Nattering nabobs of negativism

[oldmanfan]

Just now, Dopey said:

Hey, I like you as a poster. I was responding to someone else regarding  Allen and his standing here and being above criticism because he “saved “ the Bills. 

I know.  I was trying to agree with you.   Ralph made us a major league city and Terry kept it that way.

[FireChans]

4 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

I was in college during Watergate.  Weird times to be sure, but back then when push came to shove people put the country first.

Was the negative media coverage of Nixon justified?

[oldmanfan]

Just now, FireChans said:

Was the negative media coverage of Nixon justified?

In my opinion yes.  He tried to subvert the Constitution.  He did a lot of good in foreign policy but his paranoia did him in.

[FireChans]

Just now, oldmanfan said:

In my opinion yes.  He tried to subvert the Constitution.  He did a lot of good in foreign policy but his paranoia did him in.

That’s great lmao

[oldmanfan]

Just now, FireChans said:

That’s great lmao

Really?  He exceeded powers granted to him by the Constitution.  So done now, thanks for trying to hijack the thread.

[Beck Water]

3 hours ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

be prepared to be told you didn’t really hear what you heard and this is impossible because he outruns sweaty gymtats sometimes. 

 

If you were one of those claiming Josh said he wasn't a big film watcher, you didn't. in fact, hear what you think you heard.

 

I don't think you've answered my question.

 

We're talking about a QB who regularly outmaneuvers and outruns the elite of the elite, professional NFL football players.  These aren't just "sweaty gymrats" and it's not just "sometimes", so it's pretty unreasonable to characterize it as "outruns sweaty gymrats sometimes".

 

Leaving aside the question of what you heard Josh say and whether it means what you think it means, what IS your answer to my questions?  I'll recap them here for your convenience:

1) How do you think he's putting up the rush yards AND passing yards (not to mention stiff arming and trucking) against defensive players, some of whom are noted "workout warriors", if he doesn't work out and build a good base of fitness (aerobic and strength) prior to the season?

2) Josh is the active player with most consecutive starts.  It seems pretty well established that athletes who are ill conditioned or under-trained can be more prone to injury under extreme exertion, while athletes who are rigorous about strengthening stabilizer muscles and maintaining flexibility can avoid or minimize injury.  How do you think Josh is achieving these consecutive starts, if he doesn't work out and build a good base of fitness prior to the season?

 

Step away from what you think you heard Josh say, and just explain to me how it makes sense to you in light of these factual observations?

 

Again as I said to BadOl, this isn't an argument, it's a question.  If you're a rational person capable of interesting discussion, you must have some answer for this.  What is it?

Edited September 3, 2023 by Beck Water

[FireChans]

4 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

Really?  He exceeded powers granted to him by the Constitution.  So done now, thanks for trying to hijack the thread.

No, it’s great that you used a quote that was defending Nixon from negative press (which you agree with) to defend the Bills from negativity (which you don’t agree with).

 

Basically, the dude who said “nattering nabobs” was wrong last time and the negative comments were completely justified. But not this time.  Lmao.

[BADOLBILZ]

2 hours ago, RunTheBall said:

 

I have no problem with Josh not hitting the weights in the off season. It gives his body time to recover from the beating it takes during the season. He’s already a monster, he doesn’t need to put on more muscle. I’m a retired IFBB Pro (bodybuilding) and there were times I’d take off 5 weeks straight, let the joints recover and come back better than before. People don’t understand the beating these guys take, especially Josh who throws his body around unlike most QBs. 

 

It’s a nothing burger if he’s not actively weight training in the offseason. Some just want anything to latch onto to say Josh isn’t doing enough and have someone to blame when we don’t win the SB. Ridiculous.

 

 

 

 

It's a "nothing burger" until it stops working for him.    I agree that in the short term taking a break off can help.   Anybody who has been active in sports well into adulthood should know that.    But there is a difference between 5 weeks and 5 months as well.

 

Ultimately the proof will be in the results combined with the longevity.

 

Josh is following the Ben Roethlisberger offseason regimen............and his reasoning was the same as Josh's is now.

 

Big Ben hit the wall at 36 and ended his career a liability at QB and a huge cap burden for several seasons.  

