Marquise Goodwin buys mom/sister home

[mannc]

30 minutes ago, RoyBatty is alive said:

That comment is unfair.  Distinguish between what people said about his as a football player versus a human being.  As a football player here he certainly did not live up to his 3rd pickl, 6 tds in 4 seasons, hurt constantly.  I for one said we needed to get rid of him because he was frail, I always respected the man for what he did for his sister.  Even before this new house he had a home designed for himself that she had one  wing and space for  a caretaker could help her out.

It's entirely fair.  If you were around here, you would know that Goodwin was ruthlessly attacked, and not just based his perceived failure to perform on the field.  His masculinity was questioned, he was literally accused of defrauding the Bills, and many said he should be cut before training camp started, even though he eventually won the WR 3 position.  If you were one of those who said we needed to get rid of him, then you could not have been more wrong.  He'd probably be our best WR if he had stayed.   

[Irv]

Broke hand signing mortgage papers.  Out 4-6 weeks. 

[RoyBatty is alive]

6 minutes ago, mannc said:

It's entirely fair.  If you were around here, you would know that Goodwin was ruthlessly attacked, and not just based his perceived failure to perform on the field.  His masculinity was questioned, he was literally accused of defrauding the Bills, and many said he should be cut before training camp started, even though he eventually won the WR 3 position.  If you were one of those who said we needed to get rid of him, then you could not have been more wrong.  He'd probably be our best WR if he had stayed.   

I was around here or should I say at the BBMB and yes, as it typical with overzealous fans some went to extreme, he was attacked for being frail,  not 100% dedicated to football.  I dont recall him being accused of "defrauding the Bills" WTH that means. And yes I said we needed to get rid of him because 1) he could not remain healthy 2) he wasnt producing.  As for #2, he didnt have a QB that could lead him and another year with Tyrod Taylor thrown him the ball likely could have gotten him killed so I disagree, I was not wrong.  He was not a good fir for the Bills.

 

Again I think 90% of the criticism was "fair", this thread was about him as a "civilian", not a football player.  When you sign up in the NFL brutal criticism of your play is part of the process.

Edited July 6, 2018 by RoyBatty is alive

[Hapless Bills Fan]

10 hours ago, PetermanThrew5Picks said:

Question, did Marquise Goodwin break out a career season because he left that Buffalo offense? Or because he took football in the offseason seriously, being on a new team and all.. I mean just watching him briefly at the 9ers he looked like he added 30 pounds of muscle. Looked like a WR monster.

 

I think both.  Putting him in a more passing-centered offense helped get him touches when he played, but taking football more seriously and training for it helped him stay on the field to make plays, and he also seems to have worked hard on his strength and his catching abilities.

I said before (and got mocked for it here actually), when Rex let Goodwin train for the Olympics: at those highest levels of achievement these days, it's "either or not both".  You can either train optimally for football, and tolerate the dings and dangs of the normal season and play through them, OR you can train optimally for track and field which means avoiding the dings and dangs that would limit your track and field training.  But you can't do both.

18 minutes ago, mannc said:

It's entirely fair.  If you were around here, you would know that Goodwin was ruthlessly attacked, and not just based his perceived failure to perform on the field.  His masculinity was questioned, he was literally accused of defrauding the Bills, and many said he should be cut before training camp started, even though he eventually won the WR 3 position.  If you were one of those who said we needed to get rid of him, then you could not have been more wrong.  He'd probably be our best WR if he had stayed.   

 

FWIW, I thought he defrauded the Bills by presenting himself as a dedicated professional football player and taking pro-money for that, at a time in his life when he actually made track a priority.  He pretty much said as much in one interview with a news organization focused on track and field, that he was fortunate football was funding his track career.

 

And yes, he might have become our best WR, but when he was here he neither trained seriously in the offseason to optimize his football skills and durability, nor played through nagging injuries that could have lingered and hindered his spring track training. 

 

That said, I feel McBeane did a poor job of evaluating our actual talent at WR and we would be in a much better situation if they had re-signed Woods and Goodwin.  If we had been able to sign Goodwin and Woods to similar, we would have been paying them a combined $9.8M last year.  Instead we had Andre Holmes and Jordan Matthews for $2.4M

 

We got performance commenserate with what we paid for.   Now, I'm not judging them for this per se- they may have been trying to save every penny to bring in a big name FA QB, and just got out-spent and cut out of the running.  We'll see in the long run but at best, my jury is "out" on whether Beane and McDermott can recognize talent on O and are willing to pay for it.

[mannc]

25 minutes ago, RoyBatty is alive said:

 I dont recall him being accused of "defrauding the Bills" 

Trust me; it happened.  See Hapless post, below.

25 minutes ago, RoyBatty is alive said:

As for #2, he didnt have a QB that could lead him and another year with Tyrod Taylor thrown him the ball likely could have gotten him killed so I disagree, I was not wrong.  He was not a good fir for the Bills.

 

This is an argument that I see trotted out here all the time, and it's pathetic and lame: "Yeah, he played great for [fill in the team], but he would have sucked in Buffalo because [fill in the excuse]."     

18 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

 

 

FWIW, I thought he defrauded the Bills by presenting himself as a dedicated professional football player and taking pro-money for that, at a time in his life when he actually made track a priority.  He pretty much said as much in one interview with a news organization focused on track and field, that he was fortunate football was funding his track career.

