My Case For: Lamar Jackson

[BringBackOrton]

26 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Wilson has done pretty good and Watson was off to a great start (someone I was critical of coming out of college too).  

 

All fair points, but is anyone that enamored with Mason or Falk?  Odds are, Beane won't pay the price to get Allen or Baker (Neither Darnold or Rosen are going to be obtainable in my opinion).  I think 4 QB's are likely going in first 13 picks, and all 4 could go top 10 as there will be a lot of action I think for anyone willing to trade down with so many QB needy teams this year.  

 

So for me, I think we are likely looking at choices of Mason, Falk, or Jackson.  And I like to gamble on upside, and I do think he is under rated as a passer.  And if we can get a guy like TT that is better where TT is weak as a passer, that would be a pretty hard offense to defend.  

 

I won't be mad if we grab someone else, I just have started really coming around to Jackson as the guy with the most upside.  Sign Teddy or keep TT to give Lamar the time he needs to develop and see what this kid can do.  He likely cant be any worse than TT right, and that got us to the playoffs.  

Wilson and to a lesser extent Watson were playing a completely different game compared to Jackson at the college level.

 

If Jackson is our QB4 on our board, I'd rather go up and get 1, 2 or 3 than settle for 4.  We can afford it.

Edited January 20, 2018 by jmc12290

[starrymessenger]

32 minutes ago, JohnC said:

I like Lamar Jackson a lot, as I do Mayfield. This organization needs to identify their top qb prospects and then make an aggressive move to be in a position to get one of them. I certainly have my preferences but I'm still very open minded about the best qb prospect for us. What I don't want to see happen is for us to be passive and then be surprised when another team leaps ahead of us to acquire the player we had our sights on. If the Bills are going to make a mistake in this draft I would rather it come from being aggressive rather than be defensive. 

 

I like Mayfield too but honestly I think that again Jackson has shown more to suggest a successful transition to the NFL. He is also unequivocally the only real dual threat prospect at the position in this draft. There is nobody else that can do what he can do.

Mayfield plays in a QB friendly spread college offence behind a good line and with excellent receivers and a very good ground game. How well will he do taking snaps under centre, how good is his footwork dropping back, how well will he see the field when he is not standing 5-7 yards behind the line, especially if he is in reality 5'11" etc...And there is a far more important question. I have noticed where some observers feel he does not go through his progressions properly but sticks doggedly to his pre snap read even when  better options present themselves as the play develops, holds onto the ball too long as he waits for his first read to come free. That's not going to work at the next level.

Jackson played in a pro style offence. He absolutely goes through his progressions, sees the field and generally makes good decisions. He also made do with a decidedly lackluster supporting cast, unlike Mayfield. Jackson is 6'3" and if he fills out his frame with another 15lbs he will be pushing 230. 

They are both good prospects but for my money Jackson has a lot more to offer.

Edited January 20, 2018 by starrymessenger

[JohnC]

18 minutes ago, starrymessenger said:

 

I like Mayfield too but honestly I think that again Jackson has shown more to suggest a successful transition to the NFL. He is also unequivocally the only real dual threat prospect at the position in this draft. There is nobody else that can do what he can do.

Mayfield plays in a QB friendly spread college offence behind a good line and with excellent receivers and a very good ground game. How well will he do taking snaps under centre, how good is his footwork dropping back, how well will he see the field when he is not standing 5-7 yards behind the line, especially if he is in reality 5'11" etc...And there is a far more important question. I have noticed where some observers feel he does not go through his progressions properly but sticks doggedly to his pre snap read even when  better options present themselves as the play develops, holds onto the ball too long as he waits for his first read to come free. That's not going to work at the next level.

Jackson played in a pro style offence. He absolutely goes through his progressions, sees the field and generally makes good decisions. He also made do with a decidedly lackluster supporting cast, unlike Mayfield. Jackson is 6'3" and if he fills out his frame with another 15lbs he will be pushing 230. 

They are both good prospects but for my money Jackson has a lot more to offer.

I respectfully but strenuously disagree with your assessment of Mayfield. 

 

With respect to the highlighted area I have no interest in Jackson as a dual threat qb in the pros. That's the last thing I want for my qb. My advocacy for Jackson is that I believe in time he will be a good pro qb who can run a full range offense with the benefit of being a judicious runner when need be. 

