Latest Wande Owens (UDFA) Hype

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, Logic said:

 in Sean McDermott's defense, his chance at success with the Bills will come down to his football IQ and mental processing. 

 

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

Just now, Dan said:

I think folks need to get used to Hamlin being on the team longer.  I know it’s a popular opinion to dump on him, but he started all season on a team that was a few minutes away from a SuperBowl.   He’ll be on the team, at the very least throughout his rookie deal and probably longer depending upon his contract  amounts. 
 

 

 

He's great as a depth safety.  He knows the players around him, the checks, the calls.  He's a minus as an athlete though, and id say a poor tackler.  But those are the same weak traits of someone like cam lewis.  Your backups likely won't be both plus athletes and heady knowledgeable guys. Those guys are usually just... starters.  

[Mat68]

1 hour ago, Bleeding Bills Blue said:

 

He's great as a depth safety.  He knows the players around him, the checks, the calls.  He's a minus as an athlete though, and id say a poor tackler.  But those are the same weak traits of someone like cam lewis.  Your backups likely won't be both plus athletes and heady knowledgeable guys. Those guys are usually just... starters.  

I think you can have one of Ingram, Lewis and Hamlin.  All three is an issue. 

[NewEra]

3 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

well, let's see... Rapp and Hamlin have, combined, 6 training camps in Buffalo.  Has this annual competition made them much better?  You would have to argue, based on your own statement above, that obviously it has not.

 

 

 

This post could be top 5 most enjoyable in @Mr. WEO history  

 

Which annual competition are you speaking of?   There has been exactly 1 completion at S under this regime.  Taylor Rapp played much better than I had anticipated.  Damar Hamlin, while not my choice, played slightly better than I had anticipated as well.  
 

or are you speaking of every position?  As in Elam vs Benford….in which a 6th rd pick is now an All pro. Or 5th rd pick Shakir is now a 15M WR.  Or Spencer brown (vs Daryl Williams) David edwards (vs Svpg) your lover boy Gabe Davis (vs sanders, brown), Milano, Bernard and Dorian Williams (vs entire units of vets) 

 

competition breeds improvement.  I’m fairly confident this is a fact in most aspects of life…..

 

but do you mang.  Typical Weo nonsense.  Just here to argue

Edited 21 hours ago by NewEra

[thenorthremembers]

The article should of been discredited the second Chris Trepasso's name was mentioned. 

[TheWeatherMan]

4 hours ago, BigAl2526 said:

I agree he is a long shot to make the active roster.  His route of least resistance is probably to end up on the PS and hope for an injury to a guy ahead of him on the roster.

Have you seen the Safeties on this roster?  IMO S is the best position for an UDFA to make this team.   

[RoyBatty is alive]

3 hours ago, Mat68 said:

I think that is what opens the door.  No one has taken control of either spot.  Rapp and Bishop are on the roster and Hancock is likely a utility Db. Thats its.  I felt one of the biggest glaring issues with the team was the athleticism of the secondary.  Owens brings that.  Would have to wow on teams.  His ability lend itself to the type of guys that do that.   Talking 53rd guy who would be active game days.  I dont think he is a lock but certainly a guy to monitor. 

Watching his tape is impressive, he is extremely smart, quick decisions and rarely takes a bad angle or tricked, a solid tackler,

[BillsFanForever19]

14 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

While it is definitely a crowded room I think he has a shot. All UDFAs face an uphill battle to make rosters but there is only Rapp and Bishop of all the safeties the Bills have that I think are roster LOCKS. There is a lot of traffic between Owens and one of those other spots and the odds are against him, but he has a chance. 

 

That's why I said I don't think he has much of a shot, not that he has no chance. Between possible injuries and surprise off the field issues, it's not impossible for anyone who's at Training Camp to make the Roster. But it's pretty unlikely to me.

 

The number at Safety is almost always 4. As you said, Rapp and Bishop are locks. I also think at least one of Jordan Hancock and Cam Lewis are locks. Both are Backup Safety and Backup Nickel that are listed as Safeties or "DB" falling under the Safety Depth Chart (given the crowded field at CB).

 

Of the 11 5th Round Picks that were selected in the McBeane regime, not a single one were outright cut as a Rookie. The exceptions from those 11 5th Round Picks that didn't make the roster in Year 1 are Vosean Joseph and Justin Shorter, who were "redshirted". I see Hancock brought in as a replacement for Cam Lewis, as both the words of the team and the player say he's playing the exact same role.

