Einstein Posted June 12, 2023 Share Posted June 12, 2023 (edited) 13 hours ago, NewEra said: I don’t put last years season on McD.... The injuries and circumstances of the season were too much to overcome last year. This excuse is getting old. Some of you are so accustomed to the good fortune of an astronomically low injury rate the previous few seasons that an average injury season has you talking like we lost half our squad. It just isn't so. We had an average amount of injuries for an NFL team. Not only were we in the bottom half of the league in games missed by players due to injury, the cumulative wuality of the players we lost were only slightly larger than the league average. And according to Football Outsiders, we were not even in the top HALF of teams affected most by injury. https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2023/agl-2022-injuries-help-lead-broncos-trainwreck Edited June 12, 2023 by Einstein 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hondo in seattle Posted June 12, 2023 Share Posted June 12, 2023 30 minutes ago, Einstein said: This excuse is getting old. Some of you are so accustomed to the good fortune of an astronomically low injury rate the previous few seasons that an average injury season has you talking like we lost half our squad. It just isn't so. We had an average amount of injuries for an NFL team. Not only were we in the bottom half of the league in games missed by players due to injury, the cumulative wuality of the players we lost were only slightly larger than the league average. And according to Football Outsiders, we were not even in the top HALF of teams affected most by ijury. https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2023/agl-2022-injuries-help-lead-broncos-trainwreck I'm not convinced by the supposed evidence that we weren't severely impacted by injury. We have three great DBs: Poyer, Hyde and White: all were injured. Our only good pass rusher was knocked out for the season. The ability of the rest of the DL to generate pressure crashed when Miller went out. The defense was gutted by injury. The offense was healthier but the one player who means the most had a UCL problem. It didn't keep him out of games but certainly affected his strength and accuracy - as well as Dorsey's play-calling. The analytic geeks can't measure the impact, but all knowledgeable observers saw it clearly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Einstein Posted June 12, 2023 Share Posted June 12, 2023 5 minutes ago, hondo in seattle said: I'm not convinced by the supposed evidence that we weren't severely impacted by injury. We have three great DBs: Poyer, Hyde and White: all were injured. Our only good pass rusher was knocked out for the season. What you just listed is an average amount of injuries for an NFL team in a season. It’s normal. That’s the point. And White wasn’t injured. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aussie Joe Posted June 12, 2023 Share Posted June 12, 2023 14 minutes ago, Einstein said: What you just listed is an average amount of injuries for an NFL team in a season. It’s normal. That’s the point. And White wasn’t injured. I know you are a little bit negative… so you might be glad to hear that Bills have moved to second favourites to win the SB with Australia’s biggest Sportsbook… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted June 12, 2023 Share Posted June 12, 2023 1 hour ago, 90sBills said: And if Mahomes hadn’t shown up in KC Reid would still be known as a good coach that can’t win the big one and probably retired by now. I agree. He would’ve been a great offensive mind that never had a great QB. Mahomes is in the elite of the elite all time. He’s ridiculously good. But I watched the SB and saw several plays where guys were wide open. Mahomes didn’t make them wide open. Credit to both. Both are elite at what they do. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LOVEMESOMEBILLS Posted June 12, 2023 Share Posted June 12, 2023 12 hours ago, GunnerBill said: Agree with most of this although I don't really put 2020 on him either. I think the Chiefs were better coached in the game, no question (I actually think Spags > Dabes was the biggest coaching mismatch that day) but they were also just a more experienced, more talented team. You can't ignore than in 2020 they showed that in the regular season too. I don't think the Bills were 'ready' to beat the Chiefs that year. In 2021 and since we have been the better team in all 3 H2H meetings IMO.... though only narrowly in the playoff game.... and that is why it was close enough for the coaching blunders at the end to cost us. Man @GunnerBill, I was going to post something pretty similar to this. To me, 2020 felt like a natural 1st step towards reaching & winning a Super Bowl. A great breakout season for Josh & the gang, but KC was far more experienced in playing deep into the playoffs. 2021 is the year where coaching really let this team down. Not just in the loss to the Chiefs, but also during the season. 11-6 against a really easy schedule, filled with bad young QBs. At times the team looked lost and disinterested. All while being relatively health that year. Imo, easily McDermott's and the rest of the coaching staff's worst year since he arrived. It still baffles me that we lost in the 2nd round of the playoffs with a QB that had 9 TDs, no Ints and a QB Rating of 148. Not only that, but the offense scored a Td on 75%(12/16) of their drives in the playoffs in 2021. That's an unheard-of rate by an offense in the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Vader Posted June 12, 2023 Share Posted June 12, 2023 15 hours ago, Gugny said: Are people negative? Or observant? Negative or observant, a lot of people who fall under these titles will rant on and on at how the Bills are going nowhere, but will not offer or suggest any practical solutions. That's what annoys me. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted June 12, 2023 Share Posted June 12, 2023 8 hours ago, Rigotz said: I’m going to try to be as kind and objective as possible in this response. It’s ok to appreciate McDermott for getting us out of the drought and being a GOOD coach, while not bowing down to him like he’s an ELITE coach. Brandon Beane has proven that he is an elite GM. Josh Allen has proven that he is an elite QB. McDermott has had some questionable performances when it matters most. He’s a defensive coach and his defenses have failed when it matters most. I used to love McDermott and think he was on his way to be the greatest ever, but he’s shown some weakness. That’s just a fact. I’m rooting for him to evolve and turn it around and hopefully he will. If not, we need an elite coach to go with our elite QB and GM to get this thing done. See I am not on board on the bolded. I think Allen has proven himself elite. I think McDermott has proven more than Beane personally. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted June 12, 2023 Share Posted June 12, 2023 @Einstein - on the injuries point, while the data is interesting thw football outsider analysis what it also shows is the last two years the teams that make the Superbowl are top 10 in their ranking. Philly and KC are 3 and 4 in 2022. The Rams and Cincy were 5 and 8 in 2021. It would be interesting to look at historically but I suspect that pattern would continue. Once you get towards even middle of the pack I suspect you don't win Superbowls. It does on the flip side also show what an opportunity wasted 2021 was for the Bills. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted June 12, 2023 Share Posted June 12, 2023 (edited) 18 hours ago, Chicken Boo said: I actually applaud posters like newcam2012, PBF81, etc. They don't follow the herd and can actually see the forest for the trees. McDermott has done a great job in helping to build this franchise to where it is today, but soon it's going get to a point where just making the playoffs isn't good enough. I'm sure the players love him, but Bucs players loved Tony Dungy in 2000 as well. Can they see the forest for the trees? It's hard to tell. They're too busy saying that that thing over there isn't a forest or trees, it's a burnt-out ruin of what could have been a forest. Edited June 12, 2023 by Thurman#1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted June 12, 2023 Share Posted June 12, 2023 6 hours ago, Einstein said: This excuse is getting old. Some of you are so accustomed to the good fortune of an astronomically low injury rate the previous few seasons that an average injury season has you talking like we lost half our squad. It just isn't so. We had an average amount of injuries for an NFL team. Not only were we in the bottom half of the league in games missed by players due to injury, the cumulative wuality of the players we lost were only slightly larger than the league average. And according to Football Outsiders, we were not even in the top HALF of teams affected most by injury. https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2023/agl-2022-injuries-help-lead-broncos-trainwreck It's not an excuse. It's an explanation. And it's not getting old. You're getting sick of hearing it despite the fact that it makes a ton of sense, that it fits the facts better than anything else. You're sick of hearing it because it busts your narrative. If old matters, your blame-shaming is just as old but stupider. That chart you post about how we didn't have as many injuries as some other teams? Where's the chart about which teams had the most important injuries. With Von Miller we looked like a Super Bowl favorite. Without him a possible contender. The guys we lost on defense were some of the most important players for us, the ones we could least afford to lose, Hyde, Miller and Da'Quan in the Bengals game are crucial pieces for us. And some of the guys who still gutted it out and played as well as they could but well below their usual standard, Phillips, with one arm, replacing Da'Quan, Tre' White just not able to play anywhere near his standard even though he was on the field, and Jordan Poyer looking like a Buffalo rather than a shark, were also key pieces. That chart is deceptive, because some games missed due to injuries are much more important than others and we lost some of our most important players. And pretending that chart is very accurate about quality of players lost is ridiculous. It determines value by AV. And AV is OK at summing up careers, but not particularly accurate at all with picking out value to a team in any particular season. On defense we lost a lot of our most valuable players and several of the ones injured but playing were not able to play close to their usual level. Where's the chart about which other teams had guys die on the field? Seriously, where's that chart? Where's the chart about how many other teams had player's brothers, healthy college football players, die during the season? Where's the chart about mass shooters? Or the one about all the other teams that had home games moved to away stadiums, or the one about all the other teams that had never in NFL history had so many away games in so few days as we did in Weeks 11 - 13. Is this a "so everything's OK" get out of jail free card? No, they still had a bad game, but anyone who doesn't realize that all this and the blizzards and the rest of it was a huge factor is busier pushing a narrative than actually noticing how the world works. If you don't see that that season was one of the hardest most draining seasons in NFL history ... you just don't get it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted June 12, 2023 Share Posted June 12, 2023 Wildfire smoke is at the top of the list for excuses if the 2023 season goes sideways. I wonder what excuse #2 will be? 1 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProcessTruster Posted June 12, 2023 Share Posted June 12, 2023 21 hours ago, hondo in seattle said: I'm okay with McD being Dungy. In the playoffs every year. Won a Lombardi. works for me as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicken Boo Posted June 12, 2023 Share Posted June 12, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, Thurman#1 said: Can they see the forest for the trees? It's hard to tell. They're too busy saying that that thing over there isn't a forest or trees, it's a burnt-out ruin of what could have been a forest. I