Is Josh ‘too Favre’ like? (Athletic pay wall)

[TroutDog]

From The Athletic: https://theathletic.com/1268090/2019/10/04/youre-beating-a-dead-horse-the-secret-to-coaching-a-young-gunslinger-like-josh-allen/

 

Quote:

 

“Favre certainly had an interesting idea of fun.

“He just wanted to get a little bit of payback on all these defensive guys and that was part of his DNA, Mariucci said. “It was a gradual learning curve for him. His mentality and every fiber in his body was to compete and play football like the other guys, not like a quarterback. He was very unlike a quarterback with his mentality. So he would fight with Warren Sapp or he would say to guys, ‘Is that all you’ve got?! Is that your best hit?!’ Are you kidding me?!’ Then his linemen would tell him, ‘Shut up, Brett! I have to block that guy. Don’t piss him off!’

“He was just a tough guy. He was a linebacker playing quarterback in some regards. But he loved to play the game. And it wasn’t just about passing the ball. He loved to block, tackle, hit, talk trash, just mix it up like everybody else out there.”

In other words, he was out of his mind.

“Yeah, he was nuts,” Mariucci said.

Allen is a little nuts himself. The question is whether he’s the right amount of nuts or whether that screw-loose mentality will be detrimental to his body and his development.

“They need him healthy because, when he’s healthy, he’s a pretty darn good athlete,” Mariucci said. “He’ll learn from these mistakes because he’s a smart kid … he’s very coachable. He’ll learn to pick his spots.”

 

They also talk about asking the QB after and INT, “What did you see?” and show them how it differed from what was really there. 

 

Lastly, it IS coachable to switch this mentality. 

Edited October 4, 2019 by TroutDog

[The Dean]

Make 150 more irrlevant Josh Allen threads. Can't have too many, I always say. 

 

But would Josh being like Favre be a BAD thing (as long as he doesn't send dick pics to random women, that is)?

Edited October 4, 2019 by The Dean

[TroutDog]

7 minutes ago, The Dean said:

Make 150 more irrlevant Josh Allen threads. Can't have too many, I always say. 

 

But would Josh being like Favre be a BAD thing (as long as he doesn't send dick pics to random women, that is)?

I guess you’re right but this was based on a specific article. My bad if I should have tacked it on somewhere else. 

 

Would Josh being Favre like be a bad thing? Yes and no...as it was with Favre. The question is: how long are we, as fans, and the coaches willing to wait?

 

Me? I love the kid and his tenacity. I am willing to wait. 

Edited October 4, 2019 by TroutDog

[Hapless Bills Fan]

12 minutes ago, The Dean said:

Make 150 more irrlevant Josh Allen threads. Can't have too many, I always say. 

 

But would Josh being like Favre be a BAD thing (as long as he doesn't send dick pics to random women, that is)?

 

The thread is really about a rather good Fairburn article just published in the Athletic based on an interview with Steve Marriucci about what it was like to coach a young Brett Favre and the parallels between that and what he sees with Allen. 

 

It's highly relevant and new content.  Very good read.  For those without the Athletic subscription, a few tidbits.

 

Most constructive advice to Daboll and Dorsey, focused on the difference between a QB who thinks he can get away with throws that he can't, vs one who isn't processing:

 

It’s not always easy to tell the difference between a young quarterback learning what he can get away with and one who just isn’t processing what he’s seeing.

That’s why, with every play Favre would make, good or bad, Mariucci had one question when he got back to the sideline: What did you see? What a position coach sees from the booth or the sideline is different than what the quarterback sees down in the line of fire.

“I want him to verbalize to me what he sees from the pocket,” Mariucci said. “I want him to explain to me, ‘I saw the safety was off about five yards and I saw the corner over there and I thought for sure I could get it in there.’ Those kinds of things. Peyton Manning went through it his first year. He threw a lot of interceptions his rookie year and he learned eventually that ‘I can’t get it in there because these guys are faster than what I played against in college. These windows have to be a little bit bigger and wider to get some throws in there than I’ve done before.’ They learn it unless they’re bullheaded and unless they’re not very smart.”

 

Funniest anecdote:

 

In his second season in Green Bay, Favre led the NFL with 24 interceptions. Late in that 1993 season, the Packers went to Detroit for the season finale. Lions fans had a sign in the crowd that was a “Pick-O-Meter.” They would move it each time Favre threw an interception. The Pick-O-Meter got plenty of action as Favre threw four passes to the wrong team in a loss.