 

By contrast Brady, Rodgers and Brees.........who all follow the "guys who train a lot get hurt a lot" approach more than the "can't tear fat" approach that Josh is advocating.......were still playing at a high level for much longer and didn't burden their franchise with poor results for the money on their way out.   

 

The thing that Allen has working against him that Big Ben did not is that the league is loaded with quality young QB's now and the college pipeline appears to be pretty decent.    It's not likely to be as easy to remain one of the elite for as long as it was for Big Ben.   

[oldmanfan]

1 minute ago, FireChans said:

No, it’s great that you used a quote that was defending Nixon from negative press (which you agree with) to defend the Bills from negativity (which you don’t agree with).

 

Basically, the dude who said “nattering nabobs” was wrong last time and the negative comments were completely justified. But not this time.  Lmao.

I used it merely as a tag, nothing more or less.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

4 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

It's a "nothing burger" until it stops working for him.    I agree that in the short term taking a break off can help.   Anybody who has been active in sports well into adulthood should know that.    But there is a difference between 5 weeks and 5 months as well.

 

Ultimately the proof will be in the results combined with the longevity.

 

Josh is following the Ben Roethlisberger offseason regimen............and his reasoning was the same as Josh's is now.

 

Big Ben hit the wall at 36 and ended his career a liability at QB and a huge cap burden for several seasons.  

 

By contrast Brady, Rodgers and Brees.........who all follow the "guys who train a lot get hurt a lot" approach more than the "can't tear fat" approach that Josh is advocating.......were still playing at a high level for much longer and didn't burden their franchise with poor results for the money on their way out.   

 

The thing that Allen has working against him that Big Ben did not is that the league is loaded with quality young QB's now and the college pipeline appears to be pretty decent.    It's not likely to be as easy to remain one of the elite for as long as it was for Big Ben.   

I’d take a Ben career. The other side is a Luck, Culpepper or cam career. Not so good. 

[Beck Water]

3 hours ago, Bill from NYC said:

Bingo!!! Iirc, Hank Aaron smoked cigarettes. 

 

Hank Aaron smoked cigarettes.  "Greatest Diver of All Time" Greg Louganis acknowledges that he not only smoked, he was an alcoholic and used drugs until just before his first Olympic games.

 

Yet times have changed.  The #2 guy on various Olympic teams now starts his dive list with degree of difficulty dives that were Louganis best, and goes up in difficulty from there.  The "new normal" has become higher DOD.  Same with football - time was when guys would have off-season jobs to get by.  Not now, and in general NFL athletes are bigger, stronger, faster than they were even 2 decades ago.

 

I agree that genetics do play a huge role, but I think a lot of that role is getting athletes into the "elite of the elite", the top guys in the NFL.

 

Serious question, what modern elite athletes (Olympic, professional) are 5-7 years into a career and one of the best at their chosen sport, without serious sport-specific training in the off season to build a base?  Let's say, in the last 20 years.  As I said to BadOl, this isn't an argument, it's a question.  Who?

 

3 hours ago, Bill from NYC said:

Didn't Allen grow up on and work in a farm? People like that must gain strength early on as well (in addition to genetics). Bryce Paup didn't have rippling muscles, but remember how strong he was? He would move offensive liemen away by extending his arms. He grew up on a farm in Iowa.

 

I think "rippling muscles" are over perceived as a correlate to functional strength.  I think guys who have rippling muscles, generally train for rippling muscles; guys who are photographed with rippling muscles also set that up carefully.  But that doesn't mean guys with high functional strength but no rippling muscles don't train, and train hard.

 

Josh's background "growing up and working on a farm" has been overblown in the media.  I'm sure he did stuff at need, but Josh's family was really the local landed gentry.  I believe it was his grandfather who donated the land for the high school.  Josh talked about playing every sport he could -swimming, baseball, basketball, football - in part because if he were involved in sports, he got out of farm work.  It's not like his parents were pulling him away from sports to go move irrigation pipe or hoe the fields or harvest the cantaloupes.

Edited September 3, 2023 by Beck Water

[BADOLBILZ]

5 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

I’d take a Ben career. The other side is a Luck, Culpepper or cam career. Not so good. 

 

 

Big Ben won his second and last SB in his age 27 season..........so Josh is not on that trajectory........but yeah I would take 2 SB wins.

 

Point being.........there are a lot of recent precedents that favor a different approach than what Josh is doing.

