Which players on defense are you moving on from or releasing?

[intimidatortj]

In 2023 the Buffalo Bills will have a lot of defensive starters on pretty hefty contracts.
This is going to have an impact on the draft this month.   Beane needs to plan ahead.

 

Let's assume Beane wants to keep Tremaine and has to pay him $14 million a year, for 2023, 2024 and beyond.

Did you know the Bills Cap Hit for Matt Milano is $13 million in 2023 and $13 million for 2024?
And Jordan Poyer and Micah Hyde.   Do you pay them $11 million each, for 2023 and 2024?
Ed Oliver is $10 million a year just for 2023 and will be higher for 2024.
Tre White is costing $ 15-16 million / year.
Von Miller is $18 million and $21 million in 2023 & 2024.

 

To stay under the Cap long term, you need some starters making $2-3 million a year.  You need some players on rookie contracts.  

Honestly, signing Von Miller has made it almost a certainty some of the above players won't be on the roster/payroll in 2023.

 

So who would you move on from?  Who do you trade Or let go in Free Agency after 2022?

 

[T master]

I think Edmunds will be 1 only because of the money he will want being a first round pick the second on your list is Poyer only because he changed agents & Rosenhaus is one greedy mo fo & will get him the cash he is looking for but i don't think it will be from Beane unless there is a compromise & that's not in Rosenhaus vocabulary .

 

I also think they could draft both of their replacements this year in the draft .

Edited April 12, 2022 by T master

[Ethan in Cleveland]

Using your assumption of an extension for Edmunds, then Oliver is gone.

He is a very good starter but not a great DT. That said he will want to get paid top 10 money. 

You can possibly cut Milano next off-season but that adds dead money they can't afford on their books. Ideal scenario would be to get Milano to take a pay cut. I agreed and liked the deal Beane made for him but Milano was nothing but average last year. Another average year and he will look really expensive.

 

If I had to choose, I would rid myself of Edmunds and replace him this year and then look at replacing Milano and Poyer in 2023. 

[Brand J]

6 minutes ago, T master said:

I think Edmunds will be 1 only because of the money he will want being a first round pick the second on your list is Poyer only because he changed agents & Rosenhaus is one greedy mo fo & will get him the cash he is looking for but i don't think it will be from Beane unless there is a compromise & that's not in Rosenhaus vocabulary .

 

I also think they could draft both of their replacements this year in the draft .

This is the way.

[noacls]

Bye Poyer and Edmunds

[BuffaloTX]

There should be a better picture painted on who is more valuable to the team after the 2022 season and Super Bowl champions.  

[Bob in Mich]

 

Paying the stars obviously leaves little for the rest.  I think the Bills mid tier depth and the special teams aces will have to go and we won’t lose as many of the name players as feared.  This means we keep less talented depth players and will cut better players in favor of younger and cheaper depth

[george c]

The cap grows every year folks. 
 

[Mat68]

Saftey.  Imo probably Poyer.  Makes more sense to give the 2 young guys extenstions.  Oliver and Edmunds.  Now I think both have to justify this year.  I think Edmunds is closer to the Bills extending than Oliver is at this point.  

[Brand J]

3 minutes ago, george c said:

The cap grows every year folks. 
 

And not coincidentally, so do the contracts.

4 minutes ago, Mat68 said:

Saftey.  Imo probably Poyer.  Makes more sense to give the 2 young guys extenstions.  Oliver and Edmunds.  Now I think both have to justify this year.  I think Edmunds is closer to the Bills extending than Oliver is at this point.  

Not so sure about this point. I remember Oliver single-handedly destroying drives last year. When have we ever said that about Edmunds? Oliver is better at 3DT than Edmunds is at MLB.

[BullBuchanan]

The cap figures to keep going up significantly each year. Money tomorrow is cheaper than money today.

I think Oliver and Edmunds are gone after this season (or earlier) unless they suddenly become all-pros. I'd very much like to bring Poyer back as I feel he's outperformed Hyde. Next year's cap space probably comes mostly from the projected increase + some restructures and maybe a surprise retirement from someone like Morse. Your only real FA's next year are Poyer, Edmunds and Singletary. I think you can easily keep one, if not two. The following year, we'll have a pile of cap space.