The next week, the Packers were back in Detroit for a wild card game. The fans were unrelenting. Favre threw three touchdowns, including a game-winner, and just one interception.

 

Hopefully Josh is getting good coaching and he will "get it" eventually.

 

7 minutes ago, TroutDog said:

I guess you’re right but this was based on a specific article. My bad if I should have tacked it on somewhere else. 

 

Would Josh being Favre like be a bad thing? Yes and no...as it was with Favre. The question is: how long are we, as fans, and the coaches willing to wait?

 

Me? I love the kid and his tenacity. I am willing to wait. 

 

You're good.  It's novel material and an interesting perspective.

 

I pruned a bunch of posts based on your original title to see if we can take the thread down a path more relevant to the  new content.  My apologies to the pruned; nothing wrong with your post, just trying to give this thread a chance to explore the new material.

[Bangarang]

He’s Favre in the sense that he takes risks and throws a lot of interceptions.

[TroutDog]

5 minutes ago, Bangarang said:

He’s Favre in the sense that he takes risks and throws a lot of interceptions.

Favre also threw a bunch of TD’s and had a bunch of W’s. Are we willing to live with the INT’s or do we hope it’s ‘coached’ out of him?

 

I love Josh’s desire to win. His willingness to put it all on the line. It’s who he is. 

 

The real question is: can he survive in this league if he doesn’t change?

 

I believe we want it coached out of him just a touch. I want him to be our standard bearer for a long time...but he has to play another day to do so. 

Edited October 4, 2019 by TroutDog

[Hapless Bills Fan]

4 minutes ago, TroutDog said:

Favre also threw a bunch of TD’s and had a bunch of W’s. Are we willing to live with the INT’s or do we hope it’s ‘coached’ out of him?

 

I love Josh’s desire to win. His willingness to put it all on the line. It’s who he is. 

 

The real question is: can he survive in this league if he doesn’t change?

 

I believe we want it coached out of him just a touch. I want him to be our standard bearer for a long time...but he has to play another day to do so. 

 

The real key as I see it is the answer to the question "what did you see?".  Is he not processing the field, or does he see it and just believe he's got such a rifle that he can fit a throw into tighter windows than he actually can, in the NFL.  If he can't process the field, he can't last.  If he's seeing it, but just struggling to get it through his head which throws he can't make, that's probably correctable.

[Bangarang]

1 minute ago, TroutDog said:

Favre also threw a bunch of TD’s and had a bunch of W’s. Are we willing to live with the INT’s or do we hope it’s ‘coached’ out of him?

 

I love Josh’s desire to win. His willingness to put it all on the line. It’s who he is. 
 

 

I have always said that I’m willing to live with the risks and INTs if it also means Allen throws a lot of TDs and we score a bunch of points. 
 

1 minute ago, TroutDog said:

 

The real question is: can he survive in this league if he doesn’t change?

 

I believe we want it coached out of him just a touch. I want him to be our standard bearer for a long time...but he has to play another day to do so. 

He needs to be smarter whether it’s running or throwing. 

[billsfan89]

The same people on this board that were calling Trent Captain Check Down, EJ Captain Checkdown 2.0, and said Tyrod would never win because he is too conservative are now saying that Josh is too reckless and needs to be more conservative. 

 

That's me being hyperbolic but in all honesty people want a QB that is for lack of a better term "good." You want a QB that can move the ball downfield but also not turn the ball over. Those two things tend to be at odds with one another as the more you go downfield the more you risk turnovers. The less you go downfield the less likely you are to turn the ball over but the harder it is to move the ball against better defenses. A QB that can do both is rare. That's why finding a QB in the NFL is hard. 

 

Coming out of college I viewed Josh as a bad fit for this team because I thought he was a developmental QB. A player that would have been best served 1-2 years on the bench to work on his footwork and learn an offense. So that once when he got thrown into action he would be as best prepared. 

 

But Josh has honestly surprised me with how much his footwork has improved. But he has some bad habits and decision making tendencies that are hurting him. In the end I would rather see Josh start any game he is healthy enough to start and get a full evaluation of him going into 2020. I don't think his habits can be significantly improved in a practice so I think his improvement is going to come simply with experience.

 

I also don't buy this idea that Barkley offers this team a better chance of winning than Josh. I think as a mental and physical reset you play Barkley for the Titans game and then get Josh back out there after the bye. 

