EJ versus Tyrod

[TheFunPolice]

Tyrod's bacup did OK for a backup.

[fridge]

"knows for sure." "safe to assume." Same thing.

 

Have fun trolling.

 

Ok, see ya.

[mattsox]

EJ is a nice guy but a terrible QB, I'd be supposed if he was still in the league in 3 years.

Agreed. I doubt he will be unless he somehow learns how to the an NFL caliber QB overnight...

[mabden]

It's the accuracy that does EJ in. He will never be a starter in the NFL (or even a quality back-up) if he can't be more accurate. Just about every crossing throw was like 2 yards behind the receiver.

 

From what I observed with Ej, most of his inaccuracies can be attributed to not setting his feet and stepping into his throws.

[sjjr]

I would love to say EJ should be the starter but its clear that this is Tyrod's job. There are three main things that separate him from EJ in this offense...accuracy, running ability and poise in the pocket. EJ had a decent completion percentage and yards yesterday but many of his completions forced receivers to stop and limited run after the catch. He also missed some completions he should have had. He was decisive, made some good calls at the line preplay and his arm looked live but what was most disappointing was his pocket movement. Maybe I am just used to looking at Tyrod, but EJ looked clumsy moving and was clearly easier to bring down for sacks.

 

The Bills don't need Tyrod to throw for 300 yards and really he shouldn't most games. They need him to convert third downs, take care of the ball and make plays late in games that contribute to a win. The defense should be the unit that wins games for this team though.

[hondo in seattle]

I don't think there was a huge drop off from Taylor's performance in most games. EJ leaves more plays out there by not throwing to open guys if there is a shorter route open. He also can't make the ridiculous plays with his legs that can make a difference if other things aren't working. I'd still start Taylor if he's healthy, but I still don't know if he's franchise quality. I'm pretty sure EJM isn't , but he's a decent backup.

 

Before the Cincy game, both Woods and Watkins said they've been getting open but not getting targeted.

 

I'm not convinced that EJ can develop into a good starting NFL QB. I'm not convinced EJ is better than TT or has more potential that TT.

 

But neither do I believe EJ leaves more plays out there by not finding open receivers. I actually think TT has the bigger problem finding open guys down field.

The OP forgot to mention that EJ actually caused Sammy Watkins to injure his ankle yesterday with that horrible, horrible TD throw. How convenient that he left that little morsel out. EJ injures his own teammates.

 

This is a specious argument.

 

EJ was on the run and threw the ball to a spot in the endzone between the Bengal defenders.

 

Sammy is a world class athlete. I think EJ had a reasonable expectation that Sammy could make the catch without getting hurt.

 

Every QB will ask his receivers to make catches like that sometimes. It's football. It's not a sport for ninnies.

[GoBills!]

Will Tyrod get a pass this week when we suck out against the Jags...? People will say he had no talent to work with....others will say bring back EJ....Bengals D is a top 5 this year...EJ played second half with woods, moore, hogan, clay and shady.... Tyrod will have the same group this week against a terrible defense...I think its scary for tyrod not to perform with that group on a higher level or its opens the questions to who is the starter especailly against a weak D like the Jags... EJ had 4 practices with the #1's I think he did what we was suppose to do...keep them close and have the D give him chances to win, unfortunately they didnt.

[fridge]

I would love to say EJ should be the starter but its clear that this is Tyrod's job. There are three main things that separate him from EJ in this offense...accuracy, running ability and poise in the pocket. EJ had a decent completion percentage and yards yesterday but many of his completions forced receivers to stop and limited run after the catch. He also missed some completions he should have had. He was decisive, made some good calls at the line preplay and his arm looked live but what was most disappointing was his pocket movement. Maybe I am just used to looking at Tyrod, but EJ looked clumsy moving and was clearly easier to bring down for sacks.

 

The Bills don't need Tyrod to throw for 300 yards and really he shouldn't most games. They need him to convert third downs, take care of the ball and make plays late in games that contribute to a win. The defense should be the unit that wins games for this team though.

 

EJ was sacked twice in 42 passing attempts...

 

Tyrod was sacked 4 times against the Titans.

 

EJ was 5/13 on 3rd downs, Tyrod was 4/12 against the Titans.

 

Maybe it is an offense thing.

