DiMarco (Dabolls Swiss army knife)

[Buffalo716]

1 minute ago, ngbills said:

Best game of his career is 3 catches for 35 yards...I dont think its a matter of him not being utilized correctly.

 

I am all for the occasional pass out of the backfield on a short yardage play or even a wheel route. But lining him up outside is just not my preference. I think coaches can try to be cute and out think themselves. 

I don't think my point is getting across..  He isn't lined out wide for his receiving ability

 

I assume that he will be blocking downfield on screens and rub routes throughout the season when lined up wide

 

A FB blocking a CB or safety in space is a mismatch

[Logic]

A lot of DiMarco detractors are missing a key point.

Yes, he lightens the box. Yes, he helps identify the coverage for Allen. Those alone are great contributions, but there's one more thing:

The Bills were in 21 personnel the vast majority of the time yesterday. Just like the Patriots, the Bills are now coming out in just about the same personnel grouping every single play. Then, depending on the defensive look, they either line up in an old fashioned pro set (I form, Strong, Weak, etc) or flex everyone out into some sort of spread of bunch grouping. This puts the opposition in a real bind. If they stay in base defense, the Bills flex to a passing formation. Now you potentially have Cole Beasley and/or Dawson Knox matched up against a linebacker. You probably have John Brown one-on-one against a corner with no help. Alternately, if the defense decides to go to nickel or dime personnel, the Bills can line up in the standard pro sets and run the balls against the lighter defensive personnel.

Basically, the gameplan by the Bills is to keep the same offensive personnel on the field for most of the game and allow the opposing defense to choose which way you're going to attack them. The Pats have been doing this for a few years now, to great effect. Emulating one of the consistently excellent offenses in the modern NFL is not a BAD thing!

As it relates to DiMarco: For those that say "well, his spot should be taken by a second running back or a tight end or something", well...unless said running back or tight end is as good at playing fullback as DiMarco, that doesn't exactly work. I understand those who say that he should not be catching passes, but both times I saw a pass go his way yesterday, he caught it for several yards. As an offense, you never go broke if you're making a profit. I guess what I'm trying to say is: Quit yer bitchin!

Edited September 9, 2019 by Logic

[Rochesterfan]

7 minutes ago, the skycap said:

I am one of the those "people" who wants him cut or questioned why wasn't he. All I'm saying is that he is a waste of a roster spot when you can utilize Lee Smith/Sweeney/Croom/Knox to do the same things with more agility 

 

 

But you can’t utilize them to do the same thing.  The TEs are all ok to good in-line blockers, but none of them are the lead blocker on runs that Dimarco is.  The TEs do not read a play out of the backfield the way a RB does and therefore are not as good at leading a RB into a hole.

 

The TEs would be better at splitting out, but the point of the original formation was a power running formation that they could morph into a wide split to get the Jets out of position and allow JA to read the defense and decide on a run or pass option and adjust the formation.  

 

I think you will see similar things in other games using 1 RB, 2TE, and 2WR, but I think early in the game they wanted a few more veterans on the first series hence Dimarco over the 2 rookie TEs.

[Jerome007]

It was one of his better games for sure. And he always been versatile. As a FB  he is not that good though but he is a Bills, the coaches like him, good enough for me!

[Buffarukus]

10 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

I don't think my point is getting across..  He isn't lined out wide for his receiving ability

 

I assume that he will be blocking downfield on screens and rub routes throughout the season when lined up wide

 

A FB blocking a CB or safety in space is a mismatch

 

yeah i see what they are doing. you run him out in a run package and the d subs in lbers put him outside and it spreads them out

 

 A is hard to disguise a blitz from

 B can give a favorable mismatch

i like what they are doing but the d was leaving him uncovered cause hes not really a threat to do alot of damage. but if he can catch it consistantly ill take the 4 yrd gain i guess. not sure if he was clogging things up on rubs

Edited September 9, 2019 by Buffarukus

[Kelly the Dog]

Frankly, I don't like the trade off. I know he is in the game to make the Jets play a base run defense, and that is fine. Then they split him out and the Jets are forced to react accordingly. But it's not worth it. I would rather have Foster  or Zay in there instead of the fullback even if the Jets have an extra DB instead of LB in there on defense. DiMarco is no threat. He does not have great hands despite some people accusing him of it. He's never been a threat. People think he can be a receiver because he had a couple catches four years ago in a playoff game in a season where he had about four catches total. If anything his presence as a receiver clogs up the passing game because of the extra backer and his lack of speed. The team has much better chance of making yardage with a threat out there and a CB for the Jets or opponent.

