Ravens sign Justin Houston

[NewEra]

Just now, thurst44 said:

You used stats to attempt to show Addison was better than Houston (there's no other way to read your post) and neglected to put Addison's next to them--maybe you knew they were similar, maybe you didn't. But don't lash out at me when I called you on it.

 

I'd agree that Houston is the better player overall, and definitely so in his prime. At this point in their career, not quite as much. I'm not lobbying for either player on this team (as I said in my post). It's just that we have a tendency to go after whipping boys in a dishonest manner and it gets tiring eventually. Mario was mediocre last year. You're not going to get any argument from me, and I'm fine if they cut him. I don't want Houston at this point in his career either based on cost/benefit. Just don't use bogus "facts" that are easily countered as proof of how much better one player is than the other. 

 

If you want to go by stats from the last 4 years, as you did, well, then the 4 years of Addison before we signed him are close to the same as Houston--Addison had more sacks, Houston more tackles. I did not realize we were going by the measurable "People that know football know..."

Houston is and always has been better than Addison.  Everyone knows this. It’s common knowledge man.  This isn’t even a conversation.  I just so happened to showed recent stats to someone who insinuated that Houston isn’t good anymore because “it wasn’t 2014”. Stats had nothing to do with a comparison between Addison and Houston.  
 

Maybe I should scour the interwebs looking comparisons because Houston and Addison.  Maybe I should subscribe to pff so I can breakdown their advanced stats.   Maybe I should breakdown game tape and edit the video. 
 

Or maybe you should just know that Houston is better than Addison. Always has been.  Always will be. 

 

[John from Riverside]

1 minute ago, NewEra said:

Houston is and always has been better than Addison.  Everyone knows this. It’s common knowledge man.  This isn’t even a conversation.  I just so happened to showed recent stats to someone who insinuated that Houston isn’t good anymore because “it wasn’t 2014”. Stats had nothing to do with a comparison between Addison and Houston.  
 

Maybe I should scour the interwebs looking comparisons because Houston and Addison.  Maybe I should subscribe to pff so I can breakdown their advanced stats.   Maybe I should breakdown game tape and edit the video. 
 

Or maybe you should just know that Houston is better than Addison. Always has been.  Always will be. 

 

I agree that Houston has been better than Addison but the fact of the matter is they’re both old

[NewEra]

2 minutes ago, thurst44 said:

Oh, now I see... you're on a quest against Beane. You're not necessarily wrong about the DL, but maybe we should not completely judge based on the weirdest season in NFL history. I say this as someone who never liked the Butler signing particularly, was meh about Addison (seemed safe and consistent enough) and thought Jefferson was intriguing (he was the one who showed up least on rewatches.

Oh I see, you have no clue what you’re talking about.  
 

I love Beane…..:he made mistakes.  I stated them on a a bills message board.  Madness ensues because people are sensitive 

Just now, John from Riverside said:

I agree that Houston has been better than Addison but the fact of the matter is they’re both old

What does old have to do with 2021 John? Emmanuel sanders is old.  You like that signing?  Oh but…. 

[John from Riverside]

20 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Oh I see, you have no clue what you’re talking about.  
 

I love Beane…..:he made mistakes.  I stated them on a a bills message board.  Madness ensues because people are sensitive 

What does old have to do with 2021 John? Emmanuel sanders is old.  You like that signing?  Oh but…. 

I do like the sander signing and you know what the differences there are several other wide receivers on this team that are more than capable of performing if Sanders doesn’t work out by the way he’s already out with a back injury

[Weatherman]

6 minutes ago, DaBillsFanSince1973 said:

is this the thread where you find heated debates?

 

🍿

This is becoming the arm chair GM thread.  Beane took a bottom 10 team and turned into a top 3 team with a top 3 QB and top 3 WR in 4 years yet I know better than him thread.  

[machine gun kelly]

5 hours ago, dpberr said:

I know it's not true but I feel he's been in the league since the 90s. 

It’s alive, it’s alive…

 

 

Houston is Weird Science.  He has been around forever.  Good for him.  I thought for sure with the Clark thing he’d be back in KC.

