Heitz Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 i think you have to back away from the straight line causation of rex hired causing MDs suspension, and think that MD is a piece of a bigger issue potentially here. Do you think that Rex is a coach that will be able to create a team atmosphere that lends itself to high levels of accountability? does his lack of that skill (if you agree its a weakness on his resume) makes incidents more likely to happen, even if he is not the direct cause? But, again, even if Rex was a "Jeff Fischer cut a guy to prove a point" type, would that have really stopped Marcell from doing what he's going to do? Not really sure it would... How many laps for a weed suspension? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Linen Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 i think they have likewise dabbled in high risk, high reward, strategies. they have been able to hold much of it together and maximize the reward. rex at one point in his career did likewise, but for much of the last decade rex has landed on the wrong side of the equation and that concerns me at this crossroad. So you admit we should have high risk players? Just like every other team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4merper4mer Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Let me preface this by saying a think TPegs is a great owner, but i think we are seeing the repercussions of his desire to win. Which I appluad BTW. I dont know how to search, but i doubt any of us were saying this time last year Darius extension was a mistake ..but he had had two separate incidents pointing to him being a knucklehead. Kane is another great example of taking a risk, as is Karlos. TPEGS learning a hard lesson i think. When you take risks on guys with some character flaws, some of them going to come back and bit ya is da ass. We might see a different attitude on both teams moving forward. I see what you're saying. I'd remove Karlos from that because he is small potatoes in terms of replaceability and importance. He did also grab a bunch of high priced flop FAs when he first bought the Sabres and the cap wouldn't allow him to do it right away with the Bills. He made a mistake hiring Nolan which had "publicity stunt" or "fan owner" written all over it. He made a gigantic mistake with his first Bills coaching hire and that was also high profile. I think the next Bills coach will be telling as to what Pegula's thought process has become. If he consults a lot of sources and hires a relative unknown, I'd hope for Joe Maddon type results. If he grabs for another high profile name, I'll have hope but also be worried. Bylsma seems like he was a good hire but Pegs did go after the arrogant Babcock first. We'll see in 2017 after we have to purge the mess that is Rex. Personally I like Whaley and think he has been hamstrung by two horribly bad coaches in a row. I do understand what the anti-Whaley group is saying and I think it is hard with our limited information to know how many corners, if any, he has been painted into by Marrone and Rex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jobot Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 My biggest gripe with this is how long he has known this suspension has been looming... and all I've seen from him the past few months are photos of him at nascar races and attending all this outside of football bs. He posted an apology about his commitment to the Bills and fans... just more BS in my mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 How many players that he's mentored stayed out of trouble? We went down but it wasn't a clown show. That's just making things up. 54 sacks and #4 ranking to 21 sacks and #19 ranking and now this. And you can knock Mario's effort last year, but he handles his business off the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffaloed in Pa Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 He is just plain stupid. Trade him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 There's successful (wins) and respected organizations that go through this too. Every single team has high risk guys and they sometimes get in trouble with those teams too. im not denying that. but i think theres something to be said for a culture problem when we have our top paid player in dareus suspended, a vet leader in lawson suspended, karlos suspended, jwill about to be suspended, mccoy had his drama that we probably got lucky with.... we are pairing high risk guys with low accountability leadership. and im a big fan of taking chances on guys- but you need to have structure in place, and i dont know how anyone can argue that we have gotten the equation right when looking at this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Failed weed test? No links, no sources, strictly like 5 texts i have received in the last 20 minutes. 4 games on the table. anyone else? I hate you, Paul. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 If you work for a big company and you have a superior, is he not blamed from HIS superior for YOUR actions? Your superior may not cut the checks, but he is blamed for not managing you well by HIS superior. You might get suspended/fired, but guess what? Your superior might also get suspended/fired. Get it? I'm not sure it works this way with regards to drugs. I think HR is involved and typically an at will employee is terminated. I doubt they even consult your boss beyond telling him that they have to get rid of you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Nails Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 I talked to Wanny at PAC-12 media day two years ago. It was the year after he was fired. I just asked him what he thought about the team's prospects in general terms. With no prodding, he said something like, "Dareus needs to get his head on straight and stop doing dumb s*it" He went on to say, "all the talent in the world, but will probably never live up to it because he thinks he can get away with anything." I have never shared the commentary he gave me on him, but today it seems appropriate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 He is just plain stupid. Trade him. Again, this would be the Lynch trade all over. His value is at an all time low. Teams would trade for him in a second but all of our leverage is gone. When he's at his best (and not in Rex defense), he is one of the best defensive players in the NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 So you admit we should have high risk players? Just like every other team. admit? im not sure why its an admission.... Yea, i think that you need to take some risks on guys. i think having a core of established vet