Has Josh Allen put himself back in the race for MVP this year??

[ToGoGo]

13 minutes ago, Orlando Buffalo said:

I am not sure if you are being sarcastic, but if you have two guys who are similar wouldn't you pick the guy who wins more? Stafford has had a phenomenal year. 

Define similar? What about Stanford besides his TD to INT ratio? How is Stafford similar to Allen? 
 

You think I’m being sarcastic because I’m forcing you to think outside the echo chamber. 

[Chaos]

11 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

It sort of showed in McDaniels' playcalling too. He didn't seem to have a plan for coming from behind late.

But they did once in the fourth quarter.  There defense could not stop Allen.  You watch the Bills do much.  Some teams actually hold fourth quarter leads.  The Pats put up 31 points.  There special teams and defense lost this game. Not Maye and McDaniel.  Its not like Brady has a brilliant fourth quarter comeback strategy.  Josh Allen is a true unicorn in this regard.  The only comparable beast is the Mahomes - Kelce animal.  

 

10 minutes ago, Matt_In_NH said:

Look at the 11-16 seeds in both conferences.  That list is also the patriots schedule. Yep they always led those bad teams. 

Not sure what point you were making. I was just making the point you can't ding someone for not having fourth Quarter comebacks, if they are never needed. 

Edited 17 hours ago by Chaos

[Matt_In_NH]

8 minutes ago, Chaos said:

 

 

Not sure what point you were making. I was just making the point you can't ding someone for not having fourth Quarter comebacks, if they are never needed. 

And you don’t need them when you play bad teams. 

[Orlando Buffalo]

1 minute ago, ToGoGo said:

Define similar? What about Stanford besides his TD to INT ratio? How is Stafford similar to Allen? 
 

You think I’m being sarcastic because I’m forcing you to think outside the echo chamber. 

To dismiss his leading the league in TDs while also minimizing turnovers means you are not worth discussing. I don't think Maye is MVP material but Stafford is playing lights out. Let me ask you what weakness do you see in Staffords candidacy? 

[GunnerBill]

29 minutes ago, Chaos said:

But they did once in the fourth quarter.  There defense could not stop Allen.  You watch the Bills do much.  Some teams actually hold fourth quarter leads.  The Pats put up 31 points.  There special teams and defense lost this game. Not Maye and McDaniel.  Its not like Brady has a brilliant fourth quarter comeback strategy.  Josh Allen is a true unicorn in this regard.  The only comparable beast is the Mahomes - Kelce animal.  

 

 

No, the one play they scored on in the 4th Quarter was a standard zone run, the Bills had the perfect defense called for it, got numbers to the ball, but the back bounced off his teammates butt and ended up out the back and in the meantime Max Hairston has lost his concentration, wandered away from his spot, given up contain and got square on to the play. And then give Henderson credit he is a talented kid and he ran away from them all. That wasn't about McDaniels' having a plan. 9/10 that play run against that defensive call is a loss of 3. 

 

I think it felt a bit like a team who are used to being ahead in the 4th on offense and haven't yet really had chance to work out who they are and what their go to plays are in the scenario where they are behind. Those final couple of drives were not particularly well called.

[TheBrownBear]

45 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

It sort of showed in McDaniels' playcalling too. He didn't seem to have a plan for coming from behind late.

A lot of that is just trusting your quarterback to drop back and make something happen.  Maye wasn't capable today.

[CincyBillsFan]

20 minutes ago, Orlando Buffalo said:

To dismiss his leading the league in TDs while also minimizing turnovers means you are not worth discussing. I don't think Maye is MVP material but Stafford is playing lights out. Let me ask you what weakness do you see in Staffords candidacy? 

Stafford is having an MVP season but his weakness relative to Allen is that Stafford has a lot better weapons.  I can think of a lot of QB's that would be doing well with LA but not so many that would be winning these kinds of games for Buffalo.

