McShay, no elite QB 2013 draft

[filthymcnasty08]

Nassib on third or 4th round may be our move....

 

Nassib is a great pick 3/4....develop him under whatever veteran we bring in. Not Fitz.

[BillsVet]

Since 2011, teams have selected 13 QB's in rounds 1-3. Call it revisionist history, call it whatever, but there have been opportunities to get a developmental guy before having their hand was forced by Fitzpatrick's failings. Now they're in emergency mode and while McShay's opinion is worth little, it doesn't appear there are quality options. At least not in the 8-12 range where they'll be picking.

 

And if they move up (I thought drafting for need was wrong) it'll be done to put out a fire they have. From a planning standpoint, the Bills have bungled the QB worse than anyone, and that includes the Seahawks. The result is a team at sea in a sailboat without any wind.

[Florida Gator 14]

Mike Glennon at NC State is somebody I'd take a flyer on...if he's coming out this year. Big time arm, good size, smart. Not very mobile, but you can't have everything.

 

I definitely agree with you. He's a senior with a huge arm and great size. We have a pretty good o-line, so mobility is not completely necessary with our QB's. And when he is asked to throw on the run, the guy makes all the throws. And Chan was just talking yesterday about how he wants to develop a guy, and this should be the guy after a season, or maybe less. And if Graham is going to be our deep threat for years to come, why not go out and get his college QB, and a guy that has proven he can get it to him on the money!!!

[KOKBILLS]

No offense...But threads like this may very well be the biggest waste of space we endure around here...

 

First off McShay? Really? McShay?

 

Next...At this point in their final year of College did anyone see Brady, Brees, Rogers, etc being elite NFL QB prospects? It's still WAY early in the process...We don't even know who is coming out for certain...There will be a couple good QB Prospects in this Draft...You can pretty much count on it...

Edited November 29, 2012 by KOKBILLS

[eball]

i think he might be one of the guys that gets sucked into the "wait, who are the top qbs, we have to pick a qb in the first" vacuum - ala ponder. maybe not, but it seems his name has floated into a few more national media references lately.

 

That's because he's pretty good. He has put up some sick numbers in an otherwise disappointing season for the Pack. Watch his bowl game.

[thewildrabbit]

So glad I could amuse the Bills fan base with McShay's worthless opinion. If Mike Mayock had posted one I'd prefer his over anyone at ESPN.

 

The sad fact is, what he states is true as there currently is no RG3 or Andrew Luck in this years draft to trade up for! Although, I'm pretty certain a bunch of teams will reach to obtain a QB who isn't graded as elite.

[zow2]

I definitely agree with you. He's a senior with a huge arm and great size. We have a pretty good o-line, so mobility is not completely necessary with our QB's. And when he is asked to throw on the run, the guy makes all the throws. And Chan was just talking yesterday about how he wants to develop a guy, and this should be the guy after a season, or maybe less. And if Graham is going to be our deep threat for years to come, why not go out and get his college QB, and a guy that has proven he can get it to him on the money!!!

 

It's a lock that Glennon is going to move into the 1st round somewhere. I'd love him on the Bills. To me he has looked like a better pro QB prospect than Ponder, Locker or Dalton ever did in college...and those guys are decent.

[1billsfan]

Video breakdown of Smith, Glennon and Barkley...

 

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-videos/0ap2000000089114/Scout-s-take-Top-QB-prospects

 

 

Here's a guy that I like...

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000065839/article/florida-states-ej-manuel-settles-doubts-with-win-over-clemson

 

 

No way I would take Barkley. I'm on the Smith, Glennon and Manuel bandwagons for that 1st round pick.

[nobody]

and what say you to the crowd of Barkley haters who claim he has no downfield arm strength - ala Fitz?

 

Ideal for the Gailey offense?

[Dopey]

Here's what I don't get - Christian Ponder picked 13th overall - EJ Manuel same school, better measureables, similar but superior statistics and he's ranked somewhere between a 2nd and 4th round pick.

I've watched both of them play and Ponder was a better QB to me. The only thing EJ has over Ponder is the measurables.The team EJ played on is way better than the team Ponder played on. I think Ponder would have taken this year's FSU team to an undefeated season so far. I personally wouldn't want EJ on the Bills and I'm an FSU fan.

[BUFFALOTONE]

and what say you to the crowd of Barkley haters who claim he has no downfield arm strength - ala Fitz?

 

The guy can throw it down field amd make the tough throwa, the deep outs and so forth. He can drop it in a bucket as well.

 

Can Barkley play in winter?