[Buffalo716]

2 minutes ago, Buffarukus said:

 

yeah i see what they are doing. you run him out in a run package and the d subs in lbers put him outside and it spreads them out

 

 A is hard to disguise a blitz from

 B can give a favorable mismatch

i like what they are doing but the d was leaving him uncovered cause hes not really a threat to do alot of damage. but if he can catch it consistantly ill take the 4 yrd gain i guess. not sure if he was clogging things up on rubs

We will see how much it really opens up things throughout a season

 

Devlin is used all over the Patriots formations and in different roles.

 

He will never be a receiving threat like a Kyle Jusczyk but that doesn't mean he can't be dependable when called on... Allen obviously has faith in him

[eball]

No, no, no.  I have heard it stated emphatically on this forum that DiMarco is a waste of a roster spot and provides no useful purpose.

 

Armchair QBs can’t possibly be wrong, right?  The Bills’ coaches must be complete idiots, right?  Who’s with me?  I’ve got a bunch of pitchforks and torches loaded up and ready to march upon OBD!!!

[Kelly the Dog]

Just now, eball said:

No, no, no.  I have heard it stated emphatically on this forum that DiMarco is a waste of a roster spot and provides no useful purpose.

 

Armchair QBs can’t possibly be wrong, right?  The Bills’ coaches must be complete idiots, right?  Who’s with me?  I’ve got a bunch of pitchforks and torches loaded up and ready to march upon OBD!!!

They were held scoreless with him, no? Maybe not.

 

I think they should keep him. And play him a little. But the opening drive and splitting him out is worthless.

[eball]

Just now, Kelly the Dog said:

They were held scoreless with him, no? Maybe not.

 

I think they should keep him. And play him a little. But the opening drive and splitting him out is worthless.

 

The opening drive looked pretty good until Josh fumbled.

[Freddie's Dead]

DiMarco is breasts on a bull.

[Kelly the Dog]

2 minutes ago, eball said:

 

The opening drive looked pretty good until Josh fumbled.

No thanks to DM.

 

[dave mcbride]

48 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

GTFOH

 

The team couldn't get near the end zone for 3 quarters with that dink and dunk ***** and you are celebrating the return of Sam Gash split wide catching a pass that went 25 yards horizontally for 1 ***** yard gain?

 

Let me know when that screen game comes together and starts producing TD's..........in the meantime I guess we will have to settle for the 4th quarter being when they do what Allen does best......push the ball downfield and make plays with his legs when defenses are backed off trying to prevent the long ball.

 

I'm not saying that LEARNING how to run an offense like Brady isn't good for Allen in the long run.........but there is a reason that McD runs a defense that tries to force teams to make lot's of short throws.......because for most passers it's just more opportunity for mistakes.  

 

And yeah the special breed DiMarco can make not-so-athletic mistakes.......like the ball that went off his face for an interception in the Peterman 5 pic game.   He certainly shouldn't be catching passes outside the hashes unless it's a "gotcha" play like a wheel route.    The first one of those deep outs that he fails to come back for and ends up turning into a pick-six nobody is ever going to want to see him get a ball thrown his way again.

 

 

To be fair to DeMarco, that pass thrown by Peterman was thrown way too hard given how close he was to the receiver. There was no touch at all.

