Trump foreign policy

[keepthefaith]

1 hour ago, Buffalo_Gal said:

Why? They come and go all the time. For a little comparison, he's been on the job for 700 days and leaves in a bunch more days - under Obama, Panetta served 606 days, Hagel 720 and Ashe Carter 702 (he left when Trump came on) and no one wet their pants over their leaving. 

Secretaries of Defense. Click on the bio to see how long in office (if you care about that sort of thing).

 

All true and relevant but I really like Mattis's no nonsense approach.  Cabinet turnover is common but Trump is having more than his fair share and we're losing a good one here.  Prefer that Mattis would stay.

[B-Man]

TRUMP’S GREAT TALENT IS HIS ABILITY TO DRIVE PEOPLE CRAZY:

 

 

 

 

 

For example:

 

 

 

 

He’s even got Hillary Clinton, of all people, telling us that actions have consequences.

 

 

A consequence of Hillary’s actions in Libya — “we came, we saw, he died — was black people being sold as slaves in open-air slave markets. So maybe she should sit this one out.

 

But note how despite her dreadful track record, she’s still treated as part of the competent establishment. Because, in fact, competence is not required for membership in the establishment, as the least decade or two demonstrate.

 

 

UPDATE: Is Trump speaking for the “forgotten part of America” that actually fights its wars? “And in the post-election analysis of the 2016 cycle, discussion of war fatigue has been all but absent. This oversight may plausibly be due to the fact that most American elites in the chattering class have not, at least in recent years, been directly affected by on-going conflicts. Children of elites are not as likely to serve and die in the Middle East, and elite communities are thus less likely to make this a point of conversation. The costs of war remain largely hidden, and an invisible inequality of military sacrifice has taken hold.”

by Glenn Reynolds

 

 

https://pjmedia.com/instapundit/316476/

[yall]

This time they are right though. He's a ***** ***** for pulling out of Syria. He ***** over the Kurds and is basically letting that ***** Erdogan run the show.

 

To call Trump a half-wit is an insult to the mentally challenged.

Edited December 22, 2018 by yall

[DC Tom]

1 hour ago, yall said:

This time they are right though. He's a ***** ***** for pulling out of Syria. He ***** over the Kurds and is basically letting that ***** Erdogan run the show.

 

To call Trump a half-wit is an insult to the mentally challenged.

 

2012 called, they want their foreign policy back.

[Deranged Rhino]

3 hours ago, yall said:

This time they are right though. He's a ***** ***** for pulling out of Syria. He ***** over the Kurds and is basically letting that ***** Erdogan run the show.

 

To call Trump a half-wit is an insult to the mentally challenged.

 

The french are taking the place of the American forces in theater. No one is abandoning the Kurds. It's just the neocon and neoliberals trying to convince you it's a disaster to pull out of a war that's never been formally declared or authorized by congress. 

[B-Man]

 

 

.

[Buffalo_Gal]

Yellow vest protests are light today. Heck, it is the holiday season. 

[plenzmd1]

10 hours ago, Deranged Rhino said:

 

The french are taking the place of the American forces in theater. No one is abandoning the Kurds. It's just the neocon and neoliberals trying to convince you it's a disaster to pull out of a war that's never been formally declared or authorized by congress. 

2

so..we gunna hold Trump to that standard moving forward?

[GG]

11 hours ago, Deranged Rhino said:

 

The french are taking the place of the American forces in theater. No one is abandoning the Kurds. It's just the neocon and neoliberals trying to convince you it's a disaster to pull out of a war that's never been formally declared or authorized by congress. 

 

There's still zero evidence that Trump acts based on a carefully thought out plans rather than the color of his cereal in the morning.

[The_Dude]

Trump’s domestic policy is GREAT! His foreign policy is niave and pretty much wrong. 

 

Im hoping for a 2020 ticket with Mad Dog!

[B-Man]

Here’s Why Trump Made The Right Decision On Troops In Syria

An in-depth look, as someone who has spent time on the ground in Iraq and Syria with U.S. troops, local tribal militias, and rebel forces since 2005.

By Oubai Shahbandar

 

 

 

.

[B-Man]

RICHARD FERNANDEZ: Ours To Reason Why.

