Article: Today's NFL Would Have Been Perfect for Doug Flutie

[Cripple Creek]

21 hours ago, Buffalo Boy said:

   I’m sitting here, on Vaca, chilling and bored.

I just read this whole 5 page thread and no one pointed out this stat.

Rushing League Ranking

1998 1 in attempts.  3 in yards

1999. 2 in attempts. 8 in yards

   Flutie had an arm that seemed to get weaker as the season went on.

    He threw more balls into the ground, short of his open receivers than any Bills QB I can think of other than Feragamo.

    As someone pointed out, he couldn’t throw the 10 yard out because of his lack of arm. 

    Also, that stupid jump/ spin fake.

    Those teams won based on D and Ground / Ball control offense. Flutie could manage a game. He couldn’t win a playoff game and he certainly wouldn’t have won us a Super Bowl.

     

 

 

You are a wise and wonderful human being.

[Buffalo Boy]

41 minutes ago, Cripple Creek said:

You are a wise and wonderful human being.

You are a bad judge of character ?

[BADOLBILZ]

13 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

 Flutie is at about the level of Ryan Fitzpatrick as an NFL QB.   

 

13 hours ago, Gugny said:

 

Comparing Flutie to Wilson is silly.  And comparing Wilson to Fitzpatrick might even be sillier. 

 

 

Yeesh.......your shtick is so boring..........I gotta' waive ya'........it's not fair to the others I have on block.

 

 

3 hours ago, Buffalo Boy said:

Easy to avoid the sack when Antowain Smith is holding the ball....

 

 

Seattle lead the NFL in rushing yards and finished second in attempts in 2018.............and yet Wilson got sacked 51 times.

 

Flutie was just extraordinarily elusive behind the LOS.

[colin]

i will admit i hated flutie, but quickly came around to how rob johnson had a mental problem with taking sacks, they were both very good at some things and just horrible at others.

 

that D was disgusting and a win in Tennessee would have lead to an on the road super bowl run and victory.

 

I started watching game of thrones again (with my wife who had never seen it).  going back over the old seasons and seeing what happened to the characters i root for is EXACTLY like going back and watching some of these old bills games.  IT DIDN'T HAVE TO BE LIKE THIS!!

 

also, russ will is somewhat similar to flutie, but much much much better.

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

23 hours ago, Buffalo Boy said:

   I’m sitting here, on Vaca, chilling and bored.

Where the hell is ‘Vaca’?!  Google Maps can’t find it.  Closest it comes is Vaca Key, Florida.

[Gugny]

43 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

 

Yeesh.......your shtick is so boring..........I gotta' waive ya'........it's not fair to the others I have on block.

 

 

 

 

Seattle lead the NFL in rushing yards and finished second in attempts in 2018.............and yet Wilson got sacked 51 times.

 

Flutie was just extraordinarily elusive behind the LOS.

 

 

Man, I guess Tim Graham never left, after all!!

 

You call it a shtick because I'm pointing out an asinine comparison that you made.  And that might taint your self-administered label as a self-proclaimed football expert who knows more than anyone on the board.

 

I'm sorry I bruised your ego.

 

Block away.

 

 

 

Edited July 12, 2019 by Gugny

[Buffalo Boy]

11 hours ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said:

Where the hell is ‘Vaca’?!  Google Maps can’t find it.  Closest it comes is Vaca Key, Florida.

Dubrovnik Croatia

[LSHMEAB]

He'd probably be a lot like Lamar Jackson. Flutie was more savvy, but less athletic. The article is overly simplistic IMO.

On 7/8/2019 at 12:18 PM, Joe in Winslow said:

 

He was a cancer BEFORE that.

 

Look it up.

 

It was all about Doug. 

[LSHMEAB]

On 7/10/2019 at 1:19 PM, Stank_Nasty said:

I really shouldn't have watched that.... ???

 

who throws that freaking flag there?!?!?

I think the Jefferson "reception" was an even more egregious error than the PI call. They NEVER throw that flag, but Jones did interfere. I'm not even sure Jefferson had ONE foot in bounds, let alone past the sticks. Ridiculous.