 

 

How do you know how Goodwin "presented himself to the Bills"?  For all you know, he was 100 percent honest with the team regarding his intention to simultaneously pursue a career in T&F. He certainly had the team's permission to do so.  And there is actually very little evidence that his pursuit of his track career hindered his development as a football player.   

Edited July 6, 2018 by mannc

[Fr. Jerk]

[Kirby Jackson]

52 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

 

 

Just hate seeing kids blow cash.  House is great, Ferrari seems excessive... how many thousands of dollars is that back pack? 

 

$27 mil is $13 mil after taxes and agents- if he plays the whole deal. That’s gotta last him and probably the rest of his family 30-40 years and any other folks hanging off of him. 

 

I am am very familiar with money actually... hope he gets there or has good investment advice or some solid post nfl career lined up

I have the same backpack but a little bigger and I’m an insurance agent. It was about $2500. His is maybe $1500-$2000. He makes WAY more than me and I’m not in jeopardy of being broke. A $2000 backpack to him is like a regular person going to dinner at Ruth’s Chris. 

 

The players that I know (who are much dumber than Goodwin) live off the interest alone. If you want to worry about a player going broke watch the way that Shady spends. When you see the $30,000 dinner bill that’s when you worry, not when you see the $100,000 car. This isn’t the 90’s anymore though. These players are much more savvy than they used to be and receive much better care after their careers are over. 

Edited July 6, 2018 by Kirby Jackson

[Hapless Bills Fan]

23 minutes ago, mannc said:

Trust me; it happened.  See Hapless post, below.

This is an argument that I see trotted out here all the time, and it's pathetic and lame: "Yeah, he played great for [fill in the team], but he would have sucked in Buffalo because [fill in the excuse]."     

How do you know how Goodwin "presented himself to the Bills"?  For all you know, he was 100 percent honest with the team regarding his intention to simultaneously pursue a career in T&F. He certainly had the team's permission to do so.  And there is actually very little evidence that his pursuit of his track career hindered his development as a football player.   

 

I look at his interviews pre-draft, for one thing.   He presented himself as "a football player, not a track star who plays football" and talked about how missing spring training in football impacted his development and he thought he would be able to develop being full-time focused on football.  And then....

 

If he was 100% honest with how he presented himself and his priorities to the Bills, then the Bills had 100% bad judgement in drafting him where they did anyway.

 

I don't know what you consider "evidence that his pursuit of his track career hindered his development as a football player", but looking at his stats in Pro Football Reference there seems to be something pretty stark going on.   In 2014, Goodwin was "in the doghouse" with Marrone, and reportedly not being willing to play dinged was part of it.  Rex was just loosy-goosey and didn't hold his players to high expectations, but it was notable that Goodwin was willing to stay on the field more in 2016 after his Olympics hopes flamed out, and one interpretation of his first 16-start season ever in 2017 is that he actually bulked up and trained for football in the off-season.

 

[Teddy KGB]

He got out of QB purgatory and has earned his money.  

 

Way to go Goodwin.  

 

I would welcome hogan, Goodwin, Sammy or Woods back to the Bills anytime 

Edited July 6, 2018 by Teddy KGB

[Hapless Bills Fan]

3 hours ago, Jpsredemption said:

Why are non bills related topics posted in this forum?

 

Because that's the general practice.  TSW is for football-related topics (including discussion of former Bills players, rival teams etc), "off the wall" is for non-football topics, and PPP is for no-holds-barred wrangling on political topics.

 

Don't like that practice?  There's a Customer Service forum and a Suggestion Box where you may state your case.

[BmarvB]

Always did like him. Thought the Bills made a mistake letting him get away. He wasn't being used right here. Hope he has a productive and healthy season out west

[C.Biscuit97]

32 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

I have the same backpack but a little bigger and I’m an insurance agent. It was about $2500. His is maybe $1500-$2000. He makes WAY more than me and I’m not in jeopardy of being broke. A $2000 backpack to him is like a regular person going to dinner at Ruth’s Chris. 

 

The players that I know (who are much dumber than Goodwin) live off the interest alone. If you want to worry about a player going broke watch the way that Shady spends. When you see the $30,000 dinner bill that’s when you worry, not when you see the $100,000 car. This isn’t the 90’s anymore though. These players are much more savvy than they used to be and receive much better care after their careers are over. 

You spend $2500 on a backpack?  I don’t care if I Bill Gates money.  I would never spend that much on a backpack.  Here’s the only one you’ll ever need.  The only problem is you will constantly have women hitting on you.

 

As for Goodwin, he always seemed like he had a great head on his shoulders.  The nickname Glass was funny but it’s crazy that some fans expect a 5’7” 170 lbs to be super durable playing in the nfl.  

 

And for being a terrible GM, Whaley’s guys are getting paid really well.

3 minutes ago, BmarvB said:

Always did like him. Thought the Bills made a mistake letting him get away. He wasn't being used right here. Hope he has a productive and healthy season out west

I’ve been critical of a lot of their moves, especially offense, but I can’t hate on this one.  Goodwin really struggle to stay healthy here and never made a major impact.  

 

 

5 minutes ago, BmarvB said:

Always did like him. Thought the Bills made a mistake letting him get away. He wasn't being used right here. Hope he has a productive and healthy season out west

I’ve been critical of a lot of their moves, especially offense, but I can’t hate on this one.  Goodwin really struggle to stay healthy here and never made a major impact.  

