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Clowney Trending for some reason.

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Just now, JoeF said:

Bills are in a unique position because Gaine works for them...negotiations occurred and Gaine knows the parameters...kind of like the 2017 draft when we leaped in front of Carolina twice because Beane knew he was coming here (Did I just ***** say that?)

 

He knows the parameters for a 9 sack guy with an outstanding all round game. But if Clowney comes here and relinquished of some other responsibilities and sent QB hunting every down gets 15 sacks that price goes up.    

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Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, Rocket94 said:

High draft picks worry me.

 

Youd quite literally be spending the high pick hoping to get a guy not as good as this. Because we are not spending on a qb, we don’t need to horde picks and pray for luck. We can go get the guy we need and win now. 

 

Ill keep echoing- if you think josh, McD and beane are the trio; then you need to think we are contenders now and be making moves to put a trophy in the shelf within the next 18 months.

 

to the guy talking about the pats- it’s just apples to oranges. You need to be looking at the rams, and eagles, or the 9ers and Seahawks of a couple years ago. We need to be that team that fans in Tampa bay and Arizona say “how do they keep adding these guys.” At the end of the run if josh is the dude then you retool into a pats style model. It’s not who we should be today though. 

Edited by NoSaint
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2 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

 

Youd quite literally be spending the high pick hoping to get a guy not as good as this. Because we are not spending on a qb, we don’t need to horde picks and pray for luck. We can go get the guy we need and win now. 

 

Ill keep echoing- if you think josh, McD and beane are the trio; then you need to think we are contenders now and be making moves to put a trophy in the shelf within the next 18 months.

 

to the guy talking about the pats- it’s just apples to oranges. You need to be looking at the rams, and eagles, or the 9ers and Seahawks of a couple years ago. We need to be that team that fans in Tampa bay and Arizona say “how do they keep adding these guys.” At the end of the run if josh is the dude then you retool into a pats style model. It’s not who we should be today though. 

 

Yes to all this. Our Super Bowl window is the next 3 seasons. We aren't drafting a QB next year no matter what. I'd absolutely trade picks for a stud pass rusher right now.

 

The only thing that I hesitate with is the WR class next year is supposed to be great. If we're giving a 1st for a stud pass rusher that's fine but a stud WR would probably be more helpful moving forward.

 

But planning for next year's draft is tough. I'd probably still take the gamble now and know I'm getting a great player no matter what.

 

Shaq Lawson isn't a Super Bowl player. He's a fine piece. But you include him in a trade for Clowney in a heartbeat if that's what it takes. He's a throw in like Jordan Matthews was for us.

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10 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

He knows the parameters for a 9 sack guy with an outstanding all round game. But if Clowney comes here and relinquished of some other responsibilities and sent QB hunting every down gets 15 sacks that price goes up.    

 

Ultimately, gunner, do you think his pay changes drastically?

 

9 or 15 sacks he’s getting paid as essentially the top DE in the league. It’s not like he’s suddenly doubling his pay, at most it’s an extra 5-10m over the contract right? It’s not going to shoot him from 20 to 30 mil per year 

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I think it’s gonna take a lot more than a 3rd and a 5th.  More like a 2nd rounder at a minimum and some desperate team like the Skins looking to sell some hope with a splashy move will probably offer a 1st rounder.  

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29 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

 

Ultimately if you think josh is the guy you are in your 2-3 year window and outside QB getting a stud DE might be the biggest impact and we CAN and SHOULD spend a little belligerently for a minute. If not him, I’m down for other suggestions but he seems the prototype for us.

They already showed an interest in AB (who I’d argue is the other big need). In addition, to “if Josh is the guy” the roster is deep. It’s not like they are going to have 10 draft picks make the team in 2020. They have the most cap space in the league already. This is the EXACT type of investment that the Bills should make.

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41 minutes ago, Virgil said:

 

Wait, where is this coming from?

 

This is all from the trending part. 

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28 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Agree, I think Shaq is a really good football player. My dad always says that he reminds him of Phil Hansen and I think that’s a decent comparison. He’s stout against the run and a decent pass rusher. He’s just a solid NFL player. He’s the kind of guy that the Patriots always have. 

 

 

Yeah he brings a physical element they otherwise lack at DE and even though he's not been a good one-on-one rusher he has always been an opportunistic vulture if others can force the chaos.  On paper Shaq loses snaps to Clowney but since Clowney can be moved all over I think Shaq gets more opportunity to make plays in a defense with Clowney.  

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3 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

They already showed an interest in AB (who I’d argue is the other big need). In addition, to “if Josh is the guy” the roster is deep. It’s not like they are going to have 10 draft picks make the team in 2020. They have the most cap space in the league already. This is the EXACT type of investment that the Bills should make.

Bingo. 

 

It regularly blows my mind how many here think we’ve nailed it with this regime but also think our window is years away. 

