Jump to content
PlayoffsPlease

First Time I have been concerned with Josh Allen

Recommended Posts

After seeing Josh Allen's first performance in pre-season last year, I started a thread title "For the love of God, just name Josh Allen the starter" (Mods later changed thread title).

 

To me Allen is the most likable guy in the NFL, and the most fun to watch.  I so much want him to succeed.  

 

Yesterday's game troubled me quite a bit.  With two weeks to prepare for the worst team in the NFL, Singletary back,  a upgraded receiving corp including  glue hands Duke Williams and Tyler Kroft active, I expected the offense to be hitting on nearly all cylinders.   

it appears to me now that Allen and Daboll are simply not a good combination.  Daboll seems to be committed to developing Allen to play in the Daboll system rather than developing a system to optimize Allen's considerable physical skills.  At this point I am not sure they will be successful together.  There is a legitimate school of thought to say that there is a proper way to play NFL QB and Allen needs to learn that.    At the same time I think it is legitimate to say that some teams have been successful (Russell Wison) adapting an offense to take advantage of a particular QBs skill set.   I am not sure which is right.  I will say that I think Daboll's offense would work identically well with Jared Goff as our QB, and I think that leaves a lot of Josh Allen's skill set unused. I don't want to turn Allen into Goff.  

Edited by PlayoffsPlease
typo that made some readers lose their minds.
  • Like (+1) 2
  • Meh 3
  • Skeptical 6
  • Confused 3
  • Sad 2
  • Haha (+1) 2
  • Thanks! (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, PlayoffsPlease said:

After seeing Josh Allen's first performance in pre-season last year, I started a thread title "For the love of God, just name Josh Allen the starter" (Mods later changed thread title).

 

To me Allen is the most likable guy in the NFL, and the most fun to watch.  I so much want him to succeed.  

 

Yesterday's game troubled me quite a bit.  With two weeks to prepare for the worst team in the NFL, Singletary back,  a upgraded receiving corp including  glue hands Duke Williams and Tyler Kroft active, I expected the offense to be hitting on nearly all cylinders.   

it appears to me now that Allen and Daboll are simply not a good combination.  Daboll seems to be committed to developing Allen to play in the Daboll system rather than developing a system to optimize Allen's considerable physical skills.  At this point I am not sure they will be successful together.  There is a legitimate school of thought to say that there is a proper way to play NFL QB and Allen needs to learn that.    At the same time I think it is legitimate to say that some teams have been successful (Russell Williams) adapting an offense to take advantage of a particular QBs skill set.   I am not sure which is right.  I will say that I think Daboll's offense would work identically well with Jared Goff as our QB, and I think that leaves a lot of Josh Allen's skill set unused. I don't want to turn Allen into Goff.  

 

62%, 2TD, 0INT has you concerned?

 

And I think you mean Russell Wilson.

 

 

  • Like (+1) 4
  • Confused 1
  • Haha (+1) 3
  • Thanks! (+1) 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, PlayoffsPlease said:

After seeing Josh Allen's first performance in pre-season last year, I started a thread title "For the love of God, just name Josh Allen the starter" (Mods later changed thread title).

 

To me Allen is the most likable guy in the NFL, and the most fun to watch.  I so much want him to succeed.  

 

Yesterday's game troubled me quite a bit.  With two weeks to prepare for the worst team in the NFL, Singletary back,  a upgraded receiving corp including  glue hands Duke Williams and Tyler Kroft active, I expected the offense to be hitting on nearly all cylinders.   

it appears to me now that Allen and Daboll are simply not a good combination.  Daboll seems to be committed to developing Allen to play in the Daboll system rather than developing a system to optimize Allen's considerable physical skills.  At this point I am not sure they will be successful together.  There is a legitimate school of thought to say that there is a proper way to play NFL QB and Allen needs to learn that.    At the same time I think it is legitimate to say that some teams have been successful (Russell Williams) adapting an offense to take advantage of a particular QBs skill set.   I am not sure which is right.  I will say that I think Daboll's offense would work identically well with Jared Goff as our QB, and I think that leaves a lot of Josh Allen's skill set unused. I don't want to turn Allen into Goff.  