If there’s one good thing about the political crisis triggered Trump’s decision to withdraw from Syria it’s been to make people realize the US is there. As Seth Harp in the New Yorker noted, it has done everything possible to conceal that fact. . . .

 

Perhaps more people than were ever aware of the combat presence in Syria are outraged the US is leaving it and that is a good thing. The lack of awareness was the result of the breakdown of the national security debate and the abdication by Congress of its role in war making. The public is now like a man waking up in a strange city with a 3 week growth of beard with no memory of how he got there.

 

As the Los Angeles Times noted the US inherited a whole bunch of shadow wars from the past administrations. “Before he took office in 2008, Barack Obama vowed to end America’s grueling conflicts in Iraq and Afghanistan. During his second term, he pledged to take the country off what he called a permanent war footing. … U.S. military forces have been at war for all eight years of Obama’s tenure, the first two-term president with that distinction. He launched airstrikes or military raids in at least seven countries: Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, Libya, Yemen, Somalia and Pakistan.”

 

But they all went into the back pages.

 

 

.

 

[Tiberius]

Losing the Cold War we thought we won 

 

 

Quote

 

Indeed, a Soviet leader hardly could have outlined a better scenario than Trump has created for Putin:

A rift between the United States and NATO allies over the future of the alliance.

A U.S. demand that Russia be returned to the Group of Seven , as Russia continues provocations in Ukraine.

A U.S. threat to pull out of the World Trade Organization,and a round of U.S.-imposed tariffs that severely weakened it.

A U.S. president abandoning human rights, accepting Saudi Arabia’s murder of a U.S.-based journalist and embracing repressive leaders around the globe.

A U.S. president creating a rift with Europe over Iran (the nuclear agreement) and climate change (the Paris accord).

A U.S. president embracing as “very honorable” North Korea’s brutal dictator without any tangible concessions on nuclear weapons.

 

A U.S.-launched trade war that, the Federal Reserve saidthis week, is partially responsible for cooling worldwide growth.

Lost confidence among Americans in elections, the Justice Department, the FBI, the courts and the free press.

And the loss of a bipartisan consensus against the Russian threat. Forty percent of Republicans called Russia an ally or friend in a Gallup poll, up from 22 percent in 2014.

 

 

Why has Trump squandered so much for so little? Maybe it’s because, during the 2016 campaign, Russia was privately negotiating a business deal in Moscow with him and releasing stolen documents that hurt his Democratic opponent. (Meanwhile, Trump was praising Putin and his campaign was softening the GOP platform on Russia.)

Whether special counsel Robert S. Mueller III concludes there was a quid pro quo, Putin clearly has benefited from Trump’s presidency.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/its-official-we-lost-the-cold-war/2018/12/21/1c3b52b0-0565-11e9-b5df-5d3874f1ac36_story.html?utm_term=.b9af323bb3d2

[Deranged Rhino]

2 hours ago, plenzmd1 said:

so..we gunna hold Trump to that standard moving forward?

 

When it comes to starting wars? Yes. 

[GG]

It's as if Trump's inner circle is full of neocons who are upset over last week's announcements.  First Mattis, now Brett McGurk.

[The_Dude]

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/brett-mcgurk-us-envoy-to-anti-isis-coalition-resigns-in-wake-of-trump-decision-to-withdraw-from-syria

 

Trump has gone full retard and is losing all his competent horses. 

2 hours ago, B-Man said:

Here’s Why Trump Made The Right Decision On Troops In Syria

An in-depth look, as someone who has spent time on the ground in Iraq and Syria with U.S. troops, local tribal militias, and rebel forces since 2005.

By Oubai Shahbandar

 

 

 

.

 

Would it be wrong of me to just discard this without reading it because I’m Team Mattis? Cause that’s what I’m doing. 

[Deranged Rhino]

50 minutes ago, GG said:

It's as if Trump's inner circle is full of neocons who are upset over last week's announcements.  First Mattis, now Brett McGurk.

 

There was a deal made with the establishment when Trump won. That deal

included him adding certain people to his staff - including Preibus, Mattis, and a few others. 

 

That deal has concluded. 

[Magox]

I'm not going to debate whether it was the right policy move or not. This whole mid east strategy has conflicted me for some time now.

