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Who's Most Responsible for Pats* Dynasty: Brady or Belichick?

Who's Most Responsible for Pats* Dynasty: Brady or Belichick?  

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  1. 1. Who's Most Responsible for Pats* Dynasty: Brady or Belichick?



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Neither, the Refs are thanks to all that money Robert Kraft pays them on the low.

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25 minutes ago, ShadyBillsFan said:

not to put a hole in your balloon but ....   

 

Belicheat still manages to win w/o Brady.  

 Backup quarterback Matt Cassel replaced Brady. Cassel's led the team to a win in Week 2 against the New York Jets, his first start since high school.
Despite finishing the regular season with an 11–5 record, the Patriots did not qualify for the playoffs—becoming the first 11-win team since the expansion to a 12-team playoff in 1990 to not make the playoffs,

 

Meh freaking Cassel!! 

 

And lets not forget the legends of James Garoppolo and Jacoby  Brisset

blips on the radar don't a dynasty make

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Posted (edited)
29 minutes ago, Cripple Creek said:

blips on the radar don't a dynasty make

maybe maybe not,

 

11-5 with Meh Cassel.   

 

What is his record post NE? 

 

His first season in KC Meh Cassel had a 4-11 record, his 2nd  10-5, then 4-5 and 1-7.  (19-28 overall in KC)

 

 

How many of the transient players (brought into NE for 1 or 2 seasons) should be considered "blips on the radar"?  

 

Edited by ShadyBillsFan

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28 minutes ago, ShadyBillsFan said:

maybe maybe not,

 

11-5 with Meh Cassel.   

 

What is his record post NE? 

 

His first season in KC Meh Cassel had a 4-11 record, his 2nd  10-5, then 4-5 and 1-7.  (19-28 overall in KC)

 

 

How many of the transient players (brought into NE for 1 or 2 seasons) should be considered "blips on the radar"?  

 

The blips were at the QB position. Other rental players don't matter.

 

You answered your own question regarding Cassel. His 'success' was unsustainable. Brady's success has been sustained.

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5 minutes ago, Cripple Creek said:

The blips were at the QB position. Other rental players don't matter.

 

You answered your own question regarding Cassel. His 'success' was unsustainable. Brady's success has been sustained.

LOL 

 

Or was it the Coach that made his success sustainable? 

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Thankfully, this thread has helped me answer the burning question of what it must be like to discuss only deep Pats-centric questions on a Pats board :P.

 

For them, it must be something along the lines of the "debate" between the SNL "Bill Swersky superfans" roundtable (look it up kids) where figuring out who would win between Ditka and Michael Jordan, or Ditka versus a hurricane named "Ditka" were considered over heaping plates of Polish sausage. Carry on. 

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4 minutes ago, ShadyBillsFan said:

LOL 

 

Or was it the Coach that made his success sustainable? 

Nope. It's both, but without Brady Belichick is nothing special.  You must have that QB.

 

Give me a list of your top coaches NFL all time.  What do they have in common?

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People often cite the 11-5 Cassell record - but we really enabled that.  2 of the most winnable games ever that we just Billsed to the max.

 

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4 minutes ago, Success said:

People often cite the 11-5 Cassell record - but we really enabled that.  2 of the most winnable games ever that we just Billsed to the max.

 

 

They were also 16-0 the year before...that's a 5 game drop which is a lot.

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19 minutes ago, Cripple Creek said:

Nope. It's both, but without Brady Belichick is nothing special.  You must have that QB.

 

Give me a list of your top coaches NFL all time.  What do they have in common?

 

Who is Brady Belichick?

 

 

 

#commalivesmatter

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Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

Who is Brady Belichick?

 

 

 

#commalivesmatter

🖕

Edited by Cripple Creek

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1 minute ago, BarkleyForGOATBackupPT5P said:

WOW. I had Brady. Was not expecting that result.

It's ok. You are correct.  Don't let the lemmings sway you.

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22 hours ago, Binghamton Beast said:

 

What would that be?

 

Didn’t the Bills shut them out in New England without Brady?

Image result for matt cassel meme

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6 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

They were also 16-0 the year before...that's a 5 game drop which is a lot.

That roster was STACKED as well. Everybody at the time still thought of them as a really good team even after Brady went down.

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22 minutes ago, Cripple Creek said:

Nope. It's both, but without Brady Belichick is nothing special.  You must have that QB.