 

[Turk71]

1 hour ago, John from Riverside said:

You’re right we should build a team around aging vets who are due to hit the wall any year now rather than injecting life into defense of line using the draft with high draft picks

I never said anything about building with aging vets and I made no mention or advocacy for acquiring Houston. Wtf are you talking about?

  I merely pointed out that assuming two guys who have never played a down in the NFL will be starters for years to come is a ridiculous assumption. Add to that the fact  that neither is considered a talented outside rusher and it's even more ridiculous.

 I'm not against those draft picks. I'm just not assuming they will be successful starters. Even if they do both work out they may not contribute very much this year, which is the very reason you bring in older proven vets on one year deals.

Wtf is so hard to understand about that?

[John from Riverside]

Just now, Turk71 said:

I never said anything about building with aging vets and I made no mention or advocacy for acquiring Houston. Wtf are you talking about?

  I merely pointed out that assuming two guys who have never played a down in the NFL will be starters for years to come is a ridiculous assumption. Add to that the fact  that neither is considered a talented outside rusher and it's even more ridiculous.

 I'm not against those draft picks. I'm just not assuming they will be successful starters. Even if they do both work out they may not contribute very much this year, which is the very reason you bring in older proven vets on one year deals.

Wtf is so hard to understand about that?

I understood what you were saying they’re only so many spots on the team I’m trying to realistically understand how you think this would go here if we brought in that player I think Addison is a cut we just drafted two defensive ends and we have a obada we have Hughes where do you think we are going to be able to sneak that guy in if we take our two draft picks and try to put them to practice squad they’ll get snapped up so quick we won’t know what hit us you’re not being realistic

[NewEra]

30 minutes ago, Weatherman said:

This is becoming the arm chair GM thread.  Beane took a bottom 10 team and turned into a top 3 team with a top 3 QB and top 3 WR in 4 years yet I know better than him thread.  

No, this is the thread where you continue to make yourself look like “that guy”

 

Beane is amazing. I trust that we’ll eventually win a super bowl under him (mostly thanks to drafting 17). Not everyone is going to sit there and say “Beane is a great Gm, every move he makes is 💯 the right move”.  You have a problem with another person having the opinion that something Beane did is a bad move.  Listen to you dude. 

[Weatherman]

Just now, NewEra said:

No, this is the thread where you continue to make yourself look like “that guy”

 

Beane is amazing. I trust that we’ll eventually win a super bowl under him (mostly thanks to drafting 17). Not everyone is going to sit there and say “Beane is a great Gm, every move he makes is 💯 the right move”.  You have a problem with another person having the opinion that something Beane did is a bad move.  Listen to you dude. 

That guy as in someone who likes what our GM has done and doesn’t cry when every free agent I want doesn’t get signed by the Bills?  There’s not a single GM that hasn’t drafted busts and/or signed a perceived premium FAs who ended up being a scrubs.  Get over yourself, you’re not a sports GM for a reason.

[NewEra]

49 minutes ago, Weatherman said:

That guy as in someone who likes what our GM has done and doesn’t cry when every free agent I want doesn’t get signed by the Bills?  There’s not a single GM that hasn’t drafted busts and/or signed a perceived premium FAs who ended up being a scrubs.  Get over yourself, you’re not a sports GM for a reason.

No, that guy that has to attack peoples opinions because it opposes the GM and that guy that acts as if it’s preposterous to think that GM could be wrong about something.  Has he never made a mistake? He has.  And myself and others have stated that they thought he was wrong about some of those moves.  It’s a message board.  This is what people do.  Doesn’t sound like it’s for you

Edited August 1, 2021 by NewEra

[Turk71]

31 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

I understood what you were saying they’re only so many spots on the team I’m trying to realistically understand how you think this would go here if we brought in that player I think Addison is a cut we just drafted two defensive ends and we have a obada we have Hughes where do you think we are going to be able to sneak that guy in if we take our two draft picks and try to put them to practice squad they’ll get snapped up so quick we won’t know what hit us you’re not being realistic

Once again I never advocated for or against bringing in Houston. The only reason I even commented in this thread was in response to this assumption of yours before a single snap in either career:

'we know exactly who our pass rusher's are going to be for the forseeable future......all on cost controlled contracts.'