 

That reel also triggered my anger at the highlights during the Flutie era. A little razzle dazzle! A two yard shuffle pass that didn't lead to a first down. The Moulds TD was ALL him. He was something else in his prime. They pretty much never showed negative Flutie plays, which were plentiful, nor did they give credit to a dominant defense. The highlights they'd show had NOTHING to do with the Bills and everything to do with the original St. Doug; just they way he likes it.

Edited July 13, 2019 by LSHMEAB

[Locomark]

Honestly, today's NFL lineman and LBs are so much bigger and faster now that Flutie would be injured all the time after taking hits. Let's not kid ourselves. The game he played required him to be much more elusive than the defense. I don't know that he would be anymore.

[Kwai San]

On 7/8/2019 at 11:56 PM, Gugny said:

 

You bring the potus into it, then plea that the thread doesn't get political ... even though it had nothing political before your post.  Bizarre.

 Bizarre is my middle name.....as it is for quite a few of us here.....

[major]

Flutie was a winner in college, cfl, and nfl. I’ll always be grateful for the success he helped us to have during his tenure. Never have understood the dislike some have for him on this board

[NoSaint]

On 7/13/2019 at 11:27 AM, Locomark said:

Honestly, today's NFL lineman and LBs are so much bigger and faster now that Flutie would be injured all the time after taking hits. Let's not kid ourselves. The game he played required him to be much more elusive than the defense. I don't know that he would be anymore.

Tremaine would be a real problem for a Flutie, as an example 

[Tiberius]

On 7/8/2019 at 12:32 PM, Rocket94 said:

What was it...1998 and the Bills started 0-3? Flutie was way huge and very instrumental in the Bills resurgence. I believe they rallied to win the next five games. All he did was make plays for two years or so until teams caught on.

I just watched the Music City Miracle game again and was shocked by the seemingly inept performance by our leadership. They started Johnson against a team that was great at pass rushing which Johnson could not handle at all. Then in second half the finally put Sam Gash in and we started hammering them. I really loved that team, the defense was awesome, the old stars were still there, A. Smith was a bulldozer. My question is, for anyone, was Ralph Wilson ever actually confirmed to have made the decision to start Johnson? I have heard that, but was wondering if there was proof about that?

 

Thanks in advance.

 

 

[Rocket94]

31 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

I just watched the Music City Miracle game again and was shocked by the seemingly inept performance by our leadership. They started Johnson against a team that was great at pass rushing which Johnson could not handle at all. Then in second half the finally put Sam Gash in and we started hammering them. I really loved that team, the defense was awesome, the old stars were still there, A. Smith was a bulldozer. My question is, for anyone, was Ralph Wilson ever actually confirmed to have made the decision to start Johnson? I have heard that, but was wondering if there was proof about that?

 

Thanks in advance.

 

 

The game bothered me for many of the same reasons that you have pointed out. I think after the game, Wade Phillips took quite a bit of heat for starting Johnson. I have heard over the years that Ralph Wilson insisted that Johnson start. To this day, I don't really know if this is true. Sorry it has been twenty years. One more thing to point out...many have argued that the Bills did have the lead and if not for that play...

Edited August 12, 2019 by Rocket94

[Gugny]

39 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

I just watched the Music City Miracle game again and was shocked by the seemingly inept performance by our leadership. They started Johnson against a team that was great at pass rushing which Johnson could not handle at all. Then in second half the finally put Sam Gash in and we started hammering them. I really loved that team, the defense was awesome, the old stars were still there, A. Smith was a bulldozer. My question is, for anyone, was Ralph Wilson ever actually confirmed to have made the decision to start Johnson? I have heard that, but was wondering if there was proof about that?

 

Thanks in advance.

 

 

 

12 minutes ago, Rocket94 said:

The game bothered me for many of the same reasons that you have pointed out. I think after the game, Wade Phillips took quite a bit of heat for starting Johnson. I have heard over the years that Ralph Wilson insisted that Johnson start. To this day, I don't really know if this is true. Sorry it has been twenty years. One more thing to point out...many have argued that the Bills did have the lead and if not for that play...

