RkFast Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 ...how come every coupla hours I see a former Bill in the PLAYOFFS making HUGE plays and scoring touchdowns? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 You mean the Greer pick? Or the marshawn run? Or the mcgahee run? I'm scared to see what Jason peters does now. Probably carries mike Vick on his back for a td at this rate. The eagles special teams and defensive backs will probably be technically sound and make explosive plays Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohiotim Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 33% of what the Bills do wrong is draft a player, but they can't play. Examples: Aaron Maybin, John McCargo, James Hardy. 33% of what the Bills do wrong is draft a player, they can play, but they either 1) coach them poorly 2) can't figure out how to use them or 3) don't wanna pay them big money, and let them go, at which point they go on to success with other teams. Examples: Willis McGahee, Marshawn Lynch, Nate Clements, Antonie Winfield. 33% of what the Bills do wrong is develop free agent signings, but when they become successful, don't wanna pay them big money, and let them go. Examples: Jabari Greer, Pat Williams, Jason Peters. 1% of what the Bills do is right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VirginiaMike Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 Another example -- we draft someone who plays the same position as our strength and then have to9 trade from our strength -- see Lynch, greer, ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 Another example -- we draft someone who plays the same position as our strength and then have to9 trade from our strength -- see Lynch, greer, ... If only we even traded Greer. Let him walk. Fletcher and poz? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aristocrat Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 lose pat williams...try to draft mccargo draft mcgahee when we have henry and then trade willis and draft lynch then draft spiller when you have freddy and lynch and trade lynch draft mckelvin when you have greer and mcgee pat williams could have been signed, so could greer. this is why i could see us losing poz and whitner then draft peterson and some lb in the 2nd round and our defense stays about the same next year. poz and whitner aren't elite but they are decent players and should be extended so we can build on this defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albany,n.y. Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 33% of what the Bills do wrong is draft a player, but they can't play. Examples: Aaron Maybin, John McCargo, James Hardy. 33% of what the Bills do wrong is draft a player, they can play, but they either 1) coach them poorly 2) can't figure out how to use them or 3) don't wanna pay them big money, and let them go, at which point they go on to success with other teams. Examples: Willis McGahee, Marshawn Lynch, Nate Clements, Antonie Winfield. 33% of what the Bills do wrong is develop free agent signings, but when they become successful, don't wanna pay them big money, and let them go. Examples: Jabari Greer, Pat Williams, Jason Peters. 1% of what the Bills do is right. You left out the percentage of unresticted free agent OL disasters that the team has signed. Examples: Green, Walker, Dockery, Fowler, Reyes, Anderson. These guys make the signings of Villarrial, Teague & Panos look good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
....lybob Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 You left out the percentage of unresticted free agent OL disasters that the team has signed. Examples: Green, Walker, Dockery, Fowler, Reyes, Anderson. These guys make the signings of Villarrial, Teague & Panos look good. I wish we had Walker as our RT right now - sometimes I wish I wasn't a Bill's fan because then they'd be hilarious- Peters and Walker were a pretty good tackle combination and we had problems on the interior of the line - so of course we get rid of our tackles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LancasterSteve Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 You left out the percentage of unresticted free agent OL disasters that the team has signed. Examples: Green, Walker, Dockery, Fowler, Reyes, Anderson. These guys make the signings of Villarrial, Teague & Panos look good. All stifts Well You know as well as I that good teams rarely let good O-linemen hit FA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 (edited) 33% of what the Bills do wrong is draft a player, but they can't play. Examples: Aaron Maybin, John McCargo, James Hardy. 33% of what the Bills do wrong is draft a player, they can play, but they either 1) coach them poorly 2) can't figure out how to use them or 3) don't wanna pay them big money, and let them go, at which point they go on to success with other teams. Examples: Willis McGahee, Marshawn Lynch, Nate Clements, Antonie Winfield. 33% of what the Bills do wrong is develop free agent signings, but when they become successful, don't wanna pay them big money, and let them go. Examples: Jabari Greer, Pat Williams, Jason Peters. 1% of what the Bills do is right. This is really pretty good, IMO. I seriously don't know why Modrak and Co. continue to have defenders. Greer was another of those undrafted college free agents that we seem to find every year. Peters too. Lynch was miffed about us drafting Spiller, and I think that he wanted out, too. But I don't know how you can overlook Mike Williams, John McCargo, James Hardly, Erik Flowers, JP Losman, and Drew Bledsoe. Not too mention Clements was way overpaid and is gone, Schobel is now retired, Evans is a ghost in most games, Lynch was really starting to get serious offseason and off-field issues, and McKelvin does not seem to be the lock down corner we all hoped that he would be. Oh, and did I mention Whitner? Aaron Maybin? Seriously. Aaron Maybin was well scouted? This team has basically blown its first round draft picks for the entire decade. Stop defending Modrak and the scouting department. Our first good draft was Nix's first with the Bills. Wood, Bryd are good. Spiller will be. He kinda reminds me of McFadden. Took some time to find his way, but he will. The