 

 

[Kirby Jackson]

39 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

LYou spend $2500 on a backpack?  I don’t care if I Bill Gates money.  I would never spend that much on a backpack.  Here’s the only one you’ll ever need.  The only problem is you will constantly have women hitting on you.

 

As for Goodwin, he always seemed like he had a great head on his shoulders.  The nickname Glass was funny but it’s crazy that some fans expect a 5’7” 170 lbs to be super durable playing in the nfl.  

 

And for being a terrible GM, Whaley’s guys are getting paid really well.

 

 

It probably wasn’t my best decision. I got it a couple of years ago after a bonus check. At the time it felt like a great idea but I barely use it for fear of it being stolen. It has never made it to Mardi Gras. It’s just turned into an expensive pool bag that doesn’t hold much. It’s probably the least practical purchase I’ve ever made. 

 

In in terms of Goodwin I always liked him more than others. He had an elite skill. That is important IMO. You need to blend skill sets with your WRs. Even if he was only a deep threat, he had value. That was proven true in that he signed at the beginning of FA. He had value. He’s turned out to be a good receiver and an elite deep threat. He’s been rewarded for it. To your point, he’s another Whaley guy that got paid.

Edited July 6, 2018 by Kirby Jackson

[Hapless Bills Fan]

7 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

As for Goodwin, he always seemed like he had a great head on his shoulders.  The nickname Glass was funny but it’s crazy that some fans expect a 5’7” 170 lbs to be super durable playing in the nfl.  

 

And for being a terrible GM, Whaley’s guys are getting paid really well.

 

I’ve been critical of a lot of their moves, especially offense, but I can’t hate on this one.  Goodwin really struggle to stay healthy here and never made a major impact. 

 

Agree on Whaley - for being a GM criticized because so few of his draft picks/acquisitions are still on the team - a lot of them contributing on good teams in the NFL.

I do tend to think the "coaching carousel" and scheme fits had a lot to do with it.

 

Goodwin is listed as 5'9" 180 lbs on the SF 49ers website and a bit heavier (183) in his draft profile.  IMO looking at photos he weighed less than that while he was pushing for the Olympics - he is listed as 5'10" 175 on the USTAF site 0 and weighs more than that (or has re-distributed the weight to his upper body) now.  And, with that, he started 16 games last year for SF.

I feel that Goodwin had a 5- and 10- year plan for his life, but focusing 100% on playing football during the first 3 years of his career wasn't part of his plan.

 

[C.Biscuit97]

8 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

It probably wasn’t my best decision. I got it a couple of years ago after a bonus check. At the time it felt like a great idea but I barely use it for fear of it being stolen. It has never made it to Marci Gras. It’s just turned into an expensive pool bag that doesn’t hold much. It’s probably the least practical purchase I’ve ever made. 

 

In in terms of Goodwin I always liked him more than others. He had an elite skill. That is important IMO. You need to blend skill sets with your WRs. Even if he was only a deep threat, he had value. That was proven true in that he signed at the beginning of FA. He had value. He’s turned out to be a good receiver and an elite deep threat. He’s been rewarded for it. To your point, he’s another Whaley guy that got paid.

I think you know I wasn’t the biggest Tyrod fan.  But if you wanted to get the most out of him, you keep Watkins and Goodwin since they did what Tyrod did best as a passer.  Instead the forced him into a west coast offense with slow wrs.

4 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Agree on Whaley - for being a GM criticized because so few of his draft picks/acquisitions are still on the team - a lot of them contributing on good teams in the NFL.

I do tend to think the "coaching carousel" and scheme fits had a lot to do with it.

 

Goodwin is listed as 5'9" 180 lbs on the SF 49ers website and a bit heavier (183) in his draft profile.  IMO looking at photos he weighed less than that while he was pushing for the Olympics - he is listed as 5'10" 175 on the USTAF site 0 and weighs more than that (or has re-distributed the weight to his upper body) now.  And, with that, he started 16 games last year for SF.

I feel that Goodwin had a 5- and 10- year plan for his life, but focusing 100% on playing football during the first 3 years of his career wasn't part of his plan.

 

Good post.  I hated the Sammy move and the idea of Jordan Matthews trying to replace him.  But I never in a million years predicted Goodwin would have been that good on the 49ers.  Good for him.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

2 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Agree on Whaley - for being a GM criticized because so few of his draft picks/acquisitions are still on the team - a lot of them contributing on good teams in the NFL.

I do tend to think the "coaching carousel" and scheme fits had a lot to do with it.

 

Goodwin is listed as 5'9" 180 lbs on the SF 49ers website and a bit heavier (183) in his draft profile.  IMO looking at photos he weighed less than that while he was pushing for the Olympics - he is listed as 5'10" 175 on the USTAF site 0 and weighs more than that (or has re-distributed the weight to his upper body) now.  And, with that, he started 16 games last year for SF.

I feel that Goodwin had a 5- and 10- year plan for his life, but focusing 100% on playing football during the first 3 years of his career wasn't part of his plan.

 

 

...and two sports that principally focus on "your wheels" has to be tough.....look at NFL WR's who end up with hammy and/or groin injuries that nag on.....glad this kid was able to make a 2nd go of it with 49ers......always seemed to be a classy kid......and the house purchase confirms it for me......

