bobobonators Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 How did Wilkerson and Richardson have very good years under Rex if Rex is as clueless at using personnel as some are making him out to be? It appears some players on this defense thought they were the greatest defense to ever play in the NFL and when the results werent the same as last year, the complaining started happening. Newsflash: last year's defensive production wasnt the norm it was more of an exception for this group in recent years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
What a Tuel Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 (edited) How did Wilkerson and Richardson have very good years under Rex if Rex is as clueless at using personnel as some are making him out to be? It appears some players on this defense thought they were the greatest defense to ever play in the NFL and when the results werent the same as last year, the complaining started happening. Newsflash: last year's defensive production wasnt the norm it was more of an exception for this group in recent years. The thing is, although the d line did perform worse under Rex, releasing Mario isn't even about the scheme, it is because he simply gave up. His stats post bye week are way below the standard for the rest of the line under Rex's scheme. You can't pay a guy $20 million a year at the risk he will just give up half way through the year because he doesn't like the scheme. Edited December 31, 2015 by What a Tuel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhitewalkerInPhilly Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 So again, why can't it be both? This doesn't have to be a Rex vs. Mario situation. Both these statements can be true: Rex's defense underperformed. Check. Mario Williams mailed it in. Check. In any case, unless Mario had a phenomenal season he was going to be a salary causality with the younger players who need to be resigned. A team can only spend so much in the DL for so long. Why is it that Hughes was able to keep giving a ton of effort and make tackles down field even though he was asked to do things like drop into coverage? Why didn't Hughes hold a "press conference" at his locker and complain? EDIT: this same thing happened in Houston when Wade Phillips was DC and Mario was moved to OLB and was asked to rush from the right side. He complained and moaned. Yeah. Mario is going into a 19 million dollar cap hit next year. He definitely doesn't seem to be worth the money in this system. Whether it's because he's not a good fit for the system, or whether he's dogging it, when it comes to trying to keep Gilmore, Glenn and Incognito that money certainly could go to good use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 I am trying to think of and will likely edit this as it happens... but players ran out of town who have shown talent. CJ Spiller is first on the list and I must say that while he has not been as productive since his one big year, especially this year, he has talent and we ran him out of town. Lynch is a similar story but needed to go and it was for his benefit. Posuzlny, he has been solid and a consistent starter. fitzpatrick has been as good as anything we've had since. ...and i do say that including tyrod. tyrod is better right now but fitz has shown more consistency and lasted longer. Incognito the first time. Jason Peters "We" don't run players out of town. They get traded or released. Simple as that. I agree. RR does not come off as a genius. But he has apparently designed a defense that is so complicated that only the brightest minds in physics can begin to grasp its subtle nuances. Heck, it must be crafted in 10-dimensional space-time. I know, right? Some here would have us believe that Rex had the misfortune of being matched with the dumbest group of top veteran defenders he has ever coached just as he got to Buffalo. Such bad luck! I think it's a combination of that type of D no longer being effective with quick release passing offenses plus veteran players who began to tune out a HC (and staff) that they were soon to be much less impressed with as the season went on. I only read page 1, but was going to say the same thing - maybe Mopey Mario leaked this? Loved the guy when he came here, but not a big fan of his attitude this year... Why would Mario announce this? For pity? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4merper4mer Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 If we play Mario's team next year I wonder if he'l be named a captain against us or if his new coach won't waste energy on foolish things like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 "We" don't run players out of town. They get traded or released. Simple as that. I know, right? Some here would have us believe that Rex had the misfortune of being matched with the dumbest group of top veteran defenders he has ever coached just as he got to Buffalo. Such bad luck! I think it's a combination of that type of D no longer being effective with quick release passing offenses plus veteran players who began to tune out a HC (and staff) that they were soon to be much less impressed with as the season went on. Why would Mario announce this? For pity? Fletcher, Spikes, Poz. 3 very good LB's we no longer needed due to scheme. Ted Washington and Pat Williams - same thing. New coaches... new scheme... ditch the proven guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heitz Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 I know, right? Some here would have us believe that Rex had the misfortune of being matched with the dumbest group of top veteran defenders he has ever coached just as he got to Buffalo. Such bad luck! Why would Mario announce this? For pity? And others would have us believe that Rex's D is so complicated that NO NFL player ever could understand it, but he's had success before, soooo... To hasten his release? Not saying that's absolutely the case, but it isn't 100% out of the question, IMO. If we play Mario's team next year I wonder if he'l be named a captain against us or if his new coach won't waste energy on foolish things like that. Really? Rex "wasted energy" by naming IK a captain? Heck we even won the game... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobobonators Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 Fletcher, Spikes, Poz. 3 very good LB's we no longer needed due to scheme. Ted Washington and Pat Williams - same thing. New coaches... new scheme... ditch the proven guys. Spikes did nothing after leaving here. POZ was the centerpiece of bad defenses while he was here. Are we really going back to ted washington and Pat Williams? Some posters on here may never have seen them play for us. Its the NFl. Theres a lot of turnover Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 Ummm...different defensive systems? for $1000 Alex. You can do better than that, professor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4merper4mer Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 Really? Rex "wasted energy" by naming IK a captain? Heck we even won the game... It's just sideshow crap which is fine once you know what you're doing on the field. Clearly that category needs work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 And others would have us believe that Rex's D is so complicated that NO NFL player ever could understand it, but he's had success before, soooo... To hasten his release? Not saying that's absolutely the case, but it isn't 100% out of the question, IMO. Really? Rex "wasted energy" by naming IK a captain? Heck we even won the game... By one week? Not sure why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 What's going to happen when the dust settles and most of the players will back Rex? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4merper4mer Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 What's going to happen when the dust settles and most of the players will back Rex? We'll suck for 2 more years. Got any tougher questions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 Spikes did nothing after leaving here. POZ was the centerpiece of bad defenses while he was here. Are we really going back to ted washington and Pat Williams? Some posters on here may never have seen them play for us. Its the NFl. Theres a lot of turnover it's a history here that i am reminding people of - mostly as fans. we have run players out of town as a team, fanbase, etc because they no longer fit our expectations or did not do what the new guard wanted. spikes, nor Chandler, Fitz, Jackson, many others did little after we removed them due to scheme. but they were successful for us and i have a hard time believing that they would not have added to the team we had, having kept in place the systems we were successful with. continuity. Dick Jauron - average defense, average offense we have Head Coach Chan - very good offense. bad defense we have head coach marrone - very good defense, bad offense we have head coach rex - average offense, inept defense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 Because of the cap hell in 2016, even if Mario Williams was putting up 12-15 sacks this year he was probably gone anyways because of his 19 million dollar cap hit. Even at those sack numbers he is still not worth the money. This is the best move either way moving forward... I really must know why you are convinced of this "cap hell" in 2016? It's quite manageable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMan Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 No, he doesn't fit their system either. Bruce Irvin is going to be leaving Seattle after this season. Don't be surprised if Mario ends up there. Yea, I thought of that too. But Mario had a good year under Pettine and the Browns have to make bold moves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanM.D. Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 I really must know why you are convinced of this "cap hell" in 2016? It's quite manageable agreed. It's not 'great'....but we're not facing John Butler economics here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 We'll suck for 2 more years. Got any tougher questions? Want to wager a box of Crayolas on that one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Best Player Available Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 it's a history here that i am reminding people of - mostly as fans. we have run players out of town as a team, fanbase, etc because they no longer fit our expectations or did not do what the new guard wanted. spikes, nor Chandler, Fitz, Jackson, many others did little after we removed them due to scheme. but they were successful for us and i have a hard time believing that they would not have added to the team we had, having kept in place the systems we were successful with. continuity. Dick Jauron - average defense, average offense we have Head Coach Chan - very good offense. bad defense we have head coach marrone - very good defense, bad offense we have head coach rex - average offense, inept defense hard to believe Mr. personality Dick Jauron. is one of the Bills more "successful" 21st century coaches. years later who would have guessed that?You could always depend on that 7-9. Considering what he was given to work with and the state of OBD it's surprising he did that well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4merper4mer Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 Want to wager a box of Crayolas on that one? I hope I'm wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 Well before the first game of the season, there were those who said Mario should/would be a cap casualty if he did not take a pay cut. The fact that Mario has gone on strike for most of the season only confirms that he deserves to be cut. I defended Mario every step of the way until I saw him mail it in. P.S. How many plays out of all his defensive snaps did Mario actually drop back into coverage?!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