Edited October 4, 2019 by billsfan89

[HOUSE]

I almost subscribed to the Athletic than common sense  kicked in

[billsfan1959]

58 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

The real key as I see it is the answer to the question "what did you see?".  Is he not processing the field, or does he see it and just believe he's got such a rifle that he can fit a throw into tighter windows than he actually can, in the NFL.  If he can't process the field, he can't last.  If he's seeing it, but just struggling to get it through his head which throws he can't make, that's probably correctable.

Absolutely. I believe it is the latter and not the former. I think he is bright and understands what he is seeing; however, his confidence and competiveness lead him to err on the side of desire to make the play than on the side of caution. It is instinctive for him and will take time to temper - and it will never be completely coached out of him, nor should it be. It is who he is and I think that mentality will lead to a lot of success and a lot of wins in the future. He is just going to have to learn that there are times when it is best to err on the side of caution. 

 

I like these quotes from Mariucci:

 

“The gunslinger-type quarterback, which Josh is, which Brett was … they’re less apt to check it down or throw it away or work through their progression,” Mariucci said. “Because why? They’re confident in their arm. They’ve made that play before and ‘I’m going to do it again and again,’ and sometimes it bites them in the butt. So I think he’s in that mode. Brett Favre was like that. Gosh it was hard to get him out of that overconfident-type mentality..." 

 

"What follows is a quarterback who plays without fear. No window is too tight. No play is dead until he says so."

 

“Some of that mentality made those spectacular plays. You can’t coach that out of them otherwise he becomes milquetoast and he never makes a great play. There’s a fine line there where he has to tone it down sometimes and do the right thing, the smart thing, the conservative thing.”

 

27 minutes ago, HOUSE said:

I almost subscribed to the Athletic than common sense  kicked in

The Athletic consistently has a lot of very good articles. Worth the subscription, IMO

Edited October 5, 2019 by billsfan1959

[Hapless Bills Fan]

4 minutes ago, HOUSE said:

I almost subscribed to the Athletic than common sense  kicked in

 

I think you can get a trial or a deal or something.  They tick me off by offering great deals to new subscribers while ratcheting up the price for persistent supporters, but they have enough good material (and I'm too lazy to create new accounts) so I go with it.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

46 minutes ago, billsfan89 said:

The same people on this board that were calling Trent Captain Check Down, EJ Captain Checkdown 2.0, and said Tyrod would never win because he is too conservative are now saying that Josh is too reckless and needs to be more conservative. 

 

That's me being hyperbolic but in all honesty people want a QB that is for lack of a better term "good." You want a QB that can move the ball downfield but also not turn the ball over. Those two things tend to be at odds with one another as the more you go downfield the more you risk turnovers. The less you go downfield the less likely you are to turn the ball over but the harder it is to move the ball against better defenses. A QB that can do both is rare. That's why finding a QB in the NFL is hard. 

 

Coming out of college I viewed Josh as a bad fit for this team because I thought he was a developmental QB. A player that would have been best served 1-2 years on the bench to work on his footwork and learn an offense. So that once when he got thrown into action he would be as best prepared. 

 

But Josh has honestly surprised me with how much his footwork has improved. But he has some bad habits and decision making tendencies that are hurting him. In the end I would rather see Josh start any game he is healthy enough to start and get a full evaluation of him going into 2020. I don't think his habits can be significantly improved in a practice so I think his improvement is going to come simply with experience.

 

I also don't buy this idea that Barkley offers this team a better chance of winning than Josh. I think as a mental and physical reset you play Barkley for the Titans game and then get Josh back out there after the bye. 

 

Oh, yeah to the bolded.  People forget, too, that some of the best QB now in the league or recently retired did not come into the league as the players they became.  During Peyton Manning's first year, 1998, when he threw 28 INTs, I don't imagine any fan boards that existed then were exactly predicting his career trajectory.  He wasn't exactly averaging 300 ypg then either - 234 ypg to be exact.

 

I also agree Josh was a developmental QB coming out, but in retrospect I wonder to what extent McBeane really planned to play him sooner rather than later and didn't want a serious competition with a vet to get in the way.

 

If Josh is healthy for the Titans game, though, you play him.

