Updated: Steelers open to trading Antonio Brown - Rooney sees it hard bringing him back

[Bing Bong]

17 minutes ago, dabills21 said:

I agree that Ben has been known for being a controversial teammate.

 

From living in the Burgh all my life, here is my opinion:

1. Steelers no longer have locker room leaders to "self control" the team, more on this below.  It used to be Hines, Troy, Farrior, etc etc that were the superstars, but also led that team...sorta like a Kyle Williams type attitude, which can't be appreciated enough

2. Without the locker room controlling itself, it becomes more important for the Head coach to manage these situations.  For Tomlin, early in his coaching tenure he could rely on aforementioned leaders above.

 

I place the blame on Tomlin, but i know that topic has varying opinions.  He needs to prove that he can manage superstar players without the help of others doing his job.  It will be interesting to see how he approaches the situation and if he can get this team playing as a unit.  Much of the post season player interviews focused on "team chemistry" , and AB and Ben are both part of that problem, it is up to Tomlin to fix that situation.

 

Not the same, but a possible comparison is the Bulls/Lakers teams of the past, where Phil Jackson was the perfect guy for those situations.  

 

I think Tomlin has 1 more season to right the ship and return the Steelers to a superbowl

Yeah, Tomlin's very hands off which lends itself well to having lockerroom leaders on a talented team steer the ship. Troy was a fantastic lead by example type.

 

Seems this team is devoid of any of that. And Big Ben's influence has gotten out of control where Tomlin should have curtailed it long ago.

 

By this point seems like Tomlin's in a tough position now with his Quarterback not helping out in the role Troy and Hines did. The writing on the wall for me was the Raiders game. Ben seems perfectly healthy and fine to play.. Tomlin's told Ben can't go and his mind has to be on coaching the rest of the team to get the win. All the while he and Ben don't say a word to each other until Ben comes back in mid 4th quarter when they are about to lose to the friggin raiders.

 

Sets a terrible example to the team. In Brown's mind I can see where what Brown did is no more egregious to Ben skipping out IN THE MIDDLE OF THE GAME. Crazy sequence of events. That Raiders game put a stink bomb in the lockerroom for sure nobody could put out. At some point I don't even know how Tomlin 's even supposed to handle that.

 

Brady and Belicheck have their issues but Brady's at least just as manaically devoted to winning as Beli.

Edited January 2, 2019 by BarkleyForGOATBackupPT5P

[MAJBobby]

2 hours ago, DaBillsFanSince1973 said:

unlikely but would be huge. what kind of contract would it be? they have cap space but I wouldn't want to see them go all mario williams on him?

 

Three years left at roughly 12M per. That is easily doable and could give some guaranteed after trade to lower it. 

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/pittsburgh-steelers/antonio-brown-6702/

[dabills21]

3 minutes ago, BarkleyForGOATBackupPT5P said:

Yeah, Tomlin's very hands off which lends itself well to having lockerroom leaders on a talented team steer the ship. Troy was a fantastic lead by example type.

 

Seems this team is devoid of any of that. And Big Ben's influence has gotten out of control where Tomlin should have curtailed it long ago.

 

By this point seems like Tomlin's in a tough position now with his Quarterback not helping out in the role Troy and Hines did. The writing on the wall for me was the Raiders game. Ben seems perfectly healthy and fine to play.. Tomlin's told Ben can't go and his mind has to be on coaching the rest of the team to get the win. All the while he and Ben don't say a word to each other until Ben comes back in mid 4th quarter when they are about to lose to the friggin raiders.

 

Sets a terrible example to the team. In Brown's mind I can see where what Brown did is no more egregious to Ben skipping out IN THE MIDDLE OF THE GAME. Crazy sequence of events. That Raiders game put a stink bomb in the lockerroom for sure nobody could put out. At some point I don't even know how Tomlin 's even supposed to handle that.

 

Brady and Belicheck have their issues but Brady's at least just as manaically devoted to winning as Beli.

Can't agree more, excellent points.

 

And yes, it's very difficult to change your mindset and handling of players 10+ years into the job.  Tomlin is definitely in a pickle, as he will be going outside his normal coaching traits to correct this situation.

