BuffaloBill Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 Not to mention the fact that the OLD Giants stadium (which is now a parking lot) still has north of $100M in debt that won't be paid off for another decade. Did anybody bother to ask Mara about that? Source: http://mobile.nytimes.com/2010/09/08/sports/08stadium.html Thank you for that article... There should be far more public outcry over billionaires bilking taxpayers out of huge sums of money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 Thank you for that article... There should be far more public outcry over billionaires bilking taxpayers out of huge sums of money. There is plenty of it...one of the reasons the Chargers and Raiders are having difficulty getting new stadiums.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddaryl Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 if Buffalo doesn't upgrade to a nice modern stadium then all I can say is its still Bumbling Buffalo Buffalo as a city needs this The Ralph is old and tired and they need to stop throwing 100's of millions at it every 5 years IMO You want to be a rising city, a city of the future these kind of projects are a must... I do agree PSL's are a loser situation, but I honestly do not see PSL's being implemented in Buffalo. The big cities were able to use PSL's because they have lots of wealthy stupid people. I do not ever see PSL's being part of a Buffalo plan for multiple reasons My $0.02.... that is all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 I also wouldnt put much stock into Mara's veiled language about the Bills in WNY. IMO he is just speaking out of habit. Its like someone who has been dealt pocket Aces 12 hands in a row and suddenly didn't get that deal this time. It is an interesting dynamic that many saw when Pegula bought the team. Pegula doesnt have it in him to hold the city for ransom. He also has financial stake and also 5-10 years of putting out an image of "great guy/family". Then you have the bloodthirsty owners. On the other hand, will the state/county really bargain in good faith if Pegula isnt threatening? We also have the Delaware North angle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 This is a bunch of hot air. Until 2022, nothing will happen. After that, we have choices. Retrofit the Ralph, downtown, etc. I'm not sure why people would be fearful of the Bills moving from Buffalo. I wouldn't about it too much and I'm in the camp to keep making the Ralph better. Kansas City, Chicago, and so on. There are other cities that refuse to scrap a stadium with history for a new one. The Bills experience is special in Orchard Park. I think that would be lost downtown. At the end of the day, there is really nothing any of us can do about it. Whenever we decide to build a new one, you guys are right, it will be a lot more expensive on game day. I wouldn't exactly call it hot air. The time for planning the best location for a new venue in conjunction with the appropriate supporting infrastructure is now with 2022 being a mere six years away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 I've been pretty adamant that I think that it is coming. The pressure isn't going to subside anytime soon from the other owners. The non shared revenues will continue to grow at a rate that the Ralph can't keep up with. These revenues drive the cap but aren't shared. The gap between the "have's and have not's" will continue to widen. That's why you saw the Rams move and the Raiders and Chargers potentially next. The other owners want these revenues, and their franchise values, to continue to rise. I've gone into more depth on my thoughts in the other stadium thread. I will try not to derail this conversation (as I usually seem to do on the topic). I know you've expanded on it before, but given that we're talking logistics etc. here, it's probably worth laying out one more time. And folks, listen to Kirby's background/opinions on this subject. I don't know of anyone on this board that's been more closely involved in this type of issue before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8-8 Forever? Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 (edited) Nothing wrong with the current facility. New is not always better.... i agree. WNY is not like the rest of the league.. buffalo is just a small city now, just happens to have a daddy warbucks who bent over to keep the team there, which is great by the way. a billiion dollar stadium for wny makes absolutely no economic sense, either for government or for the Pegulas. you cannot possibly make the numbers work... now if Pegs wants to overspend again for a stadium, great, but the county or state shouldn't put any $$ in. think of what a billion $$ would do for all the more pressing problems of WNY. hold out to the last possible minute Edited March 24, 2016 by 8and8-->NoMore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CountDorkula Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 You said "Except it's the 31 other owners say hey Buffalo, get your **** together." - have proof or is your mouth full of ****! For you it is the little yellow bus you drive in when you pass the stadium. Insults, good job bud. i agree. WNY is not like the rest of the league.. buffalo is just a small city now, just happens to have a daddy warbucks who bent over to keep the team there, which is great by the way. a billiion dollar stadium for wny makes absolutely no economic sense, either for government or for the Pegulas. you cannot possibly make the numbers work... now if Pegs wants to overspend again for a stadium, great, but the county or state shouldn't put any $$ in. think of what a billion $$ would do for all the more pressing problems of WNY. hold out to the last possible minute Yea that's it, Buffalo cant afford a stadium because it is too small and too poor. IM sure teh rest of teh league who continue to grow revenue will understand. Or You know what the rest of the owners will say to that. "Get the eff out of Buffalo then" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammered a Lot Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 The Bills are at a huge disadvantage when it comes to marketing it's assets to players aka the stadium. Anyone ever think of that? What does a player care about the stadium except for playing surface. He would care about the practice facilities which there was a huge upgrade done in the renovations, looker rooms, cafeteria, Doubling the size of the weight room, etc. And perhaps soon an announcement of something else which a player might be interested in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 i agree. WNY is not like the rest of the league.. buffalo is just a small city now, just happens to have a daddy warbucks who bent over to keep the team there, which is great by the way. a billiion dollar stadium for wny makes absolutely no economic sense, either for government or for the Pegulas. you cannot possibly make the numbers work... now if Pegs wants to overspend again for a stadium, great, but the county or state shouldn't put any $$ in. think of what a billion $$ would do for all the more pressing problems of WNY. hold out to the last possible minute So if the county or state doesn't put any money towards the stadium....will they now use that money for the pressing problems you're talking about....and why haven't they fixed them already..