YoloinOhio Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 KevinMassare We have been told Jeffrey Littmann will never be replaced. He is Wilson's finance guy for ALL his endeavors. He will leave when Ralph does. 2/24/14, 3:43 PM Seems to me that Overdorf would be more of the problem than Littman, who probably handles more high level finance/legal outside business than what we are talking about as the issues at hand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 Haha - Browns to the rescue again. Can you imagine if Schwartz and Hackett reported directly to Russ Brandon? ProFootballTalk @ProFootballTalk 43m Report: Browns' coordinators were to report to Joe Banner in organizational structure http://wp.me/p14QSB-9q1F Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 What does Brandon get from siding with the Dougs by going after Littmann and Overdorf via this report? Aside from a big headache, nothing. The point is, Russ learned from Ralph, with the latter being very connected with Littmann. The announcement on 1/1/13 was nothing more than a re-arranging of the deckchairs on the Titanic. Nothing really changed that day and Russ never planned to deviate from the established management structure at OBD and in Detroit. Russ is part of the problem, not the solution. If nothing changes you are correct. You are absolutely right. There has always been a group of posters on here who will defend anything the Bills do. Modrak had his defenders on here right until the end. It was never his fault---he just sets the board!!! If they cant defend what the Bills are doing then they attack the messenger, in this case Graham. Please, list the people here who are supporting Littmann, Overdorf or Berchtold. For that matter, list the people who are blindly supporting Brandon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FluffHead Posted February 25, 2014 Author Share Posted February 25, 2014 There are going to be MAJOR changes at OBD. I would predict that littman gets demoted to berchtold's job, overdorf is promoted to littman's job, and marv levy is hired to replace overdorf. As a result of these changes, Bills season ticket sales then soar. You forgot Jim Kelly. They'll utter some sweet nothing's about Jim new role in the organization and 5k more season tix will be sold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TXBILLSFAN Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 I think it's a fair question for fans to expect Brandon to explain the FO roles and responsibilities and decision rights. That's management 101 and pretty basic for any CEO to establish in their organizations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewildrabbit Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 You are absolutely right. There has always been a group of posters on here who will defend anything the Bills do. Modrak had his defenders on here right until the end. It was never his fault---he just sets the board!!! If they cant defend what the Bills are doing then they attack the messenger, in this case Graham. NFN, but it wouldn't surprise me at all to find that the Bills FO has some people posting in this forum just to tow the company line. The local media, and its current reporting is nothing like it used to be. A lot of you think some of the Buffalo sports reporters recently have been down on the team. Trust me, its nothing like it was back in the Jim Kelly era. The national & local media used to crucify head coaches like Kay Stephenson, and Hack Bullough for their ineptitude. Nowadays you have guys like JW shedding tears over losers like Chan Gailey when they get fired, and even some fans here seem to still love the guy. Seven head coaches since 1998... aside from the latest hire, the list of bums hired is Johnson-esque. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 NFN, but it wouldn't surprise me at all to find that the Bills FO has some people posting in this forum just to tow the company line. The local media, and its current reporting is nothing like it used to be. A lot of you think some of the Buffalo sports reporters recently have been down on the team. Trust me, its nothing like it was back in the Jim Kelly era. The national & local media used to crucify head coaches like Kay Stephenson, and Hack Bullough for their ineptitude. Nowadays you have guys like JW shedding tears over losers like Chan Gailey when they get fired, and even some fans here seem to still love the guy. Seven head coaches since 1998... aside from the latest hire, the list of bums hired is Johnson-esque. do you know JW? Because, he doesn't cry. Ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRQ_BillsFan Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Yes, I see it as more of a leak from Marrone and Whaley. Marrone specifically has said on record he loves Byrd and wants him back. Leaking this will place the blame away from him and Whaley if he doesn't get signed, which is likely where it should be. I think it was understood when Marrone took over that Overdorf did the contract and salary cap stuff. However in the past Marrone presented that they had great communication and implied that they would always be on the same page. Does make one wonder if this is no longer true possibly regarding Bird or free agent spending in general? I would think other teams may have been set up similar? I always took this to mean that the GM would still control rough salary and Overdorf would make it work best from a spending/cap scenario as to how it was specifically set up. Giving him what seems to be full/final control is troubling. How can a coach or coach GM not control the trainers? Why would they report to someone else? This truly makes no sense to me. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALF Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 I didn't know that Jim Overdorf negotiates player contracts and reports to Brandon , not Whaley, according to todays Buffalo News article. I thought the GM did that. I learn something new everyday. http://bills.buffalo...s-organization/ A older forum post worth noting http://boards.buffal...thout-criticism Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 (edited) Interesting read! Check out (@KevinMassare) in-depth write up on the Buffalo Bills organization #buffalohouseofcards http://frgd.in/1hM43eS Excerpt- "There has been a lot of focus in the past 24 hours around the disarray of the Buffalo Bills organization and front office. Well as any good Frank Underwood quotemay tell you, whoever leaked their information to Tim Graham was posturing through the media. This was a move by someone (Doug Marrone, Doug Whaley, or Russ Brandon) to make their position very clear." Edited February 25, 2014 by Beerball Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TXBILLSFAN Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Very troubling. Even more reason to get an explanation from Brandon. Is he in charge or not ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Very troubling. Even more reason to get an explanation from Brandon. Is he in charge or not ? OBD be wise to say nothing at all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Very troubling. Even more reason to get an explanation from Brandon. Is he in charge or not ? I think, on this matter, actions will speak louder than words. New league year begins on March 11th--we shall see what unfolds by that time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TXBILLSFAN Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 I think, on this matter, actions will speak louder than words. New league year begins on March 11th--we shall see what unfolds by that time. If nothing else the actions taken on multiple issues will explain if this is a new way of doing business or not --- (1) Byrd contract, (2) Toronto series, (3) Training staff to name a few. I knew Overdorf was bad news, but if he should not be making decisions on player contracts, he should be executing a strategy against a budget that is set by Brandon (assuming Brandon has full power) and he would work in concert with Whaley to agree on what is and isn't possible in retaining talent and going after new FA's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Interesting read! Check out (@KevinMassare) in-depth write up on the Buffalo Bills organization #buffalohouseofcards http://frgd.in/1hM43eS That's a very confusing article. The author seems to be trying to be on all sides of the argument at once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plenzmd1 Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 So driving this morning, hear a report that Bart Scott had several workouts planned, and that Cleveland wanted him to play desperately. Hmm. Have to believe that crew would have wanted him in Buffalo last year. This may shed some light on this current discussion, may mean nothing. But I did find it interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 The Bills will hope this goes away quietly. Overdorf/Littman are not relinquishing power no matter what. Whaley/Marrone will be gone long before that happens. Really, it gets repeated, but the only hope we have is new (local) ownership with a new structure and new execs. It has been that way a long time. I think maybe if the media gets some blood in the water and it turns into a full blown fiasco could possibly force some changes that arent cosmetic (like we usually get). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 The Bills will hope this goes away quietly. Overdorf/Littman are not relinquishing power no matter what. Whaley/Marrone will be gone long before that happens. Really, it gets repeated, but the only hope we have is new (local) ownership with a new structure and new execs. It has been that way a long time. I think maybe if the media gets some blood in the water and it turns into a full blown fiasco could possibly force some changes that arent cosmetic (like we usually get). If the "leak" truly came from Marrone/Whaley/Brandon as the above article supposes, then the bold cannot possibly be true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 With how messy this team is. I kind of hope that Marrone and Whaley get fired right before the season starts. Just for ultimate **** show drama purposes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 With how messy this team is. I kind of hope that Marrone and Whaley get fired right before the season starts. Just for ultimate **** show drama purposes. This shows me you are more interested in seeing the Bills in flames rather than becoming good. Something I've always suspected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 This shows me you are more interested in seeing the Bills in flames rather than becoming good. Something I've always suspected. Not at all. I'd be crying tears of happiness if they made the playoffs. But I'm cynical to the point where I don't expect them to do anything right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 With how messy this team is. I kind of hope that Marrone and Whaley get fired right before the season starts. Just for ultimate **** show drama purposes. What is this? "With how messy this team is"...really? How messy are they? They finished 6-10 with a rookie coach and rookie QB--oh, and they had to start 4th string QBs for 6 games...no big deal. It never ceases to amaze me how many "fans" actually want the team to crash and burn. Not at all. I'd be crying tears of happiness if they made the playoffs. But I'm cynical to the point where I don't expect them to do anything right. I call BS...you cannot reasonably say in one sentence that you hope for a **** show and then turn around and talk about how happy you'll be if it doesn't happen and expect to be taken seriously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 What is this? "With how messy this team is"...really? How messy are they? They finished 6-10 with a rookie coach and rookie QB--oh, and they had to start 4th string QBs for 6 games...no big deal. It never ceases to amaze me how many "fans" actually want the team to crash and burn. A rookie coach who was mediocre in college. A rookie QB who can't stay on the field. Signing a FA QB who injured himself on a mat. A "stud" defense, that can't stop the run, or 3rd and long... then still lose their "awesome" DC to a head coaching job. There's always some "mess" with this team. The only consistency is that there's new excuses every year for being mediocre. Ideally I'd love if we got our collective **** together and made the playoffs. But I'm certainly not expecting anything other than absolute nonsense... for the 14th year running. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 If the "leak" truly came from Marrone/Whaley/Brandon as the above article supposes, then the bold cannot possibly be true. I believe it is from close to, if not Marrone/Whaley. I would think Marrone only, because WHaley has been around and should be aware of the pecking order... but the mention of "scouts"... I believe Brandon is firmly in the corner of the power-brokers Wilson/Littman/Overdorf. He is a career-oriented man who has never waivered in his ability/desire to please his bosses. I dont see him tossing a grenade on his org. All IMO thoughts though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 I believe it is from close to, if not Marrone/Whaley. I would think Marrone only, because WHaley has been around and should be aware of the pecking order... but the mention of "scouts"... I believe Brandon is firmly in the corner of the power-brokers Wilson/Littman/Overdorf. He is a career-oriented man who has never waivered in his ability/desire to please his bosses. I dont see him tossing a grenade on his org. All IMO thoughts though So if I'm reading your posts correctly, and I don't mean to assume, you're of the belief that the situation is "The Bills" vs. "Marrone/Whaley"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 With how messy this team is. I kind of hope that Marrone and Whaley get fired right before the season starts. Just for ultimate **** show drama purposes. May I suggest a relo to Cleveland, Ohio? All that and more, promise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 May I suggest a relo to Cleveland, Ohio? All that and more, promise. I'm going to simultaneously laugh and cry if the Browns finish with a better record than us this year (or worse, make the playoffs). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 (edited) Basically, yes. I dont know how "deep" the complaints go, I dont think there is all out conflict or anything... (or how factual Graham's column is). I just know Overdorf/Littman/Brandon are lock-step. If anything were to happen, we will see the Complainant resign or get canned at some point. Likely, things will quietly be smoothed out in-house and we wont hear anything more Edited February 25, 2014 by May Day 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sodbuster Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 According to the hour by hour account of Whaleys day at the combine, they (Brandon and Whaley) met with Overdorf over dinner late friday night to get up to speed on ufa negotiations. I would be willing to bet that one of them heard something they didn't like and that was the last straw. Saturday someone contacts TG, by Sunday night we're reading about it online. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 I call BS...you cannot reasonably say in one sentence that you hope for a **** show and then turn around and talk about how happy you'll be if it doesn't happen and expect to be taken seriously. Call BS all you want. I'm one of the loudest at the local Bills bars when I go (last year I had the Sunday Ticket from Madden though). Hurt my damned body when we came back against NE, heh. Order of things how I want: 1) Superbowl 2) Playoffs 3) "Entertaining" sh*t hitting the fan, terrible record, major shakeup with ownership/FO 4) 6-10 It's not that difficult to understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Call BS all you want. I'm one of the loudest at the local Bills bars when I go (last year I had the Sunday Ticket from Madden though). Hurt my damned body when we came back against NE, heh. Order of things how I want: 1) Superbowl 2) Playoffs 3) "Entertaining" sh*t hitting the fan, terrible record, major shakeup with ownership/FO 4) 6-10 It's not that difficult to understand. So you don't "kind of hope" Marrone/Whaley get fired then? You just think that playoffs and/or Superbowl contention is out of the question, so you'd rather be entertained by complete and utter incompetence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 So you don't "kind of hope" Marrone/Whaley get fired then? You just think that playoffs and/or Superbowl contention is out of the question, so you'd rather be entertained by complete and utter incompetence. "Kind of hope" would qualify as #3 in a list of 4... "really hope" for the top two I'm just tired of the same mediocrity. I mean, we're all worked up over coaches wanting to replace the training staff. Is that all we have now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Anyone expecting major changes to result from a BN article are probably in for some disappointment. The franchise has been run this way for years and you can go back to the 70s to see things weren't much different than now in terms of organizational priorities. http://www.buffalorumblings.com/2011/7/20/2275370/buffalo-bills-ralph-wilson-john-rauch I know some will criticize Rauch because he wasn't successful, but that's not the point. While back then it was RW and his people who protected the cash flow, he has types like Littmann, Brandon, and Overdorf doing that for the Wilson family. The good 'ole boys concept is still alive and well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Interesting timing on this piece from this morning on BB.com: Chris Brown @ChrisBrownBills 22m A new brain trust for #Bills - Whaley, Monos, Fisher among youngest in NFL. A http://Buffalobills.com exclusive. http://ow.ly/tYLDs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
extrahammer Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 I think it's ridiculous how Kevin Massare is supporting Jeffrey Littmann because he knows the family. When you offer that sort of protection for anyone, there's a problem. Like the saying goes: "one bad apple can spoil the whole bunch" http://forgedinbuffalo.com/media/sports/buffalo-bills-front-office-house-of-cards/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 I'm going to simultaneously laugh and cry if the Browns finish with a better record than us this year (or worse, make the playoffs). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Jabber Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 More from Tim Graham: http://t.co/E2u0Mn65Dy http://t.co/CoCAFkAFAE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 More from Tim Graham: http://t.co/E2u0Mn65Dy http://t.co/CoCAFkAFAE summary? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 I am glad we have Graham and I think he is just now getting the freedom and connections in the area built back to be a great beat reporter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 (edited) summary? We are Doooomed. Marrone and Whaley are trying to change the culture and improve on some things like the training staff. The old guard is not making it easy. Edited February 25, 2014 by YoloinOhio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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