llyolf Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 You know... splitting mario out wide man to man on a wr is just genius.... i can't understand why mario hated it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Best Player Available Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 Well before the first game of the season, there were those who said Mario should/would be a cap casualty if he did not take a pay cut. The fact that Mario has gone on strike for most of the season only confirms that he deserves to be cut. I defended Mario every step of the way until I saw him mail it in. P.S. How many plays out of all his defensive snaps did Mario actually drop back into coverage?!? Without looking it up it's around 30 snaps he dropped back But That may be off a tad. certainly not a reason to lay Down like a dog. Winners and team players do what it takes...................blah, blah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 You know... splitting mario out wide man to man on a wr is just genius.... i can't understand why mario hated it... When did that happen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
llyolf Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 When did that happen? It was i the Toolbox.. you just know it.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted December 31, 2015 Author Share Posted December 31, 2015 You know... splitting mario out wide man to man on a wr is just genius.... i can't understand why mario hated it... When did that happen? Not one time did this occur. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 Well before the first game of the season, there were those who said Mario should/would be a cap casualty if he did not take a pay cut. The fact that Mario has gone on strike for most of the season only confirms that he deserves to be cut. I defended Mario every step of the way until I saw him mail it in. P.S. How many plays out of all his defensive snaps did Mario actually drop back into coverage?!? prior to the Cowboys game it was 21 out of 795 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 Without looking it up it's around 30 snaps he dropped back But That may be off a tad. certainly not a reason to lay Down like a dog. Winners and team players do what it takes...................blah, blah. Thank you. Perspective. 30 freaking snaps and the guy goes on strike while being paid MILLIONS of dollars. I defended Mario for most his time with the Bills, but Mario should be embarrassed as both a man and a football player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 @mikerodak The Associated Press is reporting that the Bills plan to cut DE Mario Williams after this season. Rex Ryan just... http://espn.go.com/espn/now?nowId=21-0474280094509044796-4 Shocking! @AP_NFL AP source: Bills planning to cut Mario Williams in offseason http://apne.ws/1mlPP8I @john_wawrow Really unfortunate that he didn't work in Rex's D. Wish we could trade him but no one wants that contract with his production. Plus everyone knows we are getting rid of him so no one would trade for him anyway. There are some serious leaks within this organization which need to be dealt with. no muzzling allowed, anyone can just say whatever they want, go Rex! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackInDaDay Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 ok.. the M Williams era ends.. i understand he thought the D was crap, but i don't know if those waltzes he shared with opposing TEs were due to his indifference or decaying skills. either way, you can't have that on a team that just gave Rex the ok to keep on keepin on in 2016. my only question for Rex is.. who else doesn't fit, and how close are we to having the 'right' guys to play his D? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 prior to the Cowboys game it was 21 out of 795 2.6% Dick Lebeau and Wade are probably wondering why such a low percentage. Mario should remove the mirrors in his house. I would love to hear what Kyle Williams' thoughts are on Mario's "effort"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 2.6% Dick Lebeau and Wade are probably wondering why such a low percentage. Mario should remove the mirrors in his house. I would love to hear what Kyle Williams' thoughts are on Mario's "effort"? Read about what the players are saying. http://bills.buffalonews.com/2015/12/31/248307/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted December 31, 2015 Author Share Posted December 31, 2015 @TyDunne The Mario Williams Enigma: Was it scheme or checking out? Those at One Bills Drive are torn. http://bills.buffalonews.com/2015/12/31/248307/ On the record, center Eric Wood called Williams’ comments “disappointing,” adding that “Everybody has to buy in or else we don’t have a shot.” He isn’t alone. One other teammate, who wished to remain anonymous, ramped it up a notch in saying Williams checked out a long time ago, back to not wanting to take part in the conditioning test before training camp. “It’s been clear to me that Mario doesn’t care about anybody but himself,” the teammate said. “He followed that up by not giving any effort during the season and complaining about the scheme instead of manning up and saying he played like crap and doesn’t care." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heitz Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 prior to the Cowboys game it was 21 out of 795 That's like, 50% of the time! Though, to be fair, math is not my strong suit... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 (edited) @TyDunne The Mario Williams Enigma: Was it scheme or checking out? Those at One Bills Drive are torn. http://bills.buffalonews.com/2015/12/31/248307/ Teammates staunchly defend Williams anonymously, too. While some are skeptical about Ryan’s scheme publicly, others are downright furious privately. One player said he completely understands Williams’ season-long frustration because the simple, straightforward, attacking defense employed by 2014 coordinator Jim Schwartz was so effective. Not everyone agrees with this critique. Williams’ numbers may be down across the board, but inside linebacker Preston Brown asserts that Williams “definitely bought in” to Ryan’s defense and that effort hasn't been an issue. “He was trying to do what the coaches asked him, too,” Brown said. “When you’re 30 years old, it’s kind of hard to start doing stuff you’ve never done. … He’s out there doing his job. I know he’s out there doing his job day in and day out.” Added cornerback Leodis McKelvin, “With him, it could be frustration in getting to the quarterback a lot more. But he wants to play — there’s no doubt about it. He wants to play. But you’re used to getting to the quarterback and now you’re making sacrifices for someone else to get to the quarterback. ... You can’t say one man did something wrong and it caused the whole defense to shut the down. It was a complete, total everything." Edited December 31, 2015 by FireChan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heitz Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 @TyDunne The Mario Williams Enigma: Was it scheme or checking out? Those at One Bills Drive are torn. http://bills.buffalonews.com/2015/12/31/248307/ This quote, IMO, is why he has to go: "There is no consensus on the subject. The locker room is divided on anything Mario Williams." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted December 31, 2015 Author Share Posted December 31, 2015 This quote, IMO, is why he has to go: "There is no consensus on the subject. The locker room is divided on anything Mario Williams." Like I said earlier. "Do your job and stop acting like a little B word." See Ya Mario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 How did Wilkerson and Richardson have very good years under Rex if Rex is as clueless at using personnel as some are making him out to be? It appears some players on this defense thought they were the greatest defense to ever play in the NFL and when the results werent the same as last year, the complaining started happening. Newsflash: last year's defensive production wasnt the norm it was more of an exception for this group in recent years. different position, entirely. and both were liable as fudge against the run. it's comparing watermelon and sausage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Best Player Available Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 Read about what the players are saying. http://bills.buffalonews.com/2015/12/31/248307/ Interesting and not defending the guy but if his is being honest with his comments he has some points. That said he is playing football not tennis. Not buying into Rex's plan no matter how silly is not what great Players do Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 (edited) The article is interesting. Brown, and likely at least one other player, speak out for Williams. But, the player speaking out against him seems to be the only one doing so - and I doubt it would be the likes of Gilmore, Roby, Dareus, Hughes, Bradham or Brown. Unlikely to be Graham, either. I would imagine it is Duke Williams, Carrington, etc. To me Carrington might be the bet because he is the one playing behind others. The type who would make the comment pay a bunch of guys his money and let them contribute. The one who fully believes that. also... I do want to bring up that maybe he has regressed. That maybe he has fallen off in play. That maybe he is only good at holding the edge on a run. I have not seen a lot of things he has offered to a team, nor have I seen him provide the array and dynamic of pass rush Bruce and others brought forth. (of course, there will be that amazing 2 yard run by TN where he lost contain) This quote, IMO, is why he has to go: "There is no consensus on the subject. The locker room is divided on anything Mario Williams." There were quotes also saying he entire team buys in to Rex and his system and Mario was the only one speaking out. @TyDunne The Mario Williams Enigma: Was it scheme or checking out? Those at One Bills Drive are torn. http://bills.buffalonews.com/2015/12/31/248307/ So, there is division in the locker room and Rex Ryan did nothing about it but pose for cameras like he's a good guy? Yeah, the locker room is divided because Rex did not act quickly enough. This point is disirregardless of anything to do with what Mario did in talking out and it has everything to do with Rex Ryan not doing anything. He kept playing the guy! So, again. Mario becomes a scapegoat. Ryan should have pulled him if he was not giving an honest effort. If people here believed they saw it than surely professionals at OBD saw it. I have questions for Rex. Then, I have a boot in the ass out the door. Schmuck. Edited December 31, 2015 by Boyst62 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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