National Anthem (Cameron Jefferson)

[TakeYouToTasker]

And for those of you wondering what the problem is or why they are protesting:

 

http://people.com/crime/cobb-georgia-cop-we-only-shoot-black-people/

 

In the news this week.

Dumb thing to say, but in no way indicative of systemic racism, or even racism in the officer who said it.

 

In a vacuum, sure. But nothing exists in a vacuum.

 

It's far more likely that this officer was deescalating a situation using sarcasm. Because he's a human being, and human beings do things like that.

 

Was it stupid? Absolutely. Especially in the current environment where victims are afforded hero status, and social justice warriors are finding racists under every rock. But actually racist? Highly unlikely.

 

Hence the problem with the protests.

 

If this is your evidence of a systemic problem, I have good news for you: your problem doesn't exist.

Edited September 1, 2017 by TakeYouToTasker

[IDBillzFan]

 

No, Gomer, people are protesting because it is a systemic problem, not a lone, localized one.

 

Funny. That's the only cop I've ever heard say that. How do you know the problem is systemic?

[nucci]

I totally agree with what Jerry Jones said. You have every right to protest, but while you are representing my team, you WILL stand for the national anthem!!!! If the Bills find that they are OK with a player disrespecting the country, than they lose me as a fan.

 

Hats off to Jerry Jones!!! (I can't believe that I am saying that, but totally agree with his position......)

Protesting something is not the same as disrespecting. McDermott had conversations with the players....so I guess you're no longer a fan.....

[Mike in Horseheads]

I totally agree with what Jerry Jones said. You have every right to protest, but while you are representing my team, you WILL stand for the national anthem!!!! If the Bills find that they are OK with a player disrespecting the country, than they lose me as a fan.

 

Hats off to Jerry Jones!!! (I can't believe that I am saying that, but totally agree with his position......)

See ya, enjoy Dallas.

[stony]

I totally agree with what Jerry Jones said. You have every right to protest, but while you are representing my team, you WILL stand for the national anthem!!!! If the Bills find that they are OK with a player disrespecting the country, than they lose me as a fan.

 

Hats off to Jerry Jones!!! (I can't believe that I am saying that, but totally agree with his position......)

 

Ten bucks if Zeke Elliot kneeled, Jerruh wouldn't do a damn thing.

[Kirby Jackson]

I totally agree with what Jerry Jones said. You have every right to protest, but while you are representing my team, you WILL stand for the national anthem!!!! If the Bills find that they are OK with a player disrespecting the country, than they lose me as a fan.

 

Hats off to Jerry Jones!!! (I can't believe that I am saying that, but totally agree with his position......)

Isn't that the guy that signed Greg Hardy?

 

Translation: "it's okay to beat the crap out of women and throw them onto a pile of automatic weapons on my team but it's NOT okay to kneel during the national anthem."

Edited September 1, 2017 by Kirby Jackson

[Mike in Horseheads]

 

Ten bucks if Zeke Elliot kneeled, Jerruh wouldn't do a damn thing.

[GoBills808]

Yeah, quite sure given that I'm the guy who said it.

 

In fact, if you keep going through the exchange (publicly available to you in this thread at zero cost!), you'll see that I'm explaining why this is a poor avenue for argument, both for being a logical fallacy, and for being indistinguishable from those folks actually doing exactly as I said for the reason I said. You'll note that I was explaining, as opposed to accusing.

 

But then, you knew that already.

 

By the by, what would be so hilarious to you? Don't parse words, come right out and say it.

Well, because we've (the greater we've, as it were) had discussions in the past about how the casual labelling of racist to a person of opposing beliefs isn't a compelling strategy for arguing. And in that light, accusing (or explaining as you put it, same inference/same result) someone who questions Jim Brown's morality of trying to keep him (Brown) 'on the plantation' is lacking in self awareness and rhetorical cohesiveness.

 

As I replied earlier, I think your initial point of separating his past deeds from his expertise in other areas is the correct take. Which is why I was frankly surprised to see your racism interpretation, hence 'hilarious'.

[HappyDays]

I totally agree with what Jerry Jones said. You have every right to protest, but while you are representing my team, you WILL stand for the national anthem!!!! If the Bills find that they are OK with a player disrespecting the country, than they lose me as a fan.

 

Hats off to Jerry Jones!!! (I can't believe that I am saying that, but totally agree with his position......)

You don't find it weird that he signs all sorts of players with domestic violence history, but will cut a player that makes a silent statement during the anthem? Man our priorities are all messed up in this country.

[Kelly the Dog]

Isn't that the guy that signed Greg Hardy?

And Randy Gregory and Michael Irvin and the Unabomber.

[boyst]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Virginia_State_Board_of_Education_v._Barnette

 

I thought it was ruled by the Supreme Court that forcing people to stand and salute the flag was a violation of the 1st amendment to the constitution.

