Buffalo Sabres and NHL: 2019/20: Sabres season officially over. Draft lottery June 26th

[Foxx]

https://twitter.com/davelevinthal/status/1231418233846145024

 

[\GoBillsInDallas/]

Sabres win again!

 

[BillsFan4]

Another Nice win!  5 wins in their last 6 games! 

[Buffalophil1948]

I'm thinking the canes need a goalie.  I believe Hutton could be made available 

[JohnC]

The attached link is a summary of the game taken from NHL.com.

 

I only watched the first period so I can't give a fair assessment of the game. But from what I did see of the game the Sabres played a simple and defensive oriented game emphasizing protecting their young goalie.

 

The Sabres have won 5 of the last 6 games (as noted by BillsFan4). What is a lingering frustration is losing to Ottawa on a few occasions and losing against Anaheim at home on the extended homestand. This season would be viewed in a much better light if the team could have seized on those opportunities.  

 

There is a large segment of the population here that believes that everything associated with this GM and how he is building the team has failed. They are wrong. Many of them are ferociously clinging to their collapsing narrative because they have repeated it so often that they are invested in it.   There are obvious needs that need to be addressed but steadily this roster is being upgraded. It takes time. Although this team is unlikely to make the playoffs this year the trajectory is clearly upwards. To the tiresome snickering crowd I repeat what I have been saying all along: Stay the course!

 

 

https://www.nhl.com/gamecenter/wpg-vs-buf/2020/02/23/2019020960#game=2019020960,game_state=final

[JohnC]

The link is Krueger's post game comments on WGR. You can bring up the other post game links from this page. 

 

https://wgr550.radio.com/media/audio-channel/2-23-ralph-krueger-post-game

Edited February 24, 2020 by JohnC

[4merper4mer]

13 minutes ago, JohnC said:

The attached link is a summary of the game taken from NHL.com.

 

I only watched the first period so I can't give a fair assessment of the game. But from what I did see of the game the Sabres played a simple and defensive oriented game emphasizing protecting their young goalie.

 

The Sabres have won 5 of the last 6 games (as noted by BillsFan4). What is a lingering frustration is losing to Ottawa on a few occasions and losing against Anaheim at home on the extended homestand. This season would be viewed in a much better light if the team could have seized on those opportunities.  

 

There is a large segment of the population here that believes that everything associated with this GM and how he is building the team has failed. They are wrong. Many of them are ferociously clinging to their collapsing narrative because they have repeated it so often that they are invested in it.   There are obvious needs that need to be addressed but steadily this roster is being upgraded. It takes time. Although this team is unlikely to make the playoffs this year the trajectory is clearly upwards. To the tiresome snickering crowd I repeat what I have been saying all along: Stay the course!

 

 

https://www.nhl.com/gamecenter/wpg-vs-buf/2020/02/23/2019020960#game=2019020960,game_state=final

Don't be a jerk by insinuating people aren't rooting for the Sabres.  I don't think that is true for anyone and it certainly isn't true for me.  I want them to win every single game.  Two good wins in a row and you're on here with a "see I told you so"?  Shirley.

[BillsFan4]

 

More than I thought he’d get, though he only gets the pro-rated amount. Tampa’s defense is really banged up right now, though. 

 

Edited February 24, 2020 by BillsFan4

[shrader]

At this point, the frustration shouldn’t be about any individual game no matter how bad certain ones were. For me, it’s about how they came out of the all star break. With the way Toronto is sinking, that stretch may very well have cost this team the playoffs. 
 

Still, at this point I want to see a strong push to the playoffs. It will wind up falling short, but this season needs to end on a positive note. We haven’t seen one of those in a long time. 
 

And they can definitely do that while still dumping a few of the expiring contracts at the deadline. 

[Lurker]

While the weekend was fun, the upcoming four game road trip will let the air out of the baloon...

