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Wizard

Revisiting Clowney & a Look at Logan Ryan

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 Clowney 'could' be a blue chip edge rusher. I don't feel like he's really developed and improved since he entered the league. He was second fiddle to Watt in Texas and Seattle wasn't a fit either. I would like to see him as a 4-3 DE under a really good defensive coach and DC. He would be an intriguing fit at Buffalo but my big issue with him is that he seems to have convinced himself that hes already a premier DE which he isn't. Myles Garrett got paid and the first thing he said is it's time to REALLY prove it. That man has drive. He knows he can be better than he's shown. Clowney just wants to be paid and that is why many fans don't want him. He will go somewhere like the jets and be misused again with occasional flashy games .

 

 I think Logan Ryan is really good. But slot corner is a position which the Bills cover adequately without spending. Second outside corner is much more desirable especially if you don't believe in Norman. So both of these guys are arguably unnecessary upgrades. 

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I would love Logan Ryan. He's such a clutch player. I'm really shocked that's he wasn't one of the first free agents gone. I'm sure GM's know something we don't, but I'd really liek to know what it is.

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13 hours ago, Wizard said:

If Clowney and Logan Ryan could be picked up for say $20-$25 million for this year on one-year deals, would you want Beane to make that offer? (Say Clowney at 13-14 mil and Ryan at 7-8 mil).

 

Clowney would be no worse than a #2 DE. Logan Ryan would be a for sure #2 as he is better than all CB's minus Tre. Essentially, it is a more expensive but low-risk one-year tryout for two guys who would make the defense even stronger for a team that needs its QB to be a top 15-20 QB.

 

Last year, the 49er's made a Superbowl with a 15-25 level QB and a top 5 defense.

 

Hughes, Clowney, Oliver, Star, Edmunds, Milano, Klein, White, Ryan, Poyer, Hyde, and depth on Defense coupled with a weakened AFC East sounds like a reasonable chance to make the 2nd round.

 

***Clowney and Ryan or guys they replace become possible draft picks by flipping them too other teams, especially as teams lose depth to COVID opt-outs.

 

 Worst case scenario is we get two guys that add depth. Best case, we make a stronger run with these two or we turn these two into 2021 picks that are cheap but valuable assets that go nicely with our salary cap for when we pay people like White, Edmunds, Dawkins, or Milano.

 

 

 

 

 

Do the Bills have 25 million in cap space?

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14 hours ago, Wizard said:

If Clowney and Logan Ryan could be picked up for say $20-$25 million for this year on one-year deals, would you want Beane to make that offer? (Say Clowney at 13-14 mil and Ryan at 7-8 mil).

 

Clowney would be no worse than a #2 DE. Logan Ryan would be a for sure #2 as he is better than all CB's minus Tre. Essentially, it is a more expensive but low-risk one-year tryout for two guys who would make the defense even stronger for a team that needs its QB to be a top 15-20 QB.

 

Last year, the 49er's made a Superbowl with a 15-25 level QB and a top 5 defense.

 

Hughes, Clowney, Oliver, Star, Edmunds, Milano, Klein, White, Ryan, Poyer, Hyde, and depth on Defense coupled with a weakened AFC East sounds like a reasonable chance to make the 2nd round.

 

***Clowney and Ryan or guys they replace become possible draft picks by flipping them too other teams, especially as teams lose depth to COVID opt-outs.

 

 Worst case scenario is we get two guys that add depth. Best case, we make a stronger run with these two or we turn these two into 2021 picks that are cheap but valuable assets that go nicely with our salary cap for when we pay people like White, Edmunds, Dawkins, or Milano.

 

 

 

Meh... Take Stars money and the money you'd spend on Clowney and trade for either of the Bosas, or Watts... Preferably TJ now that he is younger than JJ and less injury history (even though it would give me plenty of work to do to JJ:wub:)

Kerrigan is another great option but on the older side as well.

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I'd be more than interested in either one of them. It's worth noting, though, that a real problem with signing even star players this season, (especially on defense, IMO) is how the restricted training protocols, and the diminished preseason will affect the players, and coaches ability to get them into the system. Clowney would make the most sense, IMO, considering the heavy rotation on the D-line. But, continuity is a real asset this season from which the Bills will benefit. I'd be pretty shocked if they cut Murphy, honestly.

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10 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

I'd sign Clowney tomorrow for $12m. He was 5th in the NFL in pass rush win percentage last year and he was disruptive on a lot of plays. He actually had a bit of the 2018 Jerry Hughes problem which was finishing those plays with sacks. But he had a much better season in Seattle than the narrative suggests. Not sure why he is still unsigned other than him originally wanting a huge pay day and to play for a competitor but he is going to end up a bargain pick up for someone at this stage.

 

I think Clowney's sack total is misleading as I do think he had a good season last year being a very disruptive player and a one year deal would be good for a mercenary like Clowney to keep his motivation. However I think that given the volatile nature of this season and possibly next season it would be best for the Bills to make any trades or big cap guzzling acquisitions in season. Players are going to miss games due to Covid and injuries happen in any season. 