think so. I try to have a level head about things, so I'm not as adamant about McDermott NOT being the guy, but you can see the red flags. These posters espouse a narrative that's often in the back of my mind. It's hard to ignore. That said, I'm of the belief that McDermott is fully capable of leading the team to a Lombardi this season, so there's that. It's a struggle. Edited June 12, 2023 by Chicken Boo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWK Posted June 12, 2023 Share Posted June 12, 2023 (edited) 6 hours ago, GunnerBill said: See I am not on board on the bolded. I think Allen has proven himself elite. I think McDermott has proven more than Beane personally. I totally agree on Beane. Aside from the Allen pick, which obviously was amazing, the draft record and free agent signings are mediocre. The reputation he has as a "wizard" or "big baller beane" is a total joke. Do wizards sign Ed Oliver to big extensions? Or strike out on every defensive line free agent we've had? Or let Spencer Brown play right tackle? He is a mediocre GM coasting on the Allen pick. Edited June 12, 2023 by MWK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Einstein Posted June 12, 2023 Share Posted June 12, 2023 3 hours ago, Thurman#1 said: That chart you post about how we didn't have as many injuries as some other teams? Where's the chart about which teams had the most important injuries. The football outsiders chart takes quality of player (player impact) into consideration. And that STILL places us into the bottom half of the league in injuries. Injuries are part of EVERY teams nfl season. It is what it is. We did not have an absurd amount of injuries - it was average. The Eagles won a Super Bowl without their starting QB, which is far more impactful than losing a playoff game without a starting safety and d-end. It’s all excuses. 6 hours ago, GunnerBill said: @Einstein - on the injuries point, while the data is interesting thw football outsider analysis what it also shows is the last two years the teams that make the Superbowl are top 10 in their ranking. Philly and KC are 3 and 4 in 2022. The Rams and Cincy were 5 and 8 in 2021. It would be interesting to look at historically but I suspect that pattern would continue. Once you get towards even middle of the pack I suspect you don't win Superbowls. It does on the flip side also show what an opportunity wasted 2021 was for the Bills. Yes good point and I did notice that as well. The Chiefs had unbelievable injury luck last year. They were pretty much completely healthy in the playoffs last season. But as you can see, the Bills injuries last year were par for the NFL. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted June 12, 2023 Share Posted June 12, 2023 10 hours ago, Einstein said: This excuse is getting old. Some of you are so accustomed to the good fortune of an astronomically low injury rate the previous few seasons that an average injury season has you talking like we lost half our squad. It just isn't so. We had an average amount of injuries for an NFL team. Not only were we in the bottom half of the league in games missed by players due to injury, the cumulative wuality of the players we lost were only slightly larger than the league average. And according to Football Outsiders, we were not even in the top HALF of teams affected most by injury. https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2023/agl-2022-injuries-help-lead-broncos-trainwreck Einstein, I don’t believe the injured designation includes IR designations which is why they are not on weekly injury reports. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Einstein Posted June 12, 2023 Share Posted June 12, 2023 1 hour ago, LabattBlue said: Wildfire smoke is at the top of the list for excuses if the 2023 season goes sideways. I wonder what excuse #2 will be? Seriously. We literally have posters who think a mass shooting tragedy that happened 8 months prior, in a city that players don’t even live most of the year, had an impact on the Bengals bashing our heads in. Never mind the fact that we won 14 games after that tragedy, including crushing the prior years super bowl champions in the first game after the shooting. Oh and the owners wife having a medical emergency 5 months prior was another reason the Bengals wiped us all over the field. Never mind the fact that players often have the games of their lives after there is deaths in their personal family (ex: Allen after his grandma passed, Tiger after his dad passed, etc). The mental gymnastics are incredible. I suspect if Allen’s cat dies, it will be season over and some posters will be saying “it’s just not fair to expect them to win like this”. 2 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Einstein Posted June 12, 2023 Share Posted June 12, 2023 7 minutes ago, machine gun kelly said: Einstein, I don’t believe the injured designation includes IR designations which is why they are not on weekly injury reports. It does include IR. That’s why the Titans were #1 on the list. They had an incredible 23 players on IR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted June 12, 2023 Share Posted June 12, 2023 23 hours ago, Dopey said: From 20 year losers to regular division winners and SB contenders. Here ya go newcam2012, PBF81 and the like, flame away. I noticed a trend a while ago here. Any attempt at a positive thread MUST be shot down by negative Nancies. Hey Einstein, are the Bengals still better than the Bills? Thing is we’ve read your negative crap already. We know! We get it! You guys make this board a ***** place IMO. Go get laid or something. Life is awesome and it sucks that people like me stay away from this place to come back a few weeks later and the same vocal group is writing the same 💩 as weeks ago. From what I read, Allen is the only good thing we have going for us. Last thought: you guys suck and it feels like you’re taking this site with you. Enjoy. Agreed, McDermott is one of the 32 best coaches in the NFL. No question…and the Bills were terrible under Rex and Jauron and Maroon, so McDermott is awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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