 

If I had the choice between Mayfield and Jackson I would without hesitation take Mayfield. One of Mayfield's best attributes is his stunning accuracy. That attribute easily translates to the pro game. 

[OldTimer1960]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

And 3rd in 2016 in most TD's scored behind only Atlanta and Saints in the 15 games TT started.

Not much thanks to Taylor, though.  Brady threw 65% more TDS in 3 fewer games.

[xRUSHx]

The guy is a tooth pick and runs more then he throws, he is going to get squashed in the NFL. He needs a bunch of work just like Allen. Running QBs are dangerous to use as it is In the NFL considering the risk of injury increases with every run but as skinny as he is IMO he is Tyrod at best but more like a Webb in the long run. IMO no thank you, I want a big pocket passer that stays protected by big linemen.

 

Rosen, Darnold, Mayfield, Rudolph

Edited January 21, 2018 by xRUSHx

[PIZ]

 

[Captain Murica]

To the people saying Lamar is the same as TT are wrong, and pretty ignorant. Just because both are African American, and mobile QBs doesn’t mean they’re comparable at all. Just by comparing their passing stats it’s not even close in how TT wasn’t in the same league as LJ as a passer.

I’ve thought that in the past and recognize it was wrong. I’d be happy with Lamar Jackson. 

 

TT college passing stats (4 years) 

 

						Passing
Year ▲	School	Conf	Class	Pos	G	Cmp	Att	Pct	Yds	Y/A	AY/A	TD	Int	Rate
Career	Virginia Tech					495	865	57.2	7017	8.1	8.1	44	20	137
*2007	Virginia Tech	ACC	FR	QB	11	72	134	53.7	927	6.9	6.7	5	3	119.7
*2008	Virginia Tech	ACC	SO	QB	12	99	173	57.2	1036	6.0	4.4	2	7	103.3
*2009	Virginia Tech	ACC	JR	QB	13	136	243	56.0	2311	9.5	9.7	13	5	149.4
*2010	Virginia Tech	ACC	SR	QB	14	188	315	59.7	2743	8.7	9.5	24	5	154.8

 

 

Lamar Jackson’s college passing stats (3 years)

 

						Passing
Year	School	Conf	Class	Pos	G	Cmp	Att	Pct	Yds	Y/A	AY/A	TD	Int	Rate
Career	Louisville					619	1086	57.0	9043	8.3	8.5	69	27	142.9
*2015	Louisville	ACC	FR	QB	12	135	247	54.7	1840	7.4	7.0	12	8	126.8
*2016	Louisville	ACC	SO	QB	13	230	409	56.2	3543	8.7	9.1	30	9	148.8
2017	Louisville	ACC	JR	QB	13	254	430	59.1	3660	8.5	8.7	27	10	146.6

 

 

 

Edited January 21, 2018 by Captain Murica

[BringBackOrton]

3 minutes ago, Captain Murica said:

To the people saying Lamar is the same as TT are wrong, and pretty ignorant. Just because both are African American, and mobile QBs doesn’t mean they’re comparable at all. Just by comparing their passing stats it’s not even close in how TT wasn’t in the same league as LJ as a passer.

I’ve thought that in the past and recognize it was wrong. I’d be happy with Lamar Jackson. 

 

TT college passing stats (4 years) 

 

						Passing
Year ▲	School	Conf	Class	Pos	G	Cmp	Att	Pct	Yds	Y/A	AY/A	TD	Int	Rate
Career	Virginia Tech					495	865	57.2	7017	8.1	8.1	44	20	137
*2007	Virginia Tech	ACC	FR	QB	11	72	134	53.7	927	6.9	6.7	5	3	119.7
*2008	Virginia Tech	ACC	SO	QB	12	99	173	57.2	1036	6.0	4.4	2	7	103.3
*2009	Virginia Tech	ACC	JR	QB	13	136	243	56.0	2311	9.5	9.7	13	5	149.4
*2010	Virginia Tech	ACC	SR	QB	14	188	315	59.7	2743	8.7	9.5	24	5	154.8

 

 

Lamar Jackson’s college passing stats (3 years)

 

						Passing
Year	School	Conf	Class	Pos	G	Cmp	Att	Pct	Yds	Y/A	AY/A	TD	Int	Rate
Career	Louisville					619	1086	57.0	9043	8.3	8.5	69	27	142.9
*2015	Louisville	ACC	FR	QB	12	135	247	54.7	1840	7.4	7.0	12	8	126.8
*2016	Louisville	ACC	SO	QB	13	230	409	56.2	3543	8.7	9.1	30	9	148.8
2017	Louisville	ACC	JR	QB	13	254	430	59.1	3660	8.5	8.7	27	10	146.6

 

 

 

Their senior numbers are pretty similar.

