Boogie Basham optimism

[BarleyNY]

I do not think Basham was supposed to play much in his rookie season.  He did get some time and did okay, especially in the post season.  We should be getting a better idea of what we have in him this year. 

[TheyCallMeAndy]

Love Boogie, he made plays every time he was on the field. 

That said, there was tons of optimism and hype around AJ last year too, and we know how that turned out. At least Boogie has had multiple moments on the field.

Edited May 11, 2022 by TheyCallMeAndy

[boyst]

  On 5/11/2022 at 3:29 PM, GunnerBill said:

 

Personally I think Boogie can be a good starting "big end" in the NFL in a similar way to how Shaq played for us in 2019 before he left for Miami. He can stop the run, push the pocket some and get some clean up production where Von, Greg, Ed have made things happen and flushed QBs out. I think that sort of sack production Shaq had in his final year - 6/6.5 sacks - is about where you can realistically hope he gets but that is probably his ceiling. I don't think he can be a difference making pass rusher. He doesn't have an explosive first step and he lacks the technique especially with his hands to win consistently against good NFL tackles. That was pretty much where I was on him coming out and I haven't seen anything yet to make me doubt that. Let's see how the body transformation goes. 

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If you combined him with Hughes youd have an all pro.  Sad seeing Hughes never fully develop and be done here.

[Alphadawg7]

  On 5/11/2022 at 3:17 PM, YoloinOhio said:

 

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I really like Boogie and his potential.  I felt like he flashed some real potential last year despite limited reps.  What is going to be interesting to me this camp is the battle for snaps between AJE and Boogie.  

 

Last camp, AJE was the talk of camp, but we still had Addison and Hughes, plus a first round pick in Groot who actually took over as a starter week 1.  So it left AJE where he had been since getting here, in a backup rotation.  

 

Now with Mario and Hughes gone, I am really excited to see how our young guys play this camp in Groot, AJE, and Boogie.  One thing I want to point out about AJE is that its too early to write him off like some around here have been.  Colts wrote off Hughes, and that was a terrible mistake.  So, I am for one excited to see this battle of the two guys probably getting over looked the most by fans in AJE and Boogie.  I feel like one, or maybe even both, could surprise this year if they can prove they deserve more snaps.  

[NoSaint]

  On 5/11/2022 at 3:22 PM, YoloinOhio said:

For the film watchers… is there a reason NOT to be optimistic? Or is it that based on him being buried in the rotation/relegated to inactive sometimes?

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his draft slot doesn’t indicate elite talent either… I think the key to the optimism is managing what that expectation is. Viable rotational guy could be optimism after being inactive, right? It’s a tricky word for the purpose of discussion here 

[H2o]

  On 5/11/2022 at 3:23 PM, GunnerBill said:

 

So they drafted another college power rusher then tried to turn him into a speed rusher, is that what we are supposed to take from the "weight under control" line? If they did, then one of Boogie or AJE better kick on. 

 

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Basham and Epenesa are different. Basham was playing at around 290lbs at Wake and looked to be in the 280's last year. Hopefully getting his weight under control is keeping him around 270lbs. Epenesa dropped from 280lbs down to about 255lbs. He needs to get his weight back up to around 265-270lbs. 

[Patrick Duffy]

  On 5/11/2022 at 4:47 PM, Boyst62 said:

If you combined him with Hughes youd have an all pro.  Sad seeing Hughes never fully develop and be done here.

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Well still could combined with Miller. I would guess that's part of reason they decided to move on from Hughes because of confidence in the younger players.

[NoSaint]

  On 5/11/2022 at 3:29 PM, GunnerBill said:

 

Personally I think Boogie can be a good starting "big end" in the NFL in a similar way to how Shaq played for us in 2019 before he left for Miami. He can stop the run, push the pocket some and get some clean up production where Von, Greg, Ed have made things happen and flushed QBs out. I think that sort of sack production Shaq had in his final year - 6/6.5 sacks - is about where you can realistically hope he gets but that is probably his ceiling. I don't think he can be a difference making pass rusher. He doesn't have an explosive first step and he lacks the technique especially with his hands to win consistently against good NFL tackles. That was pretty much where I was on him coming out and I haven't seen anything yet to make me doubt that. Let's see how the body transformation goes. 

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exactly this for me and that would sound like glass half full or half empty depending who you ask. I could see him being a good “glue guy” in the defense that holds the framework together while others get to be the showy impact players. You need both. 

[1ManRaid]

  On 5/11/2022 at 3:43 PM, machine gun kelly said:

I know a lot of people hate PFF, but they rated Settle prior to 2020 season as one of the best run stopping DT’s in the NFL.  We didn’t grab him to sack people, but to stop guys like Henry from penetrating and blowing it out like that one play last year.  Last year we had him under 2 yards a carry until he broke out.  Jackson is also known for these abilities.