 

 

[billsfan89]

18 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Oh, yeah to the bolded.  People forget, too, that some of the best QB now in the league or recently retired did not come into the league as the players they became.  During Peyton Manning's first year, 1998, when he threw 28 INTs, I don't imagine any fan boards that existed then were exactly predicting his career trajectory.  He wasn't exactly averaging 300 ypg then either - 234 ypg to be exact.

 

I also agree Josh was a developmental QB coming out, but in retrospect I wonder to what extent McBeane really planned to play him sooner rather than later and didn't want a serious competition with a vet to get in the way.

 

If Josh is healthy for the Titans game, though, you play him.

 

 

 

My view is that no one should play 7 days after suffering a concussion. I know that there are people much more qualified than me in regards to assessing a players health but from what I know about concussions time is the best method of treatment and I think it should be mandatory to be pulled from your next game (unless your team has a bye week after you get hurt.) It seems like a very basic safety procedure. 

[TroutDog]

11 minutes ago, billsfan89 said:

 

My view is that no one should play 7 days after suffering a concussion. I know that there are people much more qualified than me in regards to assessing a players health but from what I know about concussions time is the best method of treatment and I think it should be mandatory to be pulled from your next game (unless your team has a bye week after you get hurt.) It seems like a very basic safety procedure. 

Not sure if I understand this. The doctor that is saying that Josh is OK is independent. Completely in associates from the team and the and the NFL. 

 

I’ve been concusses a number of times in both football and my service. The five step process they have makes perfect sense and, if he’s good, he’s good. It is literally based on what he was like prior to being concussed. 

[billsfan89]

Just now, TroutDog said:

Not sure if I understand this. The doctor that is saying that Josh is OK is independent. Completely in associates from the team and the and the NFL. 

 

I’ve been concusses a number of times in both football and my service. The five step process they have makes perfect sense and, if he’s good, he’s good. It is literally based on what he was like prior to being concussed. 

 

I get that there is a process in place and that it is based off of independent doctors. But when it comes to head injuries (and the nature that brain damage is almost always irreversible to some extent) I think there should be an extra level of caution via mandating not playing in short order after a confirmed concussion. It is just my personal unscientific opinion. 

[TroutDog]

1 hour ago, billsfan1959 said:

Absolutely. I believe it is the latter and not the former. I think he is bright and understands what he is seeing; however, his confidence and competiveness lead him to err on the side of desire to make the play than on the side of caution. It is instinctive for him and will take time to temper - and it will never be completely coached out of him, nor should it be. 

Yup! This is the trick: he needs to continually feel that desire while simultaneously tempering it. Easy? Nope. Possible? Yup. 

 

Josh has every single intangible that you would ever want...plus a MONSTER arm. He is our QB of the future and I truly hope he see’s his long term potential before he gets it knocked out of him. 

1 minute ago, billsfan89 said:

 

I get that there is a process in place and that it is based off of independent doctors. But when it comes to head injuries (and the nature that brain damage is almost always irreversible to some extent) I think there should be an extra level of caution via mandating not playing in short order after a confirmed concussion. It is just my personal unscientific opinion. 

I completely understand this but the protocol is based on neuroscience. Being a disabled vet who has gone through multiple neurosurgeries from a number of neurosurgeons, I trust those guys. Their heads are screwed on right. ? 

[billsfan89]

3 minutes ago, TroutDog said:

Yup! This is the trick: he needs to continually feel that desire while simultaneously tempering it. Easy? Nope. Possible? Yup. 

 

Josh has every single intangible that you would ever want...plus a MONSTER arm. He is our QB of the future and I truly hope he see’s his long term potential before he gets it knocked out of him. 

 

I completely understand this but the protocol is based on neuroscience. Being a disabled vet who has gone through multiple neurosurgeries from a number of neurosurgeons, I trust those guys. Their heads are screwed on right. ? 

 

The protocol is based on science I get that, but I just think that if player safety is the goal then there should be a mandatory sit out period as an extra level of caution. Is it necessary? Probably not, but when it comes to the brain better safe than sorry. 

[TroutDog]

2 minutes ago, billsfan89 said:

 

The protocol is based on science I get that, but I just think that if player safety is the goal then there should be a mandatory sit out period as an extra level of caution. Is it necessary? Probably not, but when it comes to the brain better safe than sorry. 

It’s a business and an insanely profitable one at that. Simple as that, really. That trumps science for this for the NFL, in my opinion. 