[starrymessenger]

58 minutes ago, JohnC said:

I respectfully but strenuously disagree with your assessment of Mayfield. 

 

With respect to the highlighted area I have no interest in Jackson as a dual threat qb in the pros. That's the last thing I want for my qb. My advocacy for Jackson is that I believe in time he will be a good pro qb who can run a full range offense with the benefit of being a judicious runner when need be. 

 

If I had the choice between Mayfield and Jackson I would without hesitation take Mayfield. One of Mayfield's best attributes is his stunning accuracy. That attribute easily translates to the pro game. 

 

Well as I've indicated I like Mayfield too, but I would take Jackson ahead of him.

Obviously Mayfield's greatest attribute is his accuracy. That's important of course, but he offers more than that. He has a lively arm, has good mechanics, is mobile and can make plays in or out of the pocket. He reacts well enuf when rushed and can execute under pressure. But some of the same questions surrounding Rudolphs ability to transition to the NFL in fairness have also yet to be answered by Mayfield. It's easier to play well when your receivers are "college" open, when your O is relatively simple your line and your ground game is very good. As I mentioned some analysts feel that Mayfield has yet to show that he goes through his progressions, that he is not a system baby running a one read college passing offence. 

Regarding Jackson as a dual threat QB, clearly we are not talking about using him as a running QB here. He needs to be first and foremost a passer who can execute from the pocket. But when a guy has his type of athletic ability you should definitely scheme to take advantage of it when it makes sense to do so. That's what Carolina does with Cam and it's what Houston did with D. Watson last year. It's an added dimension that would not only yield yardage and extend drives but also create difficulties for opposing DCs and open things up for other skill position players. Just makes you so much harder to defence. Imagine if Tyrod was good as a passer in addition to being a threat to run. What would our offence have then been the last couple of years. Possibly dominant IMO. 

If he bulks up a bit Jackson is a big, sturdy kid. Tyrod has been pretty durable. I believe Jackson would be too. 

Edited January 21, 2018 by starrymessenger

[Captain Murica]

11 minutes ago, jmc12290 said:

Their senior numbers are pretty similar.

 

Lamar is a junior, and he threw 100 more

passes than TT. 

[starrymessenger]

6 minutes ago, jmc12290 said:

Their senior numbers are pretty similar.

 

Jackson threw more and for more yards. More to the point, they played in very different offences. 

It also makes little sense to compare Mayfield's or Rudolph's stat sheet with Allen's or Jackson's. The Os are very different with the pro style being more difficult and the calibre of the supporting skill position players being totally different.

[Rob's House]

I'm not high on LamaRG3 just because I'd prefer a traditional pocket passer, but if we got him without having to trade up I wouldn't hate it. 

 

The biggest ? is whether he can read NFL defenses and go through his progressions. If not he's just a rich man's Tyrod Taylor, but that might not be such a bad thing. Michael Vick wasn't great and picking apart defenses and he won a lot of games.

[FearLess Price]

3 hours ago, Tatonka68 said:

Tyrod part 2.No thanks another "gifted" athlete that cannot read a defense.  I pass.

 

 

Did you watch tape?

 

Its obvious he goes through 2-4 reads on certain plays.

 

[billsredneck1]

2 hours ago, PIZ said:

I'm very intrigued with Jackson.  The guy is electric.  However, I am concerned about this:

 

Completion %:

 

2015….. 54.7

2016..... 56.2

2017..... 59.1

College career average... 57.0

=  NO

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, OldTimer1960 said:

Not much thanks to Taylor, though.  Brady threw 65% more TDS in 3 fewer games.

 

You realize there are more than 1 way to score right at TD right?  No disrespect, but its this type of comment that drives me crazy.  The QB is only part of the offense, and our QB both runs and throws.  Its not like we were 3rd in the league in TD's because we had 20 touchdown runs by McCoy that were 80 yard each and TT never touched the ball.  TT led the offense down the field where he both used his arm and his leg to get the team in scoring position so we could score points.