[NewEra]

11 minutes ago, Ethan in Portland said:

Using your assumption of an extension for Edmunds, then Oliver is gone.

He is a very good starter but not a great DT. That said he will want to get paid top 10 money. 

You can possibly cut Milano next off-season but that adds dead money they can't afford on their books. Ideal scenario would be to get Milano to take a pay cut. I agreed and liked the deal Beane made for him but Milano was nothing but average last year. Another average year and he will look really expensive.

 

If I had to choose, I would rid myself of Edmunds and replace him this year and then look at replacing Milano and Poyer in 2023. 

Milano was better than average last year.  

[intimidatortj]

Just now, T master said:

I think Edmunds will be 1 only because of the money he will want being a first round pick the second on your list is Poyer only because he changed agents & Rosenhaus is one greedy mo fo & will get him the cash he is looking for but i don't think it will be from Beane unless there is a compromise & that's not in Rosenhaus vocabulary .

 

Sadly you are probably right about Poyer.  Although, a lot of Bills players have used Rosenhaus and the Bills front office have a somewhat okay relationship with him.

 

I love Poyer, but drafting a safety early in this year's draft just is smart football.
Also drafting a LB would be smart too.

 

You have to prepare for the 2023 Cap....you have some big #s from Josh's contract, and Von Miller's and Tre White's......

[eee1776]

If any of the top safeties in this year's draft fall to us in the third round like Cine or even Cook and Hill I think Poyes is gone after this year.

[TBBills]

30 minutes ago, intimidatortj said:

In 2023 the Buffalo Bills will have a lot of defensive starters on pretty hefty contracts.
This is going to have an impact on the draft this month.   Beane needs to plan ahead.

 

Let's assume Beane wants to keep Tremaine and has to pay him $14 million a year, for 2023, 2024 and beyond.

Did you know the Bills Cap Hit for Matt Milano is $13 million in 2023 and $13 million for 2024?
And Jordan Poyer and Micah Hyde.   Do you pay them $11 million each, for 2023 and 2024?
Ed Oliver is $10 million a year just for 2023 and will be higher for 2024.
Tre White is costing $ 15-16 million / year.
Von Miller is $18 million and $21 million in 2023 & 2024.

 

To stay under the Cap long term, you need some starters making $2-3 million a year.  You need some players on rookie contracts.  

Honestly, signing Von Miller has made it almost a certainty some of the above players won't be on the roster/payroll in 2023.

 

So who would you move on from?  Who do you trade Or let go in Free Agency after 2022?

 

Those are all small cap hits... why do you want to get rid of them? 

Hahaha long term Cap space, screw winning a Super Bowl let win the long term Cap space... even though the cap will be going up and those guys are all on good money contracts.

Edited April 12, 2022 by TBBills

[mushypeaches]

Edmunds is a luxury that they can no longer afford after this year.  

 

I know that the coaches rave about his coverage skills, and leadership, and blah blah blah.

 

But we need to pay the guys who MAKE PLAYS. 

 

Edmunds might get better, but he sure is going to get more expensive

 

Let's get what we can from him on the field this year, but let's not be rolling out the checkbook for him unless he suddenly becomes a Top 3 MLB with the stats to back up that status.

[BuffaloTX]

22 minutes ago, Ethan in Portland said:

Using your assumption of an extension for Edmunds, then Oliver is gone.

He is a very good starter but not a great DT. That said he will want to get paid top 10 money. 

You can possibly cut Milano next off-season but that adds dead money they can't afford on their books. Ideal scenario would be to get Milano to take a pay cut. I agreed and liked the deal Beane made for him but Milano was nothing but average last year. Another average year and he will look really expensive.

 

If I had to choose, I would rid myself of Edmunds and replace him this year and then look at replacing Milano and Poyer in 2023. 

I don't think getting rid of Milano, the single player who puts 100% into bringing the "SMACK" each play while not missing gaps/assignments is a good idea. Just my opinion.

Edited April 12, 2022 by BuffaloTX

[TBBills]

I can't believe you are all still talking about the cap after being so wrong this season, thinking all these players were gone and they couldn't sign anyone.