 

Yes, the NFL ‘cares’ but they really want the most exciting players on the field and Josh is one. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

5 minutes ago, billsfan89 said:

 

The protocol is based on science I get that, but I just think that if player safety is the goal then there should be a mandatory sit out period as an extra level of caution. Is it necessary? Probably not, but when it comes to the brain better safe than sorry. 

 

The problem with the idea of a mandatory sit-out period is that concussions are really variable.  Something that doesn't look like much can give a guy a concussion where symptoms persist for months.  Something that looks major can resolve in a few days.  So if you make the sit-out period long enough to fit the persistent case, you're depriving a guy who heals quickly of valuable development and career exposure (and the team of his services).  If you make it short enough not to be too big a deal, it's useless in the persistent case.

 

That's why what they came up with, individualized baseline testing and neurological evaluation/repeat testing, makes much more sense.

 

The place where the NFL does not show it cares IMO is in imposing consistent penalties for helmet to helmet contact.

[twist_to_open]

Why is it everytime we play the Pats* we come away deflated (pun intended) and full of self doubt? We're fine, our QB is fine, let's get thicker skin and step off the ledge, whatya say?

[billsfan89]

3 minutes ago, TroutDog said:

It’s a business and an insanely profitable one at that. Simple as that, really. That trumps science for this for the NFL, in my opinion. 

 

Yes, the NFL ‘cares’ but they really want the most exciting players on the field and Josh is one. 

 

But you also want players to have long careers and stay on the field long term. There is no perfect solution but I think a mandatory sit out is a basic safety procedure that seems like a good idea to provide a basic level of safety. 

4 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

The problem with the idea of a mandatory sit-out period is that concussions are really variable.  Something that doesn't look like much can give a guy a concussion where symptoms persist for months.  Something that looks major can resolve in a few days.  So if you make the sit-out period long enough to fit the persistent case, you're depriving a guy who heals quickly of valuable development and career exposure (and the team of his services).  If you make it short enough not to be too big a deal, it's useless in the persistent case.

 

That's why what they came up with, individualized baseline testing and neurological evaluation/repeat testing, makes much more sense.

 

The place where the NFL does not show it cares IMO is in imposing consistent penalties for helmet to helmet contact.

 

I don't see a one week sit out period hurting anyone. It is at best a safety procedure that will help some players avoid doing worse damage and at worse some players miss some games. I think when it comes to head injuries giving people some extra time to heal can't hurt. 

[LSHMEAB]

2 hours ago, Bangarang said:

 

I have always said that I’m willing to live with the risks and INTs if it also means Allen throws a lot of TDs and we score a bunch of points. 
 

Exactly. If you're gonna throw 3 picks, you have to balance that out with production. I think it's a foregone conclusion that Allen is going to be turnover prone with his style of play and I'm pretty much OK with that. The key will be whether or not he can start producing at a higher clip. That would come with some more efficiency in the short game(we saw it for 2.5 games) and also more connections on the deep throws(we have yet to see that). 

 

I think anyone in their right mind would be fine with Allen having a Favre like career. It's almost comical to think otherwise. Is there anyone that would be disappointed with that? Serious question.

[Success]

Every fan wants a gamer like Josh - a guy who will do anything to win.

 

It’s a hardship, but we’ll just have to deal with it.

[stosh64]

2 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

The real key as I see it is the answer to the question "what did you see?".  Is he not processing the field, or does he see it and just believe he's got such a rifle that he can fit a throw into tighter windows than he actually can, in the NFL.  If he can't process the field, he can't last.  If he's seeing it, but just struggling to get it through his head which throws he can't make, that's probably correctable.

Do you think that is what Daboll was saying to Josh after that interception?  I don't get the feeling "What did you see?" was even a footnote to the conversation, I hope I am wrong.

I am getting a bad feeling about Daboll coaching Allen up to his potential.  Just a gut feeling, I hope I am wrong.

[MDH]

4 hours ago, TroutDog said:

 

Lastly, it IS coachable to switch this mentality. 

 

It was coachable in Favre. It doesn’t mean you can change every player’s mentality who has that particular gene.

 

The article mentions that there have been quite a few players who went by the wayside who couldn’t be coached out of repeatedly making those aggressive, I can do anything mistakes.

 

Let’s hope Allen can tame that aggressiveness somewhat.

 

[Gugny]

You all know I love my baseball.

 

Nolan Ryan has the most strikeouts in MLB history.

 

Nolan Ryan also has the most walks in MLB history.

