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Buzzergate update (Again) Update: Beltran, Cora, Hinch & Luhnow (fired) for illegale sign stealing - compare to NFL & The Patsies

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18 hours ago, Don Otreply said:

Who would hire these guys? They are permanently tainted, no owner in their right mind will hire these guys, their careers are over in MLB. 

At least one would think as much.

 

12 hours ago, cba fan said:

I believe in second chances if they show contrition.

 

 

Dan, on another board someone provided excerpts from the MLB Report.  The below portions of the report provided by that guy on another message board:

 

Are they 100% innocent?  No, but I do feel bad for both these guys as they are most assuredly the fall guys for this.

 

Jeff Luhnow (General Manager). Luhnow adamantly denies knowledge of both the banging scheme and the efforts by the replay review room staff to decode signs and transmit them to the dugout. The investigation revealed no evidence to suggest that Luhnow was aware of the banging scheme. The investigation also revealed that Luhnow neither devised nor actively directed the efforts of the replay review room staff to decode signs in 2017 or 2018. Although Luhnow denies having any awareness that his replay review room staff was decoding and transmitting signs, there is both documentary and testimonial evidence that indicates Luhnow had some knowledge of those efforts, but he did not give it much attention.

 

 

 

A.J. Hinch (Field Manager). Hinch neither devised the banging scheme nor participated in it. Hinch told my investigators that he did not support his players decoding signs using the monitor installed near the dugout and banging the trash can, and he believed that the conduct was both wrong and distracting. Hinch attempted to signal his disapproval of the scheme by physically damaging the monitor on two occasions, necessitating its replacement. However, Hinch admits he did not stop it and he did not notify players or Cora that he disapproved of it, even after the Red Sox were disciplined in September 2017. Similarly, he knew of and did not stop the communication of sign information from the replay review room, although he disagreed with this practice as well and specifically voiced his concerns on at least one occasion about the use of the replay phone for this purpose.

Edited by dollars 2 donuts
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The Mets should fire Beltran today.  The Red Sox should fire Cora today.  

 

These bums have no business being MLB managers.  

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Home sick today and have ESPN on - the outrage across the board by talking heads on this - calling for Astros title to be taken away, Stephen A Smith outraged, title should be stripped and everyone fired because "installing technology is a different level!"    Not a single peep by anyone calling out the Cheaters who have been using technology to cheat for 20 yrs.  What is this world we live in.

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4 minutes ago, stevewin said:

Home sick today and have ESPN on - the outrage across the board by talking heads on this - calling for Astros title to be taken away, Stephen A Smith outraged, title should be stripped and everyone fired because "installing technology is a different level!"    Not a single peep by anyone calling out the Cheaters who have been using technology to cheat for 20 yrs.  What is this world we live in.

 

Yeah, they should take away the Astros championship. And if it's proven the Sox did the same thing in '18, take that championship away too.

 

And yeah, I agree the Pats championship from spy gate should be taken away as well, but that's over a decade ago, I'm not sure the talking heads are going to bring that up now. I don't remember what they said at the time it happened.

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19 minutes ago, MDH said:

 

Yeah, they should take away the Astros championship. And if it's proven the Sox did the same thing in '18, take that championship away too.

 

And yeah, I agree the Pats championship from spy gate should be taken away as well, but that's over a decade ago, I'm not sure the talking heads are going to bring that up now. I don't remember what they said at the time it happened.

Would just like some recognition by someone in the media of the hypocrisy - they are outraged and calling for stripping titles and mass firings for MLB cheating - but when the Patriots** have been doing it for years it is just ignored.  

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22 hours ago, BuffaloBillies said:

Guess which team had the highest BA, OBP, SLG and OPS in all of MLB last year? Houston

Their whole season needs an *

Last year?

 

Well they didnt use this beyond 2017 so that somewhat blows up your * thesis

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35 minutes ago, MDH said:

 

Yeah, they should take away the Astros championship. And if it's proven the Sox did the same thing in '18, take that championship away too.

 

And yeah, I agree the Pats championship from spy gate should be taken away as well, but that's over a decade ago, I'm not sure the talking heads are going to bring that up now. I don't remember what they said at the time it happened.