[LABILLBACKER]

6 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said:

He just signed a $20M extension. He’ll be fine. He can afford a decent sized house and a Range Rover.

 

Goodwin is a class guy. He’s one of the league’s “good guys.” For all of the negative that we see and hear about the NFL it is nice to have a story like this.

Well said and so true. Too bad Flash didn't have a better qb and a few less injuries. If you're going to spend money, spend it on family. 

[Kirby Jackson]

5 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

I think you know I wasn’t the biggest Tyrod fan.  But if you wanted to get the most out of him, you keep Watkins and Goodwin since they did what Tyrod did best as a passer.  Instead the forced him into a west coast offense with slow wrs.

Good post.  I hated the Sammy move and the idea of Jordan Matthews trying to replace him.  But I never in a million years predicted Goodwin would have been that good on the 49ers.  Good for him.

Yeah, last year was odd from an offensive standpoint. Statistically, they were one of the best rushing teams off all-time the year before. The Bills could run the ball and go over the top. That’s what they did well. They kept the box clean for the running game because teams respected Sammy and Goodwin’s speed. So what did they do? Added a lumbering Jordan Matthews to run 6 yard patterns. They jammed up the running game and cleared out the WR talent. Wasn’t Andre Holmes a number 2 to start the year?!? It was just weird and it failed miserably. I’d like to think that Rico was a big part of the problem and Daboll will get more out of these guys.

[nucci]

7 hours ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

Saw the car line up in front of the house too... he’s gonna be broke by 40

For buying a house and car?

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

6 minutes ago, nucci said:

For buying a house and car?

 

...irrational exuberance mind you...............

[C.Biscuit97]

7 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Yeah, last year was odd from an offensive standpoint. Statistically, they were one of the best rushing teams off all-time the year before. The Bills could run the ball and go over the top. That’s what they did well. They kept the box clean for the running game because teams respected Sammy and Goodwin’s speed. So what did they do? Added a lumbering Jordan Matthews to run 6 yard patterns. They jammed up the running game and cleared out the WR talent. Wasn’t Andre Holmes a number 2 to start the year?!? It was just weird and it failed miserably. I’d like to think that Rico was a big part of the problem and Daboll will get more out of these guys.

I’m just confused about their offensive moves.  They hired Rico.  Then they draft a huge arm qb, not a big fan of it.  It would be awesome to have some speed like Sammy (he just turned 25!) and Goodwin.  I wanted Juju and I’m not certainly giving up Zay but he isn’t fast.  Then, they draft 2 undersized slot wrs instead of rolling the dice on a physical freak like St Brown of Notre Dame.  I would have loved to see Allen and St Brown grow as rookies together.

 

i won’t have picked Allen but with all qbs, how you develop them matters so much.  Say what you want to EJ but his development was a joke (a first time nfl coach as his OC and QB coach, Luck had Bruce Arians as his OC his rookie year).  I fully trust them on defensive personnel moves but who is the guy on the staff we should blindly trust on offensive players moves?

 

i really liked Watson, Mahomes, and Rosen.  For Mahomes, he is in a great situation.  He has a cannon and is loaded with fast weapons and one of the best offensive coaches in the nfl.  We can’t say that here and that terrifies me.  

[Hapless Bills Fan]

5 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Yeah, last year was odd from an offensive standpoint. Statistically, they were one of the best rushing teams off all-time the year before. The Bills could run the ball and go over the top. That’s what they did well. They kept the box clean for the running game because teams respected Sammy and Goodwin’s speed. So what did they do? Added a lumbering Jordan Matthews to run 6 yard patterns. They jammed up the running game and cleared out the WR talent. Wasn’t Andre Holmes a number 2 to start the year?!? It was just weird and it failed miserably. I’d like to think that Rico was a big part of the problem and Daboll will get more out of these guys.

 

Really good description.  The whole thing was just weird, right down to the timing of the whole "Bench TT" thing.  For those who don't recall, in the Broncos Super Bowl run, Dennison/Kubiak benched Peyton Manning in Game 9 in favor of Brock Osweiler, who went 5-2 in the 7 games he started, but didn't exactly light the passing game on fire.  Now I grant you, Manning was a ghost of his best QB self, but there were other similarities - like taking an offense that Peyton ran well from the shotgun, and imposing a different system where he took a lot of snaps under center, then stubbornly clinging to it for a bit too long.  It was like Dennison has a script, "run my offense, and if you don't or can't or won't do what I say, I'll bench your a** come Game 9 'cuz any QB with two legs, an arm, and something to hold up his helmet can succeed if he does what I say.  I'll show YOU"

 

One of my frustrations in the last decade of being a Bills fan is it seems as though we just can't put together a competent offense, and a competent defense, at the same time.

 

I am hoping that Daboll did as many first-time coaches do - failed in his initial attempts at wider responsibility, took a step back, learned from his mistakes, and will now be our Pat Shurmer or Don Pederson, the creative maverick who makes the most of whatever he's got

[Hapless Bills Fan]

12 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

I’m just confused about their offensive moves.  They hired Rico.  Then they draft a huge arm qb, not a big fan of it.  It would be awesome to have some speed like Sammy (he just turned 25!) and Goodwin.  I wanted Juju and I’m not certainly giving up Zay but he isn’t fast.  Then, they draft 2 undersized slot wrs instead of rolling the dice on a physical freak like St Brown of Notre Dame.  I would have loved to see Allen and St Brown grow as rookies together.