[Beck Water]

15 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

It's a "nothing burger" until it stops working for him.    I agree that in the short term taking a break off can help.   Anybody who has been active in sports well into adulthood should know that.    But there is a difference between 5 weeks and 5 months as well.

 

I think Josh is talking about taking ~10 weeks "mostly" off, not 5 months off.  Between the end of the season and phase 1 OTAs.  That's from careful listening to the interviews people are slinging from.

 

Whether he does enough in the rest of the time, who knows?  So far, he doesn't seem to be pulling a Roethlisberger, but you have a valid point that if he in fact is taking 5 months off from position-specific strength and flexibility training, that will come. 

 

I would still like to learn your examples of modern-day elite professional athletes who don't train and get by on native athleticism.

 

 

[CincyBillsFan]

20 hours ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

very reasonable take. Allen is amazing, but he’s not carving up defenses with his presnap reads, he’s reacting on impulse and athleticism making jaw dropping velocity throws and agile escapes. 

If he had the pre play recognition a little tighter, it might have made the few more difference making plays to get to the top. 

You consider that a reasonable take?  Hmmmmmmmm

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

22 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

If you were one of those claiming Josh said he wasn't a big film watcher, you didn't. in fact, hear what you think you heard.

 

I don't think you've answered my question.

 

We're talking about a QB who regularly outmaneuvers and outruns the elite of the elite, professional NFL football players.  These aren't just "sweaty gymrats" and it's not just "sometimes", so it's pretty unreasonable to characterize it as "outruns sweaty gymrats sometimes".

 

Leaving aside the question of what you heard Josh say and whether it means what you think it means, what IS your answer to my questions?  I'll recap them here for your convenience:

1) How do you think he's putting up the rush yards AND passing yards (not to mention stiff arming and trucking) against defensive players, some of whom are noted "workout warriors", if he doesn't work out and build a good base of fitness (aerobic and strength) prior to the season?

2) Josh is the active player with most consecutive starts.  It seems pretty well established that athletes who are ill conditioned or under-trained can be more prone to injury under extreme exertion, while athletes who are rigorous about strengthening stabilizer muscles and maintaining flexibility can avoid or minimize injury.  How do you think Josh is achieving these consecutive starts, if he doesn't work out and build a good base of fitness prior to the season?

 

Step away from what you think you heard Josh say, and just explain to me how it makes sense to you in light of these factual observations?

 

Again as I said to BadOl, this isn't an argument, it's a question.  If you're a rational person capable of interesting discussion, you must have some answer for this.  What is it?

 why the whole gaslighting schtick?  …

 

you: forget what the man said about himself let’s speculate stuff… 

 

this is the recap: 

 

- poster says Allen is the hardest off-season worker in the nfl

I say:  not really, he said he doesn’t over indulge on film and doesn’t work in the gym, or with trainers in the off season.  He only throws with Palmer for a few weeks, along with a couple other QBs who do the same. 
 

you: impossible. He’s too good. Must be working out incessantly and just lying about it or the words everyone heard him say weren’t what he said. 
 

other poster: stop, my hero is better and works harder than the top 10 QBs in history combined and my 3 month old believes me so I know I’m right.  

[CincyBillsFan]

14 hours ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

He’s the one who said he doesn’t hit the gym or lift in the off-season… your beef is with him. He must have been lying in that interview with trailer boys too. 

This is a mischaracterization of what Allen said.  As Beck has repeatedly shown us Allen did not say that he didn't hit the gym or lift in the off season.  He told us what he did and didn't do and the time frame that was involved. 

 

 

[BADOLBILZ]

9 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

I think Josh is talking about taking ~10 weeks "mostly" off, not 5 months off.  Between the end of the season and phase 1 OTAs.  That's from careful listening to the interviews people are slinging from.

 

Whether he does enough in the rest of the time, who knows?  So far, he doesn't seem to be pulling a Roethlisberger, but you have a valid point that if he in fact is taking 5 months off from position-specific strength and flexibility training, that will come. 

 

I would still like to learn your examples of modern-day elite professional athletes who don't train and get by on native athleticism.

 

 

 

 

I think the broader picture is that he just doesn't believe in the process that Brady, Brees and to a similar extent Rodgers have adhered to in terms of diet and training.   Guessing how much he works out is too subjective.   The path he is taking is,  perhaps not coincidentally,  the easiest.   Whether it is/was the best for his career........like I said, his success and longevity with be the proof.