 

 

[gonzo1105]

Just now, GunnerBill said:

 

No, the one play they scored on in the 4th Quarter was a standard zone run, the Bills had the perfect defense called for it, got numbers to the ball, but the back bounced off his teammates butt and ended up out the back and in the meantime Max Hairston has lost his concentration, wandered away from his spot, given up contain and got square on to the play. And then give Henderson credit he is a talented kid and he ran away from them all. That wasn't about McDaniels' having a plan. 9/10 that play run against that defensive call is a loss of 3. 

 

I think it felt a bit like a team who are used to being ahead in the 4th on offense and haven't yet really had chance to work out who they are and what their go to plays are in the scenario where they are behind. Those final couple of drives were not particularly well called.

To me that was just as much on Epenesa as Hairston. Defensive Ends are told to squeeze it down , which he did well, but it’s also required for him to see his feet at “deepest back” level which obviously is Henderson in that scenario and he didn’t do that . Really the whole backside over pursued and he slipped out the back door 

[BuffaloRebound]

Stafford probably wins MVP but Josh is best player in the League and it’s not even  close.  10-4 with this roster and this coaching staff… there’s no other QB who’d be better than 7-7 if he traded places with Josh.  

[GunnerBill]

8 minutes ago, gonzo1105 said:

To me that was just as much on Epenesa as Hairston. Defensive Ends are told to squeeze it down , which he did well, but it’s also required for him to see his feet at “deepest back” level which obviously is Henderson in that scenario and he didn’t do that . Really the whole backside over pursued and he slipped out the back door 

 

I will look again at AJE on that play but Hairston is definitely culpable. He switches off completely loses track of where he is on the field and then it is too late to recover.

[HappyDays]

14 minutes ago, gonzo1105 said:

To me that was just as much on Epenesa as Hairston. Defensive Ends are told to squeeze it down , which he did well, but it’s also required for him to see his feet at “deepest back” level which obviously is Henderson in that scenario and he didn’t do that . Really the whole backside over pursued and he slipped out the back door 

 

Classic rookie mistake from Hairston IMO. He got complacent thinking the play side had the run stuffed. One second of losing focus against NFL speed and that is the result. He'll learn. Not worried about it the long run (no pun intended).

 

Epenesa's role in the debacle bothers me a lot more because he's a vet and losing rush contain has been a big problem with him throughout his career. But mostly I think it was just a flukey play that you have to just shake your head and move on. When THAT is the only play the offense has against you for an entire half, it's almost the exception that proves the rule of how dominant the defense was in the 2nd half.

 

Edited 16 hours ago by HappyDays

[folz]

Updating the general stats for the four top candidates going into today (with the Rams and Packers games now in the books):

 

Stats

Matt Stafford (11-3)    3,714 total yards    37 total TDs   5 INTs  

Drake Maye (11-3)      3,929 total yards   27 total TDs   7 INTs

Joshua Allen (10-4)    3,811 total yards    37 total TDs  10 INTs

Jordan Love (9-4-1)   3,500 total yards   23 total TDs   6 INTs

 

Big days and solid wins for Josh Allen and Matt Stafford today. Maye took a loss to the Bills, Love lost to the Broncos.

 

Josh's case: He only has 1 win less than Stafford, but more total yards and the same number of TDs (5 more INTS though too). He has one win less than Maye, but just beat him. And despite Maye having 118 yards more than Josh (8.4 yards more per game), Josh has 10 more TDs---I don't think a 3 INT-differential really sways things, especially with that many a TD difference (TD = 7, INTs average 4. +10 TDs = 70 points, +3 INTs = minus 12 points). Not sure Love should still be in the conversation (fewest yards, fewest TDs, worst record, had two INTs in a loss today). And finally, there is the argument of Stafford having better weapons than the other three.

 

But, I still think Stafford is the current front-runner. Three more to go...