[John from Riverside]

Will Tyrod get a pass this week when we suck out against the Jags...? People will say he had no talent to work with....others will say bring back EJ....Bengals D is a top 5 this year...EJ played second half with woods, moore, hogan, clay and shady.... Tyrod will have the same group this week against a terrible defense...I think its scary for tyrod not to perform with that group on a higher level or its opens the questions to who is the starter especailly against a weak D like the Jags... EJ had 4 practices with the #1's I think he did what we was suppose to do...keep them close and have the D give him chances to win, unfortunately they didnt.

Unless TT is 100 percent I vote to keep EJ in the lineup......

[sjjr]

 

EJ was sacked twice in 42 passing attempts...

 

Tyrod was sacked 4 times against the Titans.

 

EJ was 5/13 on 3rd downs, Tyrod was 4/12 against the Titans.

 

Maybe it is an offense thing.

Very different game with different style defenses. Also, it was a low scoring game with the Titans with a lot more conservative calls. EJ did have that bad grounding penalty that pushed the Bills back to punt inside their five too.

 

With that said, there is no doubt that Tyrod and the offense did not play well against Tennessee. If Tyrod were out there against Cincinnati, it would have been a similar result no doubt.

 

People don't want to recognize this, but the QB position is not the biggest problem on this team for once and it's not holding them back. The defense, special teams and coaching hasn't been good enough in the three losses and that's it.

[K-9]

EJ was sacked twice in 42 passing attempts...

 

Tyrod was sacked 4 times against the Titans.

 

EJ was 5/13 on 3rd downs, Tyrod was 4/12 against the Titans.

 

Maybe it is an offense thing.

Could very well be an offense thing. Aside from a glimpse here and there, like the play design on EJ's TD run yesterday, he hasn't been the offensive savant many of us were hoping to see.

 

That said, we have been bit by the injury bug something fierce, so I am more than willing cut him a little slack.

 

But only a little. Can't get the spector of that two minute offense vs the Giants out of my head.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[Captain_Quint]

Anyone with eyes can see Tyrod is a lot better than Manuel.

But are they 'slow eyes'?????

[GoBills!]

Unless TT is 100 percent I vote to keep EJ in the lineup......

 

 

I agree you keep this not being a controversy by allowing taylor 3 weeks off and pressure on EJ to perform against a bottom 10 D with a banged up lineup....If we lose they will say we need our starters healthy if we win they say we knew we could win this game with our guys we always had faith....you put Tyrod in and he blows it now people open the flood gates and the leash gets shorter....

Edited October 19, 2015 by GoBills!

[John from Riverside]

 

 

I agree you keep this not being a controversy by allowing taylor 3 weeks off and pressure on EJ to perform against a bottom 10 D with a banged up lineup....If we lose they will say we need our starters healthy if we win they say we knew we could win this game with our guys we always had faith....you put Tyrod in and he blows it now people open the flood gates and the leash gets shorter....

What makes Tyrod Taylor special is he has the ability to make a big play happen with his feet.......he has a lower leg injury

 

I want a 100 percent TT for the stretch run of the season.....play EJ Manuel against the jags

 

If our D cant slow down the jags....then all of this is a moot point anyway.

[stony]

What makes Tyrod Taylor special is he has the ability to make a big play happen with his feet.......he has a lower leg injury

 

I want a 100 percent TT for the stretch run of the season.....play EJ Manuel against the jags

 

If our D cant slow down the jags....then all of this is a moot point anyway.

Right on. I'll take a Tennessee performance against the Jags as long as we come out of Wembley with a W.

 

Rex has been blowing a bit of smoke lately, but he's damn right about being snake bit with the injuries.

 

Like the old cliche says, the bye couldn't come at a better time.

Edited October 19, 2015 by stony

[NOVABillsFan]

I see Tyrod's mom has chimed in.

or his wife.

[HuSeYiN_NYC]

So it seems like EJ didn't impress enough for anyone to talk about him being the starter when Taylor returns from injury.

 

I would argue that 1. there was zero drop off in overall production from the QB position with EJ in.