[muppy]

well folks TBD now has negativity threads across several platforms including the main board and OTW.  I come here for the various views and reads on things. 

 

However having said that, whomever thinks this place is a circle jerk think tank of positivity sunshine and rainbows is full of baloney . There are concerns about the team that cannot bee answered until the games are actually played. I don't like to stifle banter.  Those inclined  can stew boil and bubble all their negativity till the cows come home. It won't change a thing. And it doesn't even really bother me all that much. My brain has a circular file that works Great just sayin'

 

GO BILLS...the ONE thing we all agree on 🙂

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

3 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

I think the broader picture is that he just doesn't believe in the process that Brady, Brees and to a similar extent Rodgers have adhered to in terms of diet and training.   Guessing how much he works out is too subjective.   The path he is taking is,  perhaps not coincidentally,  the easiest.   Whether it is/was the best for his career........like I said, his success and longevity with be the proof.

yeah… another common theme. For example in an interview topic about nutrition regimen (old school). No special diet, If overweight just stop eating. 

[CincyBillsFan]

19 hours ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

No- I was talking about the guy in the men’s health article that grinds in the gym during the offseason with a trainer after winning superbowls. Seems like maybe the myopic view that Josh outworks every player in the nfl is a tad homercentric …

 

the hero worship is pure and innocent though, so carry on. 

 

Classic trolling.  Throw out something that no one is actually saying and then run with it. 

 

The comments I'm seeing about Allen outworking other QB's are related to his career where he was faced with the challenge of improving his mechanics.  That he did so in spite of much of the national sports media claiming that he could not is a testament to his hard work in the off season.  Palmer reinforced this in multiple interviews and we all saw the product of Allen's hard work on the field.

 

 

[Paul Costa]

On 9/2/2023 at 11:08 AM, Augie said:

I think 90% of the negativity comes from a vocal minority of a half dozen to a dozen posters. And we all know who they are. Many of you have at least some of them on “Ignore”, and I can’t blame you for that. 

It’s kind of like crime in NYC. 80% is committed by like 70 people. 30% by the other 10 million people. Get rid of the few repeat offenders and your society will be better for it. 

Edited September 3, 2023 by Paul Costa

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

1 minute ago, CincyBillsFan said:

Classic trolling.  Throw out something that no one is actually saying and then run with it. 

 

The comments I'm seeing about Allen outworking other QB's are related to his career where he was faced with the challenge of improving his mechanics.  That he did so in spite of much of the national sports media claiming that he could not is a testament to his hard work in the off season.  Palmer reinforced this in multiple interviews and we all saw the product of Allen's hard work on the field.

 

 

it’s not trolling at all - just tired of this Josh work so much harder than everyone else bull.  
 

no he ***** does not. He puts in time in the office but he’s not some elite off-season warrior, and the league is loaded with them. 

[CincyBillsFan]

1 minute ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

it’s not trolling at all - just tired of this Josh work so much harder than everyone else bull.  
 

no he ***** does not. He puts in time in the office but he’s not some elite off-season warrior, and the league is loaded with them. 

Why does it bother you? Sure it can never be definitely proven but you can make a solid argument that over his career no QB has worked harder at his craft then Allen.

 

In fact why on earth are you bothered that on a Bills message board here are homers who view the Bills through an optimistic lens?

 

I'll visit Finnheavan, Gang Green, Jungle Noise (Bengals) and that NE board and it doesn't surprise me in the least that there are homers on those boards. 

 

 

 

 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

19 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

Why does it bother you? Sure it can never be definitely proven but you can make a solid argument that over his career no QB has worked harder at his craft then Allen.

 

In fact why on earth are you bothered that on a Bills message board here are homers who view the Bills through an optimistic lens?

 

I'll visit Finnheavan, Gang Green, Jungle Noise (Bengals) and that NE board and it doesn't surprise me in the least that there are homers on those boards. 

 

 

 

 

 

Mainly the bother is, if he obsessed like he is accused of, like Brady and manning did, combined with his athletic talent, he’d be a 70% passer, he’d diagnose more presnap and frankly the bills would have Lombardi’s. 