 

First off, anyone who ONLY sites his passing stats throwing isn't giving a fair assessment in the first place as he also makes a big contribution with his legs.  Second, anyone who compares any QB to one of the 2 greatest QB's to ever play the game is also not giving a fair assessment.  More importantly, the scoreboard doesn't care if it was thrown in or run in...the object of the game is to score points, and in 2016 we were 3rd best at it in the whole NFL under TT's leadership of the offense during his 15 starts despite losing our WR"s to injuries, having an inept HC, and firing our OC in week 2.  

 

The QB's job is to put the team in position to score points, whether its thrown in or run in, its still 6 points.  And 2015 and 2016 are only behind the first 3 SB years as the 2 highest scoring 2 year period in Bills history.  TT led offense put up 25 points or more in 10 of his 15 games in 2016 and averaged 26 points per game.  That was better than almost all the playoff teams in 2016.

 

So again, no disrespect but your comment is not accurate.  I don't care what you or anyone thinks of TT,  you don't get to take away his contributions to the points on the board when he was part of almost every one of those scoring drives.  This guy led the Bills to snap our 17 year playoff drought and yet he still cant get respect for the positive things he did do for this team.  Doesn't matter if you think we need an upgrade, thats fine, but people need to stop discrediting the things he DID do for this team just to further their biased opinion.  

Edited January 21, 2018 by Alphadawg7

[Call_Of_Ktulu]

Bill Polian is a good GM but his strong suit was evaluating QB's. I don't think their is a better draft evaluator when it comes to QB's.    I agree with him in his evaluation of Jackson.

[starrymessenger]

3 minutes ago, Rob's House said:

I'm not high on LamaRG3 just because I'd prefer a traditional pocket passer, but if we got him without having to trade up I wouldn't hate it. 

 

The biggest ? is whether he can read NFL defenses and go through his progressions. If not he's just a rich man's Tyrod Taylor, but that might not be such a bad thing. Michael Vick wasn't great and picking apart defenses and he won a lot of games.

 

He can absolutely read a defence and go through his progressions. Something you should do in watching the tape is look at him in the pocket, see how well he moves to avoid pressure by making sometimes small adjustments, look what happens when the pocket gets smaller or when a d-lineman starts to penetrate the line, he does not bail until the last possible moment all the while beforehand surveying the field. Above all look at his feet in the pocket - they are drop dead quiet. Just check out the tape again. It's right there in front of your eyes.

This guy projects as a pocket passer. Of course the fact that he can run like Tyrod or Vick (or maybe better) if he has to is not bad either.

[billsredneck1]

57 minutes ago, xRUSHx said:

The guy is a tooth pick and runs more then he throws, he is going to get squashed in the NFL. He needs a bunch of work just like Allen. Running QBs are dangerous to use as it is In the NFL considering the risk of injury increases with every run but as skinny as he is IMO he is Tyrod at best but more like a Webb in the long run. IMO no thank you, I want a big pocket passer that stays protected by big linemen.

 

Rosen, Darnold, Mayfield, Rudolph

a smart(cerebral) qb with throwing skills = an nfl qb . tt got us nowhere. that running/qb thing may have worked 20 yrs.  ago, but it ain't gonna work anymore. that term certainly cannot be mixed with the term franchise qb.

[starrymessenger]

5 minutes ago, Call_Of_Ktulu said:

Bill Polian is a good GM but his strong suit was evaluating QB's. I don't think their is a better draft evaluator when it comes to QB's.    I agree with him in his evaluation of Jackson.

 

Yeah, Bill thought Johhny Football was going to be elite.

He works for ESPN now. It's more about hot takes and media traction than analysis.

You should try and make up your own mind rather than relying on somebody else.

[Putin]

3 hours ago, mob16151 said:

Apropos of nothing,I'd love to see what Daboll would do with Jackson. He's 10x the passer Hurts is.

I guess you missed the second half of the championship game 

I think that Jackson will be drafted MUCH earlier them some you think , and could even be the 4th QB of the board 

[DCOrange]

51 minutes ago, Rob's House said:

I'm not high on LamaRG3 just because I'd prefer a traditional pocket passer, but if we got him without having to trade up I wouldn't hate it. 

 

The biggest ? is whether he can read NFL defenses and go through his progressions. If not he's just a rich man's Tyrod Taylor, but that might not be such a bad thing. Michael Vick wasn't great and picking apart defenses and he won a lot of games.