 

I wouldn't hate a Clowney acquisition on a one year deal, however I would prefer the team keep its flexibility in season. Although if there is one more free agent out there that the team likes to go after I would almost rather Logan Ryan as I am not too confident in the CB2 options esp if Norman doesn't pan out (Levi Wallace is an OK fall back but Gaines is always hurt and Norman is shaky.) 

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5 hours ago, Doc said:

 

He's not getting anywhere close to a 1-year $17M deal.  I could agree with $12M like GB suggested.

He played for 15 million last year.  Seahawks were/are trying to sign him around that range.  Rumors are that the Browns are offering in the 18 million dollar range.  He was seeking around 21 million at the start of free agency.  It would take at least 17 million to get him to come to Buffalo with maybe some incentives built in.

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Now is definitely the time to save money for next year. When the cap drops next year there is going to be a historic buying opportunity as cap strapped teams can't compete for free agents.

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Yes to Ryan, absolutely not on Clowney. Massive injury risk, still more hype than production, plays a position we have great depth/talent at, and would cost way too much money. 

 

Upgrading our #2 CB position on the other hand is a smart move. That's the weak link in our defense at the moment (barring a huge comeback from Norman), still wishing we would have signed Chris Harris Jr. to be honest. 

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26 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

He played for 15 million last year.  Seahawks were/are trying to sign him around that range.  Rumors are that the Browns are offering in the 18 million dollar range.  He was seeking around 21 million at the start of free agency.  It would take at least 17 million to get him to come to Buffalo with maybe some incentives built in.

 

I thought I heard much lower.  More power to him.

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1 hour ago, Steve Billieve said:

Now is definitely the time to save money for next year. When the cap drops next year there is going to be a historic buying opportunity as cap strapped teams can't compete for free agents.

 

Or save the money for in season as this is going to be a season where depth and flexibility matter most. 

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1 minute ago, billsfan89 said:

 

Or save the money for in season as this is going to be a season where depth and flexibility matter most. 

 

Next year there will be an opportunity for teams with money to lock in  players for years on friendly deals. Next year free agents just aren't going to get paid like they used to. Sure, some will opt for 1 year deals, but plenty will want to be signed long term anyways.

It will be the equivalent of having the entire free agency pool under threat of tag.

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Just now, Steve Billieve said:

 

Next year there will be an opportunity for teams with money to lock in  players for years on friendly deals. Next year free agents just aren't going to get paid like they used to. Sure, some will opt for 1 year deals, but plenty will want to be signed long term anyways.

It will be the equivalent of having the entire free agency pool under threat of tag.

 

Yes but if the Bills are making a run at the playoffs and they suffer a Covid Infection or an injury and there is someone out on the market that might help replace them decently I wouldn't be opposed to using some money to sign that veteran talent. I agree try and save it as roll over but also have it as a tool at your disposal for this season as well. 

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2 hours ago, Dont Stop Billeiving said:

Yes to Ryan, absolutely not on Clowney. Massive injury risk, still more hype than production, plays a position we have great depth/talent at, and would cost way too much money. 

 

Upgrading our #2 CB position on the other hand is a smart move. That's the weak link in our defense at the moment (barring a huge comeback from Norman), still wishing we would have signed Chris Harris Jr. to be honest. 

Wallace is not a weak link. Between the three of them it is actually a strong position.

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17 hours ago, BruceVilanch said:

I think Clowney is effective at setting the edge and has some impact plays from time to time, but I think he is vastly overrated (especially by himself) and I think he is still living off that hit he laid on that michigan RB.

It was a thing of beauty

 

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4 hours ago, billsfan89 said:

 

Yes but if the Bills are making a run at the playoffs and they suffer a Covid Infection or an injury and there is someone out on the market that might help replace them decently I wouldn't be opposed to using some money to sign that veteran talent. I agree try and save it as roll over but also have it as a tool at your disposal for this season as well. 

Money is a much better strategic asset than a tactical one. You can't use it to fix problems easily, but you can use it to build value overtime.

I would much rather add a key piece over the next 4 years next offseason, than hope some free agent might be that additional boost (they rarely are).

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4 hours ago, H2o said:

It was a thing of beauty

 

.....it's gorgeous. That sound, and the QB turning around thinking "There's no way my RB already got lit up, I just handed him the ball...OH F***"

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Why is Logan Ryan always sitting out there late into the fire agency period and then only getting prove it deals ? The players put him in the top 70 players in the NFL 100, he has playoff experience and seems to make plays. Why wouldn’t a team want to drop 7-9mil on a guaranteed top flight CB? What is his knock? 

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7 minutes ago, Locomark said:

Why is Logan Ryan always sitting out there late into the fire agency period and then only getting prove it deals ? The players put him in the top 70 players in the NFL 100, he has playoff experience and seems to make plays. Why wouldn’t a team want to drop 7-9mil on a guaranteed top flight CB? What is his knock? 

 

He's overpricing himself.  Like Clowney.

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