[JohnC]

3 minutes ago, shrader said:

At this point, the frustration shouldn’t be about any individual game no matter how bad certain ones were. For me, it’s about how they came out of the all star break. With the way Toronto is sinking, that stretch may very well have cost this team the playoffs. 
 

Still, at this point I want to see a strong push to the playoffs. It will wind up falling short, but this season needs to end on a positive note. We haven’t seen one of those in a long time. 
 

And they can definitely do that while still dumping a few of the expiring contracts at the deadline. 

I agree with you that not taking advantage of the schedule in the extended homestand was very disappointing. I'm still not sure that winning some of those more winnable games would have catapulted us into the playoffs but it would have kept us in contention up to the end.  

 

I also want to see a strong push for the playoffs as much for the fans as for the players. As far as the expiring contracts I would hate to see either Larsson or Gergs dealt. What's the point? Because they are UFAs they won't  result in much of a return while their value is still reasonably high for us as reflected in their play. I'm hoping that they can be retained and their line maintained for next year. 

[BillsFan4]

50% retained 

 

 

Quote

So barring a late change of heart by Kreider, who apparently is in his last day as a Ranger after nearly eight years as a member of the organization, the Blueshirts will spend Monday sifting through trade offers, not only for No. 20, but in a cascade effect, for fellow pending free-agent winger Jesper Fast and perhaps others on the varsity.

 

That represents Plan B. If management had been able to come to an agreement with Kreider, the Rangers were prepared to hold tight and make a run. But removing that top-six piece from the picture changes the dynamic. The Rangers won’t give Fast away, but they are likely to deal the four-time-running Players’ Player if they can get a second-rounder as part of the package in return.

 

The Blueshirts also might be prepared to listen if teams come calling on Brady Skjei or Marc Staal, the latter of course with a no-move clause he would have to waive. 

 

With Toronto struggling and Montreal + The NYR (the 2 teams closest to buffalo in the standings) waiving the White flag, it’s somewhat tempting to keep our UFA’s to be, and/or make a smaller, cheap add and try to chase down a playoff spot. Realistically though, I know they won’t make the playoffs. But I still don’t want to see guys like Larsson or Girgensons traded for 4th round picks. They should re-sign Larsson, but I wouldn’t trade him for anything less than a 3rd (ideally a 2nd). I’d rather keep him for this season and lose him for nothing vs. trade him for a 4th or later. Staying in the playoff race is meaningful for this group IMO and they need someone that can play center besides Eichel. 

Edited February 24, 2020 by BillsFan4

[bbb]

The Rangers are red hot.  Why are they waving the white flag?!?

[JohnC]

10 hours ago, bbb said:

The Rangers are red hot.  Why are they waving the white flag?!?

They have tried to come to a contract deal with Kreider but he wants to test the market. They know what the range of what he is asking for and are not willing to at least now pay it. So instead of losing him for nothing they will try to extract as much value in return as they can. 

 

The Rangers' goal is not to eek into the playoffs. They are to a degree involved in an accelerated rebuild so that they can become a cup contending team in the near future.  

[snafu]

20 minutes ago, JohnC said:

They have tried to come to a contract deal with Kreider but he wants to test the market. They know what the range of what he is asking for and are not willing to at least now pay it. So instead of losing him for nothing they will try to extract as much value in return as they can. 

 

The Rangers' goal is not to eek into the playoffs. They are to a degree involved in an accelerated rebuild so that they can become a cup contending team in the near future.  

 

An accelerated rebuild ya say?

How reckless!

 

 

 

 

[JohnC]

1 minute ago, snafu said:

 

An accelerated rebuild ya say?

How reckless!

 

 

 

 

When you have talent you can parlay that talent for younger and upcoming talent. When you don't have that talent you can't do that to the same extent. Different teams in different situations. 

[snafu]

3 minutes ago, JohnC said:

When you have talent you can parlay that talent for younger and upcoming talent. When you don't have that talent you can't do that to the same extent. Different teams in different situations. 