 

Now this will get everyone fired up, lol...but this is exactly why I appreciate and think coach McDermott will succeed with his style of coaching/personnel decisions. 

[BarleyNY]

50 minutes ago, Chicken Boo said:

Promise you, Beane will test the waters although I'm sure Pittsburgh's asking price will be astronomical.

 

More than worth the risk.

 

I have to disagree. Brown has been a tremendous WR to be sure, but what are you buying and for now much?  A first?  More?  Two seconds maybe?  That's for a guy that'll be 31 before next season starts.  How many more of those seasons does he have left?  It's also for a guy who seems to believe that he's more important than his teammates or his team.  He got paid big time by the Steelers and with a playoff spot on the line he blew off practice, team meetings and the freaking game!  Notably it was the third time this season he has pulled stuff like this.  He also left his teammates and coaches hanging before the Bengals game.  His teammates still thought that he was playing up until gametime.  He refused to suit up and left at halftime.  That's not someone I want on my team. 

[Bing Bong]

11 minutes ago, dabills21 said:

Can't agree more, excellent points.

 

And yes, it's very difficult to change your mindset and handling of players 10+ years into the job.  Tomlin is definitely in a pickle, as he will be going outside his normal coaching traits to correct this situation.

 

Now this will get everyone fired up, lol...but this is exactly why I appreciate and think coach McDermott will succeed with his style of coaching/personnel decisions. 

I guess so on McDermott but then again having a ton of high maintenance talent constantly making noise in the playoffs is a pretty good problem to have when an incident like this and not making the playoffs with 2 silly losses one year is the end of the world.

 

I'm perfectly fine with McDermott so far but I'd like to see how he coaches a more talented team.. and if his personnel preference at some point shows it prevents his selection in the NFL talent pool if he's not willing to take risks. Hopefully either his personnel decisions work out or when he's gifted talented players with some character issues, he can motivate that with good coaching.. or prevent anybody's ego from festering out of control.

Edited January 2, 2019 by BarkleyForGOATBackupPT5P

[Trogdor]

1 hour ago, BarkleyForGOATBackupPT5P said:

Yeah if we're talking of Jerry Rice stats over a handful of way overblown media stories (as people are want to take out of proportion naturally because talented athletes making a stink ticks fans off)... In a vacuum denying that tradeoff is absolutely ludicrous to me.

 

I can see other factors.. ahem.. Poyer and asking price otherwise tipping the scales but otherwise I'm very intrigued. Disrespecting Poyer is really the only thing I'd unfortunately have to veto getting Brown. I'd hope Beane reaches out to him about how he feels if he pursues the trade and respects him accordingly. Very weird wrench a GM has to deal with but it's absolutely something he should address or consider.

You almost certainly lose Poyer if you bring in Brown. His wife might stay though.

[Bing Bong]

1 minute ago, Trogdor said:

You almost certainly lose Poyer if you bring in Brown. His wife might stay though.

I love Poyer too much for that. It would tick me off and has to affect Poyer's boys too. 

 

**** That. No to Brown. Let it be known to the NFL: don't bang Poyer's wife if you want to be on the Bills.

[KD in CA]

22 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

 

Three years left at roughly 12M per. That is easily doable and could give some guaranteed after trade to lower it. 

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/pittsburgh-steelers/antonio-brown-6702/

 

Right....and have him hold out the second he gets here.   Do people really think he's going to show up here and be a model citizen playing on a below top-tier contract?

 

I don't care what his stats are, NFW to this piece of sh--.

[MAJBobby]

2 minutes ago, KD in CA said:

 

Right....and have him hold out the second he gets here.   Do people really think he's going to show up here and be a model citizen playing on a below top-tier contract?

 

I don't care what his stats are, NFW to this piece of sh--.

 

Hold out?  Hmmm young QB with a Cannon. And move some of that money to nice new guarantees. He will play just like Shady did. 

[McBean]

Give em the house for him.