 

And another supreme court ruling -

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Eichman

 

 

 

Here's another piece on it saying there's a guideline but they can not enforce it by law -

 

http://www.ajc.com/news/national/colin-kaepernick-breaking-the-law-not-standing-for-the-national-anthem/cRjlkGqATbYZT3S3AkzJGK/

the law still stands. So it's illegal. I oppose the right, however. But it is still illegal not to stand

I only have an online GED in law, but I'm pretty sure the only words that make something a legal requirement are "must" or "must not."

shall = should. Shall is law. Should is law. Etc

 

Jr is a lawyer. Maybe he can give his two cents. But it's law

[Kirby Jackson]

And Randy Gregory and Michael Irvin and the Unabomber.

...and Nate Newton and Pacman Jones....but as that previous poster said "hats off to that guy." What a great moral example

[boyst]

 

do you have a source for this? Show me the statute.

yes it's been posted. Please try to keep up

And for those of you wondering what the problem is or why they are protesting:

 

http://people.com/crime/cobb-georgia-cop-we-only-shoot-black-people/

 

In the news this week.

hahahahahahahaha hahahahahaha. Let's look at what was said in context. Jesus Christ (my son) you're hilarious.

Agreed. It's like the commandments. Thou should not commit adultery. Thou should not kill.

how is shall any different than should.

 

Just like if I were with you 200 years ago it would be a lot different then saying I spent the night with you today.

 

Either way, you'd wake up satisfied, though.

[TakeYouToTasker]

Well, because we've (the greater we've, as it were) had discussions in the past about how the casual labelling of racist to a person of opposing beliefs isn't a compelling strategy for arguing. And in that light, accusing (or explaining as you put it, same inference/same result) someone who questions Jim Brown's morality of trying to keep him (Brown) 'on the plantation' is lacking in self awareness and rhetorical cohesiveness.

 

As I replied earlier, I think your initial point of separating his past deeds from his expertise in other areas is the correct take. Which is why I was frankly surprised to see your racism interpretation, hence 'hilarious'.

You'll note that I haven't labeled any individual a racist.

 

You'll also agree, I would think, that actual racists exist, and that those actual racists who do exist have a purpose and a process.

 

I have outlined a purpose and a process being used by actual racists.

 

There are zero inconsistencies in what I've said here.

 

Do you take umbrage with any of that?

[HappyDays]

If you need an example of what they are protesting, look at drug arrests and sentencing. Black people are 6 times more likely than white people to be locked up for drugs even though they only use drugs at a slightly higher rate:

 

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/statements/2016/jul/13/van-jones/van-jones-claim-drug-use-imprisonment-rates-blacks/

 

That should make you angrier than a football player putting his fist in the air during the national anthem. Priorities people.

[boyst]

If you need an example of what they are protesting, look at drug arrests and sentencing. Black people are 6 times more likely than white people to be locked up for drugs even though they only use drugs at a slightly higher rate:

 

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/statements/2016/jul/13/van-jones/van-jones-claim-drug-use-imprisonment-rates-blacks/

 

That should make you angrier than a football player putting his fist in the air during the national anthem. Priorities people.

why? Edited September 1, 2017 by Boyst62

[twist_to_open]

Not me.

 

Universal Standing for the aanthem never started in the NFL until 2009.

 

So did you still support the 90s teams when they did other things instead if standing

[BillsFan4]

the law still stands. So it's illegal. I oppose the right, however. But it is still illegal not to stand shall = should. Shall is law. Should is law. Etc

Jr is a lawyer. Maybe he can give his two cents. But it's law

But the supreme, court ruled that it was illegal to enforce it, so no, it really doesn't.

 

 

'So does it, and whats the penalty if I dont stand?

 

No, it doesn't. Section 171 does not specify nor impose penalties for violating the section of the code. According to a Congressional Research Service report to Congress in 2008, The Flag Code is a codification of customs and rules established for the use of certain civilians and civilian groups. No penalty or punishment is specified in the Flag Code for display of the flag of the United States in a manner other than as suggested. Cases ... have concluded that the Flag Code does not proscribe conduct, but is merely declaratory and advisory."

 

In other words, the Flag Code serves as a guide, and it is followed on a voluntary basis. You won't be forced to stand for the National Anthem, nor hauled off to jail if you don't. Cases brought because of something in the code -- mainly ones that involve defacing the flag -- have made their way to the U.S. Supreme Court where the justices have upheld that such conduct is protected by the First Amendment.

 

There are no provisions in the code for either enforcement nor penalties. '

Edited September 1, 2017 by BillsFan4

[JohnBonhamRocks]

Shall not = cannot; it's prohibited

 

Should not = can, but it is advised against

[boyst]

But the supreme, court ruled that it was illegal to enforce it, so no, it really doesn't.

haha. They did?