2. EJ actually had the best total passing yards in a Bills game this season.

3. EJ gets sacked once every 21 attempts and Tyrod has been sacked once per every 9.8 attempts

4. Tyrod loses on average 7.14 yards per sack and EJ has averaged 3.5 yards lost per sack

5. EJ had at least 6 completions to WRs in this game. Tyrod has struggled to hit WRs. Last game our top two wideo outs had 1 catch

6. EJ also made plays with his feet albeit less exciting ones but he got a TD and a bug first down when needed.

7. While the Bills went 3 and out an embarrassing 50% of the time under EJ, they did the same thing against the Titans under Tyrod and Taylor did even worse against the Giants where the Bills were 57% 3 and out.

 

Both are throwing close to 70% completion, Tyrod a little over EJ a little under.

 

Neither is tearing it up the way they should with all these weapons.

 

Personally I think EJ has more potential because he actually can play from the pocket. If he has more practice time as the number one he could elevate his game. I feel like Taylor is already playing at the top of his game and the result is not much better than EJ in mid learning curve.

 

I say start EJ against Jacksonville. If he doesn't play better than this week then Taylor can come back after the bye but if EJ plays well I think you use the BYE to establish EJ as the QB because these scrambling QBs don't last more than a few games without injury. My prediction is that EJ would have to start week 5 when Tyrod got hurt and I was only a week off. Michael Vick has only had one season out of 13 where he was able to avoid injury. That is a telling stat.

 

Can you just accept the fact that EJ is not going to be a starter in this league?

 

I know we spent a 1st on him and I personally was very excited to see his "growth" against the Bengals but I clearly am moving on and accept it not as a bust, but, we spent a 1st round pick to pick up a backup QB.

 

Do I feel Tyrod is the answer? I can't say yes and I can't say no. The only thing I do know is I've seen enough of EJ and am moving on to seeing what Tyrod can do for this franchise.

 

I also understand that EJ only has 15 games under his belt and it's not fair to judge a QB after only 15 starts blah blah blah. That's fine and dandy to access the situation like that anywhere else but, this is Buffalo. A team which hasn't made the playoffs in 15 years. A team who is QB hungry. I say we leave EJ where he is at backup QB and just ride the Tyrod bandwagon for this year and see what he can do for us.

 

I'm very upset we lost also but the remainder of the schedule is ok in my opinion. But then again, after last week's loss, I'm kind of worried about the Jaguars game.

 

Hopefully the team can come together but as far as QB goes, Tyrod all the way.

[aristocrat]

ej needs to ride the bench

[ricojes]

Unless TT is 100 percent I vote to keep EJ in the lineup......

I'd take TT at 90 over EJ at 100...

[NOVABillsFan]

 

EJ was sacked twice in 42 passing attempts...

 

Tyrod was sacked 4 times against the Titans.

 

EJ was 5/13 on 3rd downs, Tyrod was 4/12 against the Titans.

 

Maybe it is an offense thing.

I am beginning to see an obvious trend here. Even with similar numbers this EJ kid sucks while Taylor is performing well.

Edited October 19, 2015 by NOVABillsFan

[Dorkington]

Re timing: I'm ok with EJ taking the start again against the Jags. Let Tyrod get fully healthy before putting him back out there, considering the style of QB he is. No need to pull a RGIII. I don't think there's enough of a fall off that it's going to make a big dent in whether we win or lose against the Jags.

[HuSeYiN_NYC]

I'd take TT at 90 over EJ at 100...

I'd take TT at 80 over EJ at 100. I win.

[gr8billsfan]

The OP forgot to mention that EJ actually caused Sammy Watkins to injure his ankle yesterday with that horrible, horrible TD throw. How convenient that he left that little morsel out. EJ injures his own teammates.

Watkins was open. Yes a low ball but that's Football. He made a good catch but the injury is ridiculous and sucks for Bills fans

[Dr. K]

The OP forgot to mention that EJ actually caused Sammy Watkins to injure his ankle yesterday with that horrible, horrible TD throw. How convenient that he left that little morsel out. EJ injures his own teammates.

Not like that throw to Watkins TT made at the end of the Patriots game that he had to leap up ten feet even to be able to touch. leaving him hung out to dry for the safety.

 

I'm not saying EJ played great. But the double standard of evaluation here is, at the very least, interesting.

Edited October 19, 2015 by Dr. K

[TakeYouToTasker]

or his wife.

Fair point.