 

Oliver and Phillips are our penetrators.  Phillips may get back to form from when here with 9.5 sacks as a DT.  That’s rare.

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Multiple holds helped Henry penetrate and blow it out on that run.

[GunnerBill]

  On 5/11/2022 at 4:55 PM, H2o said:

Basham and Epenesa are different. Basham was playing at around 290lbs at Wake and looked to be in the 280's last year. Hopefully getting his weight under control is keeping him around 270lbs. Epenesa dropped from 280lbs down to about 255lbs. He needs to get his weight back up to around 265-270lbs. 

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I hope so. Because taking one power rusher and attempting a total rebuild of his game is worth a punt I suppose. Doing it twice would be unwise. 

[Patrick Duffy]

  On 5/11/2022 at 4:52 PM, Alphadawg7 said:

 What is going to be interesting to me this camp is the battle for snaps between AJE and Boogie.  

 

Last camp, AJE was the talk of camp, but we still had Addison and Hughes, plus a first round pick in Groot who actually took over as a starter week 1.  So it left AJE where he had been since getting here, in a backup rotation.

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Yeah agree...will be interesting to see how it plays out. Although AJE showed a flash or 2 here and there last season he clearly still needs some work. Some seem to have lost some confidence in AJE, but hopefully 3rd season's a charm for him. 

 

If he doesn't pick up the pace Boogie might end up making it an easy decision

[Paup 1995MVP]

  On 5/11/2022 at 3:29 PM, GunnerBill said:

 

Personally I think Boogie can be a good starting "big end" in the NFL in a similar way to how Shaq played for us in 2019 before he left for Miami. He can stop the run, push the pocket some and get some clean up production where Von, Greg, Ed have made things happen and flushed QBs out. I think that sort of sack production Shaq had in his final year - 6/6.5 sacks - is about where you can realistically hope he gets but that is probably his ceiling. I don't think he can be a difference making pass rusher. He doesn't have an explosive first step and he lacks the technique especially with his hands to win consistently against good NFL tackles. That was pretty much where I was on him coming out and I haven't seen anything yet to make me doubt that. Let's see how the body transformation goes. 

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Its not a beauty contest.  I thought Basham played hard and fast whenever he was on the field.  Which was not a whole lot.  I think he has solid upside to be a strong contributor in the D Line rotation.  D linemen don't need to look like Tony Gonzalez or Calvin Johnson.  (which is where Epenesa was heading.)  Put some bulk on these guys and let them fire off the ball.

[Simon]

  On 5/11/2022 at 3:22 PM, YoloinOhio said:

For the film watchers… is there a reason NOT to be optimistic? Or is it that based on him being buried in the rotation/relegated to inactive sometimes?

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His play over the last 4-6 weeks of the season was light years ahead of what we'd seen from him earlier on.

[TheBrownBear]

I like Basham over AJE going forward.  Can't help but think AJ could be the odd man out with Shaq now in the mix.  Wonder if he holds any value in a trade?

[Buffalo_Stampede]

AJ was weird because the hype spilled into camp, into preseason, and then into the start of the season. His Miami performance was one of the best performances by a Bills pass rusher that I could remember.

 

Then it just went quiet. Not a ton of snaps so it’s hard to really gauge, but some games he played a decent amount.

 

 I’m not really down on AJ, he’s shown signs. Bills use a very heavy rotation so maybe it’s difficult to develop as a pass rusher. 

[Patrick Duffy]

  On 5/11/2022 at 5:31 PM, TheBrownBear said:

I like Basham over AJE going forward.  Can't help but think AJ could be the odd man out with Shaq now in the mix.  Wonder if he holds any value in a trade?

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Lol, you really wonder if he has "value" in a trade? Lol, I have to question what exactly do you consider value?? 

[Patrick Duffy]

  On 5/11/2022 at 5:32 PM, Buffalo_Stampede said:

AJ was weird because the hype spilled into camp, into preseason, and then into the start of the season. His Miami performance was one of the best performances by a Bills pass rusher that I could remember.

 

Then it just went quiet. Not a ton of snaps so it’s hard to really gauge, but some games he played a decent amount.

 

 I’m not really down on AJ, he’s shown signs. Bills use a very heavy rotation so maybe it’s difficult to develop as a pass rusher. 

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Agree. I remember another game he made an impressive play with his speed and ran the play down stopping what should have been a big gain. 

[Don Otreply]

Basham is going to be an above average rotational guy for us, maybe even more at times, the D line looks to have gotten better imo, 

[Royale with Cheese]

  On 5/11/2022 at 5:06 PM, GunnerBill said:

 

I hope so. Because taking one power rusher and attempting a total rebuild of his game is worth a punt I suppose. Doing it twice would be unwise. 

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I don't think they're going to have him drop that much weight.  Sounds like just to get rid of some extra baby fat.  

[DCofNC]

The real question is where is going to play? Is he going to kick inside on passing downs and be a penetrating 3T or is he just a back up at DE?