John Potter - Why a kick-off specialist makes sense

[Coach55]

Everyone is voicing so much concern about keeping John Potter, yet no one ever is against keeping Ruvell Martin or Corey McIntyre because they are Specialists. Here is the reality - by keeping Potter it actually opens up roster spots. For kickoffs, NFL teams dislike using their good players as there is a significant increased risk in injury (punts don't have the set up as a kickoff), therefore teams need 10 quality players for kick coverage. By having Potter, you eliminate the need for these 10 players and roster spots on players such as McIntyre, could be used elsewhere. One would argue that most of these people are also on punt coverage, but that actually isn't entirely true given the nature of the play (you may have 5-6 players overlapping).

[Captain Hindsight]

I don't disagree with your argument but i think keeping a guy like potter just ensures that your defense gets an advantage of having more field to defend each time the other team gets the ball. Making Sanchez drive 80 yards is better than having him drive 30

[Doc]

Haven't seen the games, but is he handling all KO's and what has his touchback percentage been?

[PromoTheRobot]

Makes as much sense as keeping a wildcat QB that converts 3rd and short 75% of the time.

 

PTR

[marauderswr80]

This preseason his touchback % is 100!!!!

 

Hes 5 for 5!

 

He makes the team!

Edited August 22, 2012 by marauderswr80

[swnybillsfan]

Haven't seen the games, but is he handling all KO's and what has his touchback percentage been?

he's been freakin' great, and i think he is somewhere around 100% seriously, every kickoff i have seen him boot has gone either into the back half of the endzone or out of it. i'm real good with this kid having a roster spot.

[K-9]

he's been freakin' great, and i think he is somewhere around 100% seriously, every kickoff i have seen him boot has gone either into the back half of the endzone or out of it. i'm real good with this kid having a roster spot.

 

How can you say he's been great when he's been wide left on every kickoff attempt?

 

GO BILLS!!!

[marauderswr80]

Noones returned the ball....idc what the kick looks like

[NickelCity]

Everyone is voicing so much concern about keeping John Potter, yet no one ever is against keeping Ruvell Martin or Corey McIntyre because they are Specialists. Here is the reality - by keeping Potter it actually opens up roster spots. For kickoffs, NFL teams dislike using their good players as there is a significant increased risk in injury (punts don't have the set up as a kickoff), therefore teams need 10 quality players for kick coverage. By having Potter, you eliminate the need for these 10 players and roster spots on players such as McIntyre, could be used elsewhere. One would argue that most of these people are also on punt coverage, but that actually isn't entirely true given the nature of the play (you may have 5-6 players overlapping).

 

While I'm not disagreeing with your overall premise, I think there are a ton of people on this board who were against keeping Ruvell, especially last season.

[need therapy]

How can you say he's been great when he's been wide left on every kickoff attempt?

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

Lol

 

I think that keeping Potter makes a lot of sense in terms of field position. You make the opposing team drive 80 yard for a TD and if the defense gets a 3 and out, the Bills will start on offense around their 35 or so.

[JESSEFEFFER]

I do not think they want to expose Rian Lindell to having to either make tackles or take on blockers. His shoulder injury last year really contributed to their second half slide. Since they seem to be all in this year, I think they want him to be making their "gotta have them" kicks.

Edited August 22, 2012 by JESSEFEFFER

[I_want_2_BILL_Lieve]

I agree with the over all premise. But it DOES tend to get rather windy in Orchard Park in late November and December. We still will need a kick coverage team when he kicks into the wind.

Edited August 22, 2012 by I_want_2_BILL_Lieve

[jimmy10]

Haven't seen the games, but is he handling all KO's and what has his touchback percentage been?

 

You don't even see the ball once it leaves the tee because he pretty much kicks it into the middle of the lower deck. Dude is for real.

[Bud Adams]

This preseason his touchback % is 100!!!!

 

Hes 5 for 5!

 

He makes the team!

 

As I recall, the Raiders drafted Janikowski 17th overall mostly because of his ability to kick the ball into the endzone. Yeah, I know... It's the Raiders, but still.