[Buffalo716]

17 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said:

Frankly, I don't like the trade off. I know he is in the game to make the Jets play a base run defense, and that is fine. Then they split him out and the Jets are forced to react accordingly. But it's not worth it. I would rather have Foster  or Zay in there instead of the fullback even if the Jets have an extra DB instead of LB in there on defense. DiMarco is no threat. He does not have great hands despite some people accusing him of it. He's never been a threat. People think he can be a receiver because he had a couple catches four years ago in a playoff game in a season where he had about four catches total. If anything his presence as a receiver clogs up the passing game because of the extra backer and his lack of speed. The team has much better chance of making yardage with a threat out there and a CB for the Jets or opponent.

I don't think I've said he has great hands tho he does has good hands especially for a FB

 

He was 2nd in the NFL in receiving yards for a FB last year behind Jusczyk and will probably double his output this season

 

Not many FBs who can catch consistently

Edited September 9, 2019 by Buffalo716

[Buffarukus]

10 minutes ago, eball said:

No, no, no.  I have heard it stated emphatically on this forum that DiMarco is a waste of a roster spot and provides no useful purpose.

 

Armchair QBs can’t possibly be wrong, right?  The Bills’ coaches must be complete idiots, right?  Who’s with me?  I’ve got a bunch of pitchforks and torches loaded up and ready to march upon OBD!!!

i like anarchy so im with ya. is a dull machete ok? seriously tho just because fans say somthing that the coaches dont see doesnt make them wrong. 

 

pretty sure we were in agreement that our qb situation was way off to go into a season with last year. the coaches thought the same...after it cost us. 

 

not same situation but worth a discussion.

 

Edited September 9, 2019 by Buffarukus

[Kelly the Dog]

2 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

I don't think I've said he has great hands tho he does has good hands especially for a FB

 

He was 2nd in the NFL in receiving yards for a FB last year behind Jusczyk and will probably double his output this season

I was going to joke and say 50? But then thought I better look it up even though I didn't remember many if any other than the 40 yarder he had when no one covered him. Then I looked it up and it was 62 yards, total, or just over four yards a game. A true threat. So now, if everything goes as planned, he will get eight per game.

[Buffalo716]

Just now, Kelly the Dog said:

I was going to joke and say 50? But then thought I better look it up even though I didn't remember many if any other than the 40 yarder he had when no one covered him. Then I looked it up and it was 62 yards, total, or just over four yards a game. A true threat. So now, if everything goes as planned, he will get eight per game.

Hahah yes! But the point is he is there and can catch that 40 yarder

 

90% of NFL FBs can't. Who knows he can get 150-200 yards which would prolly put him in the pro bowl

[Cripple Creek]

1 hour ago, mrags said:

Other than his 2 catches for like 6 yards I didn’t notice him at all. 

 

 

I do not understand this thread.

13 minutes ago, Freddie's Dead said:

DiMarco is breasts on a bull.

The supernumerary Bill.

[LABILLBACKER]

Stop.....just stop....Anyone can line up anywhere, that hardly makes him an offensive asset. Call me when he breaks a big play. For him thats anything beyond 5 yards. He's still a waste of a roster spot.

[BADOLBILZ]

3 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

I don't think I've said he has great hands tho he does has good hands especially for a FB

 

He was 2nd in the NFL in receiving yards for a FB last year behind Jusczyk and will probably double his output this season

 

Not many FBs who can catch consistently

 

 

He's basically the 11th best player on the offense every time he steps on the field..........I didn't put up much complaint about him making the roster because I knew he was going to and because they didn't have to cut a quality player because of him............IMO you made a thread about something that's a high end "meh" pseudo-football-intellectual observation.

 

"See DiMarco is important to what Dabol wants to do"   ignoring the fact that the offense failed miserably for 3 quarters and turned the ball over 4 times.

 

You are kinda' missing the obvious point that it very much remains to be seen if this offense is even any good.    It's not like the Bills of the 2000's haven't been one of the few teams that has loved the fullback position and in all those cases it proved a mistake to emphasize that position.......including McD's first OC........who sacked the league's best running game. 