[Augie]

1 hour ago, BarleyNY said:

 

I have to disagree. Brown has been a tremendous WR to be sure, but what are you buying and for now much?  A first?  More?  Two seconds maybe?  That's for a guy that'll be 31 before next season starts.  How many more of those seasons does he have left?  It's also for a guy who seems to believe that he's more important than his teammates or his team.  He got paid big time by the Steelers and with a playoff spot on the line he blew off practice, team meetings and the freaking game!  Notably it was the third time this season he has pulled stuff like this.  He also left his teammates and coaches hanging before the Bengals game.  His teammates still thought that he was playing up until gametime.  He refused to suit up and left at halftime.  That's not someone I want on my team. 

 

I was listening to NFL Radio on Sirius this afternoon, and they were not on the fence about this. Nor was anyone else I heard. A 30 year old man who acts like a child and throws a ball at his QB (who is not my favorite guy) rather than follow the tried and true “use your words”, is a huge red flag. Pat Kirwin went on about it (as some of you probably heard), and talked about how Brown kept them waiting 2.5 hours to talk to him at training camp, then just blew them off. 

 

He’s getting old, he bailed on his team, he’d cost something significant to get, he’d be expensive on the cap, and he’s a selfish (30 year old) child. Hard pass, despite his talent. But that’s just me. 

Edited January 2, 2019 by Augie

[Alphadawg7]

3 hours ago, dabills21 said:

You can portray me however you like, bottom line is that you called my post out for being foolish...its not uncivil or even outrageous to say to a fellow dude, "well lets wager and see who is right?" Confidence, absolute, etc...pick whatever word you want, but maybe you havent interacted with guy friends like this...

 

Sorry that you have taken my responses so seriously and felt the need to judge my character or happiness with message board posts.  

 

Happy New Year to you also! 

 

Dude you were challenging people to bets BEFORE I ever said a word to you.  And I didn’t say you were foolish, I said it’s foolish to talk about it in absolutes and to the point where you want to bet everyone who thinks it MAY be possible.  Your first thing you said to me was to also bet you.  

 

So, my response was based on how you carried yourself through this thread.

[formerlyofCtown]

On 12/31/2018 at 4:40 PM, Buffalo_Gal said:

First Bell, now Brown... what is going on in Pittsburgh? 

Volitile locker Room and the opposite of whats being built here.  I have read post that call AB a locker Room cancer but I think the Oline and Ben are the cancer.

Edited January 2, 2019 by formerlyofCtown

[Virgil]

I just heard the Steelers will take a 20 mil cap hit if they trade him.  

 

If true, he’s not going anywhere 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

5 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

1) People start forgetting your past when you start being a great teammate who holds himself accountable.   It's never happened with Big Ben.

 

2) Don't forget McCoy going Kareem Hunt on a woman on his party bus back in his Philly days.  His off field history is purdy bad.    Throwing a piece of furniture and almost hitting somebody wouldn't make McCoy's off-field highlight reel.

 

3) Sucks to be Tomlin?   Let me know when McDermott wins a couple SB's and has his team in contention for a decade.

 

C'mon Badol.

 

1) There was a lot of stuff in the press about Roethlisberger having become a great teammate around 2014-2015.  Whether it's true or not in the locker room, I can't tell.  Nor is there stuff in the press about Steelers players having a problem with Big Ben about stuff he did back in 2006-2010.  Do you actually have any hard info that they do?  From whom?  Where? Or are you just blowing smoke?

 

Where I think we can agree, is that Big Ben has been acting publicly like a self-centered jerkoff in the press, throwing teammates under the bus and deflecting blame, for the last couple years.

 

2) Even the woman in question says that McCoy never touched her.  He did not go "Kareem Hunt" on her.  They poured water on her and put her off the bus.

 

3) Yes, sucks to be Tomlin.  He has a huge opportunity to win another Championship and really make a name for himself with all the talent on that Steelers team.  And right now, it looks as though it will all be squandered. I'm strictly comparing what Tomlin could achieve, in terms of his playcalling, gameplanning coaching abilities, to what it looks like he will if he doesn't get the inmates out of control in the asylum.  Do you disagree that he's going to squander that Championship opportunity that very few coaches get in terms of player talent?

 

McDermott is a total straw man to this discussion since I am not trying to make any comparison between McDermott and Tomlin here.  I have my doubts about McDermott's coaching chops, but there are plenty of other threads to discuss that.

 

You're better than this.