 

FireChan is to Tyrod Taylor what Miko Grimes is to Brent Grimes.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

The OP forgot to mention that EJ actually caused Sammy Watkins to injure his ankle yesterday with that horrible, horrible TD throw. How convenient that he left that little morsel out. EJ injures his own teammates.

This idea that EJ hurt Sammy is so illogical it is ridiculous. I mean just stupid.

 

 

The ball was thrown about 30 yards in the air. Sammy was just freelancing and adjusted back to a ball that thrown to space by a QB on the run.

 

It was a few feet away from him. Pro WRs make that play routinely adjusting to a ball thrown in to space. Just stop it.

Edited October 19, 2015 by over 20 years of fanhood

[peterpan]

TT and its not even close.

 

Finally the Bills decided to throw the ball v Cincy. Ej had like 42 attempts.

 

The the previous two games we refused to pass untill the 4th. Tyrod had 17 or 18 attempts in each game I think. When the runs sucks we need to throw is 35 times a game. That includes more swing passes to McCoy and Harvin which is something Tyrod does as well as any QB in football.

[FistingBot]

I'm convinced some people don't watch the games, they just obsess over meaningless stats...

 

When the game is on the line in the 4th quarter, which one makes plays and which one folds like a cheap lawn chair? Tyrod single-handedly won the game in Tennessee. The stat line wasn't pretty, but so what. Wins and losses are all that matter.

 

[peterpan]

So it seems like EJ didn't impress enough for anyone to talk about him being the starter when Taylor returns from injury.

 

I would argue that 1. there was zero drop off in overall production from the QB position with EJ in.

2. EJ actually had the best total passing yards in a Bills game this season.

3. EJ gets sacked once every 21 attempts and Tyrod has been sacked once per every 9.8 attempts

4. Tyrod loses on average 7.14 yards per sack and EJ has averaged 3.5 yards lost per sack

5. EJ had at least 6 completions to WRs in this game. Tyrod has struggled to hit WRs. Last game our top two wideo outs had 1 catch

6. EJ also made plays with his feet albeit less exciting ones but he got a TD and a bug first down when needed.

7. While the Bills went 3 and out an embarrassing 50% of the time under EJ, they did the same thing against the Titans under Tyrod and Taylor did even worse against the Giants where the Bills were 57% 3 and out.

 

 

See my post above. Its easy to get more passing yard when the coaching staff calls 40% more pass plays per game.

 

I think the Coachs learned their lesson - we arent a running team. EJ just happened to be the QB when they finally changed their tune

Edited October 19, 2015 by peterpan

[Gordio]

It's the accuracy that does EJ in. He will never be a starter in the NFL (or even a quality back-up) if he can't be more accurate. Just about every crossing throw was like 2 yards behind the receiver.

 

 

Accuracy & decision making. 2 plays sums up why Manuel will never be a starter in this league. 1st one was the throw to Clay across the middle. Clay made a shoestring catch but honestly EJ can't hit the guy in stride. He would of had another 15-20 yards. The next play I am talking about aggravated me the most. It was like 3rd & 4 he had Mccoy wide open underneath. It was right in front of him. Would of been an easy dump off over the middle & Mccoy could of turned it up & got at least 8-9 yards & moved the sticks. Manuel decides instead to throw it down the seam into double coverage & of course it gets picked off. I don't know if TT will ever be a franchise QB but he is light years better than EJ.

[HuSeYiN_NYC]

Is Fred Jackson still available?

[NOVABillsFan]

TT and its not even close.

 

Finally the Bills decided to throw the ball v Cincy. Ej had like 42 attempts.

 

The the previous two games we refused to pass untill the 4th. Tyrod had 17 or 18 attempts in each game I think. When the runs sucks we need to throw is 35 times a game. That includes more swing passes to McCoy and Harvin which is something Tyrod does as well as any QB in football.

Doesn't your post point to possible a weakness with Tyrod then those past 2 games? Why weren't they throwing the ball more to the TE's?

 

If people choose to use the excuse that it was because Sammy wasn't on the field then I might suggest that they think hard for a better excuse.

[Utah John]

It's the accuracy that does EJ in. He will never be a starter in the NFL (or even a quality back-up) if he can't be more accurate. Just about every crossing throw was like 2 yards behind the receiver.

