The PED Twins how much of a possible upgrade and "shot in the arm" do they represent?

[Marcus Aurelius]

Hoecht (Höcht) means highest or utmost in German so the Bills have that going for them ...

 

"Ogunjobi"  Western African

... is a reference to the deity Ogun, the Yoruba god of iron, war  ... yikes

[mjt328]

Not much impact, unfortunately.

 

Michael Hoecht got a lot of hype in the preseason from the analytics crowd, but I didn't specifically notice him doing anything special while rushing the passer.  He had 13.5 sacks in 4 seasons/68 games/31 starts for the Rams.  

 

Larry Ogunjobi was pretty much invisible, and some were speculating he would be a surprise cut (before DeWayne Carter's achilles injury).

[BuffaloBillsGospel2014]

To expect 2 rotational players who have missed the first 6 games of the season and a rookie corner to come in and save the defense is alot to ask although it would be great if they did and I'd be all for it. 

[Ethan in Cleveland]

If Sanders and Carter were not hurt, I'm certain Ogunjobi would not be on the team.  I'm not sure he even plays over a PS call-up guy.  Still would not be surprised if he is cut once DQ and Sanders are back.  

 

As for Hoecht, please don't start with the he looked good in camp nonsense. We heard White and Coleman had great camps.

My only hope for him is that he is an upgrade over Epenesa.  Sure would be nice if our third round pick could make a single play all year.... 

[Alphadawg7]

Hoecht is a good player, better than I think a lot of people realize, and he will help this defense.  Larry O is older, but with the injuries to the DTs and how bad our run defense has been, he should also make a noticeable impact.  And if the front 7 plays better, it can also help our secondary make more plays.  

[Pecker]

I don’t expect anything but some depth from the roid bois.  We are going to rue the day Beane gave out that contract to Hoecht 

[BearNorth]

With Miami in meltdown mode, is a draft choice trade for Douglas a possibility.  He's grading much higher [6th among CB's] than any of our DB's.  Did McBeane miscalculate this?

[SydneyBillsFan]

"Shot in the arm"

 

Ohhhh......I get it

 

 

.

Edited 11 hours ago by SydneyBillsFan

[Process]

I actually feel good about the line. Bosa and Walker are a big upgrade over what we had last year. And we have nice depth. 

 

The back 7 are what's killing us. 

 

 

[BuffaloRebound]

23 minutes ago, BearNorth said:

With Miami in meltdown mode, is a draft choice trade for Douglas a possibility.  He's grading much higher [6th among CB's] than any of our DB's.  Did McBeane miscalculate this?

could see Douglas coming back here.  Miami will probably let a bunch of veterans walk now that their season is over.  Douglas can’t be any worse than what we got plus benford gets hurt every game.  

Edited 11 hours ago by BuffaloRebound

[BillsFanForever19]

Ogunjobi is coming back at just the right time. With T.J. Sanders down, we need a 3T. I don't know that he'll be much of an upgrade from Sanders, but he could be.

 

Hoecht will almost definitely provide more than Javon Solomon, maybe A.J. Epenesa (who has had a good season making plays rotationally).

 

The problem though, is our Defensive woes are at LB, CB, and Safety. Joey Bosa's pass rushing efficiency is very, very good statistically. But the ball is out too quickly for him to get home as much as he should.

 

So I don't think you're going to see too much of a difference from additions along the Defensive Line. I'd love to be wrong tho.

[3rdand12]

2 hours ago, AlCowlingsTaxiService said:

They’re both legit NFL players, but they’re not real difference makers IMO. Can’t hurt, but not sure how much they’ll help. 

I think Hoecht is a nice chess piece who can and will be effective

 Think Lorax and can move around. Hope McD has some influence on his usage.

[Goin Breakdown]

3 hours ago, Sweats said:

Unless they can get pressure on the QB and lighten the load for our CB's/DB's, then i can't really see any difference.

I guess we're number 2 in the league in pressure. The problem is WRs are open so fast it doesn't matter. Quick route passing game and we're cooked. 

2 hours ago, RobbRiddick said:

I really hope these two do well so we can start calling them the PED Twins all the time.

 

I'm guessing if Michael does well Chris Brown will enjoy telling us he's taken the defense to new Hoechts 

"It's a forced fumble and a scoop and score. The junkies are in the lab folks"

[hondo in seattle]

I think Hoecht's versatility is interesting.  If the Bills can use him creatively to confuse offenses, he'll be a plus.  

If they simply use him as another rotational guy - well, then he's just another rotational guy with minimal impact.  

[YoloinOhio]

Can’t be worse 

[EmotionallyUnstable]

It’s not usually a shot in the arm, but in the arse. 
 

If you asked me in August I’d have been more eager to see Hoecht in action. Given the state of the DT room, I think O gun has the bigger opportunity to be a regular contributor early on. 
 

It will be very hard to work all the current DEs into the rotation, will like 1 (Jackson) being inactive. 