[Beck Water]

1 hour ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

you: impossible. He’s too good. Must be working out incessantly and just lying about it or the words everyone heard him say weren’t what he said.

 

You know, I actually took the time to listen to what Josh actually said and transcribe, which requires several back and forth.   That's actually the very opposite of the normal meaning of gaslighting.   Mischaracterizing what I've said in this way does not reflect well on your credibility as someone to have discussion with; just what exactly are you trying to accomplish here? 

 

And you still haven't answered my question.  It's not rocket science:

1) How do you think he's putting up the rush yards AND passing yards (not to mention stiff arming and trucking) against defensive players, some of whom are noted "workout warriors", if he doesn't work out and build a good base of fitness (aerobic and strength) prior to the season?

2) Josh is the active player with most consecutive starts.  It seems pretty well established that athletes who are ill conditioned or under-trained can be more prone to injury under extreme exertion, while athletes who are rigorous about strengthening stabilizer muscles and maintaining flexibility can avoid or minimize injury.  How do you think Josh is achieving these consecutive starts, if he doesn't work out and build a good base of fitness prior to the season?

 

Don't shift the frame of the discussion,  I'm not claiming Josh is an "elite off season warrior", that's not what this is about.

Edited September 3, 2023 by Beck Water

[CincyBillsFan]

17 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

 

Mainly the bother is, if he obsessed like he is accused of, like Brady and manning did, combined with his athletic talent, he’d be a 70% passer, he’d diagnose more presnap and frankly the bills would have Lombardi’s. 

If you think Allen has been the cause of our lack of Super Bowls the last couple of years I don't know what to say. For you to say this you have to be deliberately ignoring Allen's 2021 playoff run.  In back to back playoff games against NE & KC Allen gave the best QB performance in the playoffs that I have ever scene.  Every thing you sited he exhibited in excess during that 2021 playoff run. 

 

I have said it before and I'll repeat it again:  Allen is not the one preventing the Bills from winning Super Bowls.  If over the next 3 seasons Allen plays like he has played the last 3 seasons and the Bills fix the O line, add another play maker and get their D to perform better in the playoffs the Bills will be hoisting the Lombardi Trophy.

 

 

 

 

[Radar]

On 9/2/2023 at 10:34 AM, oldmanfan said:

I struggle to understand this fan base sometimes.  Many seem to actively search for ways to downplay the team’s fortunes and/or denigrate specific players, management and such.  Examples include:

 

1.  Ragging on for years on Edmunds, then as soon as he leaves in free agency ragging on Beane for not resigning or replacing him.

 

2.  Ragging on Beane for not having a veteran guy behind Brown at RT,  then ragging on him because the guy he got retired (as if Beane should be Nostradamus) then ragging on getting Ifedi as if we were going to get an All Pro.

 

There are many such examples.  But the last 24 hours or so have taken the cake, because who are we negative on now?  Josh Allen.  And why?  Mainly because of two articles from the gasbag known as Jason Whitlock, the first of which he said was a lie, then the second of which he claims Josh doesn’t work hard enough and it’s supposedly well known.  Throw in an interview with MacAfee where Josh specifically states he watches a lot of film but qualifies what he takes from it, and all of a sudden it’s Josh that is why the Bills haven’t won a Lombardi.  It’s Josh who drinks too much (one incident with Kyle Allen), Josh who doesn’t work out, Josh who doesn’t spend enough time on football in the off-season (put your TV on and measure in minutes how long till you see Mahomes in a commercial).  Or Josh impregnating waitresses, which no reputable news source has validated.

 

All this leads me to ask:  what the hell is wrong with some people around here?  I am not saying Josh can’t improve.  He needs to continue learning to take the short routes, get the ball out quicker, etc.  but to claim he is now somehow the problem, that it’s his work ethic, that as one person said here that they don’t like Josh personally  as if he actually has ever met the guy?  Come on.

 

I have thought for quite a long time there are folks on this board that really want the Bills to lose so they can somehow crow on a message board that they were right.  I think some of the stuff we’re seeing is some bizarre defense mechanism people throw up as a guard should the Bills not win it all.  
 

Me?  I’ve been a fan since 1960 when I was 5 years old.  I will do as I’ve always done, enter the season with optimism and then see how things go.  Offer praise when merited as well as criticism when merited.  But to actively seek out reasons for negativism, even to the point of believing nonsensical crap to do so?  I don’t get it.