 

 

11 minutes ago, Virgil said:

I just heard the Steelers will take a 20 mil cap hit if they trade him.  

 

If true, he’s not going anywhere 

 

$21M.  Signing bonus amortized over the next 3 years.  It's true, it's true.

They can defer some of it if they trade him after June 1, but then they get to pay him a roster bonus too.

[Boca BIlls]

If he wants a QB that is going to hurl the ball lightning speed at him and down field then Allen is his guy.

[Chicken Boo]

1 hour ago, BarleyNY said:

That's not someone I want on my team. 

 

That's one of those, "We'll cross that bridge when we get to it", deals.

 

Something is obviously going on in Pittsburgh.  8 seasons and never an issue until recently.

[dubs]

2 hours ago, MAJBobby said:

 

Three years left at roughly 12M per. That is easily doable and could give some guaranteed after trade to lower it. 

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/pittsburgh-steelers/antonio-brown-6702/

 

Antonio Brown for three years at $12m a year. Ummm....that’s an absolute steal!

 

Not sure what the Bills would have to give up in a trade, but likely a lot. If they could give up a second and a fourth or something, I’d say pull the trigger. 

[BADOLBILZ]

2 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

C'mon Badol.

 

1) There was a lot of stuff in the press about Roethlisberger having become a great teammate around 2014-2015.  Whether it's true or not in the locker room, I can't tell.  Nor is there stuff in the press about Steelers players having a problem with Big Ben about stuff he did back in 2006-2010.  Do you actually have any hard info that they do?  From whom?  Where? Or are you just blowing smoke?

 

Where I think we can agree, is that Big Ben has been acting publicly like a self-centered jerkoff in the press, throwing teammates under the bus and deflecting blame, for the last couple years.

 

2) Even the woman in question says that McCoy never touched her.  He did not go "Kareem Hunt" on her.  They poured water on her and put her off the bus.

 

3) Yes, sucks to be Tomlin.  He has a huge opportunity to win another Championship and really make a name for himself with all the talent on that Steelers team.  And right now, it looks as though it will all be squandered. I'm strictly comparing what Tomlin could achieve, in terms of his playcalling, gameplanning coaching abilities, to what it looks like he will if he doesn't get the inmates out of control in the asylum.  Do you disagree that he's going to squander that Championship opportunity that very few coaches get in terms of player talent?

 

McDermott is a total straw man to this discussion since I am not trying to make any comparison between McDermott and Tomlin here.  I have my doubts about McDermott's coaching chops, but there are plenty of other threads to discuss that.

 

You're better than this.

 

 

 

$21M.  Signing bonus amortized over the next 3 years.  It's true, it's true.

They can defer some of it if they trade him after June 1, but then they get to pay him a roster bonus too.

 

 

1)  Re-read what I wrote.

 

I didn't say they have a specific problem with Ben's further past.............what they have a problem with is him being treated by management like he's squeaky clean and should have the right to call out his teammates for their failings......when he's had his own MAJOR issues.    It's an issue with management.   Remember, this is a team which has had star players like LeVeon Bell and Martavis Bryant suspended and subsequent contract disputes with both.

 

The reality that AB should understand.....double standard or not...... is that QB's rule the team.   But it's easy for him to look at his stats and think......"hey, I'm the Tom Brady or Aaron Rodgers of WR's.......Big Ben is not as good at what he does as me.  I should have more pull around here".  

 

2)  There is MORE than enough smoke to draw a pretty strong conclusion that Shady has been abusive to women.  Antonio Brown.........not so much.  But if so please explain to me why sponsors keep hiring Antonio Brown?   Yeah that's what I thought.......crickets on that one.

 

3)  Doesn't suck to be Tomlin.......he has 2 Lombardi's and 3 SB trips DURING THE BELICHICK ERA.    He's already made a name for himself Hapless.      

[Ol Dirty B]

2 hours ago, BarkleyForGOATBackupPT5P said:

I love Poyer too much for that. It would tick me off and has to affect Poyer's boys too. 

 

**** That. No to Brown. Let it be known to the NFL: don't bang Poyer's wife if you want to be on the Bills.

 

I'm trading poyer or cutting him to get brown. 

 

Poyer and his girl come across as immature.