 

I would be shocked if he doesn't make the team. We need all the positive field position we can get.

 

BA

[jimmy10]

I do not think they want to expose Rian Lindell to having to either make tackles or take on blockers. His shoulder injury last year really contributed to their second half slide. Since they seem to be all in this year, I think they want him to be making their "gotta have them" kicks.

 

That's a great point, I forgot about Lindell's injury and how he got it while tackling a guy who got past coverage. Keep him for the ice-in-your-veins field goals, and have the kid gradually learn and take over all the kicking duties.

[Big Turk]

Statistacally speaking, opponents starting field position is the best indicator of whether they score or not...every yard of field position positively increases an opponents points per drive, and conversely, every fewer yard lessens their points per drive. If the Bills can get them in a 3rd and long a few times a game starting at the 20, they can turn loose the pasha rush and a sack would result in the Bills getting exceptional field position in return....in short, depending on how many kickoffs we have in a game, could equal 50-100 yards of field position total, or more if you figure the Bills will get better field position from their drive starts as well if they force a quick punt...

 

 

[K-9]

As I recall, the Raiders drafted Janikowski 17th overall mostly because of his ability to kick the ball into the endzone. Yeah, I know... It's the Raiders, but still.

 

I would be shocked if he doesn't make the team. We need all the positive field position we can get.

 

BA

 

The bigger reason is that Janikowski was a two time consensus All American and career 80% kicker in college who was freakishly accurate from long distances. His booming kickoffs were icing on the cake.

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

Statistacally speaking, opponents starting field position is the best indicator of whether they score or not...every yard of field position positively increases an opponents points per drive, and conversely, every fewer yard lessens their points per drive. If the Bills can get them in a 3rd and long a few times a game starting at the 20, they can turn loose the pasha rush and a sack would result in the Bills getting exceptional field position in return....in short, depending on how many kickoffs we have in a game, could equal 50-100 yards of field position total, or more if you figure the Bills will get better field position from their drive starts as well if they force a quick punt...

 

What is this pasha rush you speak of? I know it used to be a strategy in the Mongolian Goat Head Tournaments, but I've never seen it used in the NFL. It's high time though.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[Charles Romes]

Nothing kills the momentum of having scored like a long return. Potter helps keep the momentum after a score. He also helps reduce injuries.

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

I don't know--a bit torn on this one.

 

With the kickoff line pushed up, shouldn't every starting NFL kicker be able to boom touchbacks on a regular basis? Lindell can drill a 53 yard FG, but he can't be counted on to kick touchbacks?

[section122]

I don't know--a bit torn on this one.

 

With the kickoff line pushed up, shouldn't every starting NFL kicker be able to boom touchbacks on a regular basis? Lindell can drill a 53 yard FG, but he can't be counted on to kick touchbacks?

Different technique. Golf is a good analogy here. Think about the guys who can drive the ball extremely far they generally have poor accuracy on shorter shots and the guys who are accurate at short distances don't necessarily boom the ball. It takes a special player (like a Janikowski) to do both.

[cbmarley]

I agree keeping Potter makes sense, and would like to see the Bills do it. I think field position is very important to both sides of the ball. I don't know how accurate he is (hopefully something he's also working/improving on), but say the Bills have to kick a 65 yard field goal or something crazy like that, maybe he proves to be a better option than Lindell...then again maybe not. Also if Lindell goes down with another injury in the middle of a game, does having potter make more sense than having moorman kicking field goals/extra points??

[Meark]

I don't even want to read any responses.. This is totally ridiculous.. Can't the dude kick field goals? Can't we find a guy that can do both? What a waste of a roster spot.. Seriously a joke to even consider keeping three kickers.. If Lindell can't get both jobs done find someone who can. Every other team in the NFL seems to have 1 guy that can kick off and kick field goals..

 

Oh.. and I don't care to keep Martin either..

Edited August 22, 2012 by MarkinSanDiego

[Mike in Syracuse]

I hate to quote Greg Williams but he may have said it best. "Special teams is 33% of the game".