[Solomon Grundy]

42 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

No, the one play they scored on in the 4th Quarter was a standard zone run, the Bills had the perfect defense called for it, got numbers to the ball, but the back bounced off his teammates butt and ended up out the back and in the meantime Max Hairston has lost his concentration, wandered away from his spot, given up contain and got square on to the play. And then give Henderson credit he is a talented kid and he ran away from them all. That wasn't about McDaniels' having a plan. 9/10 that play run against that defensive call is a loss of 3. 

 

I think it felt a bit like a team who are used to being ahead in the 4th on offense and haven't yet really had chance to work out who they are and what their go to plays are in the scenario where they are behind. Those final couple of drives were not particularly well called.

Epenesa didn't hold contain either.

[GunnerBill]

7 minutes ago, Solomon Grundy said:

Epenesa didn't hold contain either.

 

Yea @gonzo1105 mentioned that. I need to watch back and focus on AJE's part. But AJ in non-contain shocker would not be news would it? 😄

[Billsfanatic8989]

When does voting end. Day after the season ends? I ask because if Allen keeps going off, we win the division, and the Rams are a WC, that could very well get Allen the MVP. 

 

Regardless, Maye is out. Solid QB. But it's done for him. It's Stafford and Allen imo. 

[BuffaloBillyG]

I think just as important of a question to ask:

 

Has James Cook put himself in the race for Offensive PoY?

 

Earlier in the season Johnathan Taylor looked like a shoo in. He's cooled off. Cook has been stacking the yards and TDs.  He's got to be in the convo IMO

[FireChans]

25 minutes ago, folz said:

Updating the general stats for the four top candidates going into today (with the Rams and Packers games now in the books):

 

Stats

Matt Stafford (11-3)    3,714 total yards    37 total TDs   5 INTs  

Drake Maye (11-3)      3,929 total yards   27 total TDs   7 INTs

Joshua Allen (10-4)    3,811 total yards    37 total TDs  10 INTs

Jordan Love (9-4-1)   3,500 total yards   23 total TDs   6 INTs

 

Big days and solid wins for Josh Allen and Matt Stafford today. Maye took a loss to the Bills, Love lost to the Broncos.

 

Josh's case: He only has 1 win less than Stafford, but more total yards and the same number of TDs (5 more INTS though too). He has one win less than Maye, but just beat him. And despite Maye having 118 yards more than Josh (8.4 yards more per game), Josh has 10 more TDs---I don't think a 3 INT-differential really sways things, especially with that many a TD difference (TD = 7, INTs average 4. +10 TDs = 70 points, +3 INTs = minus 12 points). Not sure Love should still be in the conversation (fewest yards, fewest TDs, worst record, had two INTs in a loss today). And finally, there is the argument of Stafford having better weapons than the other three.

 

But, I still think Stafford is the current front-runner. Three more to go...

I think it’s Stafford’s to lose.

 

hes never won it and it’s his likely last shot. The Rams are probably the most impressive team top to bottom.

 

I’m kind of okay with it honestly. It probably gets him in the Hall and he had HoF talent that went to waste in Detroit,

[Mango]

1 hour ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

I find it telling that with the game going how it was late... McDaniels didn't call anything to get Maye using his legs. Almost refused to put the game in his hands...and Maye's inability to take over on his own 

 

I thought the flee flicker was a strange first half call for a team dominating but still with a lot of football to play.

 

That's either a late game call to rub it in their face or for a team playing from behind.

 

[billieve420]

It was going to be hard enough for second year player in Maye to win award. With today’s loss I think that ends it. It is Stafford’s award to lose at this point. Allen needs to win out and put up monster stats rest of the way to have a chance but I think Stafford winning would make better NFL story and that is probably enough with Allen winning last year.

Edited 15 hours ago by billieve420

[gonzo1105]

18 minutes ago, FireChans said:

I think it’s Stafford’s to lose.

 

hes never won it and it’s his likely last shot. The Rams are probably the most impressive team top to bottom.

 

I’m kind of okay with it honestly. It probably gets him in the Hall and he had HoF talent that went to waste in Detroit,

I agree usually when it’s a toss up between a couple of guys, the guy who already won it is kind of punished