 

Just to be clear, this is the same Rob Johnson who led the Bills to the lead and had the game won, right?  Had they started Flutie, the Bills would have gotten their asses handed to them.

[Rocket94]

1 hour ago, Gugny said:

 

 

Just to be clear, this is the same Rob Johnson who led the Bills to the lead and had the game won, right?  Had they started Flutie, the Bills would have gotten their asses handed to them.

Yes...if not for the miracle, the game would have been won. How often do we see a play like that. Back then, if you remember there was a Always a Flutie vs Johnson debate. Yes I liked Flutie more, but I just wanted a Bills win. Of course because they lost, it opened the doors for the usual controversy and hysteria.

Edited August 12, 2019 by Rocket94

[Gugny]

5 minutes ago, Rocket94 said:

Yes...if not for the miracle, the game would have been won. How often do we see a play like that. Back then, if you remember there was a Always a Flutie vs Johnson debate. Yes I like Flutie more, but I just wanted a Bills win. Of course because they lost, it opened up the usual doubts and controversy. 

 

I'm the wrong guy to ask because I couldn't stand Flutie from day one and my dislike of him grows every time I talk about him.  Worst Buffalo Bill, ever, in my opinion.  Two happiest days of my life as a Bills fan - when Flutie left and when Tyrod left.  Good riddance to bad rubbish.  Two peas in a pathetic pod.

[Rocket94]

8 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

I'm the wrong guy to ask because I couldn't stand Flutie from day one and my dislike of him grows every time I talk about him.  Worst Buffalo Bill, ever, in my opinion.  Two happiest days of my life as a Bills fan - when Flutie left and when Tyrod left.  Good riddance to bad rubbish.  Two peas in a pathetic pod.

I liked Flutie at the time. In 1998 the Bills started 0-3 and I believe they rallied to 5-3. He was at the forefront it seemed and Jim Kelly had been gone two years. I am really not concerned with it anymore!

Edited August 12, 2019 by Rocket94

[Rico]

1 hour ago, Tiberius said:

I just watched the Music City Miracle game again and was shocked by the seemingly inept performance by our leadership. They started Johnson against a team that was great at pass rushing which Johnson could not handle at all. Then in second half the finally put Sam Gash in and we started hammering them. I really loved that team, the defense was awesome, the old stars were still there, A. Smith was a bulldozer. My question is, for anyone, was Ralph Wilson ever actually confirmed to have made the decision to start Johnson? I have heard that, but was wondering if there was proof about that?

 

Thanks in advance.

 

 

Yes, it was Ralph’s fault. 

[Tiberius]

7 hours ago, Gugny said:

 

 

Just to be clear, this is the same Rob Johnson who led the Bills to the lead and had the game won, right?  Had they started Flutie, the Bills would have gotten their asses handed to them.

Thanks to a great defense. I forgot to mention that both starting tackles were hurt and they were still throwing down field in first half, or trying to, something like five first half sacks. They should have just started running the power eye in first half and they wouldn't have had as many problems, imo. So my main complaint isn't so much who was at QB but how they just Johnson t the wolves in first half. After I watched that game I also watched the Miami game from a year earlier and Flutie was pretty bad, so that might have colored the decision to start Johnson.

[Stank_Nasty]

8 hours ago, Gugny said:

 

 

Just to be clear, this is the same Rob Johnson who led the Bills to the lead and had the game won, right?  Had they started Flutie, the Bills would have gotten their asses handed to them.

The same Johnson that got sacked SIX times in that game, correct? One of which was a safety.  The same Johnson that got sacked at a rate nearly 3 times higher than Flutie over their years together with the same O-line. Hey I have an idea let’s throw the most sacked qb per dropback of all time against “the freak” Jevon kearse! AWFUL team management..... the SAME rob johnson that had a LOSING record with the SAME EXACT team over the 3 years they both played there while flutie went 21-9

 

awful take, man. Johnson played well and won a meaningless game the week before against a colts team sitting their freaking starters. He never shoulda sniffed the field the next week. 

 

Gug, ive come to respect you as a poster and you you always seem to have fair takes...... Until you get all judgy about certain players personalities and then it seems like you throw your sense out the window. 