jury is still out on this years draft- though I think we will be pleasantly surprised. Let's see what a #3 overall turns into, before we start talking about how great our scouting staff now is. For a small market team like the Bills who will rely on the draft, the scouting department has got to be the backbone of the franchise. Modrak has had 10 years on the job. He has only proven that he is terrible. Edited January 9, 2011 by Red Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob in STL Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 ...how come every coupla hours I see a former Bill in the PLAYOFFS making HUGE plays and scoring touchdowns? The drafting has been poor because there is no cohesive plan to build from. So we draft RBs and DBs and WRs over, and over, and over again. There is no cohesive plan because there is constant change. There is constant change because the team is poorly managed. The team is poorly run because no one in the front office has been capable enough to get the job done. No one in the front office is capable because the owner has not found the right person yet. Why? I don't know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 (edited) Modrak has had 10 years on the job. He has only proven that he is terrible. Ironic you use the word "terrible" to describe the drafting this decade. Because that's exactly the same word the owner used to describe their drafting after the Miami win. Still, the college scouting department remains virtually unchanged despite the terrible track record there. Buddy's first draft underwhelmed, but it's very early. That 09 draft has thus far yielded 2 decent to solid interior Olineman, a safety who may be improving, and little else. Finding interior lineman and safeties is nice, but taking them in the first two rounds means you should hit. Most teams use fewer resources and draft just as well at those positions. The Bills remain weakest at the positions that are the hardest to find: QB, OT, pass rusher, and CB. Some things never change I guess. Edited January 9, 2011 by BillsVet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thoner7 Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 I will volunteer to replace whoever get paid to be that bad in the bills FO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max997 Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 ...how come every coupla hours I see a former Bill in the PLAYOFFS making HUGE plays and scoring touchdowns? so you think the Bills have been drafting well then is that what you are saying? McGahee is a backup and scored a garbage TD. Lynch can play, everyone knew that so this is no surprise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBuff423 Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 I was thinking the exact same thing as I watched McGahee run for that touchdown! I started thinking about all of the former Bills that were currently in the playoffs: Jim Leonard, McGahee, Lynch, Peters, Greer, Johnathon Scott, Sam Aiken (if he's still with the Pats), and there may be others that I'm not thinking of, but that's two running backs, a Pro Bowl LT and starting CB and Safety and reserve/Special Teamer and starting tackle for the Steelers. That's a lot of talent, and this is of course not mentioning other talent that's starting for other teams as some others have mentioned Winfield and Clements. And except for Scott (at least to my knowledge) those are players that the Bills either out-right drafted or got as UDFAs meaning that scouting can't be all of the problem there has to be some other dysfunction on draft day when you look at the Aaron Maybins, Donte Whitners, and Mike Williams of the Bills over the last 10 years. Disturbing...especially considering we are "building through the draft"! Which, I fully agree with in principle, but I also believe that you have to get at least a few impacting FAs that can contribute immediately while you "build through the draft". I don't want to be the Redskins but it would be nice to be someone like the Eagles who "build through the draft" but also get guys like Peters and Asante Samuel to contribute in the necessary areas of weakness. Ho-hum....I guess we'll see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RealityCheck Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 33% of what the Bills do wrong is draft a player, but they can't play. Examples: Aaron Maybin, John McCargo, James Hardy. 33% of what the Bills do wrong is draft a player, they can play, but they either 1) coach them poorly 2) can't figure out how to use them or 3) don't wanna pay them big money, and let them go, at which point they go on to success with other teams. Examples: Willis McGahee, Marshawn Lynch, Nate Clements, Antonie Winfield. 33% of what the Bills do wrong is develop free agent signings, but when they become successful, don't wanna pay them big money, and let them go. Examples: Jabari Greer, Pat Williams, Jason Peters. 1% of what the Bills do is right. Ouch! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PS 56 Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 33% of what the Bills do wrong is draft a player, but they can't play. Examples: Aaron Maybin, John McCargo, James Hardy. 33% of what the Bills do wrong is draft a player, they can play, but they either 1) coach them poorly 2) can't figure out how to use them or 3) don't wanna pay them big money, and let them go, at which point they go on to success with other teams. Examples: Willis McGahee, Marshawn Lynch, Nate Clements, Antonie Winfield. 33% of what the Bills do wrong is develop free agent signings, but when they become successful, don't wanna pay them big money, and let them go. Examples: Jabari Greer, Pat Williams, Jason Peters. 1% of what the Bills do is right. Argghhhh, why oh why do I love this team so? Its like I live for abuse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 33% of what the Bills do wrong is draft a player, but they can't play. Examples: Aaron Maybin, John McCargo, James Hardy. 33% of what the Bills do wrong is draft a player, they can play, but they either 1) coach them poorly 2) can't figure out how to use them or 3) don't wanna pay them big money, and let them go, at which point they go on to success with other teams. Examples: Willis McGahee, Marshawn Lynch, Nate Clements, Antonie Winfield. 