 

With Hancock, I see 3 possible scenarios: 1.) He outright replaces Lewis and Lewis is released, saving 1.75m in Cap 2.) Hancock doesn't look ready to take on the role from Lewis, he's "redshirted", and Lewis keeps his spot alongside Rapp, Bishop, and most likely one of Hamlin or Forrest 3.) They like the idea of having 2 guys who can play Safety, Nickel, and Special Teams and keep both Hancock and Lewis as the depth underneath Rapp and Bishop.

 

Ultimately, I see it playing out like this: Rapp and Bishop are locks. For one of the spots, it comes down to Jordan Hancock or Cam Lewis, who double as the Backup Nickel CB. And the other spot comes down to Hamlin or Forrest. I think if the board got their way, Hamlin would be cut. But I think the brass views him MUCH differently. I'll believe it when I see it that they go from Starting him to not even having a place for him as depth.

 

Save for unexpected injuries or off the field things that could bring suspensions or cuts, Owens would have to beat out Hamlin and Forrest and also have the Bills thinking Hancock over Lewis instead of Hancock and Lewis. It's a big ask. UDFA's generally only tend to make it when the depth is poor and they don't have many options, like Buffalo Joe at LB. Safety isn't one of those situations.

Edited 18 hours ago by BillsFanForever19

[Mr. WEO]

5 hours ago, NewEra said:

This post could be top 5 most enjoyable in @Mr. WEO history  

 

Which annual competition are you speaking of?   There has been exactly 1 completion at S under this regime.  Taylor Rapp played much better than I had anticipated.  Damar Hamlin, while not my choice, played slightly better than I had anticipated as well.  
 

or are you speaking of every position?  As in Elam vs Benford….in which a 6th rd pick is now an All pro. Or 5th rd pick Shakir is now a 15M WR.  Or Spencer brown (vs Daryl Williams) David edwards (vs Svpg) your lover boy Gabe Davis (vs sanders, brown), Milano, Bernard and Dorian Williams (vs entire units of vets) 

 

competition breeds improvement.  I’m fairly confident this is a fact in most aspects of life…..

 

but do you mang.  Typical Weo nonsense.  Just here to argue

In this case, I was clearly was referring to Safeties ( the hint was that I quoted your post about current safeties in my response).  Elam was a bum. So were Sanders and Brown. 
 

despite this preseason competition at safety, you claimed these guys are adequate as starters. 

 

you stumble over your own thoughts, amusing yourself, it seems…

[harmonkillebrew]

guy sounds pretty promising. Could easily push Hamlin off the roster on promise alone

[DeepPass]

15 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

I don't see Owens having much of a shot. The problem with Safety isn't Depth. Which is usually what a UDFA makes it on. It's lack of studs at the top. There's hope Bishop can be one of those guys for us and we'll see.

 

But between all of the depth chart from last year returning in Taylor Rapp, Cole Bishop, Damar Hamlin, and Cam Lewis (Backup Nickel and Safety) plus the additions of Derrick Forrest and Jordan Hancock (Backup Nickel and Safety) - we're already going to be cutting a couple from that list alone. 

 

Owens would essentially have to beat out 3 of those players above to make it as the last Safety.

I don't think Hamlin will be on the team after 2 pre-season games.

[BigAl2526]

4 hours ago, TheWeatherMan said:

Have you seen the Safeties on this roster?  IMO S is the best position for an UDFA to make this team.   

I don't disagree, but Owen still has players ahead of him that he has to beat out.  Like a number of posters, I've been critical of both Rapp and Hamlin, but the fact is they started most or all of the games at safety in 2024.  Likewise, Derrick Forrest has started games in the NFL and has at least decent athleticism.   Cole Bishop struggled with injury early in his rookie campaign, but came on late.  Reports this spring are that he's in great shape and is now very comfortable in the defense and making very quick reads.  Then, of course, Jordan Hancock is a draft pick that has position flexibility, mostly slot and safety.  That's vie players who are presumably ahead of Owen in the minds of the coaching staff apart from of field observations. That means Owen probably has to jump two players to be assured of roster spot in September.  He can do that either through his own stellar play, or players in front of him either disappointing coaches with their play or getting injured.  Yeah, most other positions on the team are more settled, but the path to a roster spot is still no piece of cake for a UDFA at safety.

[Buffalo716]

I think he is at least making the PS with a chance to crack the roster 

 

This was a fantastic pickup by Beane ... He is really plugged into FCS programs and has a knack for identifying NFL talent there

 

This kid is a tremendous athlete who with our coaching I think he could legitimately bloom into a potential starter in a couple years 

 

But I like his play style and I think he has a good amount of potential 

[PromoTheRobot]

This guy played ball 45 minutes from me and I never heard of him.