 

I am not so sure that is a huge concern, but I am not a scout. Palmer played at USC and did well in the cold. Its not like evrygame we play is sub freezing weather. You would look at his hand size and arm strength at that point.

 

Any thoughts on the long storied lists of USC QB failures in the NFL. Barkley doesn't look much different. You could argue he's got the best supporting cast of all of them.

besides the most important part an OL. They have two great WRs outside of that its negligable, Kiffin had to sell the Penn State RB to come there because they did not have the depth. They were hurt by sanctions the past few years as well.

 

As for the QB history, he has been there 4 years, longer than Sanchez who started 17 games and Carol even said was not ready for the NFL and Palmer who played 3 and looked unbelievable when he came out. I just think Barkley is the real deal and will be a good prospect, hes done well for 3 years. This year he took his lumps.

[Florida Gator 14]

Anyone that wants EJ Manuel is absolutely nuts. I would rather stick with Fitz and improve the defense than waste a pick on this guy. Even though I am a Gator fan, I can still look at his pro potential with an unbiased view, and this just is not a guy the Bills need to look at. Too many interceptions, too many bad decisions, too many inaccurate passes, and too often injured. They need to avoid him all together!!!

[Buffalo Barbarian]

Good to know Buddy Nix and Chan Gailey finally want to draft a QB after 3 years of a backup elevated to starter

 

According to Todd McShay there is no elite franchise QB in the upcoming draft

 

 

http://espn.go.com/n...know-2013-draft

 

Well if McShay said it then there are tons of FQBs.

 

Here's what I don't get - Christian Ponder picked 13th overall - EJ Manuel same school, better measureables, similar but superior statistics and he's ranked somewhere between a 2nd and 4th round pick.

 

Bc ej sucks

 

Much like the Buffalo Barbarian, listen to McShay and do the opposite of what he thinks.

 

We'd won strait superbowls if I was GM (and that's with Chan as HC)

[1billsfan]

Anyone that wants EJ Manuel is absolutely nuts. I would rather stick with Fitz and improve the defense than waste a pick on this guy. Even though I am a Gator fan, I can still look at his pro potential with an unbiased view, and this just is not a guy the Bills need to look at. Too many interceptions, too many bad decisions, too many inaccurate passes, and too often injured. They need to avoid him all together!!!

 

 

He has 9 interceptions in 328 passing attempts. How's that too many interceptions? Also, he's played in 12 games this season. How's that being often injured?

 

The Bills MUST draft a QB who at least has the building blocks (arm, size, mobility) and potential to be an NFL franchise QB. They will be picking in no man's land and any QB still there at around pick 10 will be a "roll of the dice". Who cares if he's rated a second rounder, just do it.

[....lybob]

Anyone that wants EJ Manuel is absolutely nuts. I would rather stick with Fitz and improve the defense than waste a pick on this guy. Even though I am a Gator fan, I can still look at his pro potential with an unbiased view, and this just is not a guy the Bills need to look at. Too many interceptions, too many bad decisions, too many inaccurate passes, and too often injured. They need to avoid him all together!!!

 

give his stat lines for the last two years and I say you are talking crazy

[KOKBILLS]

It's a lock that Glennon is going to move into the 1st round somewhere. I'd love him on the Bills. To me he has looked like a better pro QB prospect than Ponder, Locker or Dalton ever did in college...and those guys are decent.

 

Like I said in another thread, I'm pretty sure it was Sal Capaccio a couple days ago who reported that Glennon is the one to keep an eye on...He said The Bills like him a lot and are Scouting him big-time...He seemed to have some inside info on it...I was pretty surprised when I heard it...

[Maury Ballstein]

I wonder what McShay thought about Kaepernick

[Koufax]

Good to know Buddy Nix and Chan Gailey finally want to draft a QB after 3 years of a backup elevated to starter

 

According to Todd McShay there is no elite franchise QB in the upcoming draft

 

 

http://espn.go.com/n...know-2013-draft

 

Have you looked at our current 4-7 record and our remaining schedule? We would currently pick about 11th, and will likely fall to the mid teens over the next month. Guys who are labeled as "Elite Franchise QB"s rarely are guys who fall out of the top 10. And also, guys labeled as Elite Franchise QBs in November are not often the same come draft day (Quinn, Claussen, Mallet).

 

There is no Luck or RGIII in this draft, but there certainly could be a Brees or Dalton or Flacco or Freeman. But if there was an Elite Franchise QB clearly labeled as such in November by the draft gurus, chances are he would not be available when we pick anyway.

