Allen vs. Darnold: Analysts Evaluate the Present and Predict the Future

[CincyBillsFan]

3 minutes ago, NJKBillsfan said:

Darnold put up some big boy numbers on the road today.

Still waiting to see a game like that from Allen....

You won't this year unless the Dolphins mail it in big time.  There just aren't the quality play makers on the Bills offense to do it.  Hell today's game could have been a barn burner like the Jets game had the Bills play makers actually made some plays.  It's not like Allen didn't give them the opportunity.  

[CincyBillsFan]

6 minutes ago, NJKBillsfan said:

I agree that we have bad receivers.

If Allen was truly a decent QB I think it's safe to say he'd have better numbers that he does.

 

Right now he has 7 TD's and 12 Int's.

 

I don't care how bad the receivers are those numbers are HORRIBLE. 

I disagree.  With decent WR's AND TE's Allen would have better numbers then Darnold. 

 

Of the rookie QB's only Mayfield is even remotely accomplished.  The rest of them require a lot of work which is entirely expected.  And while Allen isn't laboring under quite the dumpster fire that Rosen is in Arizona, it's close.  And for sure Jackson has the advantage of QBing a playoff caliber team and Darnold does have more weapons. 

Edited December 24, 2018 by CincyBillsFan

[BuffaloBaumer]

This isn't even up for debate. One knows how to run, and the other one is actually a QB, a really good QB.

[CincyBillsFan]

1 minute ago, NJKBillsfan said:

Darnold has 17 TD's and 15 INT's.

That's significantly better than Allen's passing numbers. 

 

Also, I don't believe Darnold is surrounded with a lot of talent on the current roster. 

IMO the only Buffalo skill position player that would break into the NY Jet's starting lineup  would be Foster and that would be as the #2 or #3 WR.  No other Bill would make it on the field.  If you think differently I would be curious as to which other Bills skill player would start (or even get significant playing time) on the Jet's offense.  And while we're on the topic how many of Buffalo's O-lineman would start for the Jet's?  By my count only one would. 

 

And if I'm right here and I think I am doesn't that tell you ALL you need to know about the differences between Darnold & Allen's numbers?

[dave mcbride]

1 minute ago, BuffaloBaumer said:

This isn't even up for debate. One knows how to run, and the other one is actually a QB, a really good QB.

At this point in time, Darnold is clearly better. He is showing a ton of progress. It is still way too early to tell, but Darnold is just more accurate and has way better touch.

[CincyBillsFan]

1 minute ago, NJKBillsfan said:

I hear ya.

 

I'm interested to see what Allen looks like next year with better receivers. 

 

This is something I think we all can agree on.

[row_33]

4 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

At this point in time, Darnold is clearly better. He is showing a ton of progress. It is still way too early to tell, but Darnold is just more accurate and has way better touch.

 

Again I look forward to both having a good career and rivalry 

[dave mcbride]

2 minutes ago, row_33 said:

 

Again I look forward to both having a good career and rivalry 

Agreed.

8 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

IMO the only Buffalo skill position player that would break into the NY Jet's starting lineup  would be Foster and that would be as the #2 or #3 WR.  No other Bill would make it on the field.  If you think differently I would be curious as to which other Bills skill player would start (or even get significant playing time) on the Jet's offense.  And while we're on the topic how many of Buffalo's O-lineman would start for the Jet's?  By my count only one would. 

 

And if I'm right here and I think I am doesn't that tell you ALL you need to know about the differences between Darnold & Allen's numbers?

The Jets’ offensive talent IS better than Buffalo’s, but it’s still basically terrible. Anderson is a nice player; the rest are basically JAGs and trash.

[Scott7975]

15 minutes ago, NJKBillsfan said:

Darnold has 17 TD's and 15 INT's.

That's significantly better than Allen's passing numbers. 

 

Also, like Allen, Darnold isn't surrounded with a lot of weapons....

Let me know when one of our receivers does this: http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-cant-miss-plays/0ap3000001002845/Can-t-Miss-Play-Herndon-snags-SENSATIONAL-one-handed-grab

instead of dropping a pass that hits both hands.

Edited December 24, 2018 by Scott7975

[CincyBillsFan]

5 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Agreed.

The Jets’ offensive talent IS better than Buffalo’s, but it’s still basically terrible. Anderson is a nice player; the rest are basically JAGs and trash.

I'm not saying they're great but I would again ask who among Buffalo's skill players starts on the Jets?  It's Foster and no one else IMO.  And given that the Jet's aren't exactly loaded on offense what does that say about our collection of skill players? 

[CincyBillsFan]

6 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

Let me know when one of our receivers does this: http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-cant-miss-plays/0ap3000001002845/Can-t-Miss-Play-Herndon-snags-SENSATIONAL-one-handed-grab

instead of dropping a pass that hits both hands.

Oh my goodness was that a great catch!  And did you notice how if he doesn't grab that thing out of the air with one hand it's probably intercepted at the goal line! 