 

hmmm....I will have to disagree. At least about having a problem with Josh all the sudden after yesterday. 

 

He missed two deep balls, but had a slew of other great throws (the touch pass to duke, the TD to Brown, the brown throw across the field, the throw to knox that was dropped as examples). 

 

Josh did not appear to be the problem with the offense. Dropped passes, missed assignments and untimely penalties have continued to stall our offensive drives inside enemy territory and THAT is very concerning. We need to figure out a way to continue to execute, which to be fair we did on the drive that started in 3rd quarter and ended in the 4th. 

 

I have very little problems with the way Josh played today, aside from missing those deep throws. WHY CANT HE HIT THOSE????? Is it a total shook confidence thing now? 

  • Like (+1) 5
  • Thanks! (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Josh has played arguably his most complete and mistake free games the last two weeks and now people are concerned??

  • Like (+1) 6
  • Haha (+1) 3
  • Awesome! (+1) 2
  • Thanks! (+1) 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Philo said:

Josh has played arguably his most complete and mistake free games the last two weeks and now people are concerned??

 

right?

 

The DEFENSE is the reason that game was close. They underperformed mightily. The O put up 24 points.

 

  • Like (+1) 4
  • Thanks! (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, PlayoffsPlease said:

After seeing Josh Allen's first performance in pre-season last year, I started a thread title "For the love of God, just name Josh Allen the starter" (Mods later changed thread title).

 

To me Allen is the most likable guy in the NFL, and the most fun to watch.  I so much want him to succeed.  

 

Yesterday's game troubled me quite a bit.  With two weeks to prepare for the worst team in the NFL, Singletary back,  a upgraded receiving corp including  glue hands Duke Williams and Tyler Kroft active, I expected the offense to be hitting on nearly all cylinders.   

it appears to me now that Allen and Daboll are simply not a good combination.  Daboll seems to be committed to developing Allen to play in the Daboll system rather than developing a system to optimize Allen's considerable physical skills.  At this point I am not sure they will be successful together.  There is a legitimate school of thought to say that there is a proper way to play NFL QB and Allen needs to learn that.    At the same time I think it is legitimate to say that some teams have been successful (Russell Williams) adapting an offense to take advantage of a particular QBs skill set.   I am not sure which is right.  I will say that I think Daboll's offense would work identically well with Jared Goff as our QB, and I think that leaves a lot of Josh Allen's skill set unused. I don't want to turn Allen into Goff.  

That's pretty vague.

 

Daboll's calling a lot of designed runs (more than I care for, honestly) and moving the pocket, which seems to be what you're looking for.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Relax the kids played 17 NFL games.

 

You don't need to put 50 up on a team to win and winning like that gets you a lot of hate.

 

I like how Dabol has barely dipped into the playbook and the Bills are still 5-1.

 

Lets save some stuff for down the stretch when things get tougher.

  • Like (+1) 4
  • Thanks! (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, PlayoffsPlease said:

it appears to me now that Allen and Daboll are simply not a good combination.

 

I dont agree with this. 

 

If you just let Allen play to his strengths youd just be seeing Allen from last year. 

 

Allen was challenged to develop a short and intermediate passing game for the betterment of himself and the taem.

 

Last year he couldnt even hit a slant.

 

Im all for Dabol right now as Josh continues to become a more complete passer.

  • Like (+1) 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Could someone drive a golf cart at full speed down the field and have Josh practice throwing to it for the next few days?

 

I looked it up just now, John Elway had 4 fourth-quarter comebacks in his first two years and his stats were way below where Josh is trending, currently.

Josh already has 5 comebacks. 

 

I'll take what I'm seeing.

Edited by Seasons1992
  • Like (+1) 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

His play in the Pats* game had me concerned. This week was a little slow out of the gate, but also had some drops/bobbles.