33% of what the Bills do wrong is develop free agent signings, but when they become successful, don't wanna pay them big money, and let them go. Examples: Jabari Greer, Pat Williams, Jason Peters. 1% of what the Bills do is right. This made me laugh and cry all at once Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 How do I know this team's drafted badly? Answer: rookie contributions. I watched 4 playoff games that had rookies contribute. Our rookies can't even contribute in the regular season. For some reason this team's incapable of drafting nfl-ready players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helpmenow Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 For the past ten years the ship has been rudderless prior to Nix getting there. Whom has minding the store RW! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 (edited) Even MaGahee was an awful draft selection. People forget that he had to sit out more than a full season before he could even take the field. This team was far too weak to make a luxury selection, but this is their history, and it continued with Spiller. Edited January 10, 2011 by Bill from NYC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 How do I know this team's drafted badly? Answer: rookie contributions. I watched 4 playoff games that had rookies contribute. Our rookies can't even contribute in the regular season. For some reason this team's incapable of drafting nfl-ready players. This is a great point that many of the "give it some time" crowd ignore, for their convenience. How cna such a bad team, with so many weankesses draft so few guys who can start as rookies. Last year's draft has one legit starter--Moats. Mcuh better teams have more rookies starting than we do. Let's draft for D!!--yet we have been doing that: McCargo, Maybin, McKelvin, Whitner, Troup, Poz--these are all first or second round picks (fairly recent ones) made to imporove the defense. The defense is horrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2003Contenders Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 How do I know this team's drafted badly? Answer: rookie contributions. I watched 4 playoff games that had rookies contribute. Our rookies can't even contribute in the regular season. For some reason this team's incapable of drafting nfl-ready players. While the Bills have certainly had their share of issues with guys like Maybin, McCargo and the like and the top draft picks this year (Spiller, Troup, and Carrington) did little, I would say that several rookies did make a meaningful contribution this year: D Nelson, D Jones, and A Moats to name only three. Time will tell, but I actually have high hopes for both 2009 and 2010 draft classes (minus, of course, the Maybin fiasco). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zow2 Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 If the Bills front office get slammed (and rightfully so) for poor draft picks...do they get equal amounts of praise for great UDFA signings? I think they should. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloFan68 Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 I can only dream of where the Bills would be now if they didn't waste picks on plays like Trent Edwards, Maybin, McCargo and even the revolving door at RB. If we had addressed the lines, both Off & Def, and LBs. We would be in the playoffs already. Our scouting dept. is either totally clueless or someone is making desicions without listening to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wagon Circler Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 For the past ten years the ship has been rudderless prior to Nix getting there. Whom has minding the store RW! What makes you think the ship isn't rudderless now? I won't judge Buddy based on one draft, but when Arthur Moats is your best drafted rookie,... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 33% of what the Bills do wrong is draft a player, but they can't play. Examples: Aaron Maybin, John McCargo, James Hardy. 33% of what the Bills do wrong is draft a player, they can play, but they either 1) coach them poorly 2) can't figure out how to use them or 3) don't wanna pay them big money, and let them go, at which point they go on to success with other teams. Examples: Willis McGahee, Marshawn Lynch, Nate Clements, Antonie Winfield. 33% of what the Bills do wrong is develop free agent signings, but when they become successful, don't wanna pay them big money, and let them go. Examples: Jabari Greer, Pat Williams, Jason Peters. 1% of what the Bills do is right. Sad but extremely accurate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 How do I know this team's drafted badly? Answer: rookie contributions. I watched 4 playoff games that had rookies contribute. Our rookies can't even contribute in the regular season. For some reason this team's incapable of drafting nfl-ready players. But but... they need time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yungmack Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 You left out Joique Bell who is backing up Lynch in Seattle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zow2 Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 You left out Joique Bell who is backing up Lynch in Seattle. Hmmm, i thought the Saints signed Bell a couple weeks ago? They were down a couple RBs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfreak Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 While the Bills have certainly had their share of issues with guys like Maybin, McCargo and the like and the top draft picks this year (Spiller, Troup, and Carrington) did little, I would say that several rookies did make a meaningful contribution this year: D Nelson, D Jones, and A Moats to name only three. Time will tell, but I actually have high hopes for both 2009 and 2010 draft classes (minus, of course, the Maybin fiasco). Your post further illustrates how the Bills can't draft. You are correct in that Nelson, Jones and Moats were probably the best three rookies, and only one of them was drafted, the others were undrafted FAs. So Moats came on over the last 5 or 6 games, the jury is still somewhat