 

So again I ask who among our TE's starts ahead of this guy for the Jets? 

[row_33]

1 minute ago, NJKBillsfan said:

Wow just watched Darnold's highlights from the game today and gotta say he looked really good. 

 

The way he can roll out of the pocket, deliver strong armed throws with perfect preseason is super impressive.

 

Jets fans must be feeling pretty damn good right now. 

 

Wouldnt go that far...:

 

A good team now is a million times better than hoping to win next year

 

[CincyBillsFan]

2 minutes ago, NJKBillsfan said:

Wow just watched Darnold's highlights from the game today and gotta say he looked really good. 

 

The way he can roll out of the pocket, deliver strong armed throws with perfect preseason is super impressive.

 

Jets fans must be feeling pretty damn good right now. 

I just watched that amazing one handed catch by the Jet's TE and if he doesn't make that catch it's a sure INT at the goal line. 

[dave mcbride]

4 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

I'm not saying they're great but I would again ask who among Buffalo's skill players starts on the Jets?  It's Foster and no one else IMO.  And given that the Jet's aren't exactly loaded on offense what does that say about our collection of skill players? 

In the kingdom of the blind, the one-eyed man is king. Yes, the Bills’ offensive talent is a joke. I do think Foster could start for the Jets, though. He appears to be a player.

[row_33]

2 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

I just watched that amazing one handed catch by the Jet's TE and if he doesn't make that catch it's a sure INT at the goal line. 

 

Jets are always scrappy and get more results than they have potential on paper 

 

 

 

 

[CincyBillsFan]

1 minute ago, dave mcbride said:

In the kingdom of the blind, the one-eyed man is king. Yes, the Bills’ offensive talent is a joke. I do think Foster could start for the Jets, though. He appears to be a player.

Perfect quote.  But isn't it telling that beyond Foster no other Bill's skill player starts for the Jets?  And the Jet's are only average on offense. 

[Nihilarian]

Go back and look at what happened to that 83 draft class with all those great QBs. #1 Elway, #7 Blacklegde, #14 Kelly, #15 Eason #24 O'Brian, #27 Marino. 

 

Some went on to the HoF and some flamed out. O'Brian in his second season went 11-5 and it all went downhill from there. The best Eason did was 10-4. Blackledge always stunk. Marino went to a SB his second season and never went back. 

 

The first season doesn't mean much...especially when you have a bunch of scrubs for coaches who beat themselves. 

[Mountain Man]

3 hours ago, NJKBillsfan said:

I agree that we have bad receivers.

If Allen was truly a decent QB I think it's safe to say he'd have better numbers that he does.

 

Right now he has 7 TD's and 12 Int's.

 

I don't care how bad the receivers are those numbers are HORRIBLE. 

So he has less interceptions than Sam Darnold this season then?

[Dr.Sack]

4 hours ago, NJKBillsfan said:

Darnold put up some big boy numbers against GB today. 

Still waiting to see a game like that from Allen....

At this point Allen is a sub .50 passer with limited ability to read defense & make accurate throw.

[Mountain Man]

36 minutes ago, NJKBillsfan said:

 

Darnold has 17 TD's/15 INT's. Allen has 7 TD's/12 INT's.

 

 

Actually Allen has 13 TDs.

 

So they have virtually the same TD to interception ratio

[LABILLBACKER]

4 hours ago, CincyBillsFan said:

I disagree.  With decent WR's AND TE's Allen would have better numbers then Darnold. 

 

Of the rookie QB's only Mayfield is even remotely accomplished.  The rest of them require a lot of work which is entirely expected.  And while Allen isn't laboring under quite the dumpster fire that Rosen is in Arizona, it's close.  And for sure Jackson has the advantage of QBing a playoff caliber team and Darnold does have more weapons. 

By my calculations Allen lost 2 tds and nearly 130 yards on drops by McK, Foster and Thomas. That doesn't even include points lost on Croom's fumble. Not to mention other tds dropped by KB and others this season. Allen is so much better than these numbers.  Get him a real OL and quality wrs/te's and he's pretty darn close to 60%.

[JoPar_v2]

29 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

By my calculations Allen lost 2 tds and nearly 130 yards on drops by McK, Foster and Thomas. That doesn't even include points lost on Croom's fumble. Not to mention other tds dropped by KB and others this season. Allen is so much better than these numbers.  Get him a real OL and quality wrs/te's and he's pretty darn close to 60%.

 

He is throwing to trash at this point. And i will take Allen over Darnold every day of the week.

[Mountain Man]

29 minutes ago, NJKBillsfan said:

Nope he has 7.

 

I'm doing a passing comparison. 

And? That's irrelevant. A TD is TD, whether the QB runs it in, or passes it.