 

Groot Bosa Epinessa Hoecht as your rotational guys, and Solomon in on specials. 
 

 

[TFBillsfan]

Hoecht and Ogun BETTER have some impact or it’s only gonna heighten the scrutiny of Beane’s decision making. With 90% of the draft and FA going to the D, he’s hit on Walker and Bosa! He’s whiffed or ignored WR and S. The extensions of Groot, Bernard and Benford are not looking good six games into the season. 
 

 

20 minutes ago, EmotionallyUnstable said:

It’s not usually a shot in the arm, but in the arse. 
 

If you asked me in August I’d have been more eager to see Hoecht in action. Given the state of the DT room, I think O gun has the bigger opportunity to be a regular contributor early on. 
 

It will be very hard to work all the current DEs into the rotation, will like 1 (Jackson) being inactive. 

 

Groot Bosa Epinessa Hoecht as your rotational guys, and Solomon in on specials. 
 

 

When you look at this DE rotation, it really brings a spotlight on why we drafted Landon Jackson in the 3rd instead of addressing WR or S? Beane used it as a luxury pick instead of addressing other roster needs for a player that is likely to be inactive most of the season. 

[EmotionallyUnstable]

8 minutes ago, TFBillsfan said:

Hoecht and Ogun BETTER have some impact or it’s only gonna heighten the scrutiny of Beane’s decision making. With 90% of the draft and FA going to the D, he’s hit on Walker and Bosa! He’s whiffed or ignored WR and S. The extensions of Groot, Bernard and Benford are not looking good six games into the season. 
 

 

When you look at this DE rotation, it really brings a spotlight on why we drafted Landon Jackson in the 3rd instead of addressing WR or S? Beane used it as a luxury pick instead of addressing other roster needs for a player that is likely to be inactive most of the season. 

You have to look past this season for that answer. 2026 DEs under contract are only Groot, Hoecht and Solomon (who personally I don’t think is a valid 3 down option). I am sure if you asked Beane he would mention that they’re trying to win a Super Bowl AND sustain success year after year. 
 

I agree it’s frustrating and disappointing given the results thus far. I am also curious if they expected Epiness to have as good of a year as he is having.  Possibly they wanted to move him or Solomon, bringing the DE numbers to a more reasonable number. Bosas injury history could play into this, as well as the suspension. 
 

It’s 100% fair to question the investment, although idk how much more a 3rd round WR or S would be contributing at this point. 

[DrPJax]

     They can’t make up for small lbs who can’t stay healthy and are now afraid to shoot gaps and hit and who suddenly even struggle in zone coverage.  We are the worst team in missing tackles.  They also can’t make up for white being done and unable to cover anyone as QBs target him. They can’t make up for Bedford suddenly playing like a 6 th round talent. They can’t make up for safety play that has been horrendous with Rapp not making any impact and bishop making horrible reads and being unable to tackle backs. The dl wasn’t the worst part of the d this year, it’s an injured small lb group , cb play who rarely get pbu’s , and safties that are just poor with communication and hitting.  
 

     Good teams , especially KC , will absolutely shred this d.  Who can’t see this coming ?  The ped guys also can’t run routes and can’t force the oc to quit putting players in boxes and utilize the best rb in the passing game. Mcd has finally gotten two yes men as coordinators who are only allowed to do what he  wants and unfortunately he is an offensive mind.  He is a defensive guru supposedly yet our d 9 years into his tenure is probably the worst it has ever been. Two avg free agents aren’t going to fix this mess.  Throw in beans poor drafting with d assets while ignoring weapons for Josh while smugly ridiculing critics and it’s a mess they deserve to be in.  The colts and pats are playing better and that’s the reality of not infusing new talent , but bringing back guys you already cut once for deteriorating play. 

[biggerdaddynj]

In regard to the Hoecht signing, time to remember all we heard about how much the Bills were enamored with him and targeted him as a FA signing, let’s hope he can at least “move the needle a bit”: 

• A "chess piece" for the defense: During his time with the Rams, Hoecht played several positions, including mugging the A-gaps and serving as a versatile piece for the defense. The Bills envisioned a specific role for him, knowing his adaptability.
• Long-standing interest: The Bills' front office and coaching staff were well-acquainted with Hoecht's capabilities, having tracked him for several seasons.
• Prior experience: Hoecht had previously practiced against some members of the Bills' defensive line, including Joey Bosa, during joint practices with the Rams, giving him familiarity with the personnel.
• Suspension and roster management: Before signing Hoecht, the Bills were aware he would serve a six-game suspension for a PED violation. Despite this, they still pursued him. 
• Versatility in Buffalo: In Buffalo, Hoecht has continued to be a versatile defensive lineman, moving between different spots. This flexibility has been a key reason for the team's long-term interest in him.

Now it’s time to see if he’s a JAG, a JAG plus or a nice signing.