[intimidatortj]

9 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said:

The cap figures to keep going up significantly each year. Money tomorrow is cheaper than money today.

I think Oliver and Edmunds are gone after this season (or earlier) unless they suddenly become all-pros. I'd very much like to bring Poyer back as I feel he's outperformed Hyde. Next year's cap space probably comes mostly from the projected increase + some restructures and maybe a surprise retirement from someone like Morse. Your only real FA's next year are Poyer, Edmunds and Singletary. I think you can easily keep one, if not two.

 

The following year, we'll have a pile of cap space.

 

I will nit pick a little with the statement that we will have a pile of cap space in 2023.   Josh's contract is kicking in, and so is Von Miller's.   Any extra cap space available via the NFL raising the Cap will go poof.   

 

The Cap will not go up exponential every year.   Right now it is projected to be $220-223 million for 2023.   Josh's hit will be $39 million and Von Miller's $18.7 million.  That is $57.7 million for just those 2 players.

 

Beane has to mix in some rookie deals to the defense, while keeping as many veterans as possible.

[Brand J]

4 minutes ago, TBBills said:

I can't believe you are all still talking about the cap after being so wrong this season, thinking all these players were gone and they couldn't sign anyone.

If Beane has proven one thing, it’s that if he truly values the player he’ll find a way to get a contract done.

[intimidatortj]

8 minutes ago, eee1776 said:

If any of the top safeties in this year's draft fall to us in the third round like Cine or even Cook and Hill I think Poyes is gone after this year.

 

Daxton Hill could go bottom of the 1st round.

Cine and Nick Cross late 2nd?    Early 3rd?

I don't like our 3rd round pick, because it is towards the bottom of the 3rd....and a lot of nice players will be coming off the board early in the 3rd round.

[intimidatortj]

10 minutes ago, mushypeaches said:

Edmunds is a luxury that they can no longer afford after this year.  

 

I know that the coaches rave about his coverage skills, and leadership, and blah blah blah.

 

But we need to pay the guys who MAKE PLAYS. 

 

Edmunds might get better, but he sure is going to get more expensive

 

Let's get what we can from him on the field this year, but let's not be rolling out the checkbook for him unless he suddenly becomes a Top 3 MLB with the stats to back up that status.

 

I know the argument is "he is young" but when do coaches start to acknowledge he has reached his ceiling.    Reactive playmaking skills are something a player has, or doesn't.  Yes, they can get better because of experience, and that helps them learn to take better angles, etc.   But the ceiling isn't going up dramatically.

 

It comes back to value.   Can you sign a MLB for say 1/2 the money that is pretty much as productive?   McBeane will have to decide that one.

[Buftex]

I'm not an Edmunds hater by any means...but if it came down to it, I would prefer to lose him over Oliver.

11 minutes ago, JayBaller10 said:

If Beane has proven one thing, it’s that if he truly values the player he’ll find a way to get a contract done.

It's very true.  Good teams find ways to keep their best players.

[Logic]

The draft will go a long way toward answering this question for us.

[Rock-A-Bye Beasley]

18 minutes ago, Mat68 said:

Saftey.  Imo probably Poyer.  Makes more sense to give the 2 young guys extenstions.  Oliver and Edmunds.  Now I think both have to justify this year.  I think Edmunds is closer to the Bills extending than Oliver is at this point.  

 

Age isn't everything. Oliver plays 58% of snaps and Edmunds, well there are numerous threads about his play. We saw how DT is a position that can be added in free agency this year, and there's a good chance a rookie or second year MLB would be an upgrade over Edmunds.

 

On the other hand Poyer is coming off an all-pro season. The safety franchise tag isn't much more than Poyer's current cap hit, but I think they'll get a 1-2 year extension done soon.

[Mat68]

Just now, Rock-A-Bye Beasley said:

 

Age isn't everything. Oliver plays 58% of snaps and Edmunds, well there are numerous threads about his play. We saw how DT is a position that can be added in free agency this year, and there's a good chance a rookie or second year MLB would be an upgrade over Edmunds.

 

On the other hand Poyer is coming off an all-pro season. The safety franchise tag isn't much more than Poyer's current cap hit, but I think they'll get a 1-2 year extension done soon.