out on him, and sadly that is the best that the 2009 draft has given to the Buffalo Bills. You left out Joique Bell who is backing up Lynch in Seattle. I know he as been in Philly and New Orleans since the Bills dumped him, but I wasn't aware he was ever in Seattle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yungmack Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Your post further illustrates how the Bills can't draft. You are correct in that Nelson, Jones and Moats were probably the best three rookies, and only one of them was drafted, the others were undrafted FAs. So Moats came on over the last 5 or 6 games, the jury is still somewhat out on him, and sadly that is the best that the 2009 draft has given to the Buffalo Bills. I know he as been in Philly and New Orleans since the Bills dumped him, but I wasn't aware he was ever in Seattle. Oops! He's with the Saints. Don't know why I thought he was in Seattle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DDD Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 lose pat williams...try to draft mccargo draft mcgahee when we have henry and then trade willis and draft lynch then draft spiller when you have freddy and lynch and trade lynch draft mckelvin when you have greer and mcgee pat williams could have been signed, so could greer. this is why i could see us losing poz and whitner then draft peterson and some lb in the 2nd round and our defense stays about the same next year. poz and whitner aren't elite but they are decent players and should be extended so we can build on this defense. Like a mouse spinning in a wheel and getting nowhere, that's how things roll at OBD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 33% of what the Bills do wrong is draft a player, but they can't play. Examples: Aaron Maybin, John McCargo, James Hardy. 33% of what the Bills do wrong is draft a player, they can play, but they either 1) coach them poorly 2) can't figure out how to use them or 3) don't wanna pay them big money, and let them go, at which point they go on to success with other teams. Examples: Willis McGahee, Marshawn Lynch, Nate Clements, Antonie Winfield. 33% of what the Bills do wrong is develop free agent signings, but when they become successful, don't wanna pay them big money, and let them go. Examples: Jabari Greer, Pat Williams, Jason Peters. 1% of what the Bills do is right. I'd make this my signature if it wasn't so damn depressing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OCinBuffalo Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Some of you have argued in a circle: For example, you can't say the team mostly drafts poorly, and, mostly let's good drafted talent get away, at the same time. Pick one or the other. There has to be good drafted talent for it to get away. There can't be, if we mostly draft poorly. Even if we could do both at the same time, the constant turnover in coaches/scheme means that the people we have are almost certainly going to get their value reduced. Anybody remember Spikes/Fletcher/Posey and one of the best D's in the league? What happened? Scheme change, end of story. And, I still have no problem with the Spiller pick. The fact is that when you are drafting that high, you have to swing for the fences, and try to draft a HOF-type player. WTF is the point of drafting the 3rd best offensive lineman on the board, when the #1 at whatever position is there? Isn't this about talent? If it is, then why do we want #3s on this team instead of #1s? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 WTF is the point of drafting the 3rd best offensive lineman on the board, when the #1 at whatever position is there? When your OL is in shambles and you don't have problems at running back is not the time to draft a gadget player. Besides, Bulaga went at #23. They could have traded down and picked up more picks but no.....they absolutely had to draft Spiller. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OCinBuffalo Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 When your OL is in shambles and you don't have problems at running back is not the time to draft a gadget player. Besides, Bulaga went at #23. They could have traded down and picked up more picks but no.....they absolutely had to draft Spiller. I agree, if the #3 O lineman still grades out higher than the #1 whatever is there, you take him. But, if a HOF potential LB is there, for example, no way I take an #3 left tackle that isn't instant starting material. We are drafting very high, our #2 might as well be a #1. We had better draft instant starters, not projects, regardless of position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfreak Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Even MaGahee was an awful draft selection. People forget that he had to sit out more than a full season before he could even take the field. This team was far too weak to make a luxury selection, but this is their history, and it continued with Spiller. I thought Spiller pretty much sat out this year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chimp Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 ...how come every coupla hours I see a former Bill in the PLAYOFFS making HUGE plays and scoring touchdowns? Greer was an un-drafted free agent. McGahee was never horrible, just a horrible offensive line. If you look closely though you will see that he isn't the starter. Lynch was a reach where he was drafted. To date I think that makes 1 big run in his career. Jim Leonard would be the starting safety for the Jets also. I don't know what is hard to see about the majority of the guys buffalo has let go that have gone on to play on playoff winning teams. Name 1 that is the star. Maybe Greer? he is pretty good but name someone that is an absolute stud on his team. Last year's draft has one legit starter--Moats. I wouldn't say that. he had a couple decent games and a good hit on Favre. Terell Suggs was an outside linbacker/end that was ready to play his rookie year. Merriman was another OLB that was ready to start when he came into the league. They both started on good defenses. I don't think Moats starts on many defenses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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