 

I think Green Bay got a steal with St Brown.

 

I was in love with James Washington as a WR but also on board with the Bills trading up to take their shot at the possible Franchise QB and the possible game-changing LB.

 

But Ray-ray McCloud when St Brown was still on the board did puzzle me (and other draft pundits).  The only thing I can think is that they wanted a guy with strong ST potential there.

 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I think Green Bay got a steal with St Brown.

 

I was in love with James Washington as a WR but also on board with the Bills trading up to take their shot at the possible Franchise QB and the possible game-changing LB.

 

But Ray-ray McCloud when St Brown was still on the board did puzzle me (and other draft pundits).  The only thing I can think is that they wanted a guy with strong ST potential there.

 

 

...ST guys are a fine balancing act IMO......Bobby April had WAAAAY too much say in the final 53 with his ST guys......and when the injury bug hit, virtually none of them could step up and play their natural positions......Dickie Jauron had NOW HIRING trailers in every Walmart parking lot....if I remember correctly, the 78 yr old door greeter ALMOST made the club....

[Buffalo716]

Always like him here and wish we resigned him

 

he has supernatural speed

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

1 hour ago, Kirby Jackson said:

I have the same backpack but a little bigger and I’m an insurance agent. It was about $2500. His is maybe $1500-$2000. He makes WAY more than me and I’m not in jeopardy of being broke. A $2000 backpack to him is like a regular person going to dinner at Ruth’s Chris. 

 

The players that I know (who are much dumber than Goodwin) live off the interest alone. If you want to worry about a player going broke watch the way that Shady spends. When you see the $30,000 dinner bill that’s when you worry, not when you see the $100,000 car. This isn’t the 90’s anymore though. These players are much more savvy than they used to be and receive much better care after their careers are over. 

 

Hope he is... in isolation the expenditures are fine... but once you fall into the pattern that’s how you get broke.

 

Many of these kids spend like they will always get million dollar pay days.. 

 

In 2015 a study asserted 78% fall under fincial stress, go broke or declare bankruptcy. 

 

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/theres-a-difference-between-broke-and-bankrupt-for-ex-nfl-players/amp/

 

https://amp.businessinsider.com/what-nfl-great-terrell-owens-learned-after-losing-80-million-2017-10

[C.Biscuit97]

1 minute ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

 

Hope he is... in isolation the expenditures are fine... but once you fall into the pattern that’s how you get broke.

 

Many of these kids spend like they will always get million dollar pay days.. 

 

In 2015 a study asserted 78% fall under fincial stress, go broke or declare bankruptcy. 

 

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/theres-a-difference-between-broke-and-bankrupt-for-ex-nfl-players/amp/

 

https://amp.businessinsider.com/what-nfl-great-terrell-owens-learned-after-losing-80-million-2017-10

In other words, they can be the president one day.  

 

Honestly, I’d like to see the bankruptcy stats for all Americans.  It’s like how people think the nfl is full of thugs but it turns out they get arrested at a low rate than “regular” Americans.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

13 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

In other words, they can be the president one day.  

 

Honestly, I’d like to see the bankruptcy stats for all Americans.  It’s like how people think the nfl is full of thugs but it turns out they get arrested at a low rate than “regular” Americans.

 

No way... too short.

 

Maybe North Korea? 

[BADOLBILZ]

8 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said:

He just signed a $20M extension. He’ll be fine. He can afford a decent sized house and a Range Rover.

 

Goodwin is a class guy. He’s one of the league’s “good guys.” For all of the negative that we see and hear about the NFL it is nice to have a story like this.

 

Meh.

 

He's really just a dude who doing right by his family.    That's cool.  Not saying he's not a "good guy" but taking care of the single mom that raised you is a REALLY low bar to cross.   I think the average sociopath would do that.   

 

"Class" is more top to bottom than Goodwin.........since he was drafted he's just been a self-serving dude that manipulated the system.

 

He snowed Doug Whaley and the Bills in the pre-draft process telling them he was done with track and focused on football.  That lie got him drafted in round 3 instead of as a late rounder or a UDF that his half stepping history at Texas suggested he should be.       

 

He then basically got 3 free seasons of paychecks from the Bills.   He focused on his olympic dream while others in his same position around the league were grinding it out and trying to be good teammates and help their team win IN ADDITION to advancing their life goals.

 

It turned out to be fairly well played.......and to his credit he earned that last year of paychecks with the Bills while playing in the NFL at about 170 pounds soaking wet after an offseason with no football training at all.   I enjoyed watching him get smacked around that last year in Buffalo because he I knew he had denied his skills to Bills fans..............and as I said all along.......that dude is a TALENTED wide receiver.    He's got everything in abundance for a WR except size and love for the game.        

[Kirby Jackson]

18 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Meh.

 

He's really just a dude who doing right by his family.    That's cool.  Not saying he's not a "good guy" but taking care of the single mom that raised you is a REALLY low bar to cross.   I think the average sociopath would do that.   

 

"Class" is more top to bottom than Goodwin.........since he was drafted he's just been a self-serving dude that manipulated the system.

 

He snowed Doug Whaley and the Bills in the pre-draft process telling them he was done with track and focused on football.  That lie got him drafted in round 3 instead of as a late rounder or a UDF that his half stepping history at Texas suggested he should be.       

