Jonathan Taylor gets paid

[FireChans]

https://twitter.com/adamschefter/status/1710691846001770597?s=46&t=GGNmxHtuMQWK-ZEccAMZsQ

 

Terrible move IMO. Colts trying to compete when they should be trying to see if AR15 can be a QB.

[stevestojan]

Psst, Colts, it’s a passing league now. 

[buffaloboyinATL]

3 year/$42 million extension.  I have a feeling this is in part because Anthony Richardson looks better than expected already.

[Low Positive]

1 minute ago, buffaloboyinATL said:

3 year/$42 million extension.  I have a feeling this is in part because Anthony Richardson looks better than expected already.

They’re competing right now in a weak division. Their fans got spoiled by Payton Manning and Andrew Luck and are becoming disinterested. Something had to be done and this is the thing that they did.

[NickelCity]

This contract will be a memory by the time they have to pay a QB

[NewEra]

9 minutes ago, stevestojan said:

Psst, Colts, it’s a passing league now. 

Meanwhile- if you look at the team rushing leaders- of the top 11, 8 of those teams are the top 8 SB favorites.  
 

yes, it’s a passing league…..but if you can’t run, you’re one dimensional and have little chance to win a SB imo.  Gotta be able to run

[Warcodered]

14 minutes ago, FireChans said:

https://twitter.com/adamschefter/status/1710691846001770597?s=46&t=GGNmxHtuMQWK-ZEccAMZsQ

 

Terrible move IMO. Colts trying to compete when they should be trying to see if AR15 can be a QB.

He's already looking like that so securing help makes some sense, but if this prevents them from getting a competent O-line or more passing weapons around him in the next year or two it'll be a mistake.

[FireChans]

Just now, Warcodered said:

He's already looking like that so securing help makes some sense, but if this prevents them from getting a competent O-line or more passing weapons around him in the next year or two it'll be a mistake.

This prevents the ball from being in his hands. Josh Allen doesn’t look like Josh Allen today if he wasn’t running around making mistakes his rookie year IMO. 
 

this is how bad franchises stay bad.

[NewEra]

15 minutes ago, FireChans said:

https://twitter.com/adamschefter/status/1710691846001770597?s=46&t=GGNmxHtuMQWK-ZEccAMZsQ

 

Terrible move IMO. Colts trying to compete when they should be trying to see if AR15 can be a QB.

And how can they tell if AR15 can be a QB when they have trash WRs and RBs?  Taylor gets 2 years of gtd money.  I don’t see the problem in this particular situation.  Taylor will help AR15 more than his WRs will.  

[stevestojan]

2 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Meanwhile- if you look at the team rushing leaders- of the top 11, 8 of those teams are the top 8 SB favorites.  
 

yes, it’s a passing league…..but if you can’t run, you’re one dimensional and have little chance to win a SB imo.  Gotta be able to run

Valid. Can’t argue with that. 

[MJS]

10 minutes ago, FrenchConnection said:

They’re competing right now in a weak division. Their fans got spoiled by Payton Manning and Andrew Luck and are becoming disinterested. Something had to be done and this is the thing that they did.

You should never make a decision based on what the fans think. It should all be about what helps set up their franchise for the best chance to win now and in the future.

[PetermansRedemption]

Zach Moss has looked more than competent. No reason to have paid Taylor IMO

[Warcodered]

1 minute ago, FireChans said:

This prevents the ball from being in his hands. Josh Allen doesn’t look like Josh Allen today if he wasn’t running around making mistakes his rookie year IMO. 
 

this is how bad franchises stay bad.

Josh this year is seemingly learning/learned how to work within an offense while using his ridiculous athleticism when he has to, might not have the worst thing to have been able to learn it earlier.

 

Besides that establishing a better running game will relieve the pressure on a rookie QB and open up the passing game. They're not going to stop throwing it that'd be stupid.

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

More $ for Taylor equals less money for Irsay to piss away on guitars and pseudotheraputic agents. 🤨

[QCity]

I've never been an advocate for paying RB's, but 3 years at the age of 24 isn't the worst contract. It's no coincidence that it ends when Richardson's comes up for renewal.