  • Like (+1) 3
  • Thanks! (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

PATIENCE

 

Allen is and always has been considered a work in progress.  I think he has and will continue to improve, not in huge quantum leaps but gradually.  Yesterday was HUGE progress, didn't turn the ball over once.  He is learning not io take (as many) stupid chances and throws, learning to take care of the ball .  I think Dabol is purposely designing plays to stay in the pocket and not run at the first hint of danger and Allens pocket awareness is improving.

 

Allen is going to take some time and should get better with experience.

 

Oh and we are 5-1 and he has, pretty incredibly got his completion % above the "magic" 60%.

 

 

  • Like (+1) 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Joe in Winslow said:

 

right?

 

The DEFENSE is the reason that game was close. They underperformed mightily. The O put up 24 points.

 

 

Exactly. Defense played easily their worst game of the year (they were going to have a down game eventually) and the offense was able to bail them out. And that's despite having a few solid drives sputter out due to drops or penalties. Josh is the last person to blame for this being a closer game than anyone anticipated. 

  • Like (+1) 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lmao this thread. Russell Williams? Hahahaha

 

This fan base is horrible and why no good coaches or players liked coming here for 20 years

 

5-1 with a GREEN QB that everybody said HAD TO SIT FOR A YEAR OR 2

 

Well guess what he was baptized by fire and the growing pains will take years to fully work out..  people complaining about his INTs or hero mindset don't even realize he was NEVER given the time to acclimate to the league. Find out in practice over a few years what works and what doenst

 

But he was thrown into the fire... And now he is learning by trial and error... And people still get mad when he throws that ball across his body for an INT..   well guess what , I saw Favre throw that INT 50 times in his career and he didn't learn til 35

 

I'm giving Allen time

 

  • Like (+1) 8
  • Awesome! (+1) 1
  • Thanks! (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think people want Josh to be a 70% completion type QB and threaten 300 yards consistently.  He’s just not that type of QB.  Never was never will be most likely.  

  • Skeptical 2
  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm growing concerned over our inability to beat the blitz.  For whatever reason, Allen is not doing a good job of hitting his hot receiver -- I don't know whether that's a result of him not being able to see pressure coming pre-snap, not finding the outlet guy fast enough, poor play design, or what, but it needs to get fixed.

  • Like (+1) 3
  • Thanks! (+1) 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Buffalo716 said:

Lmao this thread. Russell Williams? Hahahaha

 

This fan base is horrible and why no good coaches or players liked coming here for 20 years

 

5-1 with a GREEN QB that everybody said HAD TO SIT FOR A YEAR OR 2

 

Well guess what he was baptized by fire and the growing pains will take years to fully work out..  people complaining about his INTs or hero mindset don't even realize he was NEVER given the time to acclimate to the league. Find out in practice over a few years what works and what doenst

 

But he was thrown into the fire... And now he is learning by trial and error... And people still get mad when he throws that ball across his body for an INT..   well guess what , I saw Favre throw that INT 50 times in his career and he didn't learn til 35

 

I'm giving Allen time

 

 

And they choose a really solid outing to get concerned?

 

Makes no sense.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Joe in Winslow said:

right?

 

The DEFENSE is the reason that game was close. They underperformed mightily. The O put up 24 points.

 

Eh...the defense only allowed 14 points when it really counted.  I didn't see the game but I could chalk-up the last TD by the Dols to prevent defense/thinking they had the game in hand being up by 10. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I feel like people are expecting a perfect product from Josh. He's barely scratching the surface of his potential, last year it was concerns about his completion percentage and that's dramatically improved, give the QB of our 5-1 team credit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Doc said:

 

Eh...the defense only allowed 14 points when it really counted.  I didn't see the game but I could chalk-up the last TD by the Dols to prevent defense/thinking they had the game in hand being up by 10. 