 It is disingenuous to put words in people's mouths and assume to know their unstated opinions for the sake of argument.

  Have a good day fellow Bills fan.

[John from Riverside]

You are my fellow bills friend and brother and I stand by what I said whenever you take players in the first and second round you were going to give them every opportunity to be foundations of your team their rookies and you’re going to give them chances to grow you’re not gonna cut them unless they fall flat on their face these are our defense of lineman for the foreseeable future on cost control contracts

[Turk71]

20 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

You are my fellow bills friend and brother and I stand by what I said whenever you take players in the first and second round you were going to give them every opportunity to be foundations of your team their rookies and you’re going to give them chances to grow you’re not gonna cut them unless they fall flat on their face these are our defense of lineman for the foreseeable future on cost control contracts

I agree and never said otherwise.

Of course you give your high draft choices every chance to succeed.   I'm just not assuming they will be successful pros or contribute much this year. ✌

[Florida Bills Fanatic]

Houston has had some very good seasons but has slowed down significantly.  His work against the run hasn't been good at all.  His signing looks like a move to add some depth in hopes of getting some rotational work out of him.  I don't picture him being a high snap count player anymore.  Seems like $4 m is a reasonable gamble to take.

[QCity]

That's a very good price, their patience paid off.

[JohnNord]

9 hours ago, NewEra said:

Think whatever you like.  He is an effective pass rusher, smart football player qnd good locker room presence that could’ve helped our young kids. He would’ve led our team in sacks the last 4 years. He’s twice the player Addison is
 

Last 4 years -

9.5 sacks

9.0 sacks

11 sacks

8 sacks

 

 

 

 

It’s an ok signing.  Not the game changer some of you make it out to be.  He didn’t have any impact in the playoff game last season 

[GoBills808]

 

[eball]

18 hours ago, NewEra said:

a year in which its Lombardi or bust

 

You keep repeating this but I guarantee you that’s not how Beane and McD look at it.  Yes, the pieces are in place to be a legitimate Super Bowl team this season, but crazy things happen.  The Bills as an organization are now “playoffs or bust — every year.”  Lots of things need to happen to win a Super Bowl but I’m not wringing my hands over Beane not signing Houston and going with what he’s got instead.  Addison had too many snaps last season and it limited his effectiveness — that’s a fact.  He is also a “great locker room presence for our young guys” and a superb individual.  With less work he is likely to be as productive as Houston.  I love what Beane did for the DL this offseason.  I also think Baltimore is a top 5 organization in the league and this is a good signing for them.

 

[NewEra]

9 hours ago, JohnNord said:

It’s an ok signing.  Not the game changer some of you make it out to be.  He didn’t have any impact in the playoff game last season 

I didn’t say it was a game changing signing……but you can pretend that I did if you prefer.  Used to it

[Don Otreply]

14 hours ago, Weatherman said:

This is becoming the arm chair GM thread.  Beane took a bottom 10 team and turned into a top 3 team with a top 3 QB and top 3 WR in 4 years yet I know better than him thread.  

I know, it’s so entertaining to read the opinions of how The FO has missed the boat on players who evidently don’t want to play in Buffalo, or they would already be here, and folk really appear to think this is the case by the way the write stuff… it’s like watching a soap… 😁👍

[ChronicAndKnuckles]

20 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

Just so glad we addressed this in our draft.....we know exactly who our pass rusher's are going to be for the forseeable future......all on cost controlled contracts.

Would’ve liked to have a guy like Houston as a good insurance policy in case it takes our top 2 picks a little more time to develop. I kind of feel like they’re putting a lot of faith in rookies which is a bit foolish. Correct me if I’m wrong.

[NewEra]

21 minutes ago, eball said:

 

You keep repeating this but I guarantee you that’s not how Beane and McD look at it.  Yes, the pieces are in place to be a legitimate Super Bowl team this season, but crazy things happen.  The Bills as an organization are now “playoffs or bust — every year.”  Lots of things need to happen to win a Super Bowl but I’m not wringing my hands over Beane not signing Houston and going with what he’s got instead.  Addison had too many snaps last season and it limited his effectiveness — that’s a fact.  He is also a “great locker room presence for our young guys” and a superb individual.  With less work he is likely to be as productive as Houston.  I love what Beane did for the DL this offseason.  I also think Baltimore is a top 5 organization in the league and this is a good signing for them.