It’s certainly a fair question regarding going through progressions, but to that end, he’s shown far more of it than Darnold, Mayfield, or Rudolph has. Allen and Rosen are ahead of him in that regard though. I think scouts have to rely on private workouts for that stuff a lot more nowadays due to the types of offenses that are run in college. 

Edited January 21, 2018 by DCOrange

[Solomon Grundy]

3 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Yeah, thats what I would do too for same reasons.  But I could see the Bills wanting to sign Teddy instead as he would be cheaper than TT, which I wouldn't hate either.  

 

 

Alphadawg, I've been on the Jackson train for awhile and I would rather have Bridgewater as a mentor than Tyrod. Not only because Teddy may be cheaper, but he throws with anticipation. I would hate for Lamar to pick up Tyrod's tendency of not letting it rip. I think what helped in Aaron Rodgers development was watching Favre throw into tight windows. Rodgers, like Jackson, needed to improve his footwork. Lamar's has improved reading defenses. He now needs to work on resetting his feet consistently from the pocket. I believe Jackson's ceiling is Aaron Rodgers and his floor is Michael Vick. 

43 minutes ago, starrymessenger said:

 

Yeah, Bill thought Johhny Football was going to be elite.

He works for ESPN now. It's more about hot takes and media traction than analysis.

You should try and make up your own mind rather than relying on somebody else.

He also thought Landry Jones was gonna be a great NFL QB. Polian is also on record saying that he wish he would've drafted Andy Dalton over Andrew Luck. What a great evaluator of QBs!!

Edited January 21, 2018 by the skycap

[JohnC]

46 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

You realize there are more than 1 way to score right at TD right?  No disrespect, but its this type of comment that drives me crazy.  The QB is only part of the offense, and our QB both runs and throws.  Its not like we were 3rd in the league in TD's because we had 20 touchdown runs by McCoy that were 80 yard each and TT never touched the ball.  TT led the offense down the field where he both used his arm and his leg to get the team in scoring position so we could score points.

 

First off, anyone who ONLY sites his passing stats throwing isn't giving a fair assessment in the first place as he also makes a big contribution with his legs.  Second, anyone who compares any QB to one of the 2 greatest QB's to ever play the game is also not giving a fair assessment.  More importantly, the scoreboard doesn't care if it was thrown in or run in...the object of the game is to score points, and in 2016 we were 3rd best at it in the whole NFL under TT's leadership of the offense during his 15 starts despite losing our WR"s to injuries, having an inept HC, and firing our OC in week 2.  

 

The QB's job is to put the team in position to score points, whether its thrown in or run in, its still 6 points.  And 2015 and 2016 are only behind the first 3 SB years as the 2 highest scoring 2 year period in Bills history.  TT led offense put up 25 points or more in 10 of his 15 games in 2016 and averaged 26 points per game.  That was better than almost all the playoff teams in 2016.

 

So again, no disrespect but your comment is not accurate.  I don't care what you or anyone thinks of TT,  you don't get to take away his contributions to the points on the board when he was part of almost every one of those scoring drives.  This guy led the Bills to snap our 17 year playoff drought and yet he still cant get respect for the positive things he did do for this team. Doesn't matter if you think we need an upgrade, thats fine, but people need to stop discrediting the things he DID do for this team just to further their biased opinion.  

You too often act as if a criticism of TT is comparable to making a demeaning comment about someone's mother. When Whaley wanted to cut TT loose was that because he was biased? If this brain trust decides to let him go will that be because they are biased? 

 

Taylor's play in the Jacksonville playoff game was an exhibition of unmatched futility. If after that game and season you don't understand why there is a strong sentiment within the organization to move on then there is little else to say other than this particular player won't be a topic of discussion for too much longer because he won't be on the team. Very often personnel decisions are tough to make. This isn't one of them. 

[Virgil]

I don’t know why, but he reminds me a lot of Geno Smith, with legs....

[Solomon Grundy]

2 minutes ago, Virgil said:

I don’t know why, but he reminds me a lot of Geno Smith, with legs....

Virgil, Geno was quite mobile too. 

[OldTimer1960]

4 hours ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

 

 

....guyz, need some help as I do not get to see college ball, but have read about Jackson....is he an upscale TT and if so, would he fit the recent OC Daboll hire from what we know?.....

You can see every throw from several of his games at draftbreakdown.com

[Captain Murica]

1 hour ago, starrymessenger said:

 

Jackson threw more and for more yards. More to the point, they played in very different offences. 