 

Please just be honest about how the Sabres got into their situation:  They tore down the team too far.  They screwed up the rebuild by trading away too many draft picks for players that weren't talented enough; or players who were overpriced and past their prime.  Their former GM couldn't pick defensemen from names in a hat.  The current GM can't pick forwards from names in a hat.  They hired a couple "system" coaches and never had accumulated the talent to fit the system in place at the time.  With all the shi**y talent, nobody could bring in a decent goaltender to at least keep the team in games.  It took years to get into cap hell and at least this year to wait to get out of it.

 

Yeah, different teams, different situations.  Don't sugarcoat the Sabres' ineptitude by characterizing it as a NON-accelerated rebuild.  It is rightly called a long-term s**t-show.

 

[Cripple Creek]

47 minutes ago, JohnC said:

They are to a degree involved in an accelerated rebuild so that they can become a cup contending team in the near future.  

So, the anti-Sabres?

[JohnC]

6 minutes ago, snafu said:

 

Please just be honest about how the Sabres got into their situation:  They tore down the team too far.  They screwed up the rebuild by trading away too many draft picks for players that weren't talented enough; or players who were overpriced and past their prime.I a  Their former GM couldn't pick defensemen from names in a hat.  The current GM can't pick forwards from names in a hat.  They hired a couple "system" coaches and never had accumulated the talent to fit the system in place at the time.  With all the shi**y talent, nobody could bring in a decent goaltender to at least keep the team in games.  It took years to get into cap hell and at least this year to wait to get out of it.

 

Yeah, different teams, different situations.  Don't sugarcoat the Sabres' ineptitude by characterizing it as a NON-accelerated rebuild.  It is rightly called a long-term s**t-show.

 

I agree with you that this franchise through its own ineptitude created its own mess. But let's not forget that Botterill inherited a mess from the previous GM. It wasn't our current GM who shed its assets for the intended quick rebuild. Our GM is in his third year. In the first year he had to put a staff together and assess what the talent in the system that he presided over. 

 

Botterill hired Housley. It didn't work out. So he fired him. He then hired Krueger who is an obvious coaching upgrade. GMs make mistakes and then have to correct their mistakes. GMs make a lot of decisions, and not all of them work out. That's the nature of the business. 

 

Where I strenuously disagree with you and others is that this GM shouldn't be blamed for what went on before him. That makes no sense. It was because of the extended period of mistakes of the prior regimes his task became even more challenging. It's my belief that in a relatively short period of time of his tenure he has put this team on the right path. Two years ago this team earned 63 pts. Last year this team earned 76 points. This year this team should earn somewhere around 86-88 points. The trendline is up. For this franchise there was never a quick fix because of where the GM was starting from.  

13 minutes ago, Cripple Creek said:

So, the anti-Sabres?

Read my response to Snafu to get my answer. 

[shrader]

No matter how badly that contract has worked out for us, it was nice to see Okposo have a moment yesterday.  You can see the talent in him, but his body gave out on him so early.

 

The other thing I really enjoyed from yesterday's game was Eichel's reaction at the buzzer.  The guy is fired up, there's no denying it.  I thought he was going to rip Johansson's head off with that hug.  Okposo had a very animated interaction with him two.  Those are two guys where I won't question their heart.

[ChevyVanMiller]

So much for the Risto for Trocheck rumors.

 

The Florida Panthers have dealt Vincent Trocheck to the Carolina Hurricanes.

Carolina is acquiring Vincent Trocheck from Florida.

— Pierre LeBrun (@PierreVLeBrun) February 24, 2020

Trocheck has two more years at $4.75 million remaining. Lucas Wallmark, Erik Haula and two prospects head the other way. 

Edited February 24, 2020 by ChevyVanMiller

[YoloinOhio]

 

[Jauronimo]

1 hour ago, shrader said:

No matter how badly that contract has worked out for us, it was nice to see Okposo have a moment yesterday.  You can see the talent in him, but his body gave out on him so early.