leaders that are on the tight and narrow, and a coach that runs a tight ship helps keep those guys on track (but certainly not without possibility of hiccups). i think that rex, long term, is not a coach that helps reduce the number of those hiccups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Now i know this isn't a good comparison. but Von Miller was suspended 6 games and denver won all 6... yea yea peyton manning. but we have TYROD TAYLOR #5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Linen Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 54 sacks and #4 ranking to 21 sacks and #19 ranking and now this. And you can knock Mario's effort last year, but he handles his business off the field. I'll give him that - he's not been in trouble. That doesn't necessarily qualify him as a mentor though. He's a selfish individual - which is fine because it served him well. admit? im not sure why its an admission.... Yea, i think that you need to take some risks on guys. i think having a core of established vet leaders that are on the tight and narrow, and a coach that runs a tight ship helps keep those guys on track (but certainly not without possibility of hiccups). i think that rex, long term, is not a coach that helps reduce the number of those hiccups. I get it - but it's just a theory and it's yours. I just have a hard time giving much blame to anyone but Dareus here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuSeYiN_NYC Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Two questions: 1) What should Rex have done to avoid this issue? 2) Who was at fault when Dareus was suspended last season for what he did in 2014 when Rex was still NYJ coach? Question 2 is irrelevant but to answer question 1, he could have been as they call him, "a player's coach", talked to him about life (as Dareus says that they do), tell him how important he is to the team and how he needs him to teach the young guys how to be a professional by leading by example if not by words. How's everything with the family blah blah blah. Talk a lil liquor talk a lil weed, joke about him being suspended and then get serious and remind him that his NFL career isn't guaranteed to last longer than a day. Any day on the field can be your last. Tell him he can do all that weed smoking after his career in the NFL is done. Now let's say he does all that and Dareus still smokes right? Guess what? Whaley will have something to say to Rex, Russ Brandon will have something to say to Rex, Pegulas will have something to say to Rex. They don't NEED to say ANYTHING to Dareus because they hired someone to manage the players get it? It's a small blame but at the end of the F'ing day, its a FREAKIN blame. Nobody saying rex is 100% to blame and I'm gonna stop typing cuz I'm starting to get upset at this bufoonery. He gets a blame whether you believe he should or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plenzmd1 Posted August 16, 2016 Author Share Posted August 16, 2016 I hate you, Paul. I will buy you a beer at the opener to make up for being the messenger! Felt like scum posting it..even woke up early and deleted cause was gnawing at me. Was hoping it was all going away, and then BOOM! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Question 2 is irrelevant but to answer question 1, he could have been as they call him, "a player's coach", talked to him about life (as Dareus says that they do), tell him how important he is to the team and how he needs him to teach the young guys how to be a professional by leading by example if not by words. How's everything with the family blah blah blah. Talk a lil liquor talk a lil weed, joke about him being suspended and then get serious and remind him that his NFL career isn't guaranteed to last longer than a day. Any day on the field can be your last. Tell him he can do all that weed smoking after his career in the NFL is done. Now let's say he does all that and Dareus still smokes right? Guess what? Whaley will have something to say to Rex, Russ Brandon will have something to say to Rex, Pegulas will have something to say to Rex. They don't NEED to say ANYTHING to Dareus because they hired someone to manage the players get it? It's a small blame but at the end of the F'ing day, its a FREAKIN blame. Nobody saying rex is 100% to blame and I'm gonna stop typing cuz I'm starting to get upset at this bufoonery. He gets a blame whether you believe he should or not. I don't think thats what an NFL coaches job is. At all. 0% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWATeam Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 I don't think thats what an NFL coaches job is. At all. 0% Can you see Bellicheat have that conversation with his players? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 I get it - but it's just a theory and it's yours. I just have a hard time giving much blame to anyone but Dareus here. is it really that controversial of a theory that putting high risk guys into situations with mentors and accountability tends to result in better outcomes than putting them into situations without those? im again not saying that one can only succeed, and the other can only fail -- but if putting odds on both, the numbers wouldnt be the same, would they? again, im not drawing a direct line. you send MD to a strict setting and he still might have the same issue (hell, he had issues with marrone).... but we see it playing out on and off the field right now. we have gotten a lot of guys that are gifted athletes but lacking in smarts, and impulse control. im not saying that is wrong, but paired with a coach that also lacks in discipline and impulse control, it seems a situation that can easily go downhill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuSeYiN_NYC Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 (edited) His % of the blame is very low. He's a coach. He's responsible for building the play book, game planning for specific opponents, and instilling this knowledge in his players so they are prepared to win football games. He's not a high school football coach. His job is not to help people grow as individuals, or learn from their mistakes. These are professionals, and should grow up and act like it. He doesn't even have to like you to do his job. Why is it his fault when you get caught in the preseason being an idiot? It can be as low as F'ing .0000000001% for all i care. At the end of the day he gets a percentage of the blame right? No seriously. Right or F'ing wrong? To say he's 100% not to blame is what we're talking about here. Edited August 16, 2016 by HuSeYiN_NYC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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