[NewEra]

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

In this case, I was clearly was referring to Safeties ( the hint was that I quoted your post about current safeties in my response).  Elam was a bum. So were Sanders and Brown. 
 

despite this preseason competition at safety, you claimed these guys are adequate as starters. 

 

you stumble over your own thoughts, amusing yourself, it seems…

Yes, in this situation- because safeties are immune to improving because…. Of last seasons competition.  Got it.

 

sanders was such a bum that he out snapped Gabe by a wide margin.  
 

competition often breeds improvement.  That’s my point. My only point here

[BillsFanForever19]

3 hours ago, DeepPass said:

I don't think Hamlin will be on the team after 2 pre-season games.

 

I think you're confusing what you'd like to see with what's likely. If McBeane felt that he provided no value as at least a depth player and he was a "cut after 2 Pre-Season games" candidate, they wouldn't have re-signed him.

 

I think you (and many of the board's) opinion of Hamlin and the teams opinion of Hamlin differ exponentially. You may *want* to see Hamlin off the team, just like everyone wanted him to be replaced in the Starting Lineup last season. But I'll believe that will happen when I see it.

 

Most of the board sees him as a terrible player. McDermott sees him as a player he started all of 2024 and that they brought back when they easily could have let him go. And then they did very little in way of competition for his roster spot. I find it hard to believe they're going to go from him Starting all last season and not being replaced to not even being the 4th Safety and cut.

 

Hancock is Lewis' competition. Forrest is Hamlin's. And again, I'll believe it when I see it that they'd move on from a guy they started all last season for a 1.3m journeyman that they only guaranteed $100k to or an Undrafted Free Agent in Owens.

Edited 13 hours ago by BillsFanForever19

[Mike in Horseheads]

4 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

In this case, I was clearly was referring to Safeties ( the hint was that I quoted your post about current safeties in my response).  Elam was a bum. So were Sanders and Brown. 
 

despite this preseason competition at safety, you claimed these guys are adequate as starters. 

 

you stumble over your own thoughts, amusing yourself, it seems…

I thought the purpose of preseason games was to see how you can improve your roster.

[Richard Noggin]

15 hours ago, Bleeding Bills Blue said:

 

Yeah have to agree.  No one from Hamlin, lewis, forest, or hancock is really a lock in the safety room.  There's also no major cap ramifications cutting anyone for a UDFA, since the UDFA salary is so low.  

 

Also - the 4th safety?  He's a special teamer... so that goes into the evaluation as well.  

 

For sure except that Hancock feels like a LOCK, to this poster at least. They seemed thrilled to land him when they did. He might not necessarily count towards the core-4 S depth chart, seeing as Lewis has traditionally been rostered in addition to 4 true safeties, right? 

[BillsFanForever19]

5 hours ago, Richard Noggin said:

 

For sure except that Hancock feels like a LOCK, to this poster at least. They seemed thrilled to land him when they did. He might not necessarily count towards the core-4 S depth chart, seeing as Lewis has traditionally been rostered in addition to 4 true safeties, right? 

 

One from the field of Hancock and Lewis *is* a lock. The question is which one? Or do both make it?

 

We have to have at least one Backup Nickel, which was Cam last season, doubling as a Safety and being counted on the Safety Depth Chart. Jordan Hancock is being brought in for the same role as a Backup Nickel and Safety. Will he outright replace him in Year 1? Time will tell.

 

While @Bleeding Bills Blue is technically correct that none of them can be called locks (although I agree it's unlikely Hancock is going anywhere) - that doesn't mean it's wide open for a UDFA. Rapp and Bishop will be here. One of Hancock and Lewis will be here. And then there's one more spot for Hamlin (who I don't believe will go from Starter last year to cut until I see it), the loser of the Hancock/Lewis competition, Forrest, and then Owens as a longshot.

 

In my opinion, it will either be Rapp, Bishop, Hamlin, and Hancock or Rapp, Bishop, Hancock, and Lewis. I envision that Forrest and Owens on the outside looking in, in the eyes of Beane and McDermott. 

Edited 7 hours ago by BillsFanForever19

[Victory Formation]

19 hours ago, Doc said:

Good. The more competition at safety the better.

I’m mildly optimistic. I think that there’s a chance that Cole Bishop wins the job and Rapp plays alright.