 

The other thing I really enjoyed from yesterday's game was Eichel's reaction at the buzzer.  The guy is fired up, there's no denying it.  I thought he was going to rip Johansson's head off with that hug.  Okposo had a very animated interaction with him two.  Those are two guys where I won't question their heart.

Okposo has been playing good hockey lately and that 4th line appears to have found real chemistry.  His vision has been on display.  Repeatedly we have seen strong pressure from the 4th line and more often than not the little play or the pass that started it all was coming from Okposo.  Hes just a step too slow from being a difference maker.  

[GG]

4 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

 

Word is 2021 5th rounder (Let's hope they meet the conditions for it to be a 4th).  

Adding some grit

Edited February 24, 2020 by GG

[shrader]

He's a free agent at the end of the year.  The Devils are retaining 50% of the salary and we gave up next to nothing, a 2021 pick.  I chalk this one up to "why not".

[Tiberius]

Good pick up, why not. 

[YoloinOhio]

10 minutes ago, GG said:

 

Word is 2021 5th rounder (Let's hope they meet the conditions for it to be a 4th).  

Adding some grit

Yep 

 

 

[row_33]

On 2/22/2020 at 9:40 PM, Jrb1979 said:

As much as a lot of hound on the Sabres for being bad at least they try most games. The Leafs are playing against a beer league goalie and have showed next to no effort. I am enjoying watching them lose. 

 

When you are in the playoff mix this late, all you need is to go .500 the rest of the way to secure a playoff spot.

 

One of the problems the NHL has to deal with is enticing teams to try when they are still in it at this stage, playing for that single point becomes the sold focus on a road game for a good team.

 

sucks watching the Leafs mail in half their games these days, nothing new, hope they pick it up for the playoffs.

 

 

 

 

[BillsFan4]

I am hoping that this means they won’t be selling Larsson and Girgensons for late round picks. 

 

I say try try to stay in the playoff race. I think that has the most potential value to our players, who have never even played meaningful games in March yet in their NHL careers.

 

Simmonds isn’t what he used to be, but he’s a right shot forward which was a desperate need. And he adds grit + a net front presence, which was also a big need. 

For a 5th 2 years from now, with 50% retained. He’s better than some of the forwards we currently have in the lineup. So I’m good with this. 

 

I also like the message it sends to the locker room. These guys have been through some tough, tough trade deadlines in previous years. Now they’re actually getting some help at the deadline instead of seeing all their buddies traded away to playoff teams. 

 

Let’s see what else Botterill does. Hopefully he doesn’t cancel out this move with a bad Larsson/Girgensons trade.

[plenzmd1]

3 minutes ago, shrader said:

He's a free agent at the end of the year.  The Devils are retaining 50% of the salary and we gave up next to nothing, a 2021 pick.  I chalk this one up to "why not".

While thats true, its the trades he is not making that are really annoying. The last thing this team needed was to get an idea they are in a playoff race and keep the gang together. 

 

The TRocheck deal. the Kase deal last week..top 6 forwards are being dealt. I mean Trocheck is a hockey deal that makes this team stronger  2C, a piece that's been missing since the ROR trade. Lets Cozens play in the NHL next year in a reduced role without as much pressure as Mitts had, or take another year to develop in the AHL...so much to like about this deal and a protected #1, a RHD, and prolly Larry or Gus gets this deal done i Think.

 

If BOTS let a win over a Penquin  team clearly looking ahread to Sundays tilt with the Caps and a admittidly nice win agasint the Jets cloud his long term evaluation of this team he is dumber than i think he is.

[Jrb1979]

16 minutes ago, row_33 said:

 

When you are in the playoff mix this late, all you need is to go .500 the rest of the way to secure a playoff spot.

 

One of the problems the NHL has to deal with is enticing teams to try when they are still in it at this stage, playing for that single point becomes the sold focus on a road game for a good team.