Cant extend everybody.  Imo Poyer would be easier replaced than Edmunds or Oliver. 

[Rock-A-Bye Beasley]

29 minutes ago, TBBills said:

I can't believe you are all still talking about the cap after being so wrong this season, thinking all these players were gone and they couldn't sign anyone.

 

Exactly. It has to be the same people saying we have no cap space a couple months ago.

Just now, Mat68 said:

Cant extend everybody.  Imo Poyer would be easier replaced than Edmunds or Oliver. 

So sick of this foolishness, they CAN extend everyone currently on the roster. Hell, there's 16+ mil in dead cap for this year that will be gone going forward. Cap will go up, and Allen and others can restructure.

 

Now Edmunds and Oliver are not smart to extend IMO because one is replacement-level and the other is a part-time player (58% of snaps)

[Patrick Duffy]

7 minutes ago, intimidatortj said:

 

I know the argument is "he is young" but when do coaches start to acknowledge he has reached his ceiling.    Reactive playmaking skills are something a player has, or doesn't.  Yes, they can get better because of experience, and that helps them learn to take better angles, etc.   But the ceiling isn't going up dramatically.

 

It comes back to value.   Can you sign a MLB for say 1/2 the money that is pretty much as productive?   McBeane will have to decide that one.

While I do acknowledge 23/24 is young obviously, however it seems like that's been said for 2 years now. Anyways, imo we are past that now and considering he's been in the same Defense the whole time I think he would have learned enough to be comfortable at this point.

 

I'm not putting him down or anything, just saying imo his performance hasn't been as I had hoped or expected by now. All that being said, I have no idea what they end up deciding to do with him, but cool with me either way

[Mat68]

3 minutes ago, Rock-A-Bye Beasley said:

 

Exactly. It has to be the same people saying we have no cap space a couple months ago.

So sick of this foolishness, they CAN extend everyone currently on the roster. Hell, there's 16+ mil in dead cap for this year that will be gone going forward. Cap will go up, and Allen and others can restructure.

 

Now Edmunds and Oliver are not smart to extend IMO because one is replacement-level and the other is a part-time player (58% of snaps)

Warren Sapp doesn't play 60% of snaps in Buffalo either.  The talent Edmunds and Oliver possess are harder to replace imo than Poyer.  Saftey is not a premier position.  Imo, it comes down to what Poyer wants.  If he takes a team friendly deal sure you can bring back everyone.  If he wants top safety money than imo thats too much.  Dont get me wrong I love Poyer and everything he does for the defense.  At a point players start to decline.  Teams that have had sustained success NE, Gb, Pit for example get off vetran players earlier than most.  Buffalo is going to need to consider that model.  Otherwise you look around and are expensive and old without much options.

[LABILLBACKER]

Edmunds....wants to get paid like Tarzan,  plays like Jane. He's the obvious one. Maybe try to restructure Poyer on a friendly deal?

[Mat68]

10 minutes ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said:

While I do acknowledge 23/24 is young obviously, however it seems like that's been said for 2 years now. Anyways, imo we are past that now and considering he's been in the same Defense the whole time I think he would have learned enough to be comfortable at this point.

 

I'm not putting him down or anything, just saying imo his performance hasn't been as I had hoped or expected by now. All that being said, I have no idea what they end up deciding to do with him, but cool with me either way

He is still about the age of the current draft class.  Now I do think his style of play is not what the majority of fans would want from a Lb.  That doesnt make him poor.  As much as Poyer and Hyde get credit for Buffalo having unreal pass coverage consistency, Edmund is as important if not more.  The best thing the defense has done is defend the pass.  Above average coverage linebakers do not grow on trees.  That is my concern.  

[Dopey]

1 hour ago, mushypeaches said:

Edmunds is a luxury that they can no longer afford after this year.  

 

I know that the coaches rave about his coverage skills, and leadership, and blah blah blah.

 

But we need to pay the guys who MAKE PLAYS. 

 

Edmunds might get better, but he sure is going to get more expensive

 

Let's get what we can from him on the field this year, but let's not be rolling out the checkbook for him unless he suddenly becomes a Top 3 MLB with the stats to back up that status.