Edited August 12, 2019 by Stank_Nasty

[Gugny]

18 minutes ago, Stank_Nasty said:

Gug, ive come to respect you as a poster and you you always seem to have fair takes...... Until you get all judgy about certain players personalities and then it seems like you throw your sense out the window. 

 

The respect is certainly mutual, Stank.  I've felt this strongly about Flutie since he was on the team.  I think he was a horrible team mate, a me-first player to an extreme fault, a locker room divider, couldn't read a defense to save his life and fooled people into thinking exciting = good.  To a mildly lesser extent, I felt the same way about Taylor - also since his very first start as a Bill.

[C.Biscuit97]

9 hours ago, Gugny said:

 

 

Just to be clear, this is the same Rob Johnson who led the Bills to the lead and had the game won, right?  Had they started Flutie, the Bills would have gotten their asses handed to them.

Clearly, Flutie who passed for 360 yards in his own playoff loss couldn’t have possibly put up the amazing 10-22 for 131 yards passing that RJ did.  Flutie had his flaws but he wasn’t completely garbage like RJ.  

9 hours ago, Gugny said:

 

I'm the wrong guy to ask because I couldn't stand Flutie from day one and my dislike of him grows every time I talk about him.  Worst Buffalo Bill, ever, in my opinion.  Two happiest days of my life as a Bills fan - when Flutie left and when Tyrod left.  Good riddance to bad rubbish.  Two peas in a pathetic pod.

Weird that you don’t like the last 2 qbs who took us to the playoffs.  They both had their faults but I enjoyed watching playoffs games and wins other scrubs like RJ taking sacks so he won’t lower his completion %.

On 7/13/2019 at 12:27 PM, Locomark said:

Honestly, today's NFL lineman and LBs are so much bigger and faster now that Flutie would be injured all the time after taking hits. Let's not kid ourselves. The game he played required him to be much more elusive than the defense. I don't know that he would be anymore.

Actually, the defensive players are becoming smaller and you aren’t allowed to blast players the way you used to.  It was a much more physical game when Flutie played.  Why do you think little guys like Cole and Edelman survive now? They would have been killed back in the day.  Much, much different game now.

[Rocket94]

Historically, I was never a big Flutie fan myself. When he arrived at TBD, I was a little skeptical. It was the aftermath of the Jim Kelly era and my thoughts were, Doug Flutie? What are the Bills doing? Is this some publicity stunt? What can he possibly do? Then when he helped rally the Bills from an 0-3 start to the 1998 season, I suppose he captured the imagination of the fan base and it took off!

Edited August 12, 2019 by Rocket94

[row_33]

9 hours ago, Gugny said:

 

I'm the wrong guy to ask because I couldn't stand Flutie from day one and my dislike of him grows every time I talk about him.  Worst Buffalo Bill, ever, in my opinion.  Two happiest days of my life as a Bills fan - when Flutie left and when Tyrod left.  Good riddance to bad rubbish.  Two peas in a pathetic pod.

 

Flutie was a decent QB, but way below Kellly

 

it was the mentality of the fans who worshiped Doug, and STILL do, that was so brutal 

 

[Gugny]

42 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Weird that you don’t like the last 2 qbs who took us to the playoffs.  They both had their faults but I enjoyed watching playoffs games and wins other scrubs like RJ taking sacks so he won’t lower his completion %.

 

Weird that you think either one of them had anything to do with the Bills going to the playoffs.

[Rocket94]

1 minute ago, row_33 said:

 

Flutie was a decent QB, but way below Kellly

 

it was the mentality of the fans who worshiped Doug, and STILL do, that was so brutal 

 

Exactly and some of the fan base were ripe to believe in something at the time. Flutie timed his arrival perfectly.

[Rocket94]

1 hour ago, Stank_Nasty said:

The same Johnson that got sacked SIX times in that game, correct? One of which was a safety.  The same Johnson that got sacked at a rate nearly 3 times higher than Flutie over their years together with the same O-line. Hey I have an idea let’s throw the most sacked qb per dropback of all time against “the freak” Jevon kearse! AWFUL team management..... the SAME rob johnson that had a LOSING record with the SAME EXACT team over the 3 years they both played there while flutie went 21-9

 

awful take, man. Johnson played well and won a meaningless game the week before against a colts team sitting their freaking starters. He never shoulda sniffed the field the next week. 