 

He then basically got 3 free seasons of paychecks from the Bills.   He focused on his olympic dream while others in his same position around the league were grinding it out and trying to be good teammates and help their team win IN ADDITION to advancing their life goals.

 

It turned out to be fairly well played.......and to his credit he earned that last year of paychecks with the Bills while playing in the NFL at about 170 pounds soaking wet after an offseason with no football training at all.   I enjoyed watching him get smacked around that last year in Buffalo because he I knew he had denied his skills to Bills fans..............and as I said all along.......that dude is a TALENTED wide receiver.    He's got everything in abundance for a WR except size and love for the game.        

It’s really tough to totally ignore all that he’s done for his sister and others in her position. There are tons of examples of him going above and beyond. 

[BringBackOrton]

3 hours ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

In other words, they can be the president one day.  

 

Honestly, I’d like to see the bankruptcy stats for all Americans.  It’s like how people think the nfl is full of thugs but it turns out they get arrested at a low rate than “regular” Americans.

That's you.  You're the one who believes that.  You post all about them every time you can bring up Kaep.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Meh.

 

He's really just a dude who doing right by his family.    That's cool.  Not saying he's not a "good guy" but taking care of the single mom that raised you is a REALLY low bar to cross.   I think the average sociopath would do that.   

 

"Class" is more top to bottom than Goodwin.........since he was drafted he's just been a self-serving dude that manipulated the system.

 

He snowed Doug Whaley and the Bills in the pre-draft process telling them he was done with track and focused on football.  That lie got him drafted in round 3 instead of as a late rounder or a UDF that his half stepping history at Texas suggested he should be.       

 

He then basically got 3 free seasons of paychecks from the Bills.   He focused on his olympic dream while others in his same position around the league were grinding it out and trying to be good teammates and help their team win IN ADDITION to advancing their life goals.

 

It turned out to be fairly well played.......and to his credit he earned that last year of paychecks with the Bills while playing in the NFL at about 170 pounds soaking wet after an offseason with no football training at all.   I enjoyed watching him get smacked around that last year in Buffalo because he I knew he had denied his skills to Bills fans..............and as I said all along.......that dude is a TALENTED wide receiver.    He's got everything in abundance for a WR except size and love for the game.        

 

 

...has there EVER been ANY parade you did not pray for rain on?.......Jesus, I looked at the NEGATIVE terminal on my car battery and it had YOUR PICTURE....SMH...............

[3rdand12]

19 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

https://twitter.com/NFLonFOX/status/1015034748291276800

awesome !

 Darned good Kid right there.

4 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Agree on Whaley - for being a GM criticized because so few of his draft picks/acquisitions are still on the team - a lot of them contributing on good teams in the NFL.

I do tend to think the "coaching carousel" and scheme fits had a lot to do with it.

 

Goodwin is listed as 5'9" 180 lbs on the SF 49ers website and a bit heavier (183) in his draft profile.  IMO looking at photos he weighed less than that while he was pushing for the Olympics - he is listed as 5'10" 175 on the USTAF site 0 and weighs more than that (or has re-distributed the weight to his upper body) now.  And, with that, he started 16 games last year for SF.

I feel that Goodwin had a 5- and 10- year plan for his life, but focusing 100% on playing football during the first 3 years of his career wasn't part of his plan.

 

His moving away from Olympics and focus on football may have been his best move career wise, looking at it now. Hindsight is funny like that though.
wish we kept him.

 But he might have been wasted as somehow Bills stopped throwing deep under Dennison. as mentioned having a viable over the top threat and using it ! ,  does wonders for stopping  a chronic 8 in the box

4 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Yeah, last year was odd from an offensive standpoint. Statistically, they were one of the best rushing teams off all-time the year before. The Bills could run the ball and go over the top. That’s what they did well. They kept the box clean for the running game because teams respected Sammy and Goodwin’s speed. So what did they do? Added a lumbering Jordan Matthews to run 6 yard patterns. They jammed up the running game and cleared out the WR talent. Wasn’t Andre Holmes a number 2 to start the year?!? It was just weird and it failed miserably. I’d like to think that Rico was a big part of the problem and Daboll will get more out of these guys.

It was weird I said it back then and still wonder what the heck.

This is honestly where my hesitation lies with this FO.
The O Line ( Mills Ducasse )  the WRs ?? and the passing game

 and Tolbert.

 I just did not understand what the goal was I still do not

[3rdand12]

3 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

Always like him here and wish we resigned him

 

he has supernatural speed

That gear he shifted into was amazening : )

Overthrowing him was nearly impossible. 

[FearLess Price]

Congrats. Good stuff. There.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, 3rdand12 said:

His moving away from Olympics and focus on football may have been his best move career wise, looking at it now. Hindsight is funny like that though.

wish we kept him.

 But he might have been wasted as somehow Bills stopped throwing deep under Dennison. as mentioned having a viable over the top threat and using it ! ,  does wonders for stopping  a chronic 8 in the box

 

This is a view I developed partially in hindsight, so take it for whatever it's worth:
 

So in 2013, Goodwin had a reasonable rookie season.  He played in 12 games and his combined 634 yds on kickoff returns and receptions was a decent contribution, considering he had the likes of Thad Lewis and Jeff Tuel throwing to him.  He missed some games due to a hand injury and was listed as "questionable" for others and played.    He contributed to the team.
 

