Probe As Partisan; Can He Get His Taxes Win?

Ultimately, the softer position was adopted

https://www.npr.org/2017/12/04/568310790/2016-rnc-delegate-trump-directed-change-to-party-platform-on-ukraine-support

[JaCrispy]

On 3/16/2022 at 7:08 PM, BillStime said:

I don’t stand with Putin...But I also don’t stand with the Ukrainian Nazis who overthrew a democratically elected government in 2014...👍

[Tiberius]

1 hour ago, JaCrispy said:

I don’t stand with Putin...But I also don’t stand with the Ukrainian Nazis who overthrew a democratically elected government in 2014...👍

So you agree with Putin that Nazis run Ukraine. Wow 

[Big Blitz]

2 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

So you agree with Putin that Nazis run Ukraine. Wow 

 

 

Fascists run America and all its mass media.  This is fact.

 

What?  You have to kill people to be a fascist?  You have to have 1 person with total power? 

 

Lolololol

 

 

[Tiberius]

15 minutes ago, Big Blitz said:

 

 

Fascists run America and all its mass media.  This is fact.

 

What?  You have to kill people to be a fascist?  You have to have 1 person with total power? 

 

Lolololol

 

 

The free press is Fascist? You people are just vermin 

[Big Blitz]

Just now, Tiberius said:

The free press is Fascist?

 

Yes.  They do the bidding for one party.

 

They deliberately lie to hold the party line.

 

They deliberately bury or ignore stories that matter.

 

They won't hire you if you're conservative.  

 

 

Facts.  

 

 

[BillsFanNC]

 

[JaCrispy]

9 hours ago, Tiberius said:

So you agree with Putin that Nazis run Ukraine. Wow 

Read my post again...😉

[Tiberius]

9 hours ago, Big Blitz said:

 

Yes.  They do the bidding for one party.

 

They deliberately lie to hold the party line.

 

They deliberately bury or ignore stories that matter.

 

They won't hire you if you're conservative.  

 

 

Facts.  

 

 

 

9 hours ago, Big Blitz said:

 

Yes.  They do the bidding for one party.

 

They deliberately lie to hold the party line.

 

They deliberately bury or ignore stories that matter.

 

They won't hire you if you're conservative.  

 

 

Facts.  

 

 

Lots of conservatives are in the media. 

 

Fact 

11 minutes ago, JaCrispy said:

Read my post again...😉

So the revolution that overthrew the corrupt Putin puppet was Nazi? 

 

Would you vote for Putin? 

[JaCrispy]

1 hour ago, Tiberius said:

 

Lots of conservatives are in the media. 

 

Fact 

So the revolution that overthrew the corrupt Putin puppet was Nazi? 

 

Would you vote for Putin? 

No, but I would certainly stay neutral in this conflict...I don’t believe this is our battle to be involved in...

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

14 hours ago, Tiberius said:

The free press is Fascist? You people are just vermin 

Free press you say?? Who might that be?