[FireChans]

2 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

Josh this year is seemingly learning/learned how to work within an offense while using his ridiculous athleticism when he has to, might not have the worst thing to have been able to learn it earlier.

 

Besides that establishing a better running game will relieve the pressure on a rookie QB and open up the passing game. They're not going to stop throwing it that'd be stupid.

He learned how to do it earlier. Josh got sloppy because his OL has deteriorated over the last two years. he didn’t just figure out how to run an offense lol.

 

Establishing a running game doesn’t matter for the Colts. Better to let AR throw 30-40 times and win 5 games and stock the cupboards. 

[GunnerBill]

9 minutes ago, NewEra said:

And how can they tell if AR15 can be a QB when they have trash WRs and RBs?  Taylor gets 2 years of gtd money.  I don’t see the problem in this particular situation.  Taylor will help AR15 more than his WRs will.  

 

Yea that's how I see it. 

 

But I agree with @FireChans IF this leads to them becoming a run team who takes the ball out of its QBs hands it will end up a mistake. They have to stay pass first and just use Taylor to bring some balance.

[FireChans]

2 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yea that's how I see it. 

 

But I agree with @FireChans IF this leads to them becoming a run team who takes the ball out of its QBs hands it will end up a mistake. They have to stay pass first and just use Taylor to bring some balance.

It will. They didn’t pay JT to not feature him heavily. He will touch the ball 20-25 times a game and it will stifle their QB’s career. 
 

Then before you know it, it will be year 3 and they will still be wondering “is he the guy?”

[GunnerBill]

As long as Taylor is getting all the carries 20-25 is fine. If it is 20-25 for Taylor and 10 for Zack Moss that is getting into dangerous territory.

[thenorthremembers]

Don't really hate it.  They have to pay someone.  

[BillsFan130]

Giving large contracts to injury prone RBs are always a great idea..

[Virgil]

And magically, he’s healed 

[NewEra]

10 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yea that's how I see it. 

 

But I agree with @FireChans IF this leads to them becoming a run team who takes the ball out of its QBs hands it will end up a mistake. They have to stay pass first and just use Taylor to bring some balance.

Takes the ball out of their QBs hands?  What are some examples of this?  Like what  run/pass ratio are you looking for?  Like the niners running the ball 52%+?  Philly is 50/50.  Det is 50/50. Dallas is 51/49.  We’re 55/45.  I think 55-60% passes is solid for teams with good QBs.  I think 50-55% is good for a QB like AR15 at this stage I’m his development.  
 

Hurts was broken into the league at a 50/50 ratio his first 2 seasons and the colts tum the same offense.  

[Brand J]

Congrats to JT, well deserved. He and his running back mates deserve a bigger piece of the pie when you consider they’re asked to run the ball, block for the QB, go out for pass routes, and generally touch the ball on average 3x-4x as much as any #1 receiver.

[GunnerBill]

3 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Takes the ball out of their QBs hands?  What are some examples of this?  Like what  run/pass ratio are you looking for?  Like the niners running the ball 52%+?  Philly is 50/50.  Det is 50/50. Dallas is 51/49.  We’re 55/45.  I think 55-60% passes is solid for teams with good QBs.  I think 50-55% is good for a QB like AR15 at this stage I’m his development.  
 

Hurts was broken into the league at a 50/50 ratio his first 2 seasons and the colts tum the same offense.  

 

I'd want to be 55% plus passing. I have to know who my QB is. I don't find that out running the football. I hate the "hide the QB" model of trying to develop a guy in this era. I know that is what happened with Hurts but that is because Philly didn't actually expect him to be as good as he is. 

 

I think the way to develop a QB in this era is by fire. Get him out there and get him throwing the ball. Easier to dial it back later than it is to ramp it up if what you have developed is a careful, don't turn it over, only pass when we have to Quarterback.