 

If you've got a guy on your team that boots the ball into the first row on the kickoffs is also saves a TON of wear and tear on your guys who play special teams. Anyone remember Kevin Everett? He might be our starting TE if it wasn't for one unfortunately kick-off.

[Doc]

I hate to quote Greg Williams but he may have said it best. "Special teams is 33% of the game".

 

If you've got a guy on your team that boots the ball into the first row on the kickoffs is also saves a TON of wear and tear on your guys who play special teams. Anyone remember Kevin Everett? He might be our starting TE if it wasn't for one unfortunately kick-off.

With a guy like Potter, HomeJob ThrowUp never happens.

[Charles Romes]

Sometimes its only a matter of time (and having the opportunity to do nothing but practice kicking for 10 hours a day) for a kicker to develop into an NFL ready FG kicker. Potter may not be ready to take over FG kicking right now. But another possible plus to keeping him is that we may be developing the team's FG kicker for the next decade.

[cbmarley]

With a guy like Potter, HomeJob ThrowUp never happens.

 

great reason to have potter on the team. If people have issues with having two kickers on the team, why not get a center who can act as a long snapper? I believe the answer is because both players bring a unique skill set that helps the team win. A second kicker taking up a roster spot who can more or less eliminate kickoff returns I believe is just as valuable, if not more valuable than a DLmen who plays 3-5 snaps a game, or anyother position for that matter

[swnybillsfan]

Sometimes its only a matter of time (and having the opportunity to do nothing but practice kicking for 10 hours a day) for a kicker to develop into an NFL ready FG kicker. Potter may not be ready to take over FG kicking right now. But another possible plus to keeping him is that we may be developing the team's FG kicker for the next decade.

this is a pretty legitimate arguement right here. plus, having him learn from lindell is a good thing imo.

[ThurmasThoman]

i think for the section of the fanbase that is against keeping a kickoff specialist - imagine it like this:

 

let's say we signed an unheard of free agent that could ONLY play special teams - he was a gunner. and with his signing, came the guarantee that he would FLY down the field at a rate of speed you had never seen before, and tackle every, single return man at the 20 yard line. they would get absolutely no further than the 20 yard line. you would certainly be for keeping that player, no?

 

just because he's a kicker, don't undervalue his importance to this team.

 

with our d-line, in our stadium (with the majority of our second half schedule being at home,) and our running game? im all for teams starting every drive at the 20. that's going to be absolutely DAUNTING. imagine sanchez throwing into the wind, down by 14 to start the fourth quarter,week 17, wild card spot on the line... and potter f*cking drills it through the endzone so they have to start on the 20.

 

this season is going to be so much fun, i cant wait.

[BillsBytheBay]

I don't know--a bit torn on this one.

 

With the kickoff line pushed up, shouldn't every starting NFL kicker be able to boom touchbacks on a regular basis? Lindell can drill a 53 yard FG, but he can't be counted on to kick touchbacks?

If it were that easy, everyone would have one.

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

Someone made a good point about November and December weather in Buffalo. Lindell is a great precision guy, but the new rules make the most effective kickoff technique to kick it back through the endzone. Lindell is able to drop it within the ten, but while that would have once been effective, now, not so much.

 

To me, nothing has cemented tne importance of having a second kicker in the wings than the godawful attempts we saw last year when Lindell went down.

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

Different technique. Golf is a good analogy here. Think about the guys who can drive the ball extremely far they generally have poor accuracy on shorter shots and the guys who are accurate at short distances don't necessarily boom the ball. It takes a special player (like a Janikowski) to do both.

 

I can see your point.

 

My rebuttal: there are only 32 teams in the NFL. Are there seriously not 32 kickers on the planet that can accurately kick FG's AND hammer home touchbacks 85% of the time?

 

Seems strange that it's such a rare combination--but, like you said, maybe it is.

[Captain Hindsight]

Only 46 guys dress each week. So we dont activate a backup corner who wont play anyway, huge loss guys.