It also makes little sense to compare Mayfield's or Rudolph's stat sheet with Allen's or Jackson's. The Os are very different with the pro style being more difficult and the calibre of the supporting skill position players being totally different.

Also, Lamar declared early as a junior . He produced way more touchdowns overall in 3 years than tyrod did in 4 years. 

[OldTimer1960]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

You realize there are more than 1 way to score right at TD right?  No disrespect, but its this type of comment that drives me crazy.  The QB is only part of the offense, and our QB both runs and throws.  Its not like we were 3rd in the league in TD's because we had 20 touchdown runs by McCoy that were 80 yard each and TT never touched the ball.  TT led the offense down the field where he both used his arm and his leg to get the team in scoring position so we could score points.

 

First off, anyone who ONLY sites his passing stats throwing isn't giving a fair assessment in the first place as he also makes a big contribution with his legs.  Second, anyone who compares any QB to one of the 2 greatest QB's to ever play the game is also not giving a fair assessment.  More importantly, the scoreboard doesn't care if it was thrown in or run in...the object of the game is to score points, and in 2016 we were 3rd best at it in the whole NFL under TT's leadership of the offense during his 15 starts despite losing our WR"s to injuries, having an inept HC, and firing our OC in week 2.  

 

The QB's job is to put the team in position to score points, whether its thrown in or run in, its still 6 points.  And 2015 and 2016 are only behind the first 3 SB years as the 2 highest scoring 2 year period in Bills history.  TT led offense put up 25 points or more in 10 of his 15 games in 2016 and averaged 26 points per game.  That was better than almost all the playoff teams in 2016.

 

So again, no disrespect but your comment is not accurate.  I don't care what you or anyone thinks of TT,  you don't get to take away his contributions to the points on the board when he was part of almost every one of those scoring drives.  This guy led the Bills to snap our 17 year playoff drought and yet he still cant get respect for the positive things he did do for this team.  Doesn't matter if you think we need an upgrade, thats fine, but people need to stop discrediting the things he DID do for this team just to further their biased opinion.  

I appreciate that the Bills snapped the drought with him at QB.  Check my posts on this - I have said many times that the Bills could and have done much worse at QB than Tyrod gave them.  However, the evidence is overwhelming that he is a very limited NFL passer.  Just check Watkin's, Woods' and Goodwin's stats in their first year with other QBs -or- check Clay's, Benjamin's and Mathew's stats before Taylor was their QB.

 

Yes, Taylor can run, but teams bottled him up well this year.  They are not really pushing the pocket and are daring him to beat them passing.  He has not shown that he can make defenses pay for that.

 

i like and respect Taylor, but he is flat not good enough to be the starting QB on a contender.  He may find a starting gig on a bottom 25% of the league team, but that team is already looking for his replacement before he even gets there.

[Tatonka68]

1 hour ago, FearLess Price said:

 

 

Did you watch tape?

 

Its obvious he goes through 2-4 reads on certain plays.

 

1st read is primary receiver, 2nd is to run.

2 hours ago, Captain Murica said:

To the people saying Lamar is the same as TT are wrong, and pretty ignorant. Just because both are African American, and mobile QBs doesn’t mean they’re comparable at all. Just by comparing their passing stats it’s not even close in how TT wasn’t in the same league as LJ as a passer.

I’ve thought that in the past and recognize it was wrong. I’d be happy with Lamar Jackson. 

 

TT college passing stats (4 years) 

 

						Passing
Year ▲	School	Conf	Class	Pos	G	Cmp	Att	Pct	Yds	Y/A	AY/A	TD	Int	Rate
Career	Virginia Tech					495	865	57.2	7017	8.1	8.1	44	20	137
*2007	Virginia Tech	ACC	FR	QB	11	72	134	53.7	927	6.9	6.7	5	3	119.7
*2008	Virginia Tech	ACC	SO	QB	12	99	173	57.2	1036	6.0	4.4	2	7	103.3
*2009	Virginia Tech	ACC	JR	QB	13	136	243	56.0	2311	9.5	9.7	13	5	149.4
*2010	Virginia Tech	ACC	SR	QB	14	188	315	59.7	2743	8.7	9.5	24	5	154.8

 

 

Lamar Jackson’s college passing stats (3 years)

 

						Passing
Year	School	Conf	Class	Pos	G	Cmp	Att	Pct	Yds	Y/A	AY/A	TD	Int	Rate
Career	Louisville					619	1086	57.0	9043	8.3	8.5	69	27	142.9
*2015	Louisville	ACC	FR	QB	12	135	247	54.7	1840	7.4	7.0	12	8	126.8
*2016	Louisville	ACC	SO	QB	13	230	409	56.2	3543	8.7	9.1	30	9	148.8
2017	Louisville	ACC	JR	QB	13	254	430	59.1	3660	8.5	8.7	27	10	146.6

 

 

 

LJ and Tyrod are the same damn p!ayer, neither can read a defense. Both suck against quality defenses and pad stats against bad defenses.