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 i agree. WNY is not like the rest of the league.. buffalo is just a small city now, just happens to have a daddy warbucks who bent over to keep the team there, which is great by the way. a billiion dollar stadium for wny makes absolutely no economic sense, either for government or for the Pegulas. you cannot possibly make the numbers work... now if Pegs wants to overspend again for a stadium, great, but the county or state shouldn't put any $$ in. think of what a billion $$ would do for all the more pressing problems of WNY. hold out to the last possible minute Of course it makes sense. Regular folks aren't the target audience for a new stadium--it's corporate money they're after. There's plenty of that around in Buffalo, Rochester, Syracuse, Southern Ontario, and Northern PA. And I hardly see how a new stadium would hurt the economy--the tax load on the County residents will be very low per capita, and you can bet that it'll be used for more than football, which will bring money to the area. Also, I wouldn't worry so much about what WNY residents can pay--these are the same people that find no difficulty shelling out for an entire 7-game series of playoff hockey tickets at $200 apiece whenever the Sabres make the postseason. What does a player care about the stadium except for playing surface. He would care about the practice facilities which there was a huge upgrade done in the renovations, looker rooms, cafeteria, Doubling the size of the weight room, etc. And perhaps soon an announcement of something else which a player might be interested in. Based on what the Pegulas have done with the Sabres' facilities, I feel pretty confident you'd be looking at those same changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpberr Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 The last thing the NFL needs is ANOTHER team swimming in a deep ocean of debt. The league right now has several teams that have debt that is 50% or greater than their value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niagara Bill Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 If the Bills could actually be a team on the field this talk would never exist. GreenBay has not got a new modern stadium but they are relevant to the league. The Bills are nothing more than potential money to visiting teams...we have no national appeal for TV because our executives and coaches have been so bad in the last 20 years. If we had a record like the Packers, Patriots or even the Giants no one would ever make these type of statements. Win on the field and all this type of talk stops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollars 2 donuts Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 (edited) Nothing wrong with the current facility. New is not always better.... Ya know what Bart I've changed my mine...I am freakin' with you on this. The cut and paste from the article virtually said what I told to a buddy this morning and it is ridiculous. In short: Build a great new palace, not because you need a great new palace, but because it is a tremendous excuse to charge the s*** out of your customers. NFL: "Hey, come on now, we're all doing it. Sure the Packers didn't have to really do it, but they did something." *starts to whistle and stare at their feet ignoring the 135 million spent on the Ralph last year* Edited March 24, 2016 by dollars 2 donuts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metzelaars_lives Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 (edited) And you sent this from your time warner wifi on your verizon wireless iphone or PC/Laptop using windows explorer - I hate rich people all they do is provide every product I use and conveniently deliver entertainment that I enjoy. What in the world? So because I have a cell phone I'm not allowed to object to calls for a new stadium from other owners. That's not a reach at all. Yes that's the whole point- I do love the entertainment that these rich people provide me. But that entertainment would be able to continue just the same whether or not the Bills build a new stadium. I can assure you that my love for the NFL does not increase every time a team moves into a newer, more modern stadium. If anything it decreases. I just hate being told that this is somehow "necessary." It isn't! Edited March 24, 2016 by metzelaars_lives Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aristocrat Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 NYC built time square on money from the niagara power project...it's time that project pays for the local people. that thing makes like 500 million a year. 1 year of profits from there towards the stadium. everybody made a big deal about cuomo giving buffalo a billion dollars but it was our project. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris heff Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 This is not a matter of if, it is when. A new stadium is inevitable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metzelaars_lives Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 Ya know what Bart I've changed my mine...I am freakin' with you on this. The cut and paste from the article virtually said what I told to a buddy this morning and it is ridiculous. In short: Build a great new palace, not because you need a great new palace, but because it is a tremendous excuse to charge the s*** out of your customers. NFL: "Hey, come on now, we're all doing it. Sure the Packers didn't have to really do it, but they did something." *starts to whistle and stare at their feet ignoring the 135 million spent on the Ralph last year* See he gets it too. Most people in this thread do. If I were Terry Pegula I would tell Mara, on behalf of WNY and Bills fans everywhere, to blow me.This is not a matter of if, it is when. A new stadium is inevitable.Yes, eventually it is. I just don't understand in what universe this is a pressing issue in 2016. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Cubed Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 See he gets it too. Most people in this thread do. If I were Terry Pegula I would tell Mara, on behalf of WNY and Bills fans everywhere, to blow me. Yes, eventually it is. I just don't understand in what universe this is a pressing issue in 2016. So you think Pegula, who is in a business which shares revenue, should tell Mara, who contributes $20m more annually in ticket revenue, to blow him? Do I think Buffalo can make as much in ticket revenue as NY? No obviously not, but I understand owners who contribute more than other owners wanting those owners to maximize their contribution. This is a business for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metzelaars_lives Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 So you think Pegula, who is in a business which shares revenue, should tell Mara, who contributes $20m more annually in ticket revenue, to blow him? Do I think Buffalo can make as much in ticket revenue as NY? No obviously not, but I understand owners who contribute more than other owners wanting those owners to maximize their contribution. This is a business for t Is all ticket revenue 100% shared? If so, I didn't realize that. I assumed that if you're Jerry Jones and you made more money at the ticket office than Pegula, that you actually got to keep some of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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