[FLFan]

There is great value in what Potter can bring. As someone else has pointed out, Potter also seems to have potential to be our kicker for the next 10 years or more once he learns how to kick FG in the NFL. It will be a very tough choice. The Bills are already going to have to cut some good football players at other positions. This is one less roster spot for a WR, DB, DL, OL, or LB they would like to have for the future. Keeping Potter would be a real luxury.

 

[RealityCheck]

I don't know--a bit torn on this one.

 

With the kickoff line pushed up, shouldn't every starting NFL kicker be able to boom touchbacks on a regular basis? Lindell can drill a 53 yard FG, but he can't be counted on to kick touchbacks?

Should and shouldn't are irrelevant. The reality is what the team has responded to and hopefully the gamble works in the regular season. The key to this move is scoring points.

[NoSaint]

Only 46 guys dress each week. So we dont activate a backup corner who wont play anyway, huge loss guys.

 

You could argue that he fills the 3rd qb slot and were netting the same depth we have otherwise and b smith is just a wr with gadget potential

 

All said, with him hopefully playing on more than a couple plays a game, hes more valuable than #45 who may never walk on the field

[marauderswr80]

Its simple....you take advantage of everything you can on the field!

[uncle flap]

I can see your point.

 

My rebuttal: there are only 32 teams in the NFL. Are there seriously not 32 kickers on the planet that can accurately kick FG's AND hammer home touchbacks 85% of the time?

 

Seems strange that it's such a rare combination--but, like you said, maybe it is.

 

 

85% isn't 100%, which seems to be what Potter can deliver.

 

And I realize this isn't a perfect analogy, but one could use that same logic to say, "Well, I know playing Quarterback is tough, but there just has to be 32 guys on the planet than can do it."

 

Plus, as already mentioned, teeing off (literally) vs accurately placing a kick that is being held by someone else who might not have the greatest consistency holding (many variables- the snap, the weather, etc.) while having to kick over a line of oncoming defenders are completely different beasts.

[K-9]

I hate to quote Greg Williams but he may have said it best. "Special teams is 33% of the game".

 

If you've got a guy on your team that boots the ball into the first row on the kickoffs is also saves a TON of wear and tear on your guys who play special teams. Anyone remember Kevin Everett? He might be our starting TE if it wasn't for one unfortunately kick-off.

 

No. I think Yogi Berra said it best when he proclaimed, "90 percent of the game is half mental."

 

GO BILLS!!!

Edited August 23, 2012 by K-9

[Best Player Available]

The Polish cannon in Oakland was and still is a freak of nature. Forget the no return kicks, that dude can still hit 70 yard field goals in warm ups. Judging by some comments here Potter "could learn how to kick field goals with lindell". Is that for real? 85% of non returnable kicks doesn't seem like a situation to burn a roster spot on. This team is still not overly stocked on overall talent IMO. If the guy could hit field goals 45- 50+yards on a consitent basis then cut Lindell. It seems like he needs to develop field goal kicking though. Can he be buried on the practice squad for awhile?

 

What next a punter who can only hit coffin corners on 60 yard punts? So then a team carries two punters? let's find Steve tasker 2.0 and put some fear in the kick returners, instead of carrying a guy for the sole purpose of hitting non returnable kicks 85% of the time.

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

85% isn't 100%, which seems to be what Potter can deliver.

 

And I realize this isn't a perfect analogy, but one could use that same logic to say, "Well, I know playing Quarterback is tough, but there just has to be 32 guys on the planet than can do it."

 

Plus, as already mentioned, teeing off (literally) vs accurately placing a kick that is being held by someone else who might not have the greatest consistency holding (many variables- the snap, the weather, etc.) while having to kick over a line of oncoming defenders are completely different beasts.

 

Part of my argument is actually based on what Lindell himself said. A few years ago he re-upped with the Bills and he basically said (I am paraphrasing), "look, there isn't much of a FA market for kickers. Each team needs only one, and there's enough guys out there that can do this, so most guys are lucky to have a job."

 

I am paraphrasing, of course.

 

Just seems odd to me that these professional kickers can't boom touchbacks, esp with the move of the kick-off line. But apparently that is the case and I am wrong, since the Bills feel they need two guys to do the job. Just seems crazy.