Actually, they were not very good yesterday - not by their standards. They gave up way too many long, time consuming drives.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I actually like what they're doing with Allen. I think that how they're developing him will pay dividends down the line. It looks to me like they are trying to rein in his hero ball and turn him into a passer. There will be growing pains but he's young and they're still winning.

 

He and Lamar are both physically gifted but I think Lamar is getting the exact opposite treatment. The Ravens seem to have taken the approach of letting him just play his game. They want to win now and don't seem to be worrying about the future which is not surprising seeing as how there'd been talk of Harbaugh needing to win or he would be out. If Lamar ever loses his ability to make plays with his legs, he'd be unprepared to play QB at a high level. I think the way their developing Allen is to make sure he can succeed if his legs become a non factor.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, PlayoffsPlease said:

After seeing Josh Allen's first performance in pre-season last year, I started a thread title "For the love of God, just name Josh Allen the starter" (Mods later changed thread title).

 

To me Allen is the most likable guy in the NFL, and the most fun to watch.  I so much want him to succeed.  

 

Yesterday's game troubled me quite a bit.  With two weeks to prepare for the worst team in the NFL, Singletary back,  a upgraded receiving corp including  glue hands Duke Williams and Tyler Kroft active, I expected the offense to be hitting on nearly all cylinders.   

it appears to me now that Allen and Daboll are simply not a good combination.  Daboll seems to be committed to developing Allen to play in the Daboll system rather than developing a system to optimize Allen's considerable physical skills.  At this point I am not sure they will be successful together.  There is a legitimate school of thought to say that there is a proper way to play NFL QB and Allen needs to learn that.    At the same time I think it is legitimate to say that some teams have been successful (Russell Williams) adapting an offense to take advantage of a particular QBs skill set.   I am not sure which is right.  I will say that I think Daboll's offense would work identically well with Jared Goff as our QB, and I think that leaves a lot of Josh Allen's skill set unused. I don't want to turn Allen into Goff.  

 

I don't know where to start with this.

 

Of all the games Allen has played, to say this is the first time you're concerned about him or the combination of Daboll and Allen is a total head-scratcher for me.

Not the Jets game where Allen had 2 picks and 2 fumbles in the first half, 1 of each unambiguously a boneheaded play on his part.

Not the Pats game where Allen threw 3 INTs, all of them bone-headed decisions, and decided as Smith put it to "run head first into human beings" and get knocked out; he only completed 46% of his passes for 153 yds and on film, he left quite a few plays on the field.

 

SMH

 

I really ought to merge this as the topic of whether or not Josh Allen will be a successful QB is being flogged thoroughly in several threads, but *cough* I don't want to derail them from such discussion as is taking place, so I'll just leave this out there.

  • Like (+1) 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've re-watched the game and I think Allen was just fine. He didn't put up 300, but he did what he was asked to do.  He threw behind Beasely early in the game and missed on the two deep balls - outside of that he did well. He didn't have enough pass attempts to put up the huge stats that everyone wants to see without hitting a deep ball.  Knox drop alone cost him 4% in his completion percentage and probably 15-20 yards.  Beasely didn't come up with a very catchable ball on an out as well - which won't go down as a drop on the stat sheet but most NFL WRs would have come up with it.  Would have, could have, should have... I get it - but if both players made those routine plays, his stat line reads 18/26 (69%) for 240, 2 TDs 0 INTs and 32 yards rushing on 4 carries.  I'll take that.

 

I'll call it here - next week he'll have his 300 yards passing.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, BuffaloHokie13 said:

His play in the Pats* game had me concerned. This week was a little slow out of the gate, but also had some drops/bobbles.

 

This.  Hokie, have you looked at the film yet?  Look at Daboll's play calling and the blocking design in the first few series and tell me what you think. 

For me there's some flashback moments to last year where I wished I could (figuratively, 'cuz he could smash me like a buuuug) grab Daboll by the ears and yell "KISS!  KISS damn your eyeballs KISS! (and I'm not talking smoochies)

 

  • Confused 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...