[GimmeSomeProcess]

We didn’t have a shot at Darnold, so who cares. Rosen we can debate, Darnold, Mayfield doesn’t matter 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

3 hours ago, JoPar_v2 said:

 

He is throwing to trash at this point. And i will take Allen over Darnold every day of the week.

 

[Coach Tuesday]

8 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

At this point in time, Darnold is clearly better. He is showing a ton of progress. It is still way too early to tell, but Darnold is just more accurate and has way better touch.

 

Interestingly - both of Allen's INTs yesterday came on weird touch passes - I think he was experimenting with trying to float passes over the defense, as opposed to lasering them.  I'm ok with him trying to add new tools to his arsenal, though obviously yesterday showed he has a lot more work to do.

Edited December 24, 2018 by Coach Tuesday

[Rico]

At this stage of the game, Josh Allen is exciting to watch, while Sam Darnold is boring as all hell. I'd rather have Josh.

[Bleedingreennc]

5 hours ago, Mountain Man said:

Actually Allen has 13 TDs.

 

So they have virtually the same TD to interception ratio

Darnold has 18 td’s since you are including rushing td’s. 

[dave mcbride]

6 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said:

By my calculations Allen lost 2 tds and nearly 130 yards on drops by McK, Foster and Thomas. That doesn't even include points lost on Croom's fumble. Not to mention other tds dropped by KB and others this season. Allen is so much better than these numbers.  Get him a real OL and quality wrs/te's and he's pretty darn close to 60%.

Foster didn't drop it. It was a completely uncatchable ball yet also a perfect throw. Both things can be true.

1 hour ago, ScottLaw said:

Either did the Jets. Until they traded up.

 

That's not fair to the Bills. The Colts have made it very clear that they were not willning to drop below 6th because they were dead set on getting Nelson, who appears to be completely worth that pick. He is a stud. The Bills didn't have enough ammo. They wanted to get to 3, but you need a trade partner. The Jets had what they wanted; we didn't.

1 hour ago, Rico said:

At this stage of the game, Josh Allen is exciting to watch, while Sam Darnold is boring as all hell. I'd rather have Josh.

I think Darnold is fun to watch myself. He makes nice plays outside the pocket consistently.

Edited December 24, 2018 by dave mcbride

[Rico]

5 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Foster didn't drop it. It was a completely uncatchable ball yet also a perfect throw. Both things can be true.

That's not fair to the Bills. The Colts have made it very clear that they were not willning to drop below 6th because they were dead set on getting Nelson, who appears to be completely worth that pick. He is a stud. The Bills didn't have enough ammo. They wanted to get to 3, but you need a trade partner. The Jets had what they wanted; we didn't.

I think Darnold is fun to watch myself. He makes nice plays outside the pocket consistently.

To be fair, I have only watched a couple of his games. Let me change that & just say that I find Allen to be more exciting.

[MJS]

2 hours ago, GimmeSomeProcess said:

We didn’t have a shot at Darnold, so who cares. Rosen we can debate, Darnold, Mayfield doesn’t matter 

 

Yep. I'm sure Darnold checked all the boxes that the Bills decision makers wanted, but we never had a shot at him. The Jets trading up sealed the deal and by that point we knew we would probably be going for the 3rd QB.

[row_33]

2 hours ago, Rico said:

At this stage of the game, Josh Allen is exciting to watch, while Sam Darnold is boring as all hell. I'd rather have Josh.

 

Thats Jets football, Curtis Martin made the Hall just running it up the gut and staying healthy for many years

 

 

 

[Norcalbillsfan]

On 12/24/2018 at 12:37 AM, LABILLBACKER said:

By my calculations Allen lost 2 tds and nearly 130 yards on drops by McK, Foster and Thomas. That doesn't even include points lost on Croom's fumble. Not to mention other tds dropped by KB and others this season. Allen is so much better than these numbers.  Get him a real OL and quality wrs/te's and he's pretty darn close to 60%.

Totally agree, I don't think very many people grasp how really bad the talent is around Allen right now. And our o line is so bad shady can't get going to take some heat off. How many rookie QBs are asked to come in and asked to become the franchise with the worst receiver core in the NFL, and bottom 5 o line in the NFL. I honestly can't think of a recent worse receiving core paired with a rookie QB.

[26CornerBlitz]

 

[26CornerBlitz]

 

[MTBill]

On ‎12‎/‎6‎/‎2018 at 12:06 PM, kota said:

Why is this even a topic?  

 

Because Bill's Fans have draft envy and buyer's remorse....  It comes from years of failing miserably at finding a replacement for nearly Saint Kelly....

[richardb1952]

I was very impressed with some of the touch passes Darnold threw vs the Bills. I think he will be a very good QB.  One difference I noticed in very limited viewing of Darnold is that he has better receivers than Allen currently has.  Anderson made some catches versus the Bills that no one on the Bills have made this year.  I still like Allen better cause all he needs is a better supporting cast.  I believe the Jets/ Bills series is going to be the teams to compete (once Brady hangs it up).  I look forward to it.