[Warcodered]

8 minutes ago, Virgil said:

And magically, he’s healed 

[JJGauna]

Why are people trashing this move? Who else are they going to pay over the next few years? Indy isn’t exactly a destination for free agents. You need to retain your talent at some point. When you have a rookie QB you get to hand out contracts like this.

[Warcodered]

5 minutes ago, JJGauna said:

Why are people trashing this move? Who else are they going to pay over the next few years? Indy isn’t exactly a destination for free agents. You need to retain your talent at some point. When you have a rookie QB you get to hand out contracts like this.

They do need to make sure they have an O-line around their new Franchise QB so they don't Andrew Luck another one.

[NewEra]

5 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I'd want to be 55% plus passing. I have to know who my QB is. I don't find that out running the football. I hate the "hide the QB" model of trying to develop a guy in this era. I know that is what happened with Hurts but that is because Philly didn't actually expect him to be as good as he is. 

 

I think the way to develop a QB in this era is by fire. Get him out there and get him throwing the ball. Easier to dial it back later than it is to ramp it up if what you have developed is a careful, don't turn it over, only pass when we have to Quarterback.

Idk….. I don’t think passing 5% more is going make that much of a difference in his development.  
 

Having an effective run game will help him.  The colts WR unit is 💩.  If they throw more than 55-60% his development might actually be stunted throwing to a bunch of average guys. Forcing passes to guys that can’t get open. The QBs that have developed nicely have good weapons to throw to.  The weapons help them succeed.  The colts weapons are unlikely to do that imo.  Passing 50-55 seems good for ar15 He can develop and they can win that way imo

[FireChans]

17 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Takes the ball out of their QBs hands?  What are some examples of this?  Like what  run/pass ratio are you looking for?  Like the niners running the ball 52%+?  Philly is 50/50.  Det is 50/50. Dallas is 51/49.  We’re 55/45.  I think 55-60% passes is solid for teams with good QBs.  I think 50-55% is good for a QB like AR15 at this stage I’m his development.  
 

Hurts was broken into the league at a 50/50 ratio his first 2 seasons and the colts tum the same offense.  

It’s not a surprise that of your examples, we have Mr Irrelevant/Dak/Goff who a lot of folks question their ceilings and their ability to deliver in the postseason. 

When it comes to the elite QB’s of this era, almost none of them were hidden behind a rushing attack in their development, except maybe Hurts (who I sneaky question his eliteness anyway).

 

[GoBills808]

9 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I'd want to be 55% plus passing. I have to know who my QB is. I don't find that out running the football. I hate the "hide the QB" model of trying to develop a guy in this era. I know that is what happened with Hurts but that is because Philly didn't actually expect him to be as good as he is. 

 

I think the way to develop a QB in this era is by fire. Get him out there and get him throwing the ball. Easier to dial it back later than it is to ramp it up if what you have developed is a careful, don't turn it over, only pass when we have to Quarterback.

They don't need to have the guy throw that much in a game to know what they've got tho

 

Game reps are what we see on TV but they pretty much already know what they've got in a QB w out having to have him hit a specific ratio during games

 

It's like golf imo- range sessions will tell you what you're working with but when it comes to getting on the course you're trying to score, not work out the kinks

[FireChans]

2 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

They don't need to have the guy throw that much in a game to know what they've got tho

 

Game reps are what we see on TV but they pretty much already know what they've got in a QB w out having to have him hit a specific ratio during games

 

It's like golf imo- range sessions will tell you what you're working with but when it comes to getting on the course you're trying to score, not work out the kinks

100% DISAGREE.

 

treating the regular season like golf, aka trying to win over develop is how you end up with year 3 of Justin Fields and not knowing what he can be. 

[NewEra]

Just now, FireChans said:

It’s not a surprise that of your examples, we have Mr Irrelevant/Dak/Goff who a lot of folks question their ceilings and their ability to deliver in the postseason. 

When it comes to the elite QB’s of this era, almost none of them were hidden behind a rushing attack in their development, except maybe Hurts (who I sneaky question his eliteness anyway).