This. Manuel was accurate on about half of his throws. The others were either injury-bait for his receivers because they had to adjust quickly to where the ball was instead of where it should have been, or because they had to move into harm's way; or they were too far away from where they should have been for even a professional receiver to adjust to (starting with the first little dump-off pass that was too short to be caught); or simply intercepted.

 

TT is accurate on a much higher percentage of throws. I think at least 85 percent of his passes hit the receiver in stride.

 

Both have strong arms, decently quick releases, nice touch on soft passes. Manuel is simply not consistent enough.

[peterpan]

Doesn't your post point to possible a weakness with Tyrod then those past 2 games? Why weren't they throwing the ball more to the TE's?

 

If people choose to use the excuse that it was because Sammy wasn't on the field then I might suggest that they think hard for a better excuse.

 

Im not sure what you mean by throw the ball to the TEs more? I didnt say they should do that?

 

Before the season the coaches said we wanted to run it 40+ times a game. I think the coaches finally learned their lesson agaisnt the Titans - we aren't good enough to run block. So we came out with the mindset of we have to pass to win. I dont think the coaches feel more comfortable with EJ throwing it 40 times rather than TT throwing it 40 times. If that were true I think EJ would be the starter.

 

I am really looking forward to TT tossing it 40 times a game. I think that kid will drop bombs on people. Especially if we ever get Harvin and Watkins healthy.

 

 

Accuracy & decision making. 2 plays sums up why Manuel will never be a starter in this league. 1st one was the throw to Clay across the middle. Clay made a shoestring catch but honestly EJ can't hit the guy in stride. He would of had another 15-20 yards. The next play I am talking about aggravated me the most. It was like 3rd & 4 he had Mccoy wide open underneath. It was right in front of him. Would of been an easy dump off over the middle & Mccoy could of turned it up & got at least 8-9 yards & moved the sticks. Manuel decides instead to throw it down the seam into double coverage & of course it gets picked off. I don't know if TT will ever be a franchise QB but he is light years better than EJ.

EJ also had woods or maybe it was Watkins wide open on the other side of the field for a 50 yard gain. The reason he was double covered was bc the Safety played over that way, leaving the WR on the other side wide open on a fade.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

Re timing: I'm ok with EJ taking the start again against the Jags. Let Tyrod get fully healthy before putting him back out there, considering the style of QB he is. No need to pull a RGIII. I don't think there's enough of a fall off that it's going to make a big dent in whether we win or lose against the Jags.

Or maybe you dress Tyrod and only put him in if EJ can't produce vs the jags, hopefully even the EJ led bills can top the jags... Then you've got Tyrod back after a full four weeks off.

Is Fred Jackson still available?

Will likely be soon as he is descending down the depth chart

[Maddog69]

Can't we just be happy that we have 2 QBs that are playing well enough to win games when our Defense decides to show up and Jerry Hughes doesn't take stupid penalties?

 

It's not Tyrod vs EJ. The question should be "Can Tyrod and EJ be good enough to get this team to the playoffs?" Because we need both to play well. Tyrod has earned the starting job. EJ was not spectacular yesterday but he made some plays. Think of it this way: Would the Patriots have beaten Cincinnati without Brady, Gronk, Edelman, Blount, Vollmer and McCourty? I doubt it.

[It's in My Blood]

Do we win the Titans game with EJ? No.

[Prickly Pete]

I want EJM to start against the Jags. It is the perfect chance to let Tyrod get healthy.

 

Of course, what I expect to happen is for Tyrod to take most of the 1st team reps, rush back, reinjure his leg during the Jags game, and be replaced by an EJM that hasn't been prepared.

Do we win the Titans game with EJ? No.

You dont know how the game would have unfolded if EJM started. Edited October 19, 2015 by HoF Watkins

[BuffaloHokie13]

I want EJM to start against the Jags. It is the perfect chance to let Tyrod get healthy.

 

Of course, what I expect to happen is for Tyrod to take most of the 1st team reps, rush back, reinjure his leg during the Jags game, and be replaced by EJM that hasn't been prepared.

 

You dont know how the game would have unfolded if EJM started.

People love to make up stats and results for players that didn't play

[fridge]

Do we win the Titans game with EJ? No.

 

You have all the questions and all the answers. You don't even need us.

Edited October 19, 2015 by fridge