[Buffalo716]

2 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

He's basically the 11th best player on the offense every time he steps on the field..........I didn't put up much complaint about him making the roster because I knew he was going to and because they didn't have to cut a quality player because of him............IMO you made a thread about something that's a high end "meh" pseudo-football-intellectual observation.

 

"See DiMarco is important to what Dabol wants to do"   ignoring the fact that the offense failed miserably for 3 quarters and turned the ball over 4 times.

 

You are kinda' missing the obvious point that it very much remains to be seen if this offense is even any good.    It's not like the Bills of the 2000's haven't been one of the few teams that has loved the fullback position and in all those cases it proved a mistake to emphasize that position.......including McD's first OC........who sacked the league's best running game. 

People wanted to keep Wade over DiMarco... People wanted to convert Duke Williams to FB

 

Those are asinine ideas that have no basis in reality in football

 

The Bills offense may suck, it may be good ... 

 

But Daboll obviously has created a niche role for DiMarco that he thinks he will be valuable in, even if it's only 30% of snaps

 

But to think that some wanted Duke Williams to play FB...

[3rdand12]

1 hour ago, Buffalo716 said:

I noticed him a bunch so I guess it depends what your looking at on a play

so did i.

Got some nice blocking in as well as holding onto the ball.

Daboll is a fun guy : ) every week will be new exciting episode lol  : )

wait till Lee Smith starts catching passes. cuz he can.

 all the naysayers will again reflect on what makes a complete Team.

Mismatches playcalling and execution.

 

Go Bills

[ngbills]

6 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

I don't think I've said he has great hands tho he does has good hands especially for a FB

 

He was 2nd in the NFL in receiving yards for a FB last year behind Jusczyk and will probably double his output this season

Come on now. He had 3 receptions last year. Saying he was 2nd in receiving yards for a fullback is some spin work.Yes its true but really meaningless. Reality is the fullback is becoming extinct in today's NFL. Teams are much more creative and able to get better weapons on the field than a FB. 

[Buffalo716]

Just now, ngbills said:

Come on now. He had 3 receptions last year. Saying he was 2nd in receiving yards for a fullback is some spin work.Yes its true but really meaningless. Reality is the fullback is becoming extinct in today's NFL. Teams are much more creative and able to get better weapons on the field than a FB. 

Yea I understand the workload isn't there... But that shows that 95% of FBs do not get stats at all... He caught a 40 yard pass, 95% of FBs cannot do that but he can 

 

and over half the league still keeps a FB including Belechick who uses Develin a bunch

 

So if DiMarco gets 20 catches this year is that not a positive? Because that's another guy Josh can trust, which he obviously does

[3rdand12]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Well, yes, and yet....there were a couple plays where he ran a route, and made a catch, but I had the thought that he's about as agile as a front loader and someone else out there would have gotten a few more yards.

 

But he hauled 'em in, so there's that. 

 

I hear ya, @Buffalo716, he's the human Leatherman Wave for Daboll

If they have to cover him? He is doing something right.

 they are setting up the Ginats already lol.

and if he hits like front loader? safeties and corners are going to spend extra time in the ice bath

 But i have always had a thing for snotknocking fullbacks

[Buffalo716]

24 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Stop.....just stop....Anyone can line up anywhere, that hardly makes him an offensive asset. Call me when he breaks a big play. For him thats anything beyond 5 yards. He's still a waste of a roster spot.

He caught a 40 yarder last season

[Kelly the Dog]

1 minute ago, Buffalo716 said:

He caught a 40 yarder last season

It was a lofted 15 yard pass with no one covering him right into his hands on the dead run and he ran a bunch more before tackled by the first guy that could. I would say 90% of the FBs could have made that play.

[mrags]

8 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

People wanted to keep Wade over DiMarco... People wanted to convert Duke Williams to FB

 

Those are asinine ideas that have no basis in reality in football

 

The Bills offense may suck, it may be good ... 

 

But Daboll obviously has created a niche role for DiMarco that he thinks he will be valuable in, even if it's only 30% of snaps

 

But to think that some wanted Duke Williams to play FB...

First of all, These are 2 different arguments entirely. 