 

Gug, ive come to respect you as a poster and you you always seem to have fair takes...... Until you get all judgy about certain players personalities and then it seems like you throw your sense out the window. 

I never liked Johnson. The Bills signed him to a big contract based on a few good performances. Sure Flutie p..... some people off, but quite often he could back it up and win football games.

Edited August 12, 2019 by Rocket94

[C.Biscuit97]

18 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

Weird that you think either one of them had anything to do with the Bills going to the playoffs.

RJ record with the Bills - 9 wins, 17 losses

 

Flutie record with the Bills - 21 wins, 9 losses

 

probably just one big coincidence though! 

6 minutes ago, Rocket94 said:

I never liked Johnson. The Bills signed him to a big contract based on a few good performances. 

One good performance.  It was idiotic and some fans are so stubborn that can’t admit they were wrong.  

[Rocket94]

11 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

RJ record with the Bills - 9 wins, 17 losses

 

Flutie record with the Bills - 21 wins, 9 losses

 

probably just one big coincidence though! 

One good performance.  It was idiotic and some fans are so stubborn that can’t admit they were wrong.  

I never liked it. Also, right after the Kelly era, some fans were willing to believe anything! I knew that both Johnson and Flutie were not the long term answer...so the search for a franchise qb would begin!

Edited August 12, 2019 by Rocket94

[Stank_Nasty]

38 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

Weird that you think either one of them had anything to do with the Bills going to the playoffs.

in 98 the bills started 0-3 with Johnson at the helm.... insert flutie. they finish 10-3 and have top ten yardage and scoring offense.... he was solid in his time for the bills. even in the next season there offense was no less than average. still middle of the pack in most rankings

 

Johnson had no business being on the field or sniffing that playoff game. these are fact that have little to do with flutie being a huge jag-off. I cant even figure out how its even up for debate. one had a horrible record and got sacked 3 times as much as the other did with the same exact team. 

 

…. on the bright side for you..... you've succeeded in taking my blood pressure through the roof by 10AM today. that's a solid start!

Edited August 12, 2019 by Stank_Nasty

[Rocket94]

1 minute ago, Stank_Nasty said:

in 98 the bills started 0-3 with Johnson at the helm.... insert flutie. they finish 10-3 and have top ten yardage and scoring offense.... he was solid in his time for the bills.

 

Johnson had no business being on the field or sniffing that playoff game. these are fact that have little to do with flutie being a huge jag-off.

The Bills were winning with Flutie and that is what mattered. I tried to suspend my individual opinions of players and formulas...whatever the Bills were doing it was working.

[Gugny]

6 minutes ago, Stank_Nasty said:

in 98 the bills started 0-3 with Johnson at the helm.... insert flutie. they finish 10-3 and have top ten yardage and scoring offense.... he was solid in his time for the bills.

 

Johnson had no business being on the field or sniffing that playoff game. these are fact that have little to do with flutie being a huge jag-off.

 

You take your facts and stick 'em where the sun don't shine, mister.

[Stank_Nasty]

Just now, Gugny said:

 

You take your facts and stick 'em where the sun don't shine, mister.

[Rocket94]

2 minutes ago, Stank_Nasty said:

Bones always seemed to need a drink!

[row_33]

2 hours ago, Rocket94 said:

Bones always seemed to need a drink!

 

He was pushing 50 wearing that silly wig

[Rocket94]

1 minute ago, row_33 said:

 

He was pushing 50 wearing that silly wig

Had a crusty lush way about him! Like he had a ready bottle of bourbon on hand!

[row_33]

3 minutes ago, Rocket94 said:

Had a crusty lush way about him! Like he had a ready bottle of bourbon on hand!

 

Perfect cast for westerns on TV and film in his day, not the lead bad or good guy

 

 

[Rocket94]

Just now, row_33 said:

 

Perfect cast for westerns on TV and film in his day, not the lead bad or good guy

 

 

Yeah he was. Remember Neville Brand? He was good too...crusty edgy guy.