 

But it's hilarious how all of a sudden the mainstream media and leftists have now become military hawks who want the US to continue on with the war.

 

TDS is a real thing folks. 

[B-Man]

20 minutes ago, The_Dude said:

 

 

Would it be wrong of me to just discard this without reading it because I’m Team Mattis? Cause that’s what I’m doing. 

 

 

It would certainly match your standard of making up your mind without hearing all viewpoints..................so go ahead.

 

 

.

[Deranged Rhino]

2 minutes ago, Magox said:

I'm not going to debate whether it was the right policy move or not. This whole mid east strategy has conflicted me for some time now.

 

But it's hilarious how all of a sudden the mainstream media and leftists have now become military hawks who want the US to continue on with the war.

 

TDS is a real thing folks. 

 

This is the most interesting thing to track for me personally. People who are TDS addled will be exposing themselves more than usual with their coverage of this news. 

 

The fighting has never been accurately covered in 17 years. It's not going to start now. 

[Tiberius]

23 hours ago, B-Man said:

TRUMP’S GREAT TALENT IS HIS ABILITY TO DRIVE PEOPLE CRAZY:

 

 

 

 

 

For example:

 

 

 

 

He’s even got Hillary Clinton, of all people, telling us that actions have consequences.

 

 

A consequence of Hillary’s actions in Libya — “we came, we saw, he died — was black people being sold as slaves in open-air slave markets. So maybe she should sit this one out.

 

But note how despite her dreadful track record, she’s still treated as part of the competent establishment. Because, in fact, competence is not required for membership in the establishment, as the least decade or two demonstrate.

 

 

UPDATE: Is Trump speaking for the “forgotten part of America” that actually fights its wars? “And in the post-election analysis of the 2016 cycle, discussion of war fatigue has been all but absent. This oversight may plausibly be due to the fact that most American elites in the chattering class have not, at least in recent years, been directly affected by on-going conflicts. Children of elites are not as likely to serve and die in the Middle East, and elite communities are thus less likely to make this a point of conversation. The costs of war remain largely hidden, and an invisible inequality of military sacrifice has taken hold.”

by Glenn Reynolds

 

 

https://pjmedia.com/instapundit/316476/

You mean people like Jim Mattis? Or were you referring to all the other competent people that have left this administration. 

 

People like you are enabling this clownish, incompetent boob. You are what's bad about America. 

[GG]

19 minutes ago, Deranged Rhino said:

 

There was a deal made with the establishment when Trump won. That deal

included him adding certain people to his staff - including Preibus, Mattis, and a few others. 

 

That deal has concluded. 

 

You're almost framing it as good news.  But I can't help but draw a parallel between the good things that have happened during the Trump era and Kelly closing ranks and taking control of the inner workings of the White House.   

 

With the notable senior level officials departing amid increasing noise that Trump wants to be Trump and stopped talking to his advisors, amplified by threats to fire Powell because he's raising rates should scare the daylights out of adults. 

[The_Dude]

15 minutes ago, B-Man said:

 

 

It would certainly match your standard of making up your mind without hearing all viewpoints..................so go ahead.

 

 

.

 

Ha! When it comes to vaccinations causing autism I have not read a word because I default to doctors who’ve told me “yeah that’s not true.” 

 

When it comes to the content of character clearly Mattis is superior to Trump. When it comes to education, clearly Mattis is superior to Trump. 

 

When it comes to defense, clearly Mattis is the authority over the author of your post. 

 

Mattis is a man whom I believe is above being second guessed. I think most familiar with him and his career would concur. 

 

 

[Deranged Rhino]

8 minutes ago, GG said:

 

You're almost framing it as good news.  But I can't help but draw a parallel between the good things that have happened during the Trump era and Kelly closing ranks and taking control of the inner workings of the White House.   

 

With the notable senior level officials departing amid increasing noise that Trump wants to be Trump and stopped talking to his advisors, amplified by threats to fire Powell because he's raising rates should scare the daylights out of adults. 

 

I don't know if it's good or bad yet.

 

But I do know there was a deal made, it's never been reported on but it happened. And now that deal is up and the establishment neocons and neoliberals are being shown the door. 

 

Considering the neocon and neoliberal establishment has been the bane of this country's foreign policy blunders for decades, I'm not crying over it. 