 

Chew on that a bit.

[par73]

Favre is a Super Bowl- winning HOF QB. Allen does not belong in the same sentence, at this point.

[JoPar_v2]

12 minutes ago, par73 said:

Favre is a Super Bowl- winning HOF QB. Allen does not belong in the same sentence, at this point.

Yes. Comparing Allen to Favre, even if it’s only a “mentality” comparison, is folly. How bout we let Allen develop into his own man? He way ahead of where I thought he’d be already, and he’s going to get better.

 

Also, mods, if you’re shutting down comparison threads like the Mahomes one from thursday, might as well shut this one down too...or are we only shutting down negative comparisons for Allen?

[Buffalo Barbarian]

Yes but i think he will learn quicker.

 

 

[billsfan1959]

4 hours ago, par73 said:

Favre is a Super Bowl- winning HOF QB. Allen does not belong in the same sentence, at this point.

 

4 hours ago, JoPar_v2 said:

Yes. Comparing Allen to Favre, even if it’s only a “mentality” comparison, is folly. How bout we let Allen develop into his own man? He way ahead of where I thought he’d be already, and he’s going to get better.

 

Also, mods, if you’re shutting down comparison threads like the Mahomes one from thursday, might as well shut this one down too...or are we only shutting down negative comparisons for Allen?

This thread is in response to a specific article in which Steve Mariucci and Brett Favre both talked about Allen and his comparison to Favre.

 

Perhaps you can send them each a strongly worded letter to stop comparing the two.

[JoPar_v2]

Just now, billsfan1959 said:

 

This thread is in response to a specific article in which Steve Mariucci and Brett Favre both talked about Allen and his comparison to Favre.

 

Perhaps you can send them each a strongly worded letter to stop comparing the two.

I know i know...positive comparisons should be promoted...even the bottom bit** allen folks are starting to waver.

[billsfan1959]

24 minutes ago, JoPar_v2 said:

I know i know...positive comparisons should be promoted...even the bottom bit** allen folks are starting to waver.

I think the difference is that this thread involved a substantive discussion on Allen's traits (good and bad) by a HOF QB and a former NFL coach. As opposed to the thread you mentioned which involved the typical "Bills made a mistake in not drafting Mahommes" whining - which is pointless, non-productive, and has been beaten to death.

 

There are plenty of threads devoted to, or filled with, negative aspects of Allen's game that have not been shut down because they have some valid points. There is a small percentage of fans who believe he will be a bust and refuse to acknowledge anything good about his game - just as there is a small percentage of fans who can see no bad in his game. 

 

Those of us who approach it rationally and objectively aren't waivering. We understand the immense talent and potential while acknowledging the lack of polish and raw nature of his game. We understand that he is a very bright kid who has shown tremendous growth since he first stepped onto an NFL field last year, yet, has so much to still learn. We understand that, at this point, there is good and bad to Allen's game - and there will be for a while because of the type of mentality he plays with. Thus, the comparisons in the referenced article between Allen and Favre. It is a legitimate discussion, not a positive promotion.

 

Most of us aren't waivering at all. We are being patient.

Edited October 5, 2019 by billsfan1959

[PlayoffsPlease]

Until Allen wins a super bowl, he is not enough Farve like. 

Edited October 5, 2019 by PlayoffsPlease

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

Simplest answer is only if he costs us more games then he wins. 

 

So far he is 3-1 in that regard so the answer is easily no at this point. 

[Buffalo_Gal]

If "all" we get out of Josh Allen is Brett Farve 2.0, I will be thrilled. And, I suspect I will not be alone in my happiness.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

9 hours ago, JoPar_v2 said:

Yes. Comparing Allen to Favre, even if it’s only a “mentality” comparison, is folly. How bout we let Allen develop into his own man? He way ahead of where I thought he’d be already, and he’s going to get better.

 

Also, mods, if you’re shutting down comparison threads like the Mahomes one from thursday, might as well shut this one down too...or are we only shutting down negative comparisons for Allen?

 

..dead on....go back and read the 2004 pre-draft prognostications from "expert urinalists".......JP Losman was labelled the "heir apparent gunslinger to Favre going to the Pack at #23"......Jaws yapped about how "smart Losman is with the football".....and Tom "Terrific" Donohoe took the bait hook, line and sinker to snooker (COUGH) the Pack......as the late great Paul Harvey would say,...."you know the REST of the story..."....