With 32 nfl franchises, he has to be top 3? What if he's top 10? 

[Patrick Duffy]

22 minutes ago, Mat68 said:

Cant extend everybody.  Imo Poyer would be easier replaced than Edmunds or Oliver. 

I don't know about easier, but the familiarity he and Hyde have may not be as easy replacing. They are considered the by very many to be the best pair of Safeties in the league for a reason.

 

But unfortunately all good things do eventually come to an end, however I think he stays, but also I think this will be his last season as a Bill.

[Mat68]

5 minutes ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said:

I don't know about easier, but the familiarity he and Hyde have may not be as easy replacing. They are considered the by very many to be the best pair of Safeties in the league for a reason.

 

But unfortunately all good things do eventually come to an end, however I think he stays, but also I think this will be his last season as a Bill.

Agreed.  Im also assuming Poyer is going to want top safety money.  I think Edmunds could be had for an easier cap hit.  He is young enough where a long contract will provide more flexibility.   I think we ride as is in 2022.  I can see Oliver and Edmunds having very good years with better play at 1 tech.

[Patrick Duffy]

4 minutes ago, Mat68 said:

He is still about the age of the current draft class.  Now I do think his style of play is not what the majority of fans would want from a Lb.  That doesnt make him poor.  As much as Poyer and Hyde get credit for Buffalo having unreal pass coverage consistency, Edmund is as important if not more.  The best thing the defense has done is defend the pass.  Above average coverage linebakers do not grow on trees.  That is my concern.  

 

Yeah I get where you're coming from. As for his pass coverage, I think one could argue Milano is better in that department and possibly the best of all the LB's. I do agree Bills have done well defending the pass. I'm excited to see it being even better with improved pass rush this season. 

 

 

1 minute ago, Mat68 said:

Agreed.  Im also assuming Poyer is going to want top safety money.  I think Edmunds could be had for an easier cap hit.  He is young enough where a long contract will provide more flexibility.   I think we ride as is in 2022.  I can see Oliver and Edmunds having very good years with better play at 1 tech.

I don't see any reason to assume that. Many assumed the same with Diggs "demanding" that type of thing. I never thought for a second it would come to that and I feel the same with Poyer. 

[Florida Bills Fanatic]

If two have to go, I would not be surprised if it is Hyde and Oliver.  Hyde appears to have lost a step.  Oliver has not had the kind of impact that the team should expect from a ninth overall pick in the draft.  I like both of these players but they are the two that are more easily replaced than the others.

 

We all need to keep in mind that the cap will continue to grow with the escalation of tv revenues and Beane has shown the ability to plan ahead.

[Dopey]

4 minutes ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said:

 

Yeah I get where you're coming from. As for his pass coverage, I think one could argue Milano is better in that department and possibly the best of all the LB's. I do agree Bills have done well defending the pass. I'm excited to see it being even better with improved pass rush this season. 

 

 

I don't see any reason to assume that. Many assumed the same with Diggs "demanding" that type of thing. I never thought for a second it would come to that and I feel the same with Poyer. 

JMO, but Milano isn't as good as Edmunds in coverage. Nah.

[Patrick Duffy]

Just now, Dopey said:

JMO, but Milano isn't as good as Edmunds in coverage. Nah.

I can respect that...there's very many that believes he is. Also many says Milano is the best pass coverage LB we have. Like with everything opinions differ lol

[Dopey]

2 minutes ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said:

I can respect that...there's very many that believes he is. Also many says Milano is the best pass coverage LB we have. Like with everything opinions differ lol

Sheneneh was a trip!🤣🤣

[Mat68]

16 minutes ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said:

 

Yeah I get where you're coming from. As for his pass coverage, I think one could argue Milano is better in that department and possibly the best of all the LB's. I do agree Bills have done well defending the pass. I'm excited to see it being even better with improved pass rush this season. 

 

 

I don't see any reason to assume that. Many assumed the same with Diggs "demanding" that type of thing. I never thought for a second it would come to that and I feel the same with Poyer. 

Still on paper Diggs got top 3 or 4 money.  Von same thing.  White aswell.  Poyer very well could want that.  And he would have every right to ask for it.