[thebandit27]

Well, I may as well start now, as you folks are going to see me campaign quite a bit for Logan Thomas out of Va. Tech if he declares.

 

By far, in my opinion, the most physically talented QB in the class. Great size, huge arm, great athlete. His release needs a bit of work, as does his foot work. He also definitely needs to learn to read defenses better, as he currently is prone to bad decisions that result in interceptions. Not surprising for a guy in his second full year as a starter.

 

If Buffalo has a shot at him in round 2 or 3, I'd be very happy.

 

I wonder what McShay thought about Kaepernick

 

He said Kaepernick could be successful if he went to the right team...had him slotted between 30-40...

[Turbosrrgood]

Good to know Buddy Nix and Chan Gailey finally want to draft a QB after 3 years of a backup elevated to starter

 

According to Todd McShay there is no elite franchise QB in the upcoming draft

 

 

http://espn.go.com/n...know-2013-draft

 

This has been bothering me for a while. Most people who watch a lot of college ball are aware that there are no REALLY good QB's coming out this year (Murray has the option to stay if he wants too). So of course THIS is finally the year that Bills have said they want to pick up a QB.

 

The only guys that sound likely to go in the 1st, are Smith and Barkley. They both have some pretty major question marks about them. There are some better opportunities later in the draft I think, but certainly no obvious Luck's or RG3's...

Edited November 29, 2012 by Turbosrrgood

[1billsfan]

Well, I may as well start now, as you folks are going to see me campaign quite a bit for Logan Thomas out of Va. Tech if he declares.

 

By far, in my opinion, the most physically talented QB in the class. Great size, huge arm, great athlete. His release needs a bit of work, as does his foot work. He also definitely needs to learn to read defenses better, as he currently is prone to bad decisions that result in interceptions. Not surprising for a guy in his second full year as a starter.

 

If Buffalo has a shot at him in round 2 or 3, I'd be very happy.

 

 

 

He said Kaepernick could be successful if he went to the right team...had him slotted between 30-40...

 

If this is all true, then he will in no way last until pick 42 and beyond (Bills probable 2nd round slot). The Bills would have to "reach" and burn a #1 pick on him and if he does have the talent you suggest, at this point I'd be completely ok with it.

 

I think that burning picks on QBs in the 1st isn't as costly as it was in the old days, when the contracts for rookie 1st rd QBs were outrageous. I think the Bills should pick a QB in rd 1 of this class and if they have doubts after a year in their system, then do it again in 2014. The Bills, Jets and Dolphins haven't been anything since Kelly, Namath and Marino left their respective buildings. Finding a QB is #1 priority and if they have to crack a few high pick eggs to do it then so be it.

[Mr. WEO]

So glad I could amuse the Bills fan base with McShay's worthless opinion. If Mike Mayock had posted one I'd prefer his over anyone at ESPN.

 

 

Oh?

 

http://deadspin.com/5907142/todd-mcshays-mock-drafts-have-beaten-mike-mayocks-and-mel-kipers-four-years-in-a-row?tag=pundit-tracker

[thebandit27]

Oh?

 

http://deadspin.com/...=pundit-tracker

 

There's a big difference between being able to predict who teams will pick as opposed to being able to project a player's NFL career...

[AxelRipper]

If this is all true, then he will in no way last until pick 42 and beyond (Bills probable 2nd round slot). The Bills would have to "reach" and burn a #1 pick on him and if he does have the talent you suggest, at this point I'd be completely ok with it.

 

I think that burning picks on QBs in the 1st isn't as costly as it was in the old days, when the contracts for rookie 1st rd QBs were outrageous. I think the Bills should pick a QB in rd 1 of this class and if they have doubts after a year in their system, then do it again in 2014. The Bills, Jets and Dolphins haven't been anything since Kelly, Namath and Marino left their respective buildings. Finding a QB is #1 priority and if they have to crack a few high pick eggs to do it then so be it.

 

Big arm, great size, good athlete, can't read defenses, and we'd have to reach for him in the first round... Sounds EXACTLY like Losman.

[Turbosrrgood]

Here's what I don't get - Christian Ponder picked 13th overall - EJ Manuel same school, better measureables, similar but superior statistics and he's ranked somewhere between a 2nd and 4th round pick.

 

I agree with you there. I don't think Manuel should be rated higher, but I never understood why Ponder was considered such a high value. He has actually outperformed my expectations of him, but still hasn't looked all that good.

 

This is exactly what I DON'T want the Bills to do. Use their 1st rnd pick on a 2nd-4th QB talent, just to say they drafted a QB.