 

To me, “super bowl or bust” means if we don’t at least make the super bowl, than it wasn’t a successful season.  Maybe a good season with lots of accomplishments.  Individuals may have had great seasons and we may set franchise records.  As a franchise, we failed to reach an attainable goal that was set.   That’s how I see.   

[ChronicAndKnuckles]

4 minutes ago, Don Otreply said:

I know, it’s so entertaining to read the opinions of how The FO has missed the boat on players who evidently don’t want to play in Buffalo, or they would already be here, and folk really appear to think this is the case by the way the write stuff… it’s like watching a soap… 😁👍

Dude only got 4 million to play there. Money talks. If Buffalo offered 5 then he would be here suiting up for training camp right now.

[Don Otreply]

1 minute ago, ChronicAndKnuckles said:

Would’ve liked to have a guy like Houston as a good insurance policy in case it takes our top 2 picks a little more time to develop. I kind of feel like they’re putting a lot of faith in rookies which is a bit foolish. Correct me if I’m wrong.

KC appears to be putting their faith in some rookies on their O line, getting first team reps and all… so it’s not unprecedented to do this, will it work out for either team? We shall see I guess, I think GR & BB are going to shine this season, with the expected ups and downs that rookies generally have, 

12 minutes ago, ChronicAndKnuckles said:

Dude only got 4 million to play there. Money talks. If Buffalo offered 5 then he would be here suiting up for training camp right now.

Not if he doesn’t want to play in Buffalo…, 

[NewEra]

14 minutes ago, Don Otreply said:

I know, it’s so entertaining to read the opinions of how The FO has missed the boat on players who evidently don’t want to play in Buffalo, or they would already be here, and folk really appear to think this is the case by the way the write stuff… it’s like watching a soap… 😁👍

Someone saying that Houston is better than Addison and would’ve been a better acquisition is like watching a soap……interesting.  
 

You’re currently on a specific message board made entirely to discuss Buffalo Bills.  Discussions on said message board often include roster moves and our amazing GM.  An amazing GM that has made mistakes in the past, just like EVERY GM has made in the past.  It’s what we do on this message boards…..discuss all things bills.  The discussions sometimes include an opposite opinion of the amazing GM…….and then the **** hits the fan.   That’s where the soap opera begins my friend.
 

was signing Mario Addison a good acquisition for this franchise?  No.  When we signed him, I was ok with it because I believed in Beane.  But Beane is human and makes mistakes too.  Addison was an awful acquisition.  People not wanting to pay Houston 4M and calling him old were ok with giving Addison 3 years 30M at the same age Houston is now.  Addison is older, lesser and was NEVER as good as Houston.  If you disagree, feel free, but you’re wrong.  
 

 

10 minutes ago, Don Otreply said:

 

Not if he doesn’t want to play in Buffalo…, 

Objection.  Speculation.  Objection granted.

[ChronicAndKnuckles]

20 minutes ago, Don Otreply said:

KC appears to be putting their faith in some rookies on their O line, getting first team reps and all… so it’s not unprecedented to do this, will it work out for either team? We shall see I guess, I think GR & BB are going to shine this season, with the expected ups and downs that rookies generally have, 

Not if he doesn’t want to play in Buffalo…, 

I feel like DE has more bust potential than O-line excluding LT. You can plug and play a G, C, or T and get average play for the most part unless your scraping the absolute bottom of the barrel for guys. Especially w/ someone like Allen or even Mahomes who both have great pocket maneuverability and scrambling. With a guy like Stafford, I would trust a rookie lineman a little less.

 

Defensive end/3-4 OLB is a different animal. I feel like guys bust a lot more frequently at that position. Putting all yours eggs in a rookie pass rusher basket seems risky even when they double down in the 2nd round. As you say, we shall see… 

 

P.S. I can guarantee w/ almost 100% certainty that Houston has a price.

Edited August 1, 2021 by ChronicAndKnuckles

[Don Otreply]

41 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Someone saying that Houston is better than Addison and would’ve been a better acquisition is like watching a soap……interesting.  
 