The best comparison I think is Bountygate (not Spygate), and the punishments seem pretty similar. Bountygate was a lot worse.

6 hours ago, Gordio said:

 

 

Check out the stats from the 2017 ALCS when they played the yankees.  The difference in stats are eye popping at home compared to at Yankee Stadium.  If I am a Yankee fan, I feel very cheated as they were the best team in baseball that year & got cheated out of another WS.  

 

Your missing the point.  Yeah teams steal signs, it is a part of baseball, Houston & Boston stole signs using technology.  

The Yankees were definitely not the best team in baseball in 2017. 

Edited by dave mcbride

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37 minutes ago, MDH said:

 

Yeah, they should take away the Astros championship. And if it's proven the Sox did the same thing in '18, take that championship away too.

 

And yeah, I agree the Pats championship from spy gate should be taken away as well, but that's over a decade ago, I'm not sure the talking heads are going to bring that up now. I don't remember what they said at the time it happened.

But what is that really going to do? They already won, went through the celebrations and everything that goes with the championship and people have moved on. Taking it away isn't really going to do anything but force them to take down a banner and have an opening in their trophy case. 

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22 hours ago, Spiderweb said:

The Astros should forfeit their titles like they do in College sports. For the owner to say this scandal and punishment doesn't tarnish 2017, etc., only shows he should have been suspended/banned as well

Sounds like a good idea. The Yankees should forfeit all titles involving Clemens, Pettitte, Giambi, A Rod, Sheffield, Cano, all their proven steroid users. 

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7 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

The best comparison I think is Bountygate (not Spygate), and the punishments seem pretty similar. Bountygate was a lot worse.

The Yankees were definitely not the best team in baseball in 2017. 

 

 

& yet they took the eventual World Series Champions to 7 games.  In that series, the road team didn't win a game.  Here were the scores

Game 1   2-1 Houston

Game 2   2-1 Houston

Game 3   8-1 Yanks

Game 4   6-4 Yanks

Game 5   5-0 Yanks

Game 6  7-1 Houston

Game 7   4-0 Houston

 

 

 

 

Yankees had probably the best lineup in baseball that.  They beat a 102 win Cleveland team to get to the NLCS & probably would of beat a 101 win Astros team if wasn't for the cheating.  

 

They may not of had the best record in baseball that year but they were a top team.  Dam you, you are making me defend the Yankees  

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18 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

The best comparison I think is Bountygate (not Spygate), and the punishments seem pretty similar. Bountygate was a lot worse.

The Yankees were definitely not the best team in baseball in 2017. 

Cleveland would be the team with a complaint to lodge, they lost to the Yankees that year, but the Astros still had a domino effect on seeding, and the Yankees were a wildcard with Boston as division winners 

Edited by cgg716

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4 hours ago, Reed83HOF said:

It's awful

Even with steroids and HGH you still have to play the game. A hitter knowing if it is a fastball or offspeed before it is even thrown is an enormous advantage.

 

So are pitchers on performance enhancing drugs.  It helps with recovery etc.  Clemens and Pettitte didn't give their rings back if i recall.

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Sad thing is the Red Sox didn’t have to cheat to win that year..  they had 108 wins, swept the Yankees in the divisional round, took out the Astros in 5 games, and the Dodgers in 5 as well.  Sigh..

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5 minutes ago, PatsFanNH said:

Sad thing is the Red Sox didn’t have to cheat to win that year..  they had 108 wins, swept the Yankees in the divisional round, took out the Astros in 5 games, and the Dodgers in 5 as well.  Sigh..

 

I'm not being an As$hole intentionally with this question, but how do you balance out this with the Sox and the Pats? I read a few Boston papers who said they should fire Cora, don't recall seeing the same outrage with the Pats.....

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51 minutes ago, apuszczalowski said:

But what is that really going to do? They already won, went through the celebrations and everything that goes with the championship and people have moved on. Taking it away isn't really going to do anything but force them to take down a banner and have an opening in their trophy case. 