[Joe Miner]

There's a big difference between being able to predict who teams will pick as opposed to being able to project a player's NFL career...

 

Agreed, although Mayock's love for Gabbert might make you question his QB analysis.

[uticaclub]

Will Aaron Murray declare?

[Fisher Bills]

All we need is a smart rookie and doesnt turn the ball over and can make a couple plays a game and hand it off to our great backs, even fitz can do that to an extent, its chan whos calling all these pass plays, only if fitz can do what rookie nick foles did a bunch of times the other night vs the panthers, he read the defense then audibles to a ran play that would work the best. if that rb didnt fumble two times the eagles would of have a great chance to win. joe flacco is that kind of qb also. and you can argue he is a super bowl qb because he did make a great throw to lee evans that was dropped that would of put his team in the super bowl

[thewildrabbit]

There's a big difference between being able to predict who teams will pick as opposed to being able to project a player's NFL career...

Exactly, who really cares where a player is picked in the draft vs if he can actually play at the NFL level.

 

Mayock is an ex NFL player, and announces for both NFL & college games. He has been a paid talent evaluator for the actual NFL, NFL network . I'd take his opinion on a players ability to be able to play at the NFL level over any other offering their opinion to the public, that includes many ex NFL GM's.

 

BTW, Mayock has been offered jobs from several NFL teams to run their scouting departments and turned them all down.

[Florida Gator 14]

He has 9 interceptions in 328 passing attempts. How's that too many interceptions? Also, he's played in 12 games this season. How's that being often injured?

 

give his stat lines for the last two years and I say you are talking crazy

 

Well I do only watch him once a year, so the fact that he sucks against Florida is enough for me to avoid him at all costs. In three games against Florida, he has five int's, and the only game in which he did not throw any picks he was only 6 of 13 for 65 yards. I'm not insinuating that Florida is the school for defensive gods, but Ej absolutely does not pass the eye test for me. And you would think that rivalry games would bring the best out of every QB, but apparently not for him. And if you think about it, the 9 int's in 328 attempts are similar to Fitz's numbers, as he has 11 int's in 356 attempts. As for the injury issue, Clint Tricket makes too many appearances for me to be comfortable with him as our future. Like I said, I don't watch FSU very much, but just knowing the backup's name without having to look it up is enough of a red flag. It would be completely asinine to take Ej to replace Fitz.

[Rob's House]

Mike Glennon at NC State is somebody I'd take a flyer on...if he's coming out this year. Big time arm, good size, smart. Not very mobile, but you can't have everything.

+1

 

This guy looks more pro-ready and complete than anyone else in this class. He's got poise, pocket awareness, strong accurate arm (like you said), and even though he's not a scrambler, he still moves pretty well for a big guy and uses it to buy time. I watched this guy then watched Tyler Bray. I no longer have any use for Tyler Bray; there's no comparison.

[Fixxxer]

I really like this class of QB. I no particular order I think these guys would be very good fits for Gailey's offense, Landry, Wilson and Manuel.

 

I wouldn't mind taking one of these guys with our 1st round pick next year.

[Dopey]

give his stat lines for the last two years and I say you are talking crazy

I live in Tallahasse(Big Nole fan) and have seen EJ while at FSU. We don't want him. I'm agreeing with a Gator,Wow!

[C.Biscuit97]

Exactly, who really cares where a player is picked in the draft vs if he can actually play at the NFL level.

 

Mayock is an ex NFL player, and announces for both NFL & college games. He has been a paid talent evaluator for the actual NFL, NFL network . I'd take his opinion on a players ability to be able to play at the NFL level over any other offering their opinion to the public, that includes many ex NFL GM's.

 

BTW, Mayock has been offered jobs from several NFL teams to run their scouting departments and turned them all down.

 

Not doubting you but do you have a link? And I like Mayock the best but he still has his share of terrible calls, like Robert Ayers being the best defensive player in his draft. Basically if you draft a good QB, you will be a good GM. It's really that simple.

[Saint Doug]

Video breakdown of Smith, Glennon and Barkley...

 

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-videos/0ap2000000089114/Scout-s-take-Top-QB-prospects

 

Geno Smith being compared to Jason Campbell and Alex Smith is not what I would call flattering.

[C.Biscuit97]

Any thoughts on the long storied lists of USC QB failures in the NFL. Barkley doesn't look much different. You could argue he's got the best supporting cast of all of them.