 

Anyone that thinks Duke Williams could or should be a TE should just end their lives now. They are clueless in life and using our good fresh air. 

 

But that doesn’t mean that Dimarco is any good at all or should deserve a roster spot on this team. @BADOLBILZ said it perfectly when he said that every time Dimarco steps onto the field he’s automatically the 11th best player on offense. I’d take it one further and say that he’s the 22nd best player on the field including the defensive players he’s going up against. Hell, he’s probably the the 94th (each team only suits up 47) best player on the field and/or sidelines anytime he suits up every Sunday. 

 

He is useless on this team. For every argument that he’s used as a decoy to find out about what kind of defense is running, etc. there is an argument that Yeldon, Gore, Lee Smith, Sweeney, a 6th lineman, anyone else for that matter, could line up in his place and be just as effective. 

 

Anyone that thinks Dimarco is useful at all should just keep watching him. He brings nothing to this offense or team that someone else couldn’t do without costing an additional roster spot for a useless fullback. 

[Buffalo716]

1 minute ago, Kelly the Dog said:

It was a lofted 15 yard pass with no one covering him right into his hands on the dead run and he ran a bunch more before tackled by the first guy that could. I would say 90% of the FBs could have made that play.

Then why didn't 28 other FBs in the league do it? 

 

I see other FBs get thrown wheel routes throughout a year and they aren't on the same page... Yes it was an easy NFL catch, but he also got NFL open

 

Gotta give credit where it's also do

[3rdand12]

52 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said:

They were held scoreless with him, no? Maybe not.

 

I think they should keep him. And play him a little. But the opening drive and splitting him out is worthless.

Dimarco did not turn the ball over did he ?

[Buffalo716]

1 minute ago, mrags said:

First of all, These are 2 different arguments entirely. 

 

Anyone that thinks Duke Williams could or should be a TE should just end their lives now. They are clueless in life and using our good fresh air. 

 

But that doesn’t mean that Dimarco is any good at all or should deserve a roster spot on this team. @BADOLBILZ said it perfectly when he said that every time Dimarco steps onto the field he’s automatically the 11th best player on offense. I’d take it one further and say that he’s the 22nd best player on the field including the defensive players he’s going up against. Hell, he’s probably the the 94th (each team only suits up 47) best player on the field and/or sidelines anytime he suits up every Sunday. 

 

He is useless on this team. For every argument that he’s used as a decoy to find out about what kind of defense is running, etc. there is an argument that Yeldon, Gore, Lee Smith, Sweeney, a 6th lineman, anyone else for that matter, could line up in his place and be just as effective. 

 

Anyone that thinks Dimarco is useful at all should just keep watching him. He brings nothing to this offense or team that someone else couldn’t do without costing an additional roster spot for a useless fullback. 

There are like 25 teams in the league with a FB and every single time they step out there they are 11 out of 11 in terms of skill

 

Still in the NFL for a reason

[Kelly the Dog]

2 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Then why didn't 28 other FBs in the league do it? 

 

I see other FBs get thrown wheel routes throughout a year and they aren't on the same page... Yes it was an easy NFL catch, but he also got NFL open

 

Gotta give credit where it's also do

You don't get credit for running a route that none of the eleven players on the other team even try to cover you. None. If anything it shows you are NO threat.

[3rdand12]

5 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said:

It was a lofted 15 yard pass with no one covering him right into his hands on the dead run and he ran a bunch more before tackled by the first guy that could. I would say 90% of the FBs could have made that play.

But did they?

 No one is saying Dimarco is more than he is.

It is the way Daboll is using his players that is cool.

Patrick did his job. if all 11 do it we have a nice chance of winning.

 Who knows what Daboll is thinking against Giants

 Maybe he uses Gore and Yeldon Knox all day.  Who knows  what evil lurks in the hearts of men ?

Da Shadow know

[Kelly the Dog]

3 minutes ago, 3rdand12 said:

Dimarco did not turn the ball over did he ?

He would have liked to.

