Pass protection rankings

[BillsMafi$]

 

[MJS]

Two metrics from two organizations I have no faith in combined into one metric to rule them all!

[Bangarang]

Top 10 huh. Wrong. 

[KOKO NFL]

The fact that Josh leaves the pocket to run (for his life) likely slants the stats favorably for the Bills' OL.

[MJS]

I wonder if there is a metric out there that measures how many times your QB has to evade pass rushers. It's like 90% of Josh's drop backs.

[Success]

Honestly - I think it's been a lot better the past couple of weeks.

 

I think Brown makes a big difference.

 

[dave mcbride]

18 minutes ago, Bangarang said:

Top 10 huh. Wrong. 

I don't think their pass pro is that bad; the issue is that because the run blocking is so bad, teams can tee off on the pass. 

[Nextmanup]

This is from PFF and their league wide ratings, HEADING INTO THE 2021 SEASON:

 

Note the italicized text.  LOL  

 

14. BUFFALO BILLS

 

The Bills finished 10th in our final 2020 rankings, and they’ve done a great job of rebuilding the trenches over the past few years.

 

The tackle tandem of Dion Dawkins and Daryl Williams is one of the league’s best; they finished 14th and 22nd, respectively, in overall grade last season. Dawkins has been incredibly consistent in his four NFL seasons, especially in pass protection, where he’s graded between 76.0 and 79.2 every year. Williams returns via free agency after playing well on a shrewd one-year deal. He’s bounced around the offensive line during his six-year career, but his two best seasons came in 2017 and 2020 — both of which he played right tackle from start to finish.

 

On the interior, center Mitch Morse has graded at 67.3 and 63.3 in his two years as a starter in Buffalo, and much like the rest of his career, he’s done his best work in pass protection. Bills guards earned a mere 60.7 grade as a unit last year, an area where the team must improve in 2020. Jon Feliciano returns as the starting right guard after posting the highest run-blocking grade on the team (76.1) but also the lowest pass-blocking grade (46.4). He’s been a league-average starter over the past two years and could be pushed by Ike Boettger, Forrest Lamp and Jamil Douglas.

 

Cody Ford is expected to start at left guard, and it’s a pivotal year for the 2019 second-rounder. He recorded just 50.3 and 53.8 grades in his first two seasons, so the Bills are hoping the common third-year breakout comes to fruition in 2021.

 

The Bills also did a fine job of adding depth, including two monster draft picks in Tommy Doyle and Spencer Brown. Both tackle prospects are at least 6-foot-8, serving as solid developmental options behind the starting duo of Dawkins and Williams.

 

Once again, the Bills have a solid offensive line unit and they continue to attack the position with volume. Their depth is strong, whcih should help them handle any injuries that pop up throughout the season.

[Matt_In_NH]

I have to think they are using hits and sacks and JA is making these guys look good

[GoBills808]

 

[strive_for_five_guy]

4 hours ago, BillsMafi$ said:

 

So in coming up with the team avg, they’re giving PFT ratings generally 2/3’s weight and ESPN 1/3?

[Bangarang]

3 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

I don't think their pass pro is that bad; the issue is that because the run blocking is so bad, teams can tee off on the pass. 

It’s hard for me to think it isn’t as bad as it looks. 

[TheBrownBear]

2 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

 

I love how Boettger loses his man and just decides to tackle Dion Dawkins instead.

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

24 minutes ago, Bangarang said:

It’s hard for me to think it isn’t as bad as it looks. 

I am far from a blocking assignment expert but I have seen a good amount of every teams offense this year since I mostly have red zone on one tv at all times and we easily look like the worst offensive line in the league in pass protection 

[HoofHearted]

4 hours ago, MJS said:

Two metrics from two organizations I have no faith in combined into one metric to rule them all!

100% - a bunch of non-football guys grading players without knowing play calls or assignments. Brilliant!

3 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

 

Slow feet don't eat. Our OL is so unathletic.

4 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

I don't think their pass pro is that bad; the issue is that because the run blocking is so bad, teams can tee off on the pass. 

This definitely compounds the issue, but we are very unathletic up front.

[D. L. Hot-Flamethrower]

Garbage in....Garbage out

[LABILLBACKER]

6 hours ago, MJS said:

I wonder if there is a metric out there that measures how many times your QB has to evade pass rushers. It's like 90% of Josh's drop backs.

Almost every pass there's a different olineman beat, causing Josh to either try to escape or throw early. Usually under 2 seconds. Watch back alot of these games. Rarely does he have a clean circular pocket.  Using some unreliable metric combo doesn't change this fact.  Not to change the subject but the 2 times in the 2nd half in TB we pulled Guards, it resulted in 2 very long gains by Devin.  Let's do more of that, ya think.