 

I don't know why, but I like Barkley the best out of them. He stuck it out with them during probation and goes on missions to Africa in the summers. Sounds stupid , I know, but this matters to me. Leinart stayed for his senior year to nail more coeds and Sanchez tries to live the NYC life. I think Barkley is all about football. Also, I think Lane Kiffin is a joke who only got where he is because of his daddy. He may have held Barkley back. But if he is on the board, I'd love to roll the dice on his resume alone.

[section122]

I don't know why, but I like Barkley the best out of them. He stuck it out with them during probation and goes on missions to Africa in the summers. Sounds stupid , I know, but this matters to me. Leinart stayed for his senior year to nail more coeds and Sanchez tries to live the NYC life. I think Barkley is all about football. Also, I think Lane Kiffin is a joke who only got where he is because of his daddy. He may have held Barkley back. But if he is on the board, I'd love to roll the dice on his resume alone.

Put me in the Barkley camp as well (at least if it has to be a 1st round qb). His accuracy is excellent and I think he outplayed Luck last year. As for the USC qbs are garbage talk I'm with you on the reasons you listed. Leinhart was a big beneficiary of a team that had how many first rounders? He also had 2 amazing rbs to take the pressure off of him. Palmer was really only good his senior year and was a sort of 1 year wonder. Sanchez came out a year early and Carroll even said as much when he declared. Marinovich was a head case 'nuff said.

Barkley if he slides would be a great pick for the Bills. 4 year starter 64.1 career completion % with a 7.9 ypa (some people's favorite stat) 116 tds to 48 picks. He is a victim of history to me. Watching him play I see an NFL qb.

[Nitro]

Prior to last years draft it was reported that 2012 would be the year to get a QB. 2013 and 2014 were viewed as weak QB classes. Nix gambled and I think the BILLS lost. Geno Smith and Matt Barkley are above average talents. Look for the Bills to draft a raw, strong armed type QB in the later rounds.

[Orton's Arm]

Since 2011, teams have selected 13 QB's in rounds 1-3. Call it revisionist history, call it whatever, but there have been opportunities to get a developmental guy before having their hand was forced by Fitzpatrick's failings. Now they're in emergency mode and while McShay's opinion is worth little, it doesn't appear there are quality options. At least not in the 8-12 range where they'll be picking.

 

And if they move up (I thought drafting for need was wrong) it'll be done to put out a fire they have. From a planning standpoint, the Bills have bungled the QB worse than anyone, and that includes the Seahawks. The result is a team at sea in a sailboat without any wind.

 

> And if they move up (I thought drafting for need was wrong) it'll be done to put out a fire they have.

 

You may be using a different definition of "drafting for need" than the one I employ. Let's say that on a scale of 1 - 100, the best player available at your pick is a 70. Let's say you draft a 50 instead, because his position is one of greater need. Then that's the kind of reaching for need/Donte Whitner pick teams should always avoid.

 

But let's say you trade up a few spots, to where the best player available is a 90. Then you take that player; who happens to fill a need. That's not reaching for need at all. In general, teams would do well to trade up or down in the draft to spots where the best available player also happens to fill a need. (Assuming, of course, that fair trades are available.)

 

Unfortunately, Buddy has thus far been unwilling to tank seasons, and unwilling to pay the price to trade up in the draft. Each year, the best available QB prospects were off the table well before the Bills picked. (By "good prospect" I mean "a good prospect based on the information available at the time. A guy like Tom Brady is a Hall of Fame player; but was not considered a particularly good prospect based on the information available back in 2000.)

 

Maybe Buddy will use a combination of skill + luck to take a QB who plays much better than his draft position would indicate. That's a best-case scenario, and I see little to indicate it will actually happen. A more realistic scenario would be for him to take a QB generally acknowledged to be a top prospect, such as Barkley. That will almost certainly require him to pay a king's ransom to trade up. If trading up gets the Bills a franchise QB, Buddy should pay that king's ransom with a smile on his face. Sometimes, if you want a king, you need to pay a king's ransom.

[Guest buffalo bill]

i take tyler wilson 1st rd. linebacker second rd. wideout 3rd rd. offense coordinator. tyrann mathiue from lsu turn him into a safety with byrd. the depth is good enough for those picks that way. qb most of important. than stop the run. but if we get vick for 3 years than pick linebacker 1st rd.real good one than get wideout 2nd rd he be a real good one deep threat then get a still in tyrann mathiue in the 3rd for a safety whats so hard about it i should be general manager!! 4th pick d-line man 5th pick o-lineman 6th pick best man on the board no matter what he do.