To me it's not about literally stripping titles, but about the media coming around to admit/recognize the illegitimacy of  the fraudulent Patriot*** "dynasty".  They are outraged over the Astros having a single cheating component and calling for stripping titles and mass firings for them - but the Cheaters have had an institutional culture of cheating for 20 yrs and no one in the media says anything

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1 hour ago, Reed83HOF said:

 

I'm not being an As$hole intentionally with this question, but how do you balance out this with the Sox and the Pats? I read a few Boston papers who said they should fire Cora, don't recall seeing the same outrage with the Pats.....

With Cora Depends on his suspension with me if he is suspended for 1 1/2 to 2 years you fire him, especially since his contract is only for 1 more year.  That and if they don’t they look weak after the Astros just cleaned house.. With BB, no one else been punished or suspended so no pressure look tough, also  at the time a lot of former coaches came out saying “everyone is doing it”. (Which is probably true in MLB as well) so was easy rationalize “ we got bagged for something everyone else is doing”

 

hope that answered it for you.. may not me logical but how I felt for both of them.. (and the Sox were not good last year they were god awful while BB and the Pats were always good before and after)

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5 hours ago, RoyBatty is alive said:

Last year?

 

Well they didnt use this beyond 2017 so that somewhat blows up your * thesis

 

It was discussed further in below posts. Yes, that was last year, but "un"surprisingly, the same was true in 2017. In 2018, it was the Red Sox. Go figure. ***

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9 hours ago, dollars 2 donuts said:

 

 

 

Dan, on another board someone provided excerpts from the MLB Report.  The below portions of the report provided by that guy on another message board:

 

Are they 100% innocent?  No, but I do feel bad for both these guys as they are most assuredly the fall guys for this.

 

Jeff Luhnow (General Manager). Luhnow adamantly denies knowledge of both the banging scheme and the efforts by the replay review room staff to decode signs and transmit them to the dugout. The investigation revealed no evidence to suggest that Luhnow was aware of the banging scheme. The investigation also revealed that Luhnow neither devised nor actively directed the efforts of the replay review room staff to decode signs in 2017 or 2018. Although Luhnow denies having any awareness that his replay review room staff was decoding and transmitting signs, there is both documentary and testimonial evidence that indicates Luhnow had some knowledge of those efforts, but he did not give it much attention.

 

 

 

A.J. Hinch (Field Manager). Hinch neither devised the banging scheme nor participated in it. Hinch told my investigators that he did not support his players decoding signs using the monitor installed near the dugout and banging the trash can, and he believed that the conduct was both wrong and distracting. Hinch attempted to signal his disapproval of the scheme by physically damaging the monitor on two occasions, necessitating its replacement. However, Hinch admits he did not stop it and he did not notify players or Cora that he disapproved of it, even after the Red Sox were disciplined in September 2017. Similarly, he knew of and did not stop the communication of sign information from the replay review room, although he disagreed with this practice as well and specifically voiced his concerns on at least one occasion about the use of the replay phone for this purpose.

Inmates running the asylum.

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7 hours ago, RoyBatty is alive said:

Last year?

 

Well they didnt use this beyond 2017 so that somewhat blows up your * thesis

Don't bring facts into the narrative, you will just confuse everyone.  

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7 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

.

The Yankees were definitely not the best team in baseball in 2017. 

I can make an argument that they were the best team in baseball in October.  The ALCS stats are astounding when comparing home and away.  

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6 hours ago, PatsFanNH said:

Sad thing is the Red Sox didn’t have to cheat to win that year..  they had 108 wins, swept the Yankees in the divisional round, took out the Astros in 5 games, and the Dodgers in 5 as well.  Sigh..

 

We were so good we didn't really need to cheat. Cheating had nothing to do with our success. 

 

Sounds vaguely familiar, where have I heard this before?

 

Sigh..

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Any years of disputed World Series titles due to gambling / cheating / steroids will immediately be stripped from the suspect teams, and awarded to the N.Y. Mets.

*
(Going for the Gugny vote here...😁)

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On 1/13/2020 at 3:48 PM, JMF2006 said:

Banned from baseball soon to be hired by Cheatriots ;)

The newest member of Kraft's video crew.

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