You’re currently on a specific message board made entirely to discuss Buffalo Bills.  Discussions on said message board often include roster moves and our amazing GM.  An amazing GM that has made mistakes in the past, just like EVERY GM has made in the past.  It’s what we do on this message boards…..discuss all things bills.  The discussions sometimes include an opposite opinion of the amazing GM…….and then the **** hits the fan.   That’s where the soap opera begins my friend.
 

was signing Mario Addison a good acquisition for this franchise?  No.  When we signed him, I was ok with it because I believed in Beane.  But Beane is human and makes mistakes too.  Addison was an awful acquisition.  People not wanting to pay Houston 4M and calling him old were ok with giving Addison 3 years 30M at the same age Houston is now.  Addison is older, lesser and was NEVER as good as Houston.  If you disagree, feel free, but you’re wrong.  
 

 

Objection.  Speculation.  Objection granted.

It’s the adamant verbiage, and the unwavering notion that a poster (you in this particular case) could never be wrong and not have considered the multitude of other reasons surrounding why a given player did not sign with the Bills, and yes it’s very entertaining, very soap ish,  It certainly would be nice to always sign the best available player at a given moment, but as we all know there are reasons why players choose one of the other thirty one teams to play for, being obstinate in ones views, well…, we’ll just leave that, as it were, nuthin but luv, 😁👍 

 

Go Bills!!!

[NewEra]

Just now, Don Otreply said:

It’s the adamant verbiage, and the unwavering notion that a poster (you in this particular case) could never be wrong and not have considered the multitude of other reasons surrounding why a given player did not sign with the Bills, and yes it’s very entertaining, very soap ish,  It certainly would be nice to always sign the best available player at a given moment, but as we all know there are reasons why players choose one of the other thirty one teams to play for, being obstinate in ones views, well…, we’ll just leave that, as it were, nuthin but luv, 😁👍 

 

Go Bills!!!

I am wrong all the time.  It’s my opinion that Justin Houston would’ve been better for this team than Mario Addison.  It’s a fact that Justin Houston is and has always been a better player than Mario Addison.  There is no debate in that regard.  
 

regarding whether or not he would’ve signed here if we offered him enough $, I have no clue either way.  Either do you.  We’re one of a handful of super bowl contenders.  The guys spent his career in KC, Indy and signed with Baltimore.  Weather certainly doesn’t matter to him.  Signs point towards him signing with us if we offered him.  But you’re right….we don’t “know” for sure, so we shouldn’t even talk about it.  My bad.  But I’m glad that you’re entertained.  That’s why message boards exist

[Don Otreply]

3 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

How do you know he doesn’t want to play in Buffalo?

 

The guy signed in Baltimore, why wouldn’t he play in Buffalo?

Oh I forgot that all NFL players are falling all over each other for the chance to play only for Buffalo, how silly of me to think otherwise…  they would never have a reason that would sway that decision…, 

 

and you answered your own question, in theory he had a choice, he signed with Baltimore… maybe the guy likes the area, maybe McDermott and Beane think he’s a tool and want no part of him, who the F knows 😂😁😆 but he didn’t sign with Buffalo…  

 

Go Bills!!!

 

 

[aceman_16]

On 7/31/2021 at 1:44 PM, Ethan in Portland said:

Didn't like most of the moves last year including Epenesa pick. But having him drop weight and then adding two young pass rushers should be a big improvement. 

I think Espinosa ADDED weight not dropped it.

[TheBeaneBandit]

The Houston signing makes me wonder if the rookie from PennSt is struggling. Either that or Houston is a nice mentor/ transitional piece. Either way good move for Baltimore.

[BarleyNY]

24 minutes ago, TheBeaneBandit said:

The Houston signing makes me wonder if the rookie from PennSt is struggling. Either that or Houston is a nice mentor/ transitional piece. Either way good move for Baltimore.

Oweh is raw.  Pairing him with a short term vet like Houston is the right move.  He can back him up and learn from him while he earns his reps.  The Ravens were very thin there as well so it’s not like they didn’t need another body anyway. 

[Ethan in Cleveland]

1 hour ago, aceman_16 said:

I think Espinosa ADDED weight not dropped it.