[3rdand12]

Just now, Kelly the Dog said:

He would have liked to.

LOL

 yur awesome Kelly

: ) 

 cheers !

[mrags]

12 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

There are like 25 teams in the league with a FB and every single time they step out there they are 11 out of 11 in terms of skill

 

Still in the NFL for a reason

I’d be willing to bet that less than 25 teams in the league even have a true FB on their roster.  I’m not doing the leg work to find out because either way I don’t care. Dimarco is useless. 

 

Id also like to state that even if it were true, and that many teams did utilize a fullback, I highly doubt they even bother to have him in the field when they only run the ball for 15 times the entire game. 

[Mat68]

Once Kroft is healthy, the Pro set will be more versatile.  Kroft is a good blocker and good athlete.  You can bring him inline or line him outside.  Dimarco is not the mismatch.  Shifting from Pro into spread, depending who covers him opens up matchups at the other positions.  Times Adams followed him.  Other times a linebaker, once a Cb.  Man to man a linebaker follows, a db is on him they are running a zone.  If it allows Brown, Beasly, or Singletary on a linebaker it's worth doing to dictate that matchup.  If it doesnt create a better matchup but shows Allen the coverage it's worth that too.  Make the game easier.

[Buffalo716]

20 minutes ago, mrags said:

I’d be willing to bet that less than 25 teams in the league even have a true FB on their roster.  I’m not doing the leg work to find out because either way I don’t care. Dimarco is useless. 

 

Id also like to state that even if it were true, and that many teams did utilize a fullback, I highly doubt they even bother to have him in the field when they only run the ball for 15 times the entire game. 

Football is a game of strategy. Belechick has always utilized a FB and thinks it's worth a roster spot

 

The Bills obviously feel the same. You think he's useless, the coaches don't

 

Again I have never called him an all pro or a world beater... He is a versatile piece for the Bills offense

17 minutes ago, Mat68 said:

Once Kroft is healthy, the Pro set will be more versatile.  Kroft is a good blocker and good athlete.  You can bring him inline or line him outside.  Dimarco is not the mismatch.  Shifting from Pro into spread, depending who covers him opens up matchups at the other positions.  Times Adams followed him.  Other times a linebaker, once a Cb.  Man to man a linebaker follows, a db is on him they are running a zone.  If it allows Brown, Beasly, or Singletary on a linebaker it's worth doing to dictate that matchup.  If it doesnt create a better matchup but shows Allen the coverage it's worth that too.  Make the game easier.

I don't think I ever called him a mismatch in a traditional sense of playmaking

 

The only time I ever used the word mismatch was when I said him blocking outwide vs CBs would be a mismatch which it is

 

Obviously going from 21 to spread personnel is to create mismatches with your athletes

Edited September 9, 2019 by Buffalo716

[GG]

1 hour ago, Buffalo716 said:

People wanted to keep Wade over DiMarco... People wanted to convert Duke Williams to FB

 

Those are asinine ideas that have no basis in reality in football

 

The Bills offense may suck, it may be good ... 

 

But Daboll obviously has created a niche role for DiMarco that he thinks he will be valuable in, even if it's only 30% of snaps

 

But to think that some wanted Duke Williams to play FB...

 

But it's actually the opposite of your theory.  DiMarco's lining up all over the field did not affect how Jets defended the Bills.  Notre how the offense started to produce once DiMarco's snaps were minimized in the 2nd half

[Buffalo716]

7 minutes ago, GG said:

 

But it's actually the opposite of your theory.  DiMarco's lining up all over the field did not affect how Jets defended the Bills.  Notre how the offense started to produce once DiMarco's snaps were minimized in the 2nd half

The Bills moved the ball fine. Turnovers and penalties and stupid mistakes killed the first half

 

The bills caught fire with 10 minutes left in the game and finally capitalized

 

The Jets best drive in the first half was 11 plays for 38 yards and a 20 yard drive

 

The Bills had drives of 37 , 35, 58 and 30 in the first half. Not crazy good but not poor

Edited September 9, 2019 by Buffalo716