 

 

Agree wth you that there are a few here that complain about everything but there are more, I believe, whose honest objective views of what they believe as weaknesses of the team,coaching and management are construed as negative nabobs. I've been a fan since it's inception (wish I could say five years old).

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

13 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

If you think Allen has been the cause of our lack of Super Bowls the last couple of years I don't know what to say. For you to say this you have to be deliberately ignoring Allen's 2021 playoff run.  In back to back playoff games against NE & KC Allen gave the best QB performance in the playoffs that I have ever scene.  Every thing you sited he exhibited in excess during that 2021 playoff run. 

 

I have said it before and I'll repeat it again:  Allen is not the one preventing the Bills from winning Super Bowls.  If over the next 3 seasons Allen plays like he has played the last 3 seasons and the Bills fix the O line, add another play maker and get their D to perform better in the playoffs the Bills will be hoisting the Lombardi Trophy.

 

 

 

 

Nuance is lost on so many here. No Allen is very good, not preventing anything.

 

But if he was a maniac about winning like the Goats, or even just the ‘hardest working player in the league’ now, they would have had one or more by now imo. 
 

absent that, yeah they need upgrades all over the place to get there. 
 

take it for what you will. 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

21 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

Don't shift the frame of the discussion,  I'm not claiming Josh is an "elite off season warrior", that's not what this is about.

it’s been my main and only point all along.  You’re trying to shift it to some dumb tangent I could care less about. 
 

You should think about how much better he could be if he did the bonus work that the other guys do of have done to get there. 

[JESSEFEFFER]

On 9/2/2023 at 10:46 AM, Johnny Hammersticks said:

Not enough strip joints in B-Lo.  Clearly…

Canada is the best of neighbors in many ways.    They have our back.

[Augie]

6 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

it’s been my main and only point all along.  You’re trying to shift it to some dumb tangent I could care less about. 
 

You should think about how much better he could be if he did the bonus work that the other guys do of have done to get there. 

 

Prove to me he didn’t.   😋

 

We don’t really know what goes on behind the scenes, and I’m certainly not taking the word of some outsider like Whitlock who lives for clicks. 

8 minutes ago, JESSEFEFFER said:

Canada is the best of neighbors in many ways.    They have our back.

 

I think they have our roof?  

[Dr. Who]

12 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

Nuance is lost on so many here. No Allen is very good, not preventing anything.

 

But if he was a maniac about winning like the Goats, or even just the ‘hardest working player in the league’ now, they would have had one or more by now imo. 
 

absent that, yeah they need upgrades all over the place to get there. 
 

take it for what you will. 

I take it for trolling garbage.

 

Other folks have made extensive commentary on the reasons for recent post-season failures. None of them plausibly indicate that Josh Allen is ill-prepared. Nor is accomplishment achieved by a mechanical following of the path that was effective for someone else. The factors that go into winning a SB are too diverse and the game changes regardless, so it's not enough to say Brady did this, why doesn't Josh? A significantly improved Oline will work wonders for Josh Allen. Not dealing with an injury that limits what he can do will make a large difference. Dorsey not being predictable in the RZ calls would be great. I expect all three to give Josh Allen and the Bills a good chance to win a SB, but luck will still play a role. The health of the team will be a factor. The notion that any one player, no matter how talented, can command a SB victory through effort alone is asinine.

[JESSEFEFFER]

6 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

Prove to me he didn’t.   😋

 

We don’t really know what goes on behind the scenes, and I’m certainly not taking the word of some outsider like Whitlock who lives for clicks. 

 

I think they have our roof?  

So, they have us covered?  That's the elite metaphor I needed!

[Warcodered]

32 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

Nuance is lost on so many here. No Allen is very good, not preventing anything.

 

But if he was a maniac about winning like the Goats, or even just the ‘hardest working player in the league’ now, they would have had one or more by now imo. 
 

absent that, yeah they need upgrades all over the place to get there. 
 

take it for what you will. 