At some point (maybe before the 2013 draft, maybe after the season)  Goodwin decided to take a shot at the 2016 Olympics.  To do that, he was going to train for long jump in the off season before 2015 and 2016, compete in the Pan Am Games summer of 2015 and try to qualify for Worlds, and then compete and try to qualify for Rio in 2016.

In 2014, with Orton throwing to him, Goodwin saw 9 targets in 10 games.  He spent 7 games on injury report and didn't play in 6 games.  There was talk (if I recall) at the time about Goodwin not "making himself available" to practice and maybe pampering injuries thus getting himself in Marrone's "doghouse".  In 2015, he scarcely played - he was out the first 4 games with a rib injury, played 2 games, then was out again and IR'd.  Now, rib injuries have all levels of seriousness, and can be debilitatingly painful.  But many a football player straps 'em up and puts on a flak jacket and gets injections and plays through 'em. 

 

In hindsight, I think Goodwin's plan to train for the Olympics made him unwilling to play through injuries other NFL players work with.  His priority wasn't helping the team; his priority was getting to the off-season in good enough shape to start track training.  And his priority was conditioning for track, not football.

 

Now forward to 2016.  His NFL contract is about to be up.  He flubs the Olympic trials, performing way below his personal best and his YTD best.  His track career is done.   All of a sudden, he plays in 15 games - never sees the Injury Report at all.  His catch percentage absolutely sucks, maybe 'cuz his off-season was spent on track and not improving his route running and catching abilities.  But he actually puts up OK numbers - not great numbers for a 4th year guy drafted in the 3rd, but enough to earn him a decent contract somewhere else.  Then he focuses his attention on football and lo and behold! in 2017 his career takes off.

I think Goodwin made a fool out of the Bills FO.  Again, take it for whatever it's worth.  He may be a nice guy - sterling family man, not someone wasting his money and talent on booze and wimmin.  But football simply wasn't his priority his first 3 years with the Bills, and we let him get away with it.

 

I think the Bills not throwing deep under Dennison, was in part lack of speedy targets who can gain separation.  Tyrod didn't trust his WR enough to put the ball out there if he didn't believe they would outrun their coverage - and our guys couldn't.

[JohnC]

6 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I look at his interviews pre-draft, for one thing.   He presented himself as "a football player, not a track star who plays football" and talked about how missing spring training in football impacted his development and he thought he would be able to develop being full-time focused on football.  And then....

 

If he was 100% honest with how he presented himself and his priorities to the Bills, then the Bills had 100% bad judgement in drafting him where they did anyway.

 

I don't know what you consider "evidence that his pursuit of his track career hindered his development as a football player", but looking at his stats in Pro Football Reference there seems to be something pretty stark going on.   In 2014, Goodwin was "in the doghouse" with Marrone, and reportedly not being willing to play dinged was part of it.  Rex was just loosy-goosey and didn't hold his players to high expectations, but it was notable that Goodwin was willing to stay on the field more in 2016 after his Olympics hopes flamed out, and one interpretation of his first 16-start season ever in 2017 is that he actually bulked up and trained for football in the off-season.

 

Goodwin was very open prior to the draft about his desire to participate in the Olympics. There was no secret about his love of track. It wasn't surprising that the pre-draft consideration about was whether he was mostly a track athlete who played football or a football player who also participated in track. From what I remember the consensus was that he was more of a track athlete whose  elite speed talent could be used as a specialty on the football field. 

 

I do agree with you that in order to make himself more attractive as a draft prospect he misrepresented his desire to play football at the expense of a track career. That Olympic dream was a flame that was still burning very hot when he was drafted. I won't go so far as to say that he lied but I am comfortable in saying that he wasn't candid about what he wanted to do relative to his track interests. 

 

I do agree with you when he first entered the pros that his training that focused on track hindered his development on the football field. As you noted the training for each sport is very different and to an extent counterproductive. Without question his lack of durability was attributable to not fully dedicating himself to train for football. 

 

 

[BADOLBILZ]

2 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said:

It’s really tough to totally ignore all that he’s done for his sister and others in her position. There are tons of examples of him going above and beyond. 

 

 

You don't have to "totally ignore" anything.    People are complicated.    They usually aren't just bad or good.   He does nice things for his family and causes close to his own heart but his lack of professional integrity is simultaneously a prime example of why NFL players STILL won't be getting guaranteed contracts in their next CBA.   Which really !@#$s over a lot of people who pour their heart and soul into the game.   The people we watch the game for.    The people that make the fat TV dollars possible.    People who also have their own single mom's to support and causes close to their hearts.

 

Perception of the player is key in Goodwins case.    He gradually convinced Bills fans that he was just a scrub and Whaley was obviously dumb for drafting him and in their eyes MG ceased to be responsible for his own performance or lack thereof.    If Josh Allen mails in his first 4 seasons and then decides to try for his next team will he be seen as a great guy by Bills fans regardless of how much money he gives to his family or any charity?    Thinking not.     

[mannc]

28 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

You don't have to "totally ignore" anything.    People are complicated.    They usually aren't just bad or good.   He does nice things for his family and causes close to his own heart but his lack of professional integrity is simultaneously a prime example of why NFL players STILL won't be getting guaranteed contracts in their next CBA.   Which really !@#$s over a lot of people who pour their heart and soul into the game.   The people we watch the game for.    The people that make the fat TV dollars possible.    People who also have their own single mom's to support and causes close to their hearts.