 

sucks watching the Leafs mail in half their games these days, nothing new, hope they pick it up for the playoffs.

 

 

 

 

I blame the Leafs play on the big 3 who for some reason to seem to care much other then to score. 

[Jauronimo]

What are the lines going to look like with Simmonds in the mix?  Does he join 3rd line in place of ERod/Frolik?  Does he bump Vesey.  

 

I would love to see Skinner back on first line. Oloffson is basically a PP specialist and Skinner has been highly productive 5 on 5 before this year.  Playing him with Lazar and Frolik seems punitive.  

[row_33]

8 minutes ago, Jrb1979 said:

I blame the Leafs play on the big 3 who for some reason to seem to care much other then to score. 

 

 

there is no incentive to push during the regular season, only one team stands in the Leafs way of a playoff spot, Florida, and the Leafs can't seriously improve in the division standings

 

the regular season is a total joke except for:

 

1)  teams struggling to stay in contention; and

 

2) a newly great team feeling its oats and trying to win every game, they soon learn how dumb this is... 

 

 

and look at the Raptors, just stay healthy and show up and win it all

 

 

[snafu]

3 hours ago, JohnC said:

The trendline is up. For this franchise there was never a quick fix because of where the GM was starting from.  

 

Have you ever said that the trendline was down?

Patience is a virtue, until it becomes enabling.

 

 

30 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

Yep 

 

 

 

 

Sonofagun, that's thy guy I wanted last year at this time (and I barely wanted him -- more his type of player).

Too little, too late. This does NOT make our "upward trend" any better.  Is this our eighth 4th liner now -- or is he our sixth third liner?

At least they didn't give up a lot to get him.

 

 

 

 

[row_33]

--------------------------

 

the Habs and Sabres have to go on a tear to get to around 10 more wins than losses and KEEP playing at an incredible level the rest of the way

 

if you fall out of the playoff picture it is almost impossible to get back in it considering that extra point handed to a team that coasts to a regulation tie, and all the imbalance in the schedule with the East playing the East

 

so if you win you tread water, and maybe gain a little and if you lose you plummet

 

the key is to play decent hockey and be around 10 wins over losses at this stage and pick your moments

 

wish it was fairer than that, but that's what the NHL and fans love

 

[K-9]

2 hours ago, shrader said:

No matter how badly that contract has worked out for us, it was nice to see Okposo have a moment yesterday.  You can see the talent in him, but his body gave out on him so early.

 

The other thing I really enjoyed from yesterday's game was Eichel's reaction at the buzzer.  The guy is fired up, there's no denying it.  I thought he was going to rip Johansson's head off with that hug.  Okposo had a very animated interaction with him two.  Those are two guys where I won't question their heart.

Never wanted to see a player get a hat trick as bad as I wanted KO to get one. 

[shrader]

40 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

While thats true, its the trades he is not making that are really annoying. The last thing this team needed was to get an idea they are in a playoff race and keep the gang together. 

 

The TRocheck deal. the Kase deal last week..top 6 forwards are being dealt. I mean Trocheck is a hockey deal that makes this team stronger  2C, a piece that's been missing since the ROR trade. Lets Cozens play in the NHL next year in a reduced role without as much pressure as Mitts had, or take another year to develop in the AHL...so much to like about this deal and a protected #1, a RHD, and prolly Larry or Gus gets this deal done i Think.

 

Making up a hypothetical trade offer does not mean that 1) Florida would be interested, or 2) the Sabres weren't talking to them.  That trade suggests to me that Florida wanted a more immediate return, guys who were close to ready.  They weren't going to want an expiring Larry or Gus.  Haula's only in there as a money dump for Carolina.  I also don't think Buffalo would be interested in moving a first for Trocheck, protection or not.  That deal essentially is summed up as two prospects and a bottom pair d-man for Trocheck.  I really don't know what our equivalent would be.