 

(Addendum, typing on the run: the Powell noise is likely kabuki. The fed is going to be painted as a target for the next few weeks/months going forward)

[GG]

And you're feeling comfortable because Trump has a life long history of properly managing complex organizations?

[Deranged Rhino]

4 minutes ago, GG said:

And you're feeling comfortable because Trump has a life long history of properly managing complex organizations?

 

I'm feeling comfortable because Trump isn't running this op alone.  I'm feeling comfortable because all the right people are mad about the latest moves - and the hysteria is telling. 

 

When Obama fired Mattis, no one cared. Now they do. Twelve months ago the same people that are crying over Mattis were warning Trump surrounding himself with generals was anti American. It's all nonsense driven by either ignorance, TDS, or partisanship. Mattis leaving now is MILDEC to the max. 

 

Results are what matter. And in the fight against ISIS and AQ and Hezbollah, we have been doing more good in the past 2 year span than in the last 15. It's not reported, because orange man bad - but it's real and ongoing. 

 

 

[TPS]

1 hour ago, Deranged Rhino said:

 

I don't know if it's good or bad yet.

 

But I do know there was a deal made, it's never been reported on but it happened. And now that deal is up and the establishment neocons and neoliberals are being shown the door. 

 

Considering the neocon and neoliberal establishment has been the bane of this country's foreign policy blunders for decades, I'm not crying over it. 

 

Trump bringing on Bolton doesn't fit the story. 

[Deranged Rhino]

1 minute ago, TPS said:

Trump bringing on Bolton doesn't fit the story. 

 

He won't be there much longer imo. He's there to scare the hell out of the mullahs. 

[B-Man]

THIS IS PERCEPTIVE, AND GOES TO A LARGER POINT ABOUT TRUMP:

 

 

The political class has managed to set things up so that it’s impossible to both play by the rules and make fundamental changes to the post-WWII institutional setup.

 

For a while, that protected the whole feedlot. But eventually, all that means is that the changes will be made by people who don’t play by the rules.

 

 

 

As said before, that's why Trump was elected..............NOT to be a moral example, NOT to try and pacify all sides, but to start and whittle down our out of touch, out of control federal government.

 

[Deranged Rhino]

36 minutes ago, B-Man said:

THIS IS PERCEPTIVE, AND GOES TO A LARGER POINT ABOUT TRUMP:

 

 

The political class has managed to set things up so that it’s impossible to both play by the rules and make fundamental changes to the post-WWII institutional setup.

 

For a while, that protected the whole feedlot. But eventually, all that means is that the changes will be made by people who don’t play by the rules.

 

 

 

As said before, that's why Trump was elected..............NOT to be a moral example, NOT to try and pacify all sides, but to start and whittle down our out of touch, out of control federal government.

 

 

People forget what happened last time Trump tried to pull out of Syria. He announced his intentions then, completely randomly of course, there was a "gas" attack which resulted in international outcry - and a tomahawk response. 

 

 

[meazza]

7 hours ago, Deranged Rhino said:

 

He won't be there much longer imo. He's there to scare the hell out of the mullahs. 

 

You’re painting a picture of someone who actually has a strategy and I wonder when you’ll snap out it. 

 

Only a blithering idiot could go bust running a casino.

 

And I don’t have TDS. Looking at his career trajectory, he has messed up big when it mattered the most.

 

Edited December 23, 2018 by meazza
To add context

[Koko78]

10 hours ago, Tiberius said:

Losing the Cold War we thought we won 

 

 

 

Why has Trump squandered so much for so little? Maybe it’s because, during the 2016 campaign, Russia was privately negotiating a business deal in Moscow with him and releasing stolen documents that hurt his Democratic opponent. (Meanwhile, Trump was praising Putin and his campaign was softening the GOP platform on Russia.)

Whether special counsel Robert S. Mueller III concludes there was a quid pro quo, Putin clearly has benefited from Trump’s presidency.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/its-official-we-lost-the-cold-war/2018/12/21/1c3b52b0-0565-11e9-b5df-5d3874f1ac36_story.html?utm_term=.b9af323bb3d2

 

A list made for myopic dipschiffs. Seems right that you posted it.