 

If you aren’t willing to put some chips on the table now, I don’t know when you will. I agree beane is thinking in these terms despite many citing it not being process-y

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2 hours ago, Mike in Syracuse said:

Honestly, the Bills had the #2 defense last year with a hobbled Murphy.    Is adding Clowney really going to make that big of a difference?   Especially on a one year rental?

 

 

We had the 18th ranked defense.  Points allowed is all that matters.  Yards allowed is meaningless if you can't keep your opponents from scoring. 

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I am surprised to see Miami mentioned in the rumors. They are a prime candidate for the #1 overall pick - are they going to give that up for Clowney in a rebuilding year? That is the last team I would expect to make this trade.

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1 minute ago, HappyDays said:

I am surprised to see Miami mentioned in the rumors. They are a prime candidate for the #1 overall pick - are they going to give that up for Clowney in a rebuilding year? That is the last team I would expect to make this trade.

No, the talk is Tunsil and a pick

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, msw2112 said:

I agree with those who want to take a pass on Clowney.  I see him as a Dareus-like player (albeit with a much better physique).  He is highly talented and would be paid top dollar as such, but is not highly motivated.  Whatever team signs him to a large, long-term deal will regret it later.  Clowney is the exact type of player (like Dareus) that causes teams to get into salary cap jail. 

 

I hate the Patriots as much as the next guy, but they manage their cap extremely well.  They get rid of guys like this and let some other team take on the headaches and salary cap issues.  When they do get "problem child" types of players, which they sometimes do (see Josh Gordon, Randy Moss, etc.), it's usually on the cheap, when the guys are running out of chances and trying to re-establish themselves.  If it works out, they get a bargain and if it doesn't, they can get rid of them with little cap impact.

Watch Clowney play and don’t focus on raw sack numbers. Look at tackles for loss, for instance. It’s where he excels. He is a truly elite player and doesn’t underproduce.

 

By PFF, he has been elite-level the past two seasons. This is indicative: https://texanswire.usatoday.com/2017/10/30/jadeveon-clowney-deandre-hopkins-post-blistering-pff-scores-vs-seattle/

Edited by dave mcbride
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7 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

I am surprised to see Miami mentioned in the rumors. They are a prime candidate for the #1 overall pick - are they going to give that up for Clowney in a rebuilding year? That is the last team I would expect to make this trade.

 

I’d assume 33 not 1

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Posted (edited)
39 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

 

Youd quite literally be spending the high pick hoping to get a guy not as good as this. Because we are not spending on a qb, we don’t need to horde picks and pray for luck. We can go get the guy we need and win now. 

 

Ill keep echoing- if you think josh, McD and beane are the trio; then you need to think we are contenders now and be making moves to put a trophy in the shelf within the next 18 months.

 

to the guy talking about the pats- it’s just apples to oranges. You need to be looking at the rams, and eagles, or the 9ers and Seahawks of a couple years ago. We need to be that team that fans in Tampa bay and Arizona say “how do they keep adding these guys.” At the end of the run if josh is the dude then you retool into a pats style model. It’s not who we should be today though. 

I remember this argument at draft time. Clowney in all probability is better now than any DE that we would draft in 2020 and he is a proven player. It seems like he has been around for years, yet he is only 26. He would probably fit in the Bills defense seamlessly.

Edited by Rocket94

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10 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

 

I’d assume 33 not 1

 

I assumed a 1st round pick was the floor for a Clowney trade. Maybe with the weird contract situation he wouldn't cost that much?

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clowny is a type of defensive player you have to game plan for or he wrecks your offense. He’s not the best d end in the league but a dangerous one nonetheless. He’s a great grab for this defense if we can get him

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2 hours ago, Johnny Hammersticks said:

This doesn’t seem like a very “processy” move to me.  Several picks for Clowney?  No thanks.....

Yep.  Multiple picks plus big $ if they are able to sign him in next off-season.  Doesn't like a Beane thing.   

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Am I giant Clowney fan? Not at all.  But the thought of Hughes, Oliver and Clowney going after Brady and the other QBs sounds great.

 

I would be okay with a 2nd or a 3rd/4th and Shaq Lawson.  Saying we could get an extension of course

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Big money and giving up high picks doesn’t work.

 

Anything above Shaq Lawson and a 3rd is a dealbreaker for me. 

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If he was a free agent I'd be hesitant to give him that much money but having to give up a likely 1st round pick along with that much money would be a gigantic mistake.

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33 minutes ago, Rocket94 said:

I remember this argument at draft time. Clowney in all probability is better now than any DE that we would draft in 2020 and he is a proven player. It seems like he has been around for years, yet he is only 26. He would probably fit in the Bills defense seamlessly.

It would have been a better trade at draft time for both sides. Texans get a 2019 pick and Bills have opportunity to sign him to an extension. Now Texans need a player in return in addition to a 2020 pick and Bills are past the timeline to sign him to an extension, which is a big risk. 

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Unless he is getting a big deal, it would make sense. Or not getting the deal or turning down. I can see it. But people are trending like Michael J Fox for no reason. If it is that he is dying it would be one thing.

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