Edited January 21, 2018 by Tatonka68

[Johnny Hammersticks]

1 minute ago, Tatonka68 said:

1st read is primary receiver, 2nd is to run.

 

Fake news.  You obviously have no idea what you’re talking about, friendo.

[Tatonka68]

3 minutes ago, Johnny Hammersticks said:

 

Fake news.  You obviously have no idea what you’re talking about, friendo.

Nope watched him play, cannot read a defense and pads stats against sub par teams. Maybe CFL not NFL.

Edited January 21, 2018 by Tatonka68

[Turk71]

51 minutes ago, DCOrange said:

It’s certainly a fair question regarding going through progressions, but to that end, he’s shown far more of it than Darnold, Mayfield, or Rudolph has. Allen and Rosen are ahead of him in that regard though. I think scouts have to rely on private workouts for that stuff a lot more nowadays due to the types of offenses that are run in college. 

I was just watching Mayfield and he looked like he processed the field very quickly and made great decisions. Watched Jackson film too and there is no way he is ahead in that regard imo. Think both of them are risky proposition with high ceilings.

[Alphadawg7]

51 minutes ago, the skycap said:

Alphadawg, I've been on the Jackson train for awhile and I would rather have Bridgewater as a mentor than Tyrod. Not only because Teddy may be cheaper, but he throws with anticipation. I would hate for Lamar to pick up Tyrod's tendency of not letting it rip. I think what helped in Aaron Rodgers development was watching Favre throw into tight windows. Rodgers, like Jackson, needed to improve his footwork. Lamar's has improved reading defenses. He now needs to work on resetting his feet consistently from the pocket. I believe Jackson's ceiling is Aaron Rodgers and his floor is Michael Vick. 

He also thought Landry Jones was gonna be a great NFL QB. Polian is also on record saying that he wish he would've drafted Andy Dalton over Andrew Luck. What a great evaluator of QBs!!

 

Yeah, I do like singing Teddy too, he's the one QB FA I want the most outside of Cousins.  But signing Teddy and drafting a QB high still.  I do think TT is still in play with Lamar though, but you also make a good point of not wanting the same tendencies now that you bring that up.  Thats a very good point.

38 minutes ago, JohnC said:

You too often act as if a criticism of TT is comparable to making a demeaning comment about someone's mother. When Whaley wanted to cut TT loose was that because he was biased? If this brain trust decides to let him go will that be because they are biased? 

 

Taylor's play in the Jacksonville playoff game was an exhibition of unmatched futility. If after that game and season you don't understand why there is a strong sentiment within the organization to move on then there is little else to say other than this particular player won't be a topic of discussion for too much longer because he won't be on the team. Very often personnel decisions are tough to make. This isn't one of them. 

 

Criticism is fine, to say the offense being 3rd in TD's in his 15 games had nothing to do with him is absurd, and thats what I responded too.  People go way out of their to take any and all credit from any success the offense has while TT is QB.  Its utterly ridiculous.  There is a VERY big difference of pointing out his weaknesses and saying that everything the offense accomplished had nothing to do with him.  Thats what I tire of...and thats what my reply was about that you responded to.

 

Tyrod has clear weaknesses, always has.  But the naysayers on him grossly exaggerate how "bad" he is and work hard to discredit take away from what he did do positive just to further that opinion.

[Ol Dirty B]

This would be the worst place for Jackson.

 

The coaches already showed they won't support a mobile qb and use that to their advantage. He may be able produced from the pocket, he's shown an effort of doing this in college.

 

But with the great white American hope behind him, I hope this coach staff doesn't subject another black qb to the overwhelming stupidity that is a buffalo bills fan. 

[purple haze]

4 hours ago, PIZ said:

 

Just scary when we are coming off how many years of horrid QB play?  I want a sure bet.  Daboll is probably the best place though for Lamar Jackson.