 

if he’s going to be elite….he’s going to be elite, regardless of 5% more pass ratio.  
 

1 minute ago, FireChans said:

100% DISAGREE.

 

treating the regular season like golf, aka trying to win over develop is how you end up with year 3 of Justin Fields and not knowing what he can be. 

An additional 3-4 passes a game isn’t going to make or break him.going to ruin him. If it could ruin him, they have the wrong QB.  

[GoBills808]

1 minute ago, FireChans said:

100% DISAGREE.

 

treating the regular season like golf, aka trying to win over develop is how you end up with year 3 of Justin Fields and not knowing what he can be. 

You and I may not know what he can be but I guarantee their staff has a more informed opinion and it doesn't have much to do w a few more passes/game 

[starrymessenger]

If your going to pay a star running back this looks to me a reasonable way to do it. He’s on his first contract which he has outperformed and he’s still very much in his prime. Even there however there is risk relative to the guaranteed amount since he played through injury just last year. Given the hazards of playing the position, what not to do is chase after guys on their second or third contract looking for a big payday.. Look at Dalvin Cook. Looks like hes got nothing left in the tank. Who would have thought. The only RB who seems to have been worth the costs of acquiring him is CMC.

[NewEra]

The bills passed 53 and 54% of the time Josh Allen’s first 2 years, while his WRs were 💩.  Then they got him Diggs….and it jumped to 62%.  
 

This conversation is centered around AR15s development his first 2-3 years, that’s when Taylor’s contract is gtd.  
 

The colts don’t have the horses in the passing game right now.  

[Warcodered]

6 minutes ago, FireChans said:

100% DISAGREE.

 

treating the regular season like golf, aka trying to win over develop is how you end up with year 3 of Justin Fields and not knowing what he can be. 

I'd tie the whole Justin Fields thing to more incompetent coaching than that, if you change your game plan halfway/three quarters through the season to actually use what he's good at, then maybe you just don't know what the hell you're doing.

[FireChans]

10 minutes ago, NewEra said:

if he’s going to be elite….he’s going to be elite, regardless of 5% more pass ratio.  
 

An additional 3-4 passes a game isn’t going to make or break him.going to ruin him. If it could ruin him, they have the wrong QB.  

 

7 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

You and I may not know what he can be but I guarantee their staff has a more informed opinion and it doesn't have much to do w a few more passes/game 

4 more passes a game ends up being 204 attempts over 3 years. 
 

IMO it’s not as much about the raw numbers as it is who the onus of the offense is on. If they make this “our offense revolves around JT, just make a couple throws and keep drives alive” it will harm Richardson’s development.

 

Just like Josh, put it on him and see what he does when the bullets are flying. It’s why we were pretty optimistic about Josh after his rookie year. We knew what he was dealing with, and he had a good amount of big moments.

Edited October 7, 2023 by FireChans

[GoBills808]

Just now, FireChans said:

 

4 more passes a game ends up being 204 attempts over 3 years. 
 

IMO it’s not as much about the raw numbers as it is who the onus of the offense is on. If they make this “our offense revolves around JT, just make a couple throws and keep drives alive” it will harm Richardson’s development. 

I think that concern gets weighed against the balance of their personnel, their mandate to win games, and the totality of their player development program and comes in a distant fourth tbh

[GunnerBill]

2 minutes ago, FireChans said:

 

4 more passes a game ends up being 204 attempts over 3 years. 
 

IMO it’s not as much about the raw numbers as it is who the onus of the offense is on. If they make this “our offense revolves around JT, just make a couple throws and keep drives alive” it will harm Richardson’s development.

 

Just like Josh, put it on him and see what he does when the bullets are flying. It’s why we were pretty optimistic about Josh after his rookie year. We knew what he was dealing with, and he had a good amount of big moments.

 

Yea it isn't just about volume. It is about exposing him to everything you are going to see as an NFL QB. The extra 204 reps is an extra 204 times he has had to navigate how a defense is trying to defend him.