 

Perception of the player is key in Goodwins case.    He gradually convinced Bills fans that he was just a scrub and Whaley was obviously dumb for drafting him and in their eyes MG ceased to be responsible for his own performance or lack thereof.    If Josh Allen mails in his first 4 seasons and then decides to try for his next team will he be seen as a great guy by Bills fans regardless of how much money he gives to his family or any charity?    Thinking not.     

Badol, I'll give you credit, because all along, while the idiot fringe here was saying that Goodwin sucked at football, you've acknowledged that Goodwin has bona fide NFL talent and is not just another TJ Graham.  That being said, there just isn't any evidence that he was mailing it in during his four years with the Bills.  If Goodwin was mailing it in for the sake of long-jumping, then he's an idiot because even the top two or three long jumpers in the world make far less than a WR 3 in the NFL.  It takes some players longer to develop than others, and of course a WR's performance can be greatly affected by the team around him, especially the QB.  There is no reason not to believe that what we are seeing with Goodwin is just a guy getting better with more time in the league, and rising to the occasion when he gets a chance to play more in a different system.     

[3rdand12]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

This is a view I developed partially in hindsight, so take it for whatever it's worth:
 

So in 2013, Goodwin had a reasonable rookie season.  He played in 12 games and his combined 634 yds on kickoff returns and receptions was a decent contribution, considering he had the likes of Thad Lewis and Jeff Tuel throwing to him.  He missed some games due to a hand injury and was listed as "questionable" for others and played.    He contributed to the team.
 

At some point (maybe before the 2013 draft, maybe after the season)  Goodwin decided to take a shot at the 2016 Olympics.  To do that, he was going to train for long jump in the off season before 2015 and 2016, compete in the Pan Am Games summer of 2015 and try to qualify for Worlds, and then compete and try to qualify for Rio in 2016.

In 2014, with Orton throwing to him, Goodwin saw 9 targets in 10 games.  He spent 7 games on injury report and didn't play in 6 games.  There was talk (if I recall) at the time about Goodwin not "making himself available" to practice and maybe pampering injuries thus getting himself in Marrone's "doghouse".  In 2015, he scarcely played - he was out the first 4 games with a rib injury, played 2 games, then was out again and IR'd.  Now, rib injuries have all levels of seriousness, and can be debilitatingly painful.  But many a football player straps 'em up and puts on a flak jacket and gets injections and plays through 'em. 

 

In hindsight, I think Goodwin's plan to train for the Olympics made him unwilling to play through injuries other NFL players work with.  His priority wasn't helping the team; his priority was getting to the off-season in good enough shape to start track training.  And his priority was conditioning for track, not football.

 

Now forward to 2016.  His NFL contract is about to be up.  He flubs the Olympic trials, performing way below his personal best and his YTD best.  His track career is done.   All of a sudden, he plays in 15 games - never sees the Injury Report at all.  His catch percentage absolutely sucks, maybe 'cuz his off-season was spent on track and not improving his route running and catching abilities.  But he actually puts up OK numbers - not great numbers for a 4th year guy drafted in the 3rd, but enough to earn him a decent contract somewhere else.  Then he focuses his attention on football and lo and behold! in 2017 his career takes off.

I think Goodwin made a fool out of the Bills FO.  Again, take it for whatever it's worth.  He may be a nice guy - sterling family man, not someone wasting his money and talent on booze and wimmin.  But football simply wasn't his priority his first 3 years with the Bills, and we let him get away with it.

 

I think the Bills not throwing deep under Dennison, was in part lack of speedy targets who can gain separation.  Tyrod didn't trust his WR enough to put the ball out there if he didn't believe they would outrun their coverage - and our guys couldn't.

As i post i am usually trying to cover a number of comments. Or just focused on my own opinion on occasion !
The relationship with the Bills.. if he took advantage shame on them. Because we have become more and more aware of what a tough business it is to play ball in the NFL i will take no side.
 

 My respect for him has been for his dedication to his sister and Family. Same as you and I would do.

On the other note, he can and should be faulted for his lack of focus on being a WR employed by the Buffalo Bills. on that i return to shame on Bills FO hoping to get more from him than they did. and then sticking with a false hope for so long. Even we knew he was focused on long jump.

But Bills were spinning at as fully supportive.

 

i would guess that was the Russ Brandon talking and selling tickets.

But the kid ? when healthy? was something to see him catch up to a football no one had business catching.

 When they ran him over the middle and used some curl routes.. well that did not work out so well

8 minutes ago, mannc said:

Badol, I'll give you credit, because all along, while the idiot fringe here was saying that Goodwin sucked at football, you've acknowledged that Goodwin has bona fide NFL talent and is not just another TJ Graham.  That being said, there just isn't any evidence that he was mailing it in during his four years with the Bills.  If Goodwin was mailing it in for the sake of long-jumping, then he's an idiot because even the top two or three long jumpers in the world make far less than a WR 3 in the NFL.  It takes some players longer to develop than others, and of course a WR's performance can be greatly affected by the team around him, especially the QB.  There is no reason not to believe that what we are seeing with Goodwin is just a guy getting better with more time in the league, and rising to the occasion when he gets a chance to play more in a different system.     

who was it that hung onto TJ Graham so painfully long as a deep threat and important to the game ? I just cannot put my finger on that persons name..