 

26 minutes ago, Jauronimo said:

What are the lines going to look like with Simmonds in the mix?  Does he join 3rd line in place of ERod/Frolik?  Does he bump Vesey.  

 

I would love to see Skinner back on first line. Oloffson is basically a PP specialist and Skinner has been highly productive 5 on 5 before this year.  Playing him with Lazar and Frolik seems punitive.  

 

I think you can give up on that one.  I'd say that Kreuger has made it very clear that he won't be putting Skinner on Eichel's line.

[Jrb1979]

43 minutes ago, row_33 said:

 

 

there is no incentive to push during the regular season, only one team stands in the Leafs way of a playoff spot, Florida, and the Leafs can't seriously improve in the division standings

 

the regular season is a total joke except for:

 

1)  teams struggling to stay in contention; and

 

2) a newly great team feeling its oats and trying to win every game, they soon learn how dumb this is... 

 

 

and look at the Raptors, just stay healthy and show up and win it all

 

 

I disagree. A lot of other teams work hard for good majority of the season.Anytime the Leafs get down in a game or have any adversity they fold. 

[JohnC]

35 minutes ago, snafu said:

 

Have you ever said that the trendline was down?

Patience is a virtue, until it becomes enabling.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

When Pegula took over as the owner he acted as if he was playing fantasy hockey foolishly throwing around his money. He also made bad hiring decisions that set this franchise back. There was no hope. As with the Bills the new and over eager owner seemed to learned from his mistakes. After firing Murray who set this franchise back he made a good hire in Botterill In my opinion he has prudently and steadily upgraded the roster. So to answer your question under this current GM's operation the trendline has been upward. That is not to say that everything he has done has worked out. His decision to hire Housley didn't work out and how he handled the ROR deal was a very injurious deal. But in general he has done a good job.   

 

The notion that I am too patient makes no sense to me. In order to rebuild properly there was never going to be a quick fix. What makes no sense, and it seems to be a prevailing view, is to associate this GM's tenure with the prior regimes. What has made Botterill's job even more daunting is the necessity to rectify the mistakes that the prior regimes made that had set this franchise further back that it needed to be.  

[BillsFan4]

https://theathletic.com/1631507/2020/02/24/devils-trade-pending-free-agent-wayne-simmonds-to-buffalo/ (Sub. Req.)

 

Quote

 

”I thought he was great here,” Devils defenseman P.K. Subban, who played with Simmonds last year in Nashville as well, said. “This is a team that had some leadership but also lost a little bit of it. I think we were brought in to help bring some young guys along, and I think Simmer did a great job. Whether it was sticking up for guys or competing every night or driving home messages from the coaching staff, I think Buffalo is getting some good leadership there. I think that’s probably a little of what their team needs too. It is tough to see a guy like that go. He’s a great guy.

 

“I know he’s a guy that wants to win,” Subban said. “He’ll do everything in his power to help that team.”

 

...Part of Simmonds’ value is his leadership skills (he earned the Mark Messier Leadership award last year), and he quickly became a well-respected member of the Devils locker room. He has not been as much of a pugilist on the ice as he was in previous seasons, but Simmonds has become a vocal leader for the club as he got more comfortable with his new team.

 

“(Simmonds) meant a lot, with his leadership on and off the ice,” Devils coach Alain Nasreddine said. “People see what happened on the ice, but not what happens inside our room. He’s been a big influence. It hasn’t been an easy year, and a guy like Simmer really helped everyone keep this whole thing together. I couldn’t thank him enough for all of his help, and he’s going to be a big miss for us.”

 

I think, like the Frolik move, this is also about what he brings to the locker room. 

Simmonds is a well respected veteran leader. I Really hope he brings more on the ice than Frolik, though... lol

 

edit - BTW, Simmonds had to waive his NTC to come to Buffalo. So he’s obviously on board with the move. 

 

 

Edited February 24, 2020 by BillsFan4