No guarantees on a drafted player.  Great could come from any round and so could a bust.  You want a sure thing then you want Cousins.  You know what he'll give you.

[Alphadawg7]

18 minutes ago, OldTimer1960 said:

I appreciate that the Bills snapped the drought with him at QB.  Check my posts on this - I have said many times that the Bills could and have done much worse at QB than Tyrod gave them.  However, the evidence is overwhelming that he is a very limited NFL passer.  Just check Watkin's, Woods' and Goodwin's stats in their first year with other QBs -or- check Clay's, Benjamin's and Mathew's stats before Taylor was their QB.

 

Yes, Taylor can run, but teams bottled him up well this year.  They are not really pushing the pocket and are daring him to beat them passing.  He has not shown that he can make defenses pay for that.

 

i like and respect Taylor, but he is flat not good enough to be the starting QB on a contender.  He may find a starting gig on a bottom 25% of the league team, but that team is already looking for his replacement before he even gets there.

 

Not much wrong with any of this, but you do understand that this is a very different post than just flat out saying Taylor had little to do with the scoring and then compared his throwing TD stats only to the one of the greatest players in NFL history?  

 

That is where I get frustrated...I dont have an issue with the criticism of his weaknesses, its warranted and accurate.  But even with the weaknesses the Bills have had some of the highest scoring seasons in team history, and he was a significant part of that.  To say he wasn't just is a completely false statement.  Taylor gave everything he had to this team, and he had some special moments and incredible plays.  He also led this team to the playoffs for the first time in 17 years during a year everyone said we were a 4 to 5 win team and tanking.  He deserves more credit than he gets by fans here.  He isnt the long term solution, but he was a lot better than many gave him credit for.

[Turk71]

6 minutes ago, Ol Dirty B said:

This would be the worst place for Jackson.

 

The coaches already showed they won't support a mobile qb and use that to their advantage. He may be able produced from the pocket, he's shown an effort of doing this in college.

 

But with the great white American hope behind him, I hope this coach staff doesn't subject another black qb to the overwhelming stupidity that is a buffalo bills fan. 

Is it because he is a mobile qb or because he is black? Are you overwhelmingly stupid or it just other Bills fans? 

[Ol Dirty B]

9 minutes ago, Turk71 said:

Is it because he is a mobile qb or because he is black? Are you overwhelmingly stupid or it just other Bills fans? 

 

Well, it's quite simple and they were in these things they call paragraphs. We use them to separate thoughts.

 

Coaches have shown they won't take advantage of an athletic qb, which is fine. It's a difference in philosophy, how they went about it, I'll disagree with.

 

Buffalo bills fans obsession with the great white hope is a joke, it's flat out wrong. Peterman sucks. I was out at a bar for the playoff game, and people actually cheered when they saw peterman coming in. It's a joke and embarrassing. People are warming up to Alex Smith and he sucks too. He went a whole season without throwing a td pass to a wr. So yea it is a black thing going on with the fan base in my opinion. If you feel offended by that it's probably because their is some truth to it.

 

But yea you're simple. 

Edited January 21, 2018 by Ol Dirty B

[Johnny Hammersticks]

19 minutes ago, Ol Dirty B said:

This would be the worst place for Jackson.

 

The coaches already showed they won't support a mobile qb and use that to their advantage. He may be able produced from the pocket, he's shown an effort of doing this in college.

 

But with the great white American hope behind him, I hope this coach staff doesn't subject another black qb to the overwhelming stupidity that is a buffalo bills fan. 

 

You do know we just hired a new OC, correct?  One, in fact, that is regarded as an OC who adapts his offense to capitalize on the strength of his QB and other play makers...

[Ol Dirty B]

1 minute ago, Johnny Hammersticks said:

 

You do know we just hired a new OC, correct?  One, in fact, that is regarded as an OC who adapts his offense to capitalize on the strength of his QB and other play makers...

 

I have read he likes to capitalize on strengths vs weaknesses. More on a week to week basis though, and i hope he does that. However, I can't go off the unknown. McDermott hired a guy originally who wanted a pocket passer under center. I think it's fair to assume that's what he'd prefer. 

 

What I'm saying already happened, what you're talking about is something you'd hope would change. Do you want Tyrod back? Or a mobile qb? That is kind of the argument you are making, or are you just making an argument for the sake of it?