Not sure what you have been reading, but It's been very well documented that Beane and McD asked him to lose weight last year.  which he did.  

38 minutes ago, TheBeaneBandit said:

The Houston signing makes me wonder if the rookie from PennSt is struggling. Either that or Houston is a nice mentor/ transitional piece. Either way good move for Baltimore.

Baltimore has always liked having experience on defense mixed with some youth.  

[Weatherman]

5 hours ago, NewEra said:

I am wrong all the time.  It’s my opinion that Justin Houston would’ve been better for this team than Mario Addison.  It’s a fact that Justin Houston is and has always been a better player than Mario Addison.  There is no debate in that regard.  
 

regarding whether or not he would’ve signed here if we offered him enough $, I have no clue either way.  Either do you.  We’re one of a handful of super bowl contenders.  The guys spent his career in KC, Indy and signed with Baltimore.  Weather certainly doesn’t matter to him.  Signs point towards him signing with us if we offered him.  But you’re right….we don’t “know” for sure, so we shouldn’t even talk about it.  My bad.  But I’m glad that you’re entertained.  That’s why message boards exist

How can you say you trust Beane and than proceed to cry about every FA he signs/doesn’t sign?

 

I understand this is a place to discuss Bills football, but you come across as very arrogant and juvenile.  It’s like you are 5 and papa Brandon told you “no” to a toy you wanted.  

Edited August 1, 2021 by Weatherman

[BarleyNY]

1 hour ago, Ethan in Portland said:

Not sure what you have been reading, but It's been very well documented that Beane and McD asked him to lose weight last year.  which he did.  

Epenesa was asked to lose weight, but it wound up that it was too much so they had him add some back during the season.  I think that is probably the point of confusion. 

Edited August 1, 2021 by BarleyNY

[NewEra]

30 minutes ago, Weatherman said:

How can you say you trust Beane and than proceed to cry about every FA he signs/doesn’t sign?

 

I understand this is a place to discuss Bills football, but you come across as very arrogant and juvenile.  It’s like you are 5 and papa Brandon told you “no” to a toy you wanted.  

This will be my last reply to you, then you will go on ignore.  You’ve already taken up more of my time that you deserve.  Of you actually came to the plate with something of worth, it may be different, yet all you do is attack in one or two sentences of ridicule with zero substance.  The ignore is based on your lies and the fact that you continue to exaggerate and make things up. 
 
I don’t cry about “every FA he signs and doesn’t sign”. Many here can attest to this nonsense that you spew.   I think Beane has done a great job.  I wouldn’t trade he or McD for any GM or coach in the league.   I wouldn’t trade Allen for Mahomes.  Yet, I’m not so much of a homer that I can state when “I THINK” he made a mistake and can share it on a bills message board knowing that the homer cavalry will attack me for saying Beane might have made a mistake.  GMs never make mistakes right?  Wrong.  But some think that it’s sacrilegious to talk about it on a fan site. 

 

You call me juvenile, yet you personally attack me in each of your replies.  Keep on keeping on my man.  Good bye.  

 

[Chicken Boo]

On 7/31/2021 at 2:48 PM, SWATeam said:

Addison has more sacks over the last 5 years than Houston, just saying.

 

I mean, Houston was injured in 2016 and only played 5 games. 

 

Houston had 9.5 sacks last season to Addison's 5.  Let's hope Mario returns to his Carolina form.

Edited August 1, 2021 by Chicken Boo

[SWATeam]

15 minutes ago, Chicken Boo said:

 

I mean, Houston was injured in 2016 and only played 5 games. 

 

Houston had 9.5 sacks last season to Addison's 5.  Let's hope Mario returns to his Carolina form.

No doubt Mario had a down year.

[GunnerBill]

3 minutes ago, SWATeam said:

No doubt Mario had a down year.

 

His 2019 year in Carolina was a classic case of the numbers overstating his performance. I said this 12 months ago and as @NewEra has been here was roundly dismisses. Too many people here don't watch the film or know what they are watching. Addison was a player on the downslope in 2019 who posted unusual sack production given his pass rush effectiveness. That was not sustainable and 2020 went as I expected.