 

Give me a list of your top coaches NFL all time.  What do they have in common?

How can anyone make this claim?  When has Brady been without Belichick?  Belichick struggled as a head coach with Brady.  Brady has never played without Belichick.  

 

And the Cassel point is such garbage.  They won 5 less games than the previous year and scored 179 less points.  Also in 2016, they averaged 20.25 points/ game without Brady and  30.9 points/ game with him.  Brady might be the greatest qb ever.

7 minutes ago, BarkleyForGOATBackupPT5P said:

WOW. I had Brady. Was not expecting that result.

Yeah, I don’t get it either. Great qb > great coach

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2 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

How can anyone make this claim?  When has Brady been without Belichick?  Belichick struggled as a head coach with Brady.  Brady has never played without Belichick.  

 

And the Cassel point is such garbage.  They won 5 less games than the previous year and scored 179 less points.  Also in 2016, they averaged 20.25 points/ game without Brady and  30.9 points/ game with him.  Brady might be the greatest qb ever.

 

He probably is - his playoff numbers are insanely good too.  

 

Last 3 years, 8-1 in the playoffs 66% comp, averaging 358 per game - they scored a ton of TDs on the ground this past year, but that all opens up because brady basically carves you up unless you play nickel.  And if you're in nickel they just abuse you with the ground game.

14 minutes ago, ProcessAccepted said:

Image result for matt cassel meme

 

One of these things is not like the other....

 

4806 50/8 68.9% 16-0 vs. 3693 21/11 63.4% 11-5

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At this point, it’s not provable, one way or the other.  Perhaps after Brady retires and the Pats keep winning, we’ll have our answer.

 

As great as Brady is, if he had not come along, I don’t think there’s much doubt that Belichick would have found another franchise QB somewhere, somehow.  Maybe he doesn’t win six Super Bowls, but still...

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This game revolves around having a top 5 QB. Brady has made so so so so many big time throws to win Super Bowls and playoff games. If both these guys were FA they would both have their choice of teams. Brady without a doubt would win a lot more Super Bowls with his new team then Belicheat. It sickens me to say this but Brady's is just on a different level when is comes to pressure situations, pocket awareness, accuracy, confidence, game situations, never rattled, knowledge and film study and big play making. Without Brady Belicheat is like so many good coaches that couldn't find a top 5 QB.

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57 minutes ago, Cripple Creek said:

Nope. It's both, but without Brady Belichick is nothing special.  You must have that QB.

 

Give me a list of your top coaches NFL all time.  What do they have in common?

agree to that  -  They needed each other to be successful. 

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11 hours ago, Ol Dirty B said:

 

He went 10-6 with Matt Cassel and wasnt Garrapolo 2-0?

And 1-1 with Brissett. The one loss was to the Bills but Brissett pretty much played with one hand that day and Edelman was the backup

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37 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

How can anyone make this claim?  When has Brady been without Belichick?  Belichick struggled as a head coach with Brady.  Brady has never played without Belichick.  

 

And the Cassel point is such garbage.  They won 5 less games than the previous year and scored 179 less points.  Also in 2016, they averaged 20.25 points/ game without Brady and  30.9 points/ game with him.  Brady might be the greatest qb ever.

 

Because it's the obvious truth.

 

Give me your list of all time top NFL coaches. 

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1 minute ago, Captain Hindsight said:
11 hours ago, Ol Dirty B said:

 

He went 10-6 with Matt Cassel and wasnt Garrapolo 2-0?

And 1-1 with Brissett. The one loss was to the Bills but Brissett pretty much played with one hand that day and Edelman was the backup

 

IIRC  - I think it was 1.5 games each that got the Putz off to 3-0 before the powerhouse Tyrod Taylor beat them 16-0 

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Seeing as you could be the best QB in the league but if you didn't have a decent O line & scheme to go along with it i voted BB  

 

He has been able to bring in players that can keep (for the most part) Brady clean enough to get done what he needs to along with a scheme that the other players brought in on the offense that at times were less than elite players to get the job done with in that scheme to help Brady in every way to be the GOAT .

 

The emphasis has been on team with the Pats it's a some of all the parts but there has to be a master mind to put those parts together & it has to involve a lot more than luck to make it all work especially as long as it has !!

 

Even on the rare occasion when Brady has went down BB would insert another QB that would pull off good results with in the scheme they ran & even losing or getting rid of other great players on the roster in the past he always seems to make the parts work which is his strength !!

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