Not a maniac about winning 🤦‍♂️

 

Odds are Allen, Mahomes, and Burrow are all maniacs about winning if not even more than them, there's more that goes into winning a Super Bowl than that, even Brady who's a ridiculous ***** outlier went to the Super Bowl 10 times which was less than half the time he was in the league and won it less than that. Looking at someone with less ridiculous numbers Peyton Manning went 4 times in his 16 year career and won half of them, Roethlisberger twice in 17 years. It's like it's really ***** hard or something.

[Lagoon Blues]

Somebody is clearly a Spiro Agnew fan....lol

[BADOLBILZ]

6 hours ago, FireChans said:

There’s something ironic about using a phrase that was notably used to defend Nixon from “unfair” media coverage in this context. 
 

Something like, “yeah, the last time all those nattering nabobs were negative, the sitting President was impeached, so what do they know?” 
 

@oldmanfan

 

 

Yeah this thread only proves one thing........ @oldmanfan most likely IS a crook!    

 

 

 

 

[oldmanfan]

1 minute ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Yeah this thread only proves one thing........ @oldmanfan most likely IS a crook!    

 

 

 

 

Nope, honest as the day is long

[ColoradoBills]

This thread (topic of Josh aside) epitomizes what IMO happens too much on the board.

 

Fans can be "homers or haters" (for the sake of better words) and that's fine by me.  The board also has more than its share of "trolls".

Once I identify the trolls, I assign them a spot in the "ignore" list.  Something I encourage others to try.

 

It also has a bunch of fans that come on here for information and knowledge of Buffalo Bills football.

It also has fans who want to share their deep affection they have with the team with other like-minded fans.

I would imagine there are other reasons than the ones I mentioned and if others would like to add to the above, please do.

 

To get back to what I started to say it's this.  Fans securely entrenched on the opposite sides of a certain topic should realize all the 

arguing and point making, in most cases, will never change the others opinion.  To continuously attempt to do so just becomes argumentative.

It just becomes "noise".

 

Take it as you will but sometimes a well stated point with a follow up rebuttal carries more weight than dozens of replies degenerating into

an abyss.  At least it does for me.

FWIW.

 

 

[oldmanfan]

1 minute ago, ColoradoBills said:

This thread (topic of Josh aside) epitomizes what IMO happens too much on the board.

 

Fans can be "homers or haters" (for the sake of better words) and that's fine by me.  The board also has more than its share of "trolls".

Once I identify the trolls, I assign them a spot in the "ignore" list.  Something I encourage others to try.

 

It also has a bunch of fans that come on here for information and knowledge of Buffalo Bills football.

It also has fans who want to share their deep affection they have with the team with other like-minded fans.

I would imagine there are other reasons than the ones I mentioned and if others would like to add to the above, please do.

 

To get back to what I started to say it's this.  Fans securely entrenched on the opposite sides of a certain topic should realize all the 

arguing and point making, in most cases, will never change the others opinion.  To continuously attempt to do so just becomes argumentative.

It just becomes "noise".

 

Take it as you will but sometimes a well stated point with a follow up rebuttal carries more weight than dozens of replies degenerating into

an abyss.  At least it does for me.

FWIW.

 

 

Agreed

[PBF81]

OP sounds like an embellished tantrum.  

 

Quite honestly, what's the problem with being critical on some aspects of one's own team.  Every team's fans are when things don't go perfectly, and they've been far from perfect for us.  

 

Being critical doesn't mean that someone isn't a fan.  What's very noticeable is that there are "sponsored" or "endorsed" criticisms, and it's fine to agree with those, but heaven forbid one steps outside of that box.  LOL  

 

And what, the glaring hole we have at MLB isn't an issue?   We can discuss it nine ways to Sunday and we can make excuses for it, which is what the OP did, but that doesn't alleviate the issue.  

 

Same for RT.  

 

For years now it's been the WRs, and criticizing them has been fine and dandy, but little else.  LOL  

 

And this bickering before things even unfold.  So what, people can state their expectations, what's the harm.  Honestly, someone reads a non-favorable viewpoint that doesn't agree with their own and loses their mind?  LOL  Seems like a them problem to me.  

 

Let the season play out.  As I've said numberous times, should we win a Championship this season, or any season, I don't see a single person that comes to this forum, sitting at home sulking upon the conclusion of the Super Bowl and the following week, posting anything but rejoicing posts here.  

 

This place is funny.  The game day threads, a week away, are an absolute hoot!!   Posters need monitoring and need to be kept away from matches.