 

10 hours ago, GG said:

It's as if Trump's inner circle is full of neocons who are upset over last week's announcements.  First Mattis, now Brett McGurk.

 

Damn, I know Trump is the first president ever to have turnover in his cabinet and all, but let's just take a step back from the ledge.

[Deranged Rhino]

38 minutes ago, meazza said:

 

You’re painting a picture of someone who actually has a strategy and I wonder when you’ll snap out it. 

 

Only a blithering idiot could go bust running a casino.

 

And I don’t have TDS. Looking at his career trajectory, he has messed up big when it mattered the most.

 

 

It's not Trump who has the strategy. It's the people around him. 

[Q-baby!]

9 hours ago, Deranged Rhino said:

 

I don't know if it's good or bad yet.

 

But I do know there was a deal made, it's never been reported on but it happened. And now that deal is up and the establishment neocons and neoliberals are being shown the door. 

 

Considering the neocon and neoliberal establishment has been the bane of this country's foreign policy blunders for decades, I'm not crying over it. 

 

(Addendum, typing on the run: the Powell noise is likely kabuki. The fed is going to be painted as a target for the next few weeks/months going forward)

Lol so typical. Everything good was part of the plan. Everything bad was also part of the plan. Not Trumps plan, but the plan of the people he surrounds himself with. Lol they keep disappearing you moron! Spin, spin, spin! 

 

I’m sure you will have another brilliant spin for every time he ***** up I the future. 

[Deranged Rhino]

4 minutes ago, BigMcD said:

Lol so typical. Everything good was part of the plan. Everything bad was also part of the plan. Not Trumps plan, but the plan of the people he surrounds himself with. Lol they keep disappearing you moron! Spin, spin, spin! 

 

I’m sure you will have another brilliant spin for every time he ***** up I the future. 

 

None of this is about Trump for me. Never has been.  

[Q-baby!]

Just now, Deranged Rhino said:

 

None of this is about Trump for me. Never has been.  

Of coarse.

[Deranged Rhino]

2 minutes ago, BigMcD said:

Of coarse.

 

If you read my stuff, you'd see. Didn't vote for him (wrote in a vote for Tulsi Gabbard ? ), never thought he'd win. 

[ALF]

On 12/21/2018 at 10:34 PM, Deranged Rhino said:

 

The french are taking the place of the American forces in theater. No one is abandoning the Kurds. It's just the neocon and neoliberals trying to convince you it's a disaster to pull out of a war that's never been formally declared or authorized by congress. 

 

I hope so.  Trump should have made a deal with Erdogan to leave Syria if Turkey will not slaughter the Kurds,  same deal for Assad , Russia and Iran .  jmo  

 

https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2018/12/chaos-washington-kurds-stranded/578941/

 

 

 

Edited December 23, 2018 by ALF

[Doc Brown]

16 hours ago, GG said:

 

You're almost framing it as good news.  But I can't help but draw a parallel between the good things that have happened during the Trump era and Kelly closing ranks and taking control of the inner workings of the White House.   

 

With the notable senior level officials departing amid increasing noise that Trump wants to be Trump and stopped talking to his advisors, amplified by threats to fire Powell because he's raising rates should scare the daylights out of adults. 

I think back to the campaign where during one of the debates Trump committed Republican heresy for railing against the Iraq War and saying 9/11 happened under GW's watch after Jeb says his brother's policies made this country safe.  The audience booed and Trump's poll numbers and primary victories increased.  With the midterms over and Republicans getting crushed in the House, I think Trump's instinct is to go back to the policies that won him the nomination in order to win reelection which is an isolationist foreign policy position.  To hell with the consequences as it's not our problem as long as we increase border security. 

 

The various comments about how the decision to withdraw troops from Syria and Afghanistan makes our country less safe and another 9/11 is coming by Graham (takes donations from defense contractors), Rubio, etc. was the same line of thinking that got us into Iraq in the first place.  Not to mention the Patriot Act.  Maybe I'm giving Trump too much credit, but I think he realizes his reelection chances hinge on him still being considered a pragmatic outsider who wants to dispel the idea the notion that he's part of the Republican establishment.

[3rdnlng]

10 hours ago, BigMcD said:

Of coarse.

Fine.