Edited December 16, 2021 by LABILLBACKER

[MJS]

21 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Almost every pass there's a different olineman beat, causing Josh to either try to escape or throw early. Usually under 2 seconds. Watch back alot of these games. Rarely does he have a clean circular pocket.  Using some unreliable metric combo doesn't change this fact.  Not to change the subject but the 2 times in the 2nd half in TB we pulled Guards, it resulted in 2 very long gains by Devin.  Let's do more of that, ya think.

A lot of times it's a free rusher. Our oline sometimes doubles one guy and completely ignores another guy. It's a lack of communication on the line or just getting confused by stunts.

 

There is a large component of what the oline does that is mental. And I think our oline lacks in that department. Not that I think they are dumber than average, but that I think they are unprepared and not well enough schooled in these things. That's why I think it comes back to the oline coach. Obviously I'm guessing, but it makes sense to me.

[John from Riverside]

Do they factor in QB elusiveness into this metric

[Hapless Bills Fan]

8 hours ago, BillsMafi$ said:

 

 

Why on earth combine ratings from 2 different organizations and in the ratio 2/3 to 1/3?

 

Is there any rationale for this?

[GoBills808]

4 hours ago, TheBrownBear said:

I love how Boettger loses his man and just decides to tackle Dion Dawkins instead.

End zone view is even sadder😢

 

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

8 hours ago, MJS said:

I wonder if there is a metric out there that measures how many times your QB has to evade pass rushers. It's like 90% of Josh's drop backs.

 

I don't think it's that high, and at times when Josh does need to run, it's because he's trying to wait for something to develop.

 

But it happens a lot and very quickly, too.  Erik Turner made a note of the impact:

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

5 hours ago, TheBrownBear said:

I love how Boettger loses his man and just decides to tackle Dion Dawkins instead.

 

Um, I don't think that's what happens.  Look again.  The end zone view shows it more clearly.

Dawkins totes loses his guy Big Time and pursues him.  In the process, he unintentionally "picks" Boettger, which allows Boettger's guy to get off the block

[TheBrownBear]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Um, I don't think that's what happens.  Look again.  The end zone view shows it more clearly.

Dawkins totes loses his guy Big Time and pursues him.  In the process, he unintentionally "picks" Boettger, which allows Boettger's guy to get off the block

You're absolutely right.  Upon zooming in, it's Dawkins who gets burned on that play and his rusher's knee clips Boettger's left leg causing him to bail out and collapse.  It's wild how quickly all of this occurs in real time.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

6 hours ago, TheBrownBear said:

You're absolutely right.  Upon zooming in, it's Dawkins who gets burned on that play and his rusher's knee clips Boettger's left leg causing him to bail out and collapse.  It's wild how quickly all of this occurs in real time.

 

Erik Turner makes that point in the video clip I linked:  "where is Josh looking after the snap?"

[NewEra]

12 hours ago, MJS said:

A lot of times it's a free rusher. Our oline sometimes doubles one guy and completely ignores another guy. It's a lack of communication on the line or just getting confused by stunts.

 

There is a large component of what the oline does that is mental. And I think our oline lacks in that department. Not that I think they are dumber than average, but that I think they are unprepared and not well enough schooled in these things. That's why I think it comes back to the oline coach. Obviously I'm guessing, but it makes sense to me.

I think that’s the biggest problem.

 

if Bobby keeps his job, it could cost McD his

[GoBills808]

13 hours ago, MJS said:

A lot of times it's a free rusher. Our oline sometimes doubles one guy and completely ignores another guy. It's a lack of communication on the line or just getting confused by stunts.

 

There is a large component of what the oline does that is mental. And I think our oline lacks in that department. Not that I think they are dumber than average, but that I think they are unprepared and not well enough schooled in these things. That's why I think it comes back to the oline coach. Obviously I'm guessing, but it makes sense to me.

It’s more lack of physical ability than mental imo. Outside maybe Dawkins and Morse on a good day none of them are complete players due to some combination of lack of size/strength, agility, or technique. And they perform worse as a unit, somehow, than the sum of their mismatched parts. 

[MJS]

4 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

It’s more lack of physical ability than mental imo. Outside maybe Dawkins and Morse on a good day none of them are complete players due to some combination of lack of size/strength, agility, or technique. And they perform worse as a unit, somehow, than the sum of their mismatched parts. 

I think they perform worse as a unit because of coaching and perhaps scheme. They may be asked to do things they aren't good at.

[Lothar]

I saw where we've given up the most pressure in the league. But Josh has only taken 22 sacks. If he was ANYBODY else, the Bills would be ranked near dead last in every protection metric.

 

This is all about the OL and besides Dawkins (